Autopsy Round 11: Hawks audition for top 4 draft pick, v Freo

[Maybloomer]

Funny, I don't recall one possession he had.

Plus we got torched and were flattered by the margin.

I'm not knocking him, I just don't see what a guy like Morrison offers long term. He'll always be a bottom six player from what I can see. He goes ok but will never hurt an opposition.

I remember 2 passages of play, one where he got talked out of a possession by a Freo player and meekly threw an arm out at him in an attempt to tackle and the other where a gimme goal turned into a lucky one courtesy of a Gunners free kick.
Bottom 6 players can go OK if you're playing as a team. We're not. There is just no coherence and little talk.

 

[Mercy Seat]

Facebook is not a news source.

It is if it's an interview with Graham Wright etc.

 

[Lickmesocks]

If I read......
Bring the ball to ground.....
One more &@$#ing time....
I will head butt myself...

MARK THE $@&#ING THING

Gravity O'Brien is not the answer. Never will be the answer. Till we get a big strong forward that can take contested marks consistently we will struggle. Just a stay at home key that will grab more than he misses.

I struggle to understand how our team can only manage 1 goal a quarter v Fremantle.

Reckon our back six are awesome. They hardly get any respite because our mids are getting flogged and the ball exits the 50 as quick as it enters it. Basically means the mids and backs are working twice as hard as they should be. The mids are in all sorts so the pressure on the backs is enormous - reckon the backs have been huge considering.

We can get the ball onto our 50. If we can find someone to actually mark the ball in there then the ball would be spending twice as much time there than it does now. The backs and mids get twice the rest and twice the time to set up. And.......we might even score a few &%#€ING GOALS.....

Jon Patton was our hope.

 

[Mercy Seat]

If I read......
Bring the ball to ground.....
One more &@$#ing time....
I will head butt myself...

MARK THE $@&#ING THING

Gravity O'Brien is not the answer. Never will be the answer. Till we get a big strong forward that can take contested marks consistently we will struggle. Just a stay at home key that will grab more than he misses.

I struggle to understand how our team can only manage 1 goal a quarter v Fremantle.

Reckon our back six are awesome. They hardly get any respite because our mids are getting flogged and the ball exits the 50 as quick as it enters it. Basically means the mids and backs are working twice as hard as they should be. The mids are in all sorts so the pressure on the backs is enormous - reckon the backs have been huge considering.

We can get the ball onto our 50. If we can find someone to actually mark the ball in there then the ball would be spending twice as much time there than it does now. The backs and mids get twice the rest and twice the time to set up. And.......we might even score a few &%#€ING GOALS.....

I agree on our back 6.

However, there's hardly a player in the league that would be marking our deliveries into 50 at the moment. Our ball movement is so slow and stagnant, that by the time we hit 50, the opposition has zoned so effectively, our only hope is TOB leaping over and getting half a hand to it. Therefore, bringing the ball to ground is important - extremely important. Something that Patton and Lewis simply cannot do.

The issue is the midfield. We need to find a way to move the ball significantly better than what we are, and stop with the turnovers across defensive 50. The reason Freo took so many marks inside 50 last night were the turnovers, and rapid ball movement into their half.

 

[Maybloomer]

Jon Patton was our hope.

I often wonder what would happen if you parked one big forward in the F50 by himself. No opposition coach worth his salt would allow that so they would send a defender back. Patton one-on-one, you'd take that. So Opp Coach sends 2 back, you suddenly have a free forward roaming around providing leads. Surely it can't be that hard? Nothing infuriates me more seeing Patton or Lewis or Bruest outside the 50 being on the end of a chain of 5 dinky kicks or handballs when one long one was all that was needed. There is one footy on the field, you don't need 4 Hawks fighting over it so the winner can kick it to nobody.

 

[Adelaide Hawk]

It doesn't help when you continually trade away your draft picks and guys like Burton for players who are at the back end of their careers or are not as good as you think they are.

I agree with this. I was staggered when they let Burton go to Port. You should have seen how green with envy the Adelaide clubs were when we snared Burton, and then we gave him away

 

[Rev08]

I often wonder what would happen if you parked one big forward in the F50 by himself. No opposition coach worth his salt would allow that so they would send a defender back. Patton one-on-one, you'd take that. So Opp Coach sends 2 back, you suddenly have a free forward roaming around providing leads. Surely it can't be that hard? Nothing infuriates me more seeing Patton or Lewis or Bruest outside the 50 being on the end of a chain of 5 dinky kicks or handballs when one long one was all that was needed. There is one footy on the field, you don't need 4 Hawks fighting over it so the winner can kick it to nobody.

Every coach would allow that. It gives you an extra around the ball.

 

[The Cryptkeeper]

I agree with this. I was staggered when they let Burton go to Port. You should have seen how green with envy the Adelaide clubs were when we snared Burton, and then we gave him away

It feels a bit as though we are trying the same trick with Scully and Patton as we did with Burgoyne, thinking naively that our medical team will return these guys to their best before injury struck.

This overlooks the fact that Burgoyne is a freak and also has a football brain that overcomes any of his diminished physical capacity.

 

[Adelaide Hawk]

I often wonder what would happen if you parked one big forward in the F50 by himself. No opposition coach worth his salt would allow that so they would send a defender back. Patton one-on-one, you'd take that. So Opp Coach sends 2 back, you suddenly have a free forward roaming around providing leads. Surely it can't be that hard? Nothing infuriates me more seeing Patton or Lewis or Bruest outside the 50 being on the end of a chain of 5 dinky kicks or handballs when one long one was all that was needed. There is one footy on the field, you don't need 4 Hawks fighting over it so the winner can kick it to nobody.

I've been saying this for years. Any coach worth his salt would have to drop a player back. When that happens, drop a pacey crumber down there to hoover up the fall out. Then an opposition coach would have to react. You never know, it may catch on.

Unfortunately, coaches are so locked into their safety first attitudes that it is killing the game. Come on coaches, time to take a few risks, break a few eggs and make that omelet. And more than this, breathe a bit of excitement back into a very drab game.

 

[Adelaide Hawk]

It feels a bit as though we are trying the same trick with Scully and Patton as we did with Burgoyne, thinking naively that our medical team will return these guys to their best before injury struck.

This overlooks the fact that Burgoyne is a freak and also has a football brain that overcomes any of his diminished physical capacity.

Also, Burgoyne was desperate to move to the Hawks. We didn't recruit him, he recruited us. At the time he was regarded as one of the premier midfielders in the AFL, it was a no brainer when he contacted the Hawthorn coaching staff asking if he could play for us. You don't knock those offers back. You may be right though, I think we have possibly got a little carried with ourselves in the recruitment and rehabilitation of injured players.

 

[Hawk88]

I've been saying this for years. Any coach worth his salt would have to drop a player back. When that happens, drop a pacey crumber down there to hoover up the fall out. Then an opposition coach would have to react. You never know, it may catch on.

Unfortunately, coaches are so locked into their safety first attitudes that it is killing the game. Come on coaches, time to take a few risks, break a few eggs and make that omelet. And more than this, breathe a bit of excitement back into a very drab game.

This is almost impossible in today's game without some linking through the middle of the ground. The reasoning is sound but players cant kick 70-80 metres to break the web/cluster every team uses. The defenders simply move forward or back depending on where the ball is.

The only CONSISTENT way to get through it is precise kicking/switching play or speed via run and handball

The reason this strategy works for defending is if you turn the ball over by trying to break through the cluster there is a turnover. Turnovers as we know greatly increase the opportunity to score

All the top teams have a great % of scoring from turnovers, similar to what we did in our glory years a few ago

This leads people to say why don't we man up 18v18. In this scenario there is generally no run from behind play and if you turn it over up the ground the same scenario occurs.

Can be done if you have great cattle on the park but we don't

 

[Jack Gun Cyril Stun]

Trying to be glass half full:
-If you’re going to have a bad year, good year to pick
-see this year as a long pre season for 2021 (as long as next few weeks we experiment and test list)
-Only one team will win it this year and it’s not us,so no opportunity missed
-be our 1st look at top end talent in a long time. Imagine grabbing 2 more Will day types
- Tigers looked worse than us at the end of 2016!
- we have lots of $ to finally grab a top FA
- things change quickly in footy,
- we have one of the best coaches ever. He still has ammunition left I’m sure!

 

[Adelaide Hawk]

This is almost impossible in today's game without some linking through the middle of the ground. The reasoning is sound but players cant kick 70-80 metres to break the web/cluster every team uses. The defenders simply move forward or back depending on where the ball is.

The only CONSISTENT way to get through it is precise kicking/switching play or speed via run and handball

The reason this strategy works for defending is if you turn the ball over by trying to break through the cluster there is a turnover. Turnovers as we know greatly increase the opportunity to score

All the top teams have a great % of scoring from turnovers, similar to what we did in our glory years a few ago

This leads people to say why don't we man up 18v18. In this scenario there is generally no run from behind play and if you turn it over up the ground the same scenario occurs.

Can be done if you have great cattle on the park but we don't

Don't you think when things are going poorly that we try something unorthodox to try and break it up. No point in plodding along with no real chance of catching up. There are times when only the unorthodox will do.

 

[PhatHQ]

Clarko’s presser was the same old tripe.
His introduction to bring in youth was a bit half arsed if I’m being honest.
There is a lot wrong at the moment...
Mids
Rucks
Leadership
Coaching

The term “protection” when referencing introducing youth and maintaining mature body’s has fallen on deaf ears with other clubs.
What is wrong with playing guys that won a reserves premiership together?
There is no use having mature body’s if they are stale, slow and devoid of leadership.
The next batch of leaders is there. Sicily, Hardwick, Jager, Mitchell... let them lead.
The kids aren’t really kids anymore and the one player that is a kid has almost been out best player since he started.

I don’t care if the players coming in get a little life lesson for the remainder of the year and we finish bottom 3. The likes of Greaves, Jones, Moore, Walker and Maginness all need an extended run to the end of the year and I’d like to see at least 3 of these guys play for the remainder of the season.

If Clarko will only now introduce more youth it can’t be at the expense of players under 50-100 games or the “management” of Day, Nash, Worpell.

 

[TylerDurden]

If I read......
Bring the ball to ground.....
One more &@$#ing time....
I will head butt myself...

MARK THE $@&#ING THING

Gravity O'Brien is not the answer. Never will be the answer. Till we get a big strong forward that can take contested marks consistently we will struggle. Just a stay at home key that will grab more than he misses.

I struggle to understand how our team can only manage 1 goal a quarter v Fremantle.

Reckon our back six are awesome. They hardly get any respite because our mids are getting flogged and the ball exits the 50 as quick as it enters it. Basically means the mids and backs are working twice as hard as they should be. The mids are in all sorts so the pressure on the backs is enormous - reckon the backs have been huge considering.

We can get the ball onto our 50. If we can find someone to actually mark the ball in there then the ball would be spending twice as much time there than it does now. The backs and mids get twice the rest and twice the time to set up. And.......we might even score a few &%#€ING GOALS.....

I've said this all year. TOB is part of the problem. Its not like we have Cyril to bring the ball to the ground to!
Yes the delivery is appalling, but we'd look far better with a tall who can take a contested mark off some of these high balls. And yes, scoring is better than any other type of pressure someone can apply.
Lewis had shoulder surgery and never mentally recovered.
Patton also has injuries and is struggling.

The worry is that Tim is currently the best we have, as the cupboard is bare.

Having said that, I've not given up on the other 2. In fact I wanna see Patton play all remaining games to see if we can unlock his confidence again. To be fair, when performing, he's exactly what we need.

 

[WWSD]

With Breust back in the side, I don't understand why Wingard wasn't used in the middle more.

FML - he even put Breust in at CBs during the 2nd half!

Breust attended more centre bounces yesterday than Wingard.

 

[WWSD]

Our problems are way bigger than TOB, but it would be nice for TOB to start repaying the faith soon.

Contracted til end of 2021. How much more time does he get?

At what point to do thrown Jeka to the wolves?

O’Brien and Ceglar the two most inconsistent players, are both contracted until the end of 2021. Meanwhile there’s 24 Hawthorn players out of contract this year.

 

[MrPremiership]

Teams don't really tag these days, its team defence, O'Meara goes AWOL for no real reason.

O’Brien and Ceglar the two most inconsistent players, are both contracted until the end of 2021. Meanwhile there’s 24 Hawthorn players out of contract this year.

Thought Ceglar got one until 2022.....

Very inconsistent from both.

 

[hamohawk1]

I've been saying this for years. Any coach worth his salt would have to drop a player back. When that happens, drop a pacey crumber down there to hoover up the fall out. Then an opposition coach would have to react. You never know, it may catch on.

Unfortunately, coaches are so locked into their safety first attitudes that it is killing the game. Come on coaches, time to take a few risks, break a few eggs and make that omelet. And more than this, breathe a bit of excitement back into a very drab game.

Yep, nothing pains me more than seeing a forward (from any team) be 100+ metres from goal. I wouldn't be against a rule that restricts forwards to be within the attacking centre of the ground. It's what was done until the late 90's (without the rules), and allows the re-emergence of a proper forward. Otherwise the competition is going to turn into a battle of 175-190cm speedsters battling out low scoring battles.

 

[Freshmeat]

pathetic. lot of our players look finished

Not finished, just BLOODY lazy! A lot of them are in holiday mode.

 

[detox]

For anyone potting Morrison, he is not the problem. Has actually been reasonable recently, and shouldn't have the blowtorch on him.

I am far more concerned about our midfield. Mitchell is the only one getting the ball which unfortunately means he is the only one who kicks it. Worpel tackles hard but only plays half a game. Omeara plays a qtr and shiels is a liability.

Our outside runners are either injured or out of form.

Mcevoy looks just spent. Hes not old in Ruckmans terms. Whats going on?

2 Ruckman is not working. We need another bloke in to play around the footy and help out our midfield. Its just not working as it is.

Our fwds (who have had shocking service) and our backs are fine but our connection between them isn't.

 

[Judd2Sewell]

O’Brien and Ceglar the two most inconsistent players, are both contracted until the end of 2021. Meanwhile there’s 24 Hawthorn players out of contract this year.

TOB is consistent. Make of that what you will.

 

[savagelunchbox]

For anyone potting Morrison, he is not the problem.

That's not people's issue.

The issue is that while he's playing okay, since his debut, there hasn't been much improvement and there hasn't been any signs that there's much more improvement in him.

So while we're not contending and needing to be looking into the future towards our next flag tilt, why play someone who doesn't look to have a high ceiling?

 

[checkraiseulite]

Not finished, just BLOODY lazy! A lot of them are in holiday mode.

tom mitchell seems to be playing like an out of form daniel cross. concerning and don’t think it’s an effort thing either.

 

[detox]

That's not people's issue.

The issue is that while he's playing okay, since his debut, there hasn't been much improvement and there hasn't been any signs that there's much more improvement in him.

So while we're not contending and needing to be looking into the future towards our next flag tilt, why play someone who doesn't look to have a high ceiling?

Who else do we play?

He is definately improving, and far from our worst