Preview Round 12: Changes V West Coast

[The German Hunter]

I’m just glad we have shortened quarters, it will save us from loosing by 100 points against WC

 

[Judd2Sewell]

I don't think it matters who's in or out if we persist with the same game plan, whatever that is. It drives me insane seeing 3 or 4 players guarding space while oppo players are running free all over the ground. Worst of all, by a country mile, or 1.6Km, is that except for a handful of players the team seems to have lost it's heart. It's the football equivilent of waving a white flag befor the battle has begun. Having said that I would like to see us play as many of our kids that is practical. You can't play 6 or 8 kids at the same time against any team let alone WC, they would be mincemeat. Will Day is absolutely fantastic but if someone like Darling or Hurn ran into him he would be knocked 3 weeks into the future. I bet he still gets asked for ID when he walks into a pub. We have long term problems that require long term solutions and winning the odd game against the Blues or "possibly" the Crows is just that, no more.

Simply terrible game plan. It was surreal to watch Freo pick it apart early with short kicks, complete role reversals from a few years ago when we were good.

We are a much better side on paper than we are performing - clearly indicating that our game plan desperately needs a change. The players aren't playing with passion. They seem bored and tired of it to me.

 

[savagelunchbox]

Simply terrible game plan. It was surreal to watch Freo pick it apart early with short kicks, complete role reversals from a few years ago when we were good.

We are a much better side on paper than we are performing - clearly indicating that our game plan desperately needs a change. The players aren't playing with passion. They seem bored and tired of it to me.

...or conceded.

 

[Judd2Sewell]

...or conceded.

Or that. In legit worried that the players just aren't playing for the coach anymore. We are getting done at the selection table and getting out coached during games.

 

[kazzooka]

What's Howe's injury situation? I know the consensus here is that he is slow of mind and foot, but he brings tackling and a bit of mongrel.

Howe is a better kick than all our mids and can handball too. Not that slow of foot but just doesn't have awareness sometimes and gets caught. He can get better at that.

 

[kazzooka]

He is a slow outside mid. It is bad enough we have too many slow inside mids, we don't need slow outside mids to add on to the issues we have

Morrison is never worst on and usually is tidy with disposal but he will not win a contest or stick a tackle, and isn't fast enough to get out in the open. The disposals he gets are when a a shank kick forward that he reads the play well to intercept or b he is left free by the opposition in a non dangerous position.

He doesn't stuff up and gets a lot of cheap possessions but he never hurts the opposition. He will never be a premiership player.

 

[savagelunchbox]

Howe is a better kick than all our mids and can handball too. Not that slow of foot but just doesn't have awareness sometimes and gets caught. He can get better at that.

He's slow by mind. His decision making, especially under pressure, takes a lot longer than what we need.

WX had the same problem.

You need to act instinctively and pretty much know what to go is before you get the ball. Howe gets it, then thinks.

 

[The Kipster]

I think the Hub has had a massive impact. The players know they are going to be on the road all year, living in a hotel and heaps of that time in lockdown. They are creatures of habit, and have had that taken away. Once the form dropped off, then that combined with knowing you are away from family and friends, who are doing it tough in Victoria, is going to be really difficult for them.
I would be offering the senior players with family the opportunity to head home after the WA stint and play the youngsters. Will give them exposure and benefit us next year.

I tip my hat Sir, 100% agree.

 

[hawkman]

Morrison is never worst on and usually is tidy with disposal but he will not win a contest or stick a tackle, and isn't fast enough to get out in the open. The disposals he gets are when a a shank kick forward that he reads the play well to intercept or b he is left free by the opposition in a non dangerous position.

He doesn't stuff up and gets a lot of cheap possessions but he never hurts the opposition. He will never be a premiership player.

He reminds me of the type of player we used to carry in the 02-05 period. The Steve Greene, Nick Reis, Luke Brennan or Brett Johnson's types that you know will never be good enough to be in a good team

 

[theiaofseed]

Morrison is never worst on and usually is tidy with disposal but he will not win a contest or stick a tackle, and isn't fast enough to get out in the open. The disposals he gets are when a a shank kick forward that he reads the play well to intercept or b he is left free by the opposition in a non dangerous position.

He doesn't stuff up and gets a lot of cheap possessions but he never hurts the opposition. He will never be a premiership player.

Hmm so when he out marked Hurley in a one on one contest 2 years ago that was a dream of mine? What bullshit.

 

[user33]

The people still calling for Morrison to be dropped can only be doing so from a biased point of view.

Last night he had 17 touches at 75%, plus took 3 intercept marks meaning he was getting in the right positions defensively.

He was getting those touches in the back pocket and in the opposite forward flank. Was everywhere.

BuT He iS VAnILlA aND SloW

 

[theiaofseed]

Wingard full time midfield, Sicily goes forward, McEvoy to ruck with Nash and Patton helping out.

In: Moore, Patton, Finn, CJ

Out: Smith, O'Brien, Shiels, Ceglar

 

[user33]

It won't happen I know, but I hope we make sweeping changes.

OUT:
Scully (not good enough)
TOB (not good enough)
Stratton (cooked)
Ceglar (not good enough)
Smith (injured)

IN:
Patton
Finn
Jones
CJ
Walker

Hardwick - Frawley - CJ
Sicily - Frost - Scrimshaw

Big Boy - Mitchell - Worpel
Day - Wingard - Finn

Impey - Gunston - JOM
Breust - Patton - Nash

Jones - Morrison - Shiels - Walker

I like it but we know it’ll be Burgoyne for Smith and maybe Patton for Ceglar.

 

[hk89]

This will be an interesting game to juxtapose against our final game of 2019. WC had everything to play for, we had a very outside chance of lurching into 8th spot at the time the game was played, so certainly had something on the line, but WC had the double chance, and a real shot at a flag on the line. We thumped them.

The differences in the teams on the park that beat WC and lost to Freo last night?
Out: Burgoyne, Henderson, Hanrahan, Poppy, Howe
In: Mitchell, Frost, Impey, Morrison, Day

There are some pluses and minus in those list changes, but I don't think you can argue that on paper the Ins are worse than the outs, even though a couple of the ins might need more time to get back to their best (Mitchell and Impey) , and Day is still super light for a guy playing at this level.

That WC game wasn't an outlier either. We had wins against all of the 2019 prelim finalists that we came up against in that stretch (played them all but Richmond).

What has gone so horribly wrong since the last game of 2019 and just before the mid point of this season? Have we really had a bunch of players fall off
the age cliff? It doesn't look like it to me. It looks more like we are not getting enough out of the guys under 30. We are also playing like a team that
looks to be psychologically damaged. Can play positively for very brief stretches, but then crawl back into the foetal position as soon as the flow of the game
goes against us. I really don't believe what we see out on the field at the moment is the result of game plan instruction. You get glimpses of what the
coaches are telling players to do at the start of games, or sometimes after coming out after quarter or half time breaks, but they just can't mentally
stick to it for more than a few minutes before they become hesitant and reactive.

I think it is likely far too late to fix things right now, and with the AFL apparently saying no to Tassie and sending us to SA for the rest of the season, I
can't see things turning around for us. 1 home game against a travelling team for the entire season has probably had a lot to do with our mental *edness.

In terms of selection this week, I think it has probably come time for Clarko to make good on his promises of a few weeks ago, that senior heads would be on the block if results didn't improve. A win against Carlton (who we let kick the first 5) and another poor loss is not improvement.

Personally I don't think players like Cousins are the answer (our midfield simply has too many of this type already, most of who are likely better than Cousins), but now is as good a time as any to find out. Give shiels a rest. He's not been much worse than Worpel, but Worpel should remain part of our midfield for the next 10 years, and the more time he can spend with Mitchell and O'Meara the better. Can anyone speculate on why Shiels has dropped from dependenable to deplorable so quickly? Is the midfield mix to blame? Whatever is going on the entire group seems to be affected. The only reason I single out Shiels for a rest is because of his age bracket, and the need for the others to Gel.

Stratton out for CJ. Even if this move doesn't happen, we need a new Captain next year. Stratton is not the guy to lift the spirits of a demoralised bunch.

Would like to give Scully a rest, but if Smith doesn't play , then with Hendo also out, I'm not sure that is viable.

Patton in. Not sure who comes out for him. Maybe Nash, but we look so poor in the forward pressure department, I don't think we can bring in a tall for a player in the forward half for pressure. Maybe leave Nash in, take Ceglar out.

Let Morrisson step aside for another young guy. I don't mind Morrisson, but we can afford to have a different kid play his role without hurting out structures too much.

So maybe something like this:
In: Patton, Cousins, Finn, CJ
Out: Shiels, Smith (Inj), Stratton, Ceglar

That will never happen though. More realistic might be:

In: Patton, Finn (can he play wing? played there last year as a junior, but seems more suited to inside?)
Out: Ceglar, Smith (inj)

Wouldn't mind seeing Hartley at some point either. Too many young blokes to mention that would be
good to see too, such as Reeves, Jones, Ross, Walker, however we can't go completely bananas. Losing all these games
will already be putting a dint in confidence that will be hard to hammer out, we need to avoid an avalanche of 10 goal+ losses, which
will occur if we try to look at too many kids too quickly.

I'd also put Wingard into the midfield full time for the rest of the season, and keep him there. One of our few players with class. Only goes forward to rest.

I really think we are a much much better team on paper than what we currently see on the ground, but given we seem
to have ****ed this season now, there is no reason to get an early look at the next set of players, and perhaps get an idea
on the future of guys like Cousins (and maybe Howe).

 

[TylerDurden]

He's slow by mind. His decision making, especially under pressure, takes a lot longer than what we need.

WX had the same problem.

You need to act instinctively and pretty much know what to go is before you get the ball. Howe gets it, then thinks.

This. He's more of the same. Gets caught with the footy and can turn it over under pressure.

One of those players who's ability gets miraculously better the longer they are injured.

He's not gonna solve our problem.

 

[HedgeFund]

i would think having a normal year would go a long way to fixing things, or at the very least, being able to better identify what our problems are.

I'm sure drafting kids will help to some degree, but so will getting blokes in through FA/trade, playing at the MCG, being able to train properly, altering our gameplan, getting some fringe players to either find their feet in our 22 or replaced etc. There's no easy solution to any football issues and ours are just compounded by the fact we can't get any continuity in working on them for obvious reasons

You do realise there’s 17 other clubs having to deal with very similar, if not identical, problems with training/playing interstate/continuity don’t you?

Why would we be any better than them in 2021 of things can return back to something close to normal?

 

[Brishawk]

This. He's more of the same. Gets caught with the footy and can turn it over under pressure.

One of those players who's ability gets miraculously better the longer they are injured.

He's not gonna solve our problem.

Your an opposition mid and you see worpel and Howe walking your way. Who do you want standing next to you at the stoppage? Pretty sure Fyfe was happy that Howe wasn’t playing. It isn’t that Howe is a great player but he makes life hard for the opposition unlike the rest of our mids. I think people recognise that and are hopping he can change the dynamic.

 

[HedgeFund]

Your an opposition mid and you see worpel and Howe walking your way. Who do you want standing next to you at the stoppage? Pretty sure Fyfe was happy that Howe wasn’t playing. It isn’t that Howe is a great player but he makes life hard for the opposition unlike the rest of our mids. I think people recognise that and are hopping he can change the dynamic.

Worpel - because I know he won’t defend me and I can push off from the contest and get an easy kick. He also won’t hurt me by foot because he has returned to the absolute butcher of the footy he was as a junior.

 

[Judd2Sewell]

I like it but we know it’ll be Burgoyne for Smith and maybe Patton for Ceglar.

If that's the case then questions need to be asked about Clarko

 

[Judd2Sewell]

You do realise there’s 17 other clubs having to deal with very similar, if not identical, problems with training/playing interstate/continuity don’t you?

Why would we be any better than them in 2021 of things can return back to something close to normal?

Exactly, that excuse is baffling.

 

[Todman]

Nic Nat is a beast.

Big Boy looks tired and Ceglar out of form. If BB needs a rest, an option might be to throw Ceglar, head to head, at Nic Nat and rest Big Boy. Ceglar needs to step up! He was given a 3 year contract for a reason. He'll probably be beaten, but it allows the side to get another midfielder in. TOB can pinch hit while Nic Nat is resting.

Slot Finn in for Big Boy.

A few more changes needed.

Last time Nic Nat and Cegs played one another they both did ACLs

 

[savagelunchbox]

Your an opposition mid and you see worpel and Howe walking your way. Who do you want standing next to you at the stoppage? Pretty sure Fyfe was happy that Howe wasn’t playing. It isn’t that Howe is a great player but he makes life hard for the opposition unlike the rest of our mids. I think people recognise that and are hopping he can change the dynamic.

Howe.

Our midfield has no attacking flair. So a defensive mid who offers nothing offensively doesn't help the opposition to be more dangerous. Worpel at least will do the defensive things plus provide some offensive flair if given the opportunity.

 

[Blackhawk42]

With Clarko referencing bringing guys in who have been performing in the scratch matches, it makes those post-game write ups on each players performance all the more interesting.

We know Jones has been the best mid by far, so you'd have to think he is close to a recall.
CJ has been noted his for line breaking and higher confidence levels in each game.
Dylan Moore had over 20 touches and 2 goals for 3 games in a row too I believe.

Those 3 kept standing out as the best performed of the youngsters in my view.

 

[Kanga Commando]

I think the Hub has had a massive impact. The players know they are going to be on the road all year, living in a hotel and heaps of that time in lockdown. They are creatures of habit, and have had that taken away. Once the form dropped off, then that combined with knowing you are away from family and friends, who are doing it tough in Victoria, is going to be really difficult for them.
I would be offering the senior players with family the opportunity to head home after the WA stint and play the youngsters. Will give them exposure and benefit us next year.

i do agree to an extent, but it hasnt had such a bad effect on all the other vic teams as it ?
Maybe the other clubs have better leaders to deal with this ?

 

[The Spirit of Cricket]

You do realise there’s 17 other clubs having to deal with very similar, if not identical, problems with training/playing interstate/continuity don’t you?

Why would we be any better than them in 2021 of things can return back to something close to normal?

oh * i didn't, but now that you mentioned it I'm all over it, cheers man