Preview Round 20 Richmond vs Fremantle @ Optus Stadium, Sun 1st August, 5.10pm

[biaseddustyfan]

Eye of the Prestia
It's the thrill of Optus
Rising up to the challenge of the Dockers

one of your best gloryjc

 

[wegetpumped]

Why do people always think the selectors don't know that ins and outs don't have to be like for like? Or that anyone on this board knows better than anyone actually making the decisions.

They have WAY more information than us on how these players are playing. All these advanced stats, deep insgiht into our gameplan and what each players role is, how they train, their attitude, how they pressure, how they position themselves, the things they do off the ball etc etc.
Like seriously some people watch the game on TV and then look at the stat sheet and think they know better. Get a grip. All we see is a few pieces of the full puzzle.

"Just move Baker there". Clearly hes more valuable to us in different positions. Do people get the small forward is the hardest position to impact games from? You almost entirely rely on the rest of your team to even get an opportunity. Your mids have to win the ball (something we're sh*t at), they have to delver the ball well inside 50 so its not intercepted (something we're sh*t at) then if our forwards are good they will mark it (no opportunities), if they're sh*t they won't bring it to ground (no opportunities). Small windows and half chances to make an impact.

Its why stats and watching the game are not how you judge them. When they go through the tapes they will look at how they performed in the chances they had, not how many chances they got like we all judge them by.

There are clearly reason why Castgana and Aarts are still being picked. Dimma has said it 10000x that our team is not about individual performances and are about how each player contributes to the team plan. It would be idiotic to think that they haven't considered other options with replacing these guys and therefor they with all the information they have, all the stats and the full picture have come to the conclusion that so far, they have been our best option.

If we were still a bottom club with no success under this group, then sure you could argue that they are making the wrong choice and its clearly not working and that they have nfi. But after 3 flags in 4 years I think they deserve a bit of trust that they know what they're doing.

The question is how is it working? Are you saying they just keep playing them because we don't have anyone else to play the role? If so play someone that can play a different role which may work out better. What do you have to gain by persisting with something that ain't working? Other teams have worked out our system and changed there's accordingly rule changes further have enhanced them against us. We are flogging a dead horse we need to change the way we play it worked in 17 why cant it work again.

 

[wegetpumped]

richmond by 104 tomorrow again please

Every single time KB predicted a score like that we have lost I hope you don't have the same genes.

 

[wegetpumped]

I’m in bloody Western Australia by pure fluke, so guess who’s going to the game! Me!!

Good one mate hopes you have a good day and they match your attitude.

 

[Matthew45]

Lose this and season over most probably.

 

[Matthew45]

Wow, Broad has recovered much quicker than first anticipated.
Likely Broad and Prestia are back this week V Freo. CCJ most likely to play ressies in his first game back.
Next week Vlustuin and Macintosh return V North
Bachar RD23 and Balta back finals bye weekend.

That's 6 players back plus Edwards who just returned V Cats.
A 3rd of the side has been out for multiple games, take 7-8 top 22 players out of any side and see how they go.

So if we end up playing finals and we don't sustain any further long term injuries, only Dusty and Soldo will be our main 2 outs.

View attachment 1189144

They are big outs

 

[Maybenextyear]

No excuses today. We are pretty well cooked anyway but there is never an excuse to throw in the towel. Don’t think.....DO SOMETHING ! There is never an excuse to not bring effort.

 

[Grrr]

The question is how is it working? Are you saying they just keep playing them because we don't have anyone else to play the role? If so play someone that can play a different role which may work out better. What do you have to gain by persisting with something that ain't working? Other teams have worked out our system and changed there's accordingly rule changes further have enhanced them against us. We are flogging a dead horse we need to change the way we play it worked in 17 why cant it work again.

It's called evolving as a coaching group. If you don't evolve you get stuck. Hardwick has done it before, and will do it again. He won't have a choice because as it stands the results are showing that things are not working the same as before. George and Aarts are not the main reason, far from it, age, injury and teams working out how to beat us are the main reason. But they aren't helping.

 

[Vassp]

It's called evolving as a coaching group. If you don't evolve you get stuck. Hardwick has done it before, and will do it again. He won't have a choice because as it stands the results are showing that things are not working the same as before. George and Aarts are not the main reason, far from it, age, injury and teams working out how to beat us are the main reason. But they aren't helping.

And to t it off our FORM is s**t. Missed tackled ,missed marks ,missed passes and the lack of a coherent game plan. I think we are doing ok considering all of the above are broken.

 

[AstuteTiger]

Courtesy of LeeToRainesToRoach from PRE

In all honesty, this is some telling insight and if we are serious we should be beating this young freo team by 5 goals min.

Club	Avg Age	Avg Gms	Avg Gls	Avg Hgt	Avg Wgt
Frem	23.73	66.1	26.5	186.7	87.0
Rich	26.32	111.5	89.3	185.1	83.8

Youngest Freo side for three years. Mundy + a group of kids, 15 players 23 or under. Losing this would just about be a new season low.

Biggest Freo age deficits

Age Diff	Year	Round	Opp	Result	Margin
-3.22	2010	SF	Geel	L	69
-3.17	2018	19	Haw	L	59
-3.15	1996	18	Carl	L	61
-3.10	2013	23	St.K	L	71
-3.05	2000	9	Carl	L	65
-2.98	2003	1	Adel	L	56
-2.89	2001	16	Carl	L	75
-2.74	1996	20	Melb	L	21
-2.68	1995	13	Carl	L	57
-2.68	2017	17	W.C.	L	30
-2.59	2021	20	Rich
-2.55	2000	10	N.M.	L	88
-2.51	1996	10	Haw	L	57

 

[austyn08]

Courtesy of LeeToRainesToRoach from PRE

In all honesty, this is some telling insight and if we are serious we should be beating this young freo team by 5 goals min.

Club	Avg Age	Avg Gms	Avg Gls	Avg Hgt	Avg Wgt
Frem	23.73	66.1	26.5	186.7	87.0
Rich	26.32	111.5	89.3	185.1	83.8

Youngest Freo side for three years. Mundy + a group of kids, 15 players 23 or under. Losing this would just about be a new season low.

Biggest Freo age deficits

Age Diff	Year	Round	Opp	Result	Margin
-3.22	2010	SF	Geel	L	69
-3.17	2018	19	Haw	L	59
-3.15	1996	18	Carl	L	61
-3.10	2013	23	St.K	L	71
-3.05	2000	9	Carl	L	65
-2.98	2003	1	Adel	L	56
-2.89	2001	16	Carl	L	75
-2.74	1996	20	Melb	L	21
-2.68	1995	13	Carl	L	57
-2.68	2017	17	W.C.	L	30
-2.59	2021	20	Rich
-2.55	2000	10	N.M.	L	88
-2.51	1996	10	Haw	L	57

First stat I looked at there was weight, we seem a smaller team now which should indicate we are quicker, but are we?
Rules have killed that advantage and now we miss bigger bodies?

 

[Aristotle Pickett]

Craig Lambert interview on SEN now.

 

[Antzzz]

Havnt seen the Dangerous tackle rule applied much lately …. I bet my left nacker it’s in full force today or they go hard on another ******* dumb rule the AFL Superminds aka Hocking have introduce to kill off the Tigers game plan…. These mental giants thought giving the fullback 30 metres latitude would help scoring … by clearing the defence …obviously these *heads didn’t realise all it will do is make the whole defending team just move back further thus making it even harder to score … YOU CANT MAKE THIS s**t UP …

 

[guruisatiger]

Now let me think?

Titmus. Conjures up lovely images of quality special time, with a very nice set. (think Broady pic

Castagna. Conjures up images of unco little porky George from Seinfield.

Ummm?

Yep, Titmas in July please.

Its titmus for the rest of us

 

[TiggerMan22]

y
Yes they have more information but most of us have watched a lot of footy over the years, and by and large the consensus is fairly pretty negative towards the two. You might have noticed that we currently sit in 10th place and are a good chance to go from premiers to missing the 8. So it is pretty obvious that things are not working all that well.

George has been a useful contributor in our premiership wins no doubt. Surrounded by a good team his run and chase and general contribution was important. Without that support he is a below average player. Aarts has some talent but is so slow for his position. There would be 20+ small forwards in the league who are much better players than either of them, some teams have two or more who are better than either.

If we had a gun small forward they would be playing. Higgins is a much better footballer than Aarts for one that we had but left for more opportunity.

We could keep one and try something new in their place, we have plenty of young players who we have no real idea about because they get dropped every other week and have no time to settle. First average game, back to the VFL.

Yes we haven't performing well. Do you think the coaches are doing anything about that? Do you generally think it's because of our small forwards? Not the injuries or the poor delivery inside 50 or the inability to win the ball out of the centre or the runs we let teams go on.

It's the small forwards. Of course!

 

[TiggerMan22]

And with your written essay, I still come to the conclusion that castagna and aarts have been sh*t.

So has most our team tbh.

Who have we got to replace them again?

 

[Grrr]

Yes we haven't performing well. Do you think the coaches are doing anything about that? Do you generally think it's because of our small forwards? Not the injuries or the poor delivery inside 50 or the inability to win the ball out of the centre or the runs we let teams go on.

It's the small forwards. Of course!

As I said post #258, no Castagna and Aarts are not the main problem, but no I don't think the coaches are doing enough about it.

Both players in the form they are in would be lucky to get a game in many other sides. George has history, triple premiership player, and as I've stated, he was good in those years because he has great pace so he closed down space really well and he played many good games. 2017 he was a good marking option up front, 2019 if he could kick straight he may have had a Norm Smith medal. But that is the past. In a good side his lack of ability to get the ball and use it well was covered by his other assets namely pace, and a great side that covered up these deficiencies. But with injuries/age etc he now has to be one of those senior player covering up for the deficiencies of especially young players coming in. And he does not have the skill to do it. He does not have the luxury of being a role player.

Aarts is not a bad footballer, but the slowest small forward going around with no standout skills. A similar type in Higgins that we just got rid of has great hands, can mark the ball and get it a fair bit, but even he is limited a bit by his lack of pace.

I don't bag players, never have, doesn't mean they can't be criticised or critiqued. But we need to rotate some other players through one of their spots in the team otherwise we are treading water and stopping our young players from developing.

 

[TiggerMan22]

Somethings not right then, they have all that information and they continue to pick two spuds who constantly stink it up. But hey how dare anyone suggest even with all that information they get things wwrrrrooonnnnngggggg SOMETIMES. Nobody on this board thinks they know better than the selectors coaches most of the time. What they can comment on is very poor form and state that ITO they are getting the odd thing wrong.This is a forum where my opinion your opinion anyones opinion has as much weight as those in charge.

Every one can see what sort of contribution Aarts and Castagna are bringing to the table that is both offensively and defensively it aint good enough. Just like what Rioli was offering up they eventually had to drop him and now move him. I suppose all those who were critical of Rioli were wrong and should have shut up as well.Castagna is offering nothing except poor decision making and poor disposal when he does get his hands on the ball and a blind man can see the little he offers defensively. IMO he is literally the worst skilled player in the entire comp and there is no logical explanation for them playing him other than loyality.

Fmd this is a footy forum and most people i see do have thier own opinions on who should play and where. I know lets just shut the whole site down and we can all just go along with what the club decides. After all they just NEVER GET THINGS WRONG. Mate stop telling people to just trust them on everything. premierships or not they do get some things wrong and i bet my bottom dollar behind closed doors they are the first ones to say so when they recognise it.

I can also tell ya Coaches right thru history have picked players who are favorites when they shouldn't have.Hardwick has been very loyal to those who have played in the premierships we all know he has backed players in for inordinate amounts of time when out of form.
Personally i don't think he is doing Castagna any favors by continually picking him.
You continue to post like they never ever get anything wrong when we all know they do get some things wrong and imo this is one of those occasions.

Hmm Baker started out as a fwd, Bolton is probably our best fwd hes also a fwd who has become a good mid with the most x factor. Edwards spent a big part of his career as primarily a fwd with midfield time .Geez mate it actually makes more sense to now revert back to more fwd time for him at age 33. It really is simple just give em a bit more time fwd and bring in some mids to pick up the slack.
FMD Parker has only now with us become a mid he has always been primarily a fwd. Lambert already spends a lot of time fwd while primarily being a mid.

Literally talking about how we don't see the whole picture and you reply with "everyone can see what they contribute".

The point was we don't see what they contribute. There's much more than just the stat sheet with our game plan. If they ran hard to cover ground that stops the opposition from moving through there then they have contributed without getting a stat and without anyone watching on tv seeing what they did.
Coaches see that.
Clearly there is a reason they are still in.

No s**t coaches make wrong decisions sometimes. But this isn't one selection error, this is an entire year of choices and each time they have chosen the same one. It's not like they are incapable of dropping smalls as they have with Rioli multiple times. So yeh that loyalty reasoning is clearly wrong. But nah you're right the selection committee have nfi and are just picking them just cos.

Yeh have your opinion. I'm giving you mine.
And as I said they have earned the trust by winning flags. Their decision have been far more right than wrong so how can you not think that they are seeing more than we are?

There's a big difference between the position that Edwards and Bolton played in the forward line and the small forward role.

 

[Grrr]

So has most our team tbh.

Who have we got to replace them again?

Add another mid and rotating forward more. Also try some young players. Don't have to drop both at the same time, but surely one of them could have made way at some stage. And we don't really know what the kids can do because they are given one game or so and are dropped.

 

[Wooden Robot]

Yes we haven't performing well. Do you think the coaches are doing anything about that? Do you generally think it's because of our small forwards? Not the injuries or the poor delivery inside 50 or the inability to win the ball out of the centre or the runs we let teams go on.

It's the small forwards. Of course!

Well, when you have a good number of posters who continually tell us that the performance and input of our small forwards has been so crucial to our premiership success, or in some cases, the biggest factor - people are quite right to deduce that their non-performance (if you call it that as the likes of George and Aarts have been outright missing in action for months) is a giant factor.
You can't have it both ways.
The simple fact is, and even though some won't admit it publicly on here and even shy away from it, that the likes of Castagna, Aarts etc. were periphery to our success. Take them out we win three premierships; take out Dusty, Jack, Cotch, Prestia, Grimes - we win none.
What was the name of that threat - Castagna GOAT??? The GOAT
I'm f***** baffled how a supposedly smart match committee and coach can't see that these two have been useless and detrimental to the cause for weeks and months.

 

[Wooden Robot]

Well, when you have a good number of posters who continually tell us that the performance and input of our small forwards has been so crucial to our premiership success, or in some cases, the biggest factor - people are quite right to deduce that their non-performance (if you call it that as the likes of George and Aarts have been outright missing in action for months) is a giant factor.
You can't have it both ways.
The simple fact is, and even though some won't admit it publicly on here and even shy away from it, that the likes of Castagna, Aarts etc. were periphery to our success. Take them out we win three premierships; take out Dusty, Jack, Cotch, Prestia, Grimes - we win none.
What was the name of that threat - Castagna GOAT??? The GOAT
I'm f***** baffled how a supposedly smart match committee and coach can't see that these two have been useless and detrimental to the cause for weeks and months. You don't need to replace like for likes .... we don't every time some other size or role player goes out of the team.

 

[dusty1234!]

I want to see us just give SOMETHING this week

 

[BruceTempany14]

George and Aarts 10 goals between them

For the year


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

 

[Lsta062]

Courtesy of LeeToRainesToRoach from PRE

In all honesty, this is some telling insight and if we are serious we should be beating this young freo team by 5 goals min.

Club	Avg Age	Avg Gms	Avg Gls	Avg Hgt	Avg Wgt
Frem	23.73	66.1	26.5	186.7	87.0
Rich	26.32	111.5	89.3	185.1	83.8

Youngest Freo side for three years. Mundy + a group of kids, 15 players 23 or under. Losing this would just about be a new season low.

Biggest Freo age deficits

Age Diff	Year	Round	Opp	Result	Margin
-3.22	2010	SF	Geel	L	69
-3.17	2018	19	Haw	L	59
-3.15	1996	18	Carl	L	61
-3.10	2013	23	St.K	L	71
-3.05	2000	9	Carl	L	65
-2.98	2003	1	Adel	L	56
-2.89	2001	16	Carl	L	75
-2.74	1996	20	Melb	L	21
-2.68	1995	13	Carl	L	57
-2.68	2017	17	W.C.	L	30
-2.59	2021	20	Rich
-2.55	2000	10	N.M.	L	88
-2.51	1996	10	Haw	L	57

Yep exactly, losing to this Fremantle side would be worse than any other loss this season because of how inexperienced they are. They have so many crucial injuries so it is no excuse even with our outs.

Interesting how their margins have only dipped below 50 twice in this chart so we probably need to aim for a 50+ margin (although just the win would be the priority).

 

[TiggerMan22]

As I said post #258, no Castagna and Aarts are not the main problem, but no I don't think the coaches are doing enough about it.

Both players in the form they are in would be lucky to get a game in many other sides. George has history, triple premiership player, and as I've stated, he was good in those years because he has great pace so he closed down space really well and he played many good games. 2017 he was a good marking option up front, 2019 if he could kick straight he may have had a Norm Smith medal. But that is the past. In a good side his lack of ability to get the ball and use it well was covered by his other assets namely pace, and a great side that covered up these deficiencies. But with injuries/age etc he now has to be one of those senior player covering up for the deficiencies of especially young players coming in. And he does not have the skill to do it. He does not have the luxury of being a role player.

Aarts is not a bad footballer, but the slowest small forward going around with no standout skills. A similar type in Higgins that we just got rid of has great hands, can mark the ball and get it a fair bit, but even he is limited a bit by his lack of pace.

I don't bag players, never have, doesn't mean they can't be criticised or critiqued. But we need to rotate some other players through one of their spots in the team otherwise we are treading water and stopping our young players from developing.

Our team is more than the individual. On paper our team was never the best at any time. Giants have always had loads more talent, Crows were superior in 2017 etc.

So yeh Castagna wouldnt get games at other clubs but in our system he is valuable. I agree that has poor but the fact that he hasn't been dropped all year meens the coaches see something I don't. And after this system brought us 3 flags, I'm gonna trust it