Review Round 17, 2020 - Sydney vs. Brisbane Lions

Who were your five best players against Sydney?


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3KZ is Football

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Are you sure they are not the same posters who judge McStay solely on goals scored? People in glass houses and all that....
Goals scored, Disposals, Marks held, Tackles, Goal Assists ... these are all reasonable metrics that I use when commenting on Dan McStay's performance and when he don't have "many of any" over a sustained period, it is reasonable to criticise his performance. When he performs well, which he did against Sydney, I am HAPPY to praise his performance.

The problem with people being critical of Oscar McInerney is they are doing so in spite of the evidence of their eyes and a lot of data, particularly in terms of his outstanding performance in clearances. As I said, currently 4th at the club for clearances this year and people are suggesting he's a one dimensional tap ruckman who doesn't do much around the ground. Hilarious!

You can arrange these by clearances to get the totals. He's ahead of some 'big names' in our side.

 

martinson

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Goals scored, Disposals, Marks held, Tackles, Goal Assists ... these are all reasonable metrics that I use when commenting on Dan McStay's performance and when he don't have "many of any" over a sustained period, it is reasonable to criticise his performance. When he performs well, which he did against Sydney, I am HAPPY to praise his performance.

The problem with people being critical of Oscar McInerney is they are doing so in spite of the evidence of their eyes and a lot of data, particularly in terms of his outstanding performance in clearances. As I said, currently 4th at the club for clearances this year and people are suggesting he's a one dimensional tap ruckman who doesn't do much around the ground. Hilarious!

You can arrange these by clearances to get the totals. He's ahead of some 'big names' in our side.

I remember watching Oscar's second or third game with someone when he was playing forward and we both commented on how clever he was with his hands in close or when on the ground.

Because he looks like an awkward friendly draught horse and doesn't appear to be technically perfect in his execution he's been constantly underestimated.

Can't run or kick ,do this or that. It's all wrong. He's very capable in many facets of the game and is improving all the time.
 

QLioness

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Personally, I feel like the fact we havent just blooded players for the sake of it has meant when they have come in they have been raring to go, Coleman being the perfect example of that.

The club is at a stage where we have to expect our best 22 to be performing to the standard immediately or they will be replaced. Coleman has done that. Skinner did not. Payne was borderline against Richmond.

It is clear that Fages has a best 22 in mind at the start of the season, and anyone outside that has to go over expectations to push someone out. I don't really have a problem with that personally, and I'm pretty sure Fages has said previously that everyone is "reset" back to even at the start of the preseason. (Although maybe I am remembering things here)
You’re forgetting that Skinner was in the Sydney hub which means NO match sims in those 4 weeks, barely a good prep
 

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luthor

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Goals scored, Disposals, Marks held, Tackles, Goal Assists ... these are all reasonable metrics that I use when commenting on Dan McStay's performance and when he don't have "many of any" over a sustained period, it is reasonable to criticise his performance. When he performs well, which he did against Sydney, I am HAPPY to praise his performance.

The problem with people being critical of Oscar McInerney is they are doing so in spite of the evidence of their eyes and a lot of data, particularly in terms of his outstanding performance in clearances. As I said, currently 4th at the club for clearances this year and people are suggesting he's a one dimensional tap ruckman who doesn't do much around the ground. Hilarious!

You can arrange these by clearances to get the totals. He's ahead of some 'big names' in our side.


I don't think it's necessary to reference Dan MCstay to justify your defence of Oscar.

Your obsession with McStay is unhealthy

BTW , I agree with you about Oscar
 

Sanchez365

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You’re forgetting that Skinner was in the Sydney hub which means NO match sims in those 4 weeks, barely a good prep
I'm not writing Skinner off at all, was more stating that if you get brought into the side and want to hold your spot, you have to perform well. More leeway is given to the regular 22 players that have performed over the preseason.
 

3KZ is Football

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I don't think it's necessary to reference Dan MCstay to justify your defence of Oscar.

Your obsession with McStay is unhealthy

BTW , I agree with you about Oscar
That post was responding to another that mentioned Dan.

I take your point though. I am seeing my analyst about my McStay obsession. It replaced my Sam Sheldon obsession, which you will remember. The reality was that I was right about Sheldon. I hope I am wrong about McStay.
 
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ZoBlitz

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That post was responding to another that mentioned Dan.

I take your point though. I am seeing my analyst about my McStay obsession. It replaced my Sam Sheldon obsession, which you will remember. The reality was that I was right about Sheldon. I hope I am wrong about McStay.
You were wrong about Hawksley too.
 

jackess

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I think most argue that McStay is the best option now, not that he won't lose his spot at some point in the future. The only issue I have is those that say McStay should be dropped now which has been confirmed as wrong given how Skinner, Ballenden, Eagles and Fullarton performed in their brief stints.
 

3KZ is Football

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You were wrong about Hawksley too.
Nah, he was a good footballer who was treated badly by the coach in my opinion. I don't think I ever predicted he would win a brownlow or anything, just that he deserved a better run in the seniors. As I have said before, I was contacted by someone via PM who was close to the situation and I didn't like what they had to say in terms of how James was treated off the field. That was all.
 

DERRINALPHIL

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I think most argue that McStay is the best option now, not that he won't lose his spot at some point in the future. The only issue I have is those that say McStay should be dropped now which has been confirmed as wrong given how Skinner, Ballenden, Eagles and Fullarton performed in their brief stints.
My point is that any of the other players should have been given more games. If any of them had played games as inept as Dan's two games where he could not take a grab to save himself and missed easy shots they would have been dropped immediately.

Its too late to change now
 

Dylan12

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Nah, he was a good footballer who was treated badly by the coach in my opinion. I don't think I ever predicted he would win a brownlow or anything, just that he deserved a better run in the seniors. As I have said before, I was contacted by someone via PM who was close to the situation and I didn't like what they had to say in terms of how James was treated off the field. That was all.
Exactly how I viewed Hawksley in his time at the Lions. One of the few players that I think was hardly done by at the Lions. Was rarely afforded stretches of games afforded to guys that shouldn't have got them (Sam Sheldon case in point) and for some reason held to a higher standard compared to many of his teammates.
 

3KZ is Football

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Exactly how I viewed Hawksley in his time at the Lions. One of the few players that I think was hardly done by at the Lions. Was rarely afforded stretches of games afforded to guys that shouldn't have got them (Sam Sheldon case in point) and for some reason held to a higher standard compared to many of his teammates.
100% Correct. That is what I argued then and what remains true today.

James did well here. He had a quiet game but a couple of his pinpoint passes were sublime, especially the one in the last to Bradshaw.

 
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jackess

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My point is that any of the other players should have been given more games. If any of them had played games as inept as Dan's two games where he could not take a grab to save himself and missed easy shots they would have been dropped immediately.

Its too late to change now
He hasn't missed that many easy shots this season. Hard to know what the reserves form is like and you have to remember he's not just judged on amount of marks
 

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bungalow_bill

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My point is that any of the other players should have been given more games. If any of them had played games as inept as Dan's two games where he could not take a grab to save himself and missed easy shots they would have been dropped immediately.

Its too late to change now
Dan though has runs on the board and has been a solid to very good player for a number of years, a bad game here and there won't get him dropped like it would a player just starting out such as Skinner. We witnessed how our forward line functioned sans Dan and it wasn't pretty.
 

3KZ is Football

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Dan though has runs on the board and has been a solid to very good player for a number of years, a bad game here and there won't get him dropped like it would a player just starting out such as Skinner. We witnessed how our forward line functioned sans Dan and it wasn't pretty.
There is a bit of an "Urban Group Think Myth" forming about how our forward line functioned without McStay which needs to be debunked.

McStay missed rounds Rounds 9 and 10, this is the period where our forward line apparently, according to the group think, didn't function. Well in Round 9 we kicked 14.7.91 and beat Essendon by 63 Points, which suggests to me that our forward line functioned admirably. What was "not pretty" about that scoreline? It was in fact our second highest score this season.



The next week sans Dan we had our infamous 4.17.41 game against Richmond, which we lost by 41 points. As Fagan and others pointed out, we still managed 21 scoring shots and while we may never have won, it was poor kicking that cost us that week, not the absence of Dan McStay.

DERRINALPHIL has focused on two games in particular where Dan McStay was playing and it is interesting to look at how our forward line went with him in the team and not playing well. DERRINALPHIL has also focused on McStay’s poor marking, a concern that Brownie echoed early in his call of the game on Sunday. Anyway, in Round 13 we kicked 6.14.50 and then after our bye we kicked 6.6.42, a mere point above our Richmond losing score. In both instances the presence of an out of touch McStay hasn't been of any real benefit. We won those games, but we won very ugly.

Now on the upside - Dan McStay had a very good game last round, albeit against a team that is currently 15th on the ladder. In fact, it was clearly his best for the year. The challenge he faces, and where he has struggled, is in maintaining his form and particularly reproducing it against top sides. Let's be real, Dan McStay isn't going to be dropped, so I sincerely hope, as do all Lions supporters, that he can play as well as he did against Sydney next round against Carlton and more importantly, against top flight opposition like Geelong, Richmond and Port Adelaide. We are clearly a better side when Dan is playing well.
 
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Dylan12

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I was wrong about Jason Roe, Bryce Retzlaff, Aaron Cornelius, Tom Collier and Rhan Hooper.
To be fair, Rhan Hooper should've been as good or at least close to Cyril Rioli. He had all the attributes but just didn't apply himself, but skill wise, was up there. I reckon he'd be out there somewhere with regrets about his footy career given he had all the skill in the world, just lacked the obvious discipline or desire to make it.

I reckon Ace wasn't too dissimilar to Hawklsey in that he rarely got a good run of games, was held to higher standard and often scapegoated for the team's ineffectiveness.

I remember the year Collier got drafted, he was certainly the consensual choice on this board as to who we should take with our second point.

I got to know Jason Roe pretty well in my time living in Brisbane through Max Kennedy and Roey was a ripping fella that I thought was a competent KPD prone to the odd brain fade, not too dissimilar to Dan Merrett, but the club just didn't persist with him. He was never going to be a star though.
 

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