Preview Round 21, 2021: Hawthorn v Collingwood 8 August 2021, 2.10pm @ MCG

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daniel23

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Ins - Morris,ceglar and hanrahan last chance for both

Outs - bruest , shiel and mcevoy both rested. You could make a case for resting Denver also but collingwood have a couple of smaller players he would match up well onc

Burgoyne can go fwd with Morris taking his spot.
 

grumbleguts

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Ins - Morris,ceglar and hanrahan last chance for both

Outs - bruest , shiel and mcevoy both rested. You could make a case for resting Denver also but collingwood have a couple of smaller players he would match up well onc

Burgoyne can go fwd with Morris taking his spot.
Not sure Essendon* would take too kindly to us dropping one of their players for them.
 

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Rocket72

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Ins - Morris,ceglar and hanrahan last chance for both

Outs - bruest , shiel and mcevoy both rested. You could make a case for resting Denver also but collingwood have a couple of smaller players he would match up well onc

Burgoyne can go fwd with Morris taking his spot.
Agreed on Morris, he deserves a recall based on his performances in defence. I can't recall the last time I've seen such an improvement through a position change. Forward he looked lost frankly, but in defence his kicking has been elite, he has taken intercept marks (both contested and uncontested) and has ran forward when appropriate and has looked to be an offensive weapon from long range.
 

HairyO

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it usually takes ~4 years for mids to properly come on, guys like Worpel and Walsh are the exception not the standard
I would think 2 or 3 years is plenty to see if there is a spark. Tall forwards and especially ruckmen are the ones who near 4 years or more... apart from the very rare freak (Kreuzer, Nic Nat, Grundy, Jackson).
 

SSSSSS

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I would think 2 or 3 years is plenty to see if there is a spark. Tall forwards and especially ruckmen are the ones who near 4 years or more... apart from the very rare freak (Kreuzer, Nic Nat, Grundy, Jackson).
Darcy Parish was a spud when he was stuck on a HFF despite his obvious ball winning ability from his junior days. Gets plonked into the middle and is now a bonafide gun.

Nash may not have that trajectory but it's hard to judge a player unless they are played where they should be. Last week was a good start.
 

darthmann

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I would think 2 or 3 years is plenty to see if there is a spark. Tall forwards and especially ruckmen are the ones who near 4 years or more... apart from the very rare freak (Kreuzer, Nic Nat, Grundy, Jackson).
Yeah in terms of signs you can definitely see good things before the 4-year mark, but I'm talking about when they become consistent guns. Ie. realising their potential.

Tall fwds and ruckmen usually need way more than that. Like up to 7+ years, if they're drafted as 18-year-olds. They can certainly show they're going to be good and play great games, but consistent top-tier performances mostly come after 25. Max was exactly 7 years when he became a gun, Grundy 6 (though they were both good before that, but not great).

Looking at mids, Sam Mitchell was in his 5th year when he polled over 10 votes in the brownlow. Tom Mitchell, Luke Parker, Ollie Wines, Petracca (6 years), Gary Ablett Jnr the same. Brayshaw is in his 4th year and looks like he's fully emerged as a top-tier mid. The list goes on and on.

So maybe we should be hoping to have seen more from Finn by now, but I would imagine giving up on him before he's been given 4 years in our system would be premature.

Anyway, this is irrelevant to this game. So let's leave it there
 

Billyc

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I know mate, I was just taking the piss out of the posters that claim people "hated" Nash, which was why they didn't rate him.
"Poster hates player X because they don't rate player X as highly as me" is one of the most inane takes on this board.

Rivalled only by "player X played a great game this week after several inconsistent weeks, so therefore any criticism of them ever (including criticism that they are inconsistent which is actually supported by the occasional great game) must be wrong, and indicative of hatred."
 

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darthmann

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"Poster hates player X because they don't rate player X as highly as me" is one of the most inane takes on this board.

Rivalled only by "player X played a great game this week after several inconsistent weeks, so therefore any criticism of them ever (including criticism that they are inconsistent which is actually supported by the occasional great game) must be wrong, and indicative of hatred."
arent they kinda the same thing
 

theiaofseed

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Ins - Morris,ceglar and hanrahan last chance for both

Outs - bruest , shiel and mcevoy both rested. You could make a case for resting Denver also but collingwood have a couple of smaller players he would match up well onc

Burgoyne can go fwd with Morris taking his spot.
We don't need to see Ceglar, nothing he does in the last 3 games will change any clubs mind about him. He stays for depth or or traded for a late pick.

Hanrahan needs to come in and play midfield.
 

burner1

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Finn has not even had one season in the VFL, and Sam himself has spoken well of the "jobs" he's done.
For the athletic guys sometimes it’s takes a while then just ‘clicks’ when they learn to use their tools combined with some improved game sense.

CJ was nowhere last year then with a good offseason suddenly a key part of backline. Possibly similar with Nash now maybe finding his position.

Finn has most of the athletic tools you’d want in a mid - size, decent speed, massive tank, clean hands but lacks a bit of game sense and doesn’t use his speed/run.

Still I reckon ollie, Morris, downie, Jai are ahead of Finn in pecking order for rest of the year and Finn will be a 2022 project.
 

Milkshaker

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Game sold out. Wow.
Yep I jagged some of the tickets. Was a battle. The Pies supporters are all over the chance to see their side in Tassie!

At least I can guarantee a little bit of Brown and Gold in the crowd.

Expecting to walk into a R14 Hawks v Essendon type scenario at UTAS Stadium.



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hawkman

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hardway

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I know mate, I was just taking the piss out of the posters that claim people "hated" Nash, which was why they didn't rate him.
Problem with Nash is he had no idea what to do on the field. 1 game doesn’t turn it all around and in order to challenge again he doesn’t exactly add the polish. We should of developed Nash the way Finn is being developed (tag). Finn needs to get hold of the ball and develop that side of his game
 

Judd2Sewell

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Problem with Nash is he had no idea what to do on the field. 1 game doesn’t turn it all around and in order to challenge again he doesn’t exactly add the polish. We should of developed Nash the way Finn is being developed (tag). Finn needs to get hold of the ball and develop that side of his game
I agree it doesn't turn it around, though it was very promising, even I, a Nash "hater," can admit that.

The main thing I noticed was that having him in there bought JOM and Wingard just a fraction more time, and with Wingard in particular you just can't give him a moment otherwise he will most likely cut you up.

Surprisingly the midfield role seemed to simplify the game for him. He always looked completely lost, I guess, because the structures and potentially over-coached nature of the role was too much to grasp. Running through the middle and hunting changes all of that for him. I imagine teams will expose that going to the other way, and he may end up getting in the way of our better midfielders. But right now it's worth a look at least.

I agree on Finn. During his TAC year he was a big, quick, clean (by hand) goal kicking midfielder. I hope we start developing him as one.
 
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