Autopsy Round 22, 2021 | Autopsy vs Sydney

[franjon]

Great to see some positive signs here and there, but the standard simply has to be much, much higher than starting games as abysmally as we did tonight's.

Thats pretty much how I saw it. It was a great effort in the second half to outscore them and get within 4 points, but the first half was terrible and basically iced any chance of winning. You know what you are going to get with Sydney, they are one of the best contested/pressure teams in the competition, and we didnt appear to be switched on at all making their job a lot easier. But at least we fought it out and didnt allow a blow out which was what it was looking like. Those 2 late Hayward goals also highlight the defensive lapses. I'm only reiterating other comments but theres a lot to like, but also a bit of work to do.

 

[Merlin007]

I agree with the posters who are pushing up the positives, and they are real enough - TT, LDU and Jy against Kennedy, Parker etc was a good effort, Ford looks to have all the tools, Curtis Taylor

5

Curtis Taylor

Age

24

Ht

188cm

Wt

82kg

Pos.

M/F

Career

Season

Last 5

D

6.0

1star

K

3.0

1star

HB

3.0

3star

M

1.5

2star

T

2.0

4star

CL

0.0

1star

No current season stats available

D

6.0

2star

K

3.0

1star

HB

3.0

3star

M

1.5

2star

T

2.0

4star

CL

0.0

1star

is showing he's going to be a good ordinary footballer (I mean that in the positive), more game time for Phillips and his ball use is first class etc etc

But I must say the thing I took away from last night was just how much further we have to go. If we're honest with ourselves, the last two weeks have been against sides with as many youngsters as us, and with more significant 'outs' among senior players. It's just a reminder that other teams have good young players too, and we have big holes. I hope I'm wrong, but Goldy and Taz look to me to be fading - Xerri may took over from Goldy, but it's not certain, and Edwards is years away. As for Taz, Corr - assuming he is fully recovers - is not really like for like. And then there's the known gaps - lack of small forward with scoreboard impact (not a knock on Mahony, he's on the improve, but we need more competition for that role) and apart from Hall, there's not much leg speed from HBF (and even then, his kicking can be either death or glory).

So happy days, we win the Horne Handicap, but we're going to need more than that to keep the green shoots sprouting up

 

[Kanga Glory]

How many on here got a feeling when we got to a goal the difference in the last quarter, we are going to blow the number 1 pick.
That’s all we have talked about for the past month, thank god we can put that to bed.
It like Dennis pagan said ‘it’s like dancing with your sister’.
It’s a shocking way to watch a game. Hopefully this is the last time we got through it.

 

[1975]

I reckon he has had another super season.
I think he's showing some slight signs fatigue (don't blame him) . Lets not forget that he is over 33-34 , held the ruck together brilliantly once again for the whole season , played all 23 games. What a superstar he is.

Sure has,
lots of speculation about his ankle but I think his injury may have been a little birdie in his ear.

 

[the flying ham]

I agree with the posters who are pushing up the positives, and they are real enough - TT, LDU and Jy against Kennedy, Parker etc was a good effort, Ford looks to have all the tools, Curtis Taylor

5

Curtis Taylor

Age

24

Ht

188cm

Wt

82kg

Pos.

M/F

Career

Season

Last 5

D

6.0

1star

K

3.0

1star

HB

3.0

3star

M

1.5

2star

T

2.0

4star

CL

0.0

1star

No current season stats available

D

6.0

2star

K

3.0

1star

HB

3.0

3star

M

1.5

2star

T

2.0

4star

CL

0.0

1star

is showing he's going to be a good ordinary footballer (I mean that in the positive), more game time for Phillips and his ball use is first class etc etc

But I must say the thing I took away from last night was just how much further we have to go. If we're honest with ourselves, the last two weeks have been against sides with as many youngsters as us, and with more significant 'outs' among senior players. It's just a reminder that other teams have good young players too, and we have big holes. I hope I'm wrong, but Goldy and Taz look to me to be fading - Xerri may took over from Goldy, but it's not certain, and Edwards is years away. As for Taz, Corr - assuming he is fully recovers - is not really like for like. And then there's the known gaps - lack of small forward with scoreboard impact (not a knock on Mahony, he's on the improve, but we need more competition for that role) and apart from Hall, there's not much leg speed from HBF (and even then, his kicking can be either death or glory).

So happy days, we win the Horne Handicap, but we're going to need more than that to keep the green shoots sprouting up

A couple weeks ago Goldy gave Draper an absolute lesson. A fading goldy is still head and tails above most of the opposition rucks getting around. He will still have a couple of years. He might not be as potent as he once was, thats a reasonable expectation - all it does is bring us a little bit back to the pack in that regard. I wouldnt be considering replacing him for a while yet.

Taz concerns me more but he is still making the right spots and competing hard. I think he plays next year and will be improved by the addition of Corr.

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[Psicosis]

I agree with the posters who are pushing up the positives, and they are real enough - TT, LDU and Jy against Kennedy, Parker etc was a good effort, Ford looks to have all the tools, Curtis Taylor is showing he's going to be a good ordinary footballer (I mean that in the positive), more game time for Phillips and his ball use is first class etc etc

But I must say the thing I took away from last night was just how much further we have to go. If we're honest with ourselves, the last two weeks have been against sides with as many youngsters as us, and with more significant 'outs' among senior players. It's just a reminder that other teams have good young players too, and we have big holes. I hope I'm wrong, but Goldy and Taz look to me to be fading - Xerri may took over from Goldy, but it's not certain, and Edwards is years away. As for Taz, Corr - assuming he is fully recovers - is not really like for like. And then there's the known gaps - lack of small forward with scoreboard impact (not a knock on Mahony, he's on the improve, but we need more competition for that role) and apart from Hall, there's not much leg speed from HBF (and even then, his kicking can be either death or glory).

So happy days, we win the Horne Handicap, but we're going to need more than that to keep the green shoots sprouting up

Anyone going into next year with huge expectations is going to be disappointed. Not due to our young players, but our experience. Goldy isn’t getting better, Cunners coming back from serious surgery, another year into our experienced backline.

It’s going to take a couple years till our 22-23 year olds (Jy, McKay, LDU, Steph, Bonar etc.) are ready to lead consistently.

 

[the flying ham]

Anyone going into next year with huge expectations is going to be disappointed. Not due to our young players, but our experience. Goldy isn’t getting better, Cunners coming back from serious surgery, another year into our experienced backline.

It’s going to take a couple years till our 22-23 year olds (Jy, McKay, LDU, Steph, Bonar etc.) are ready to lead consistently.

Im not expecting to play finals but it is a distinct possibility. A bit of luck with injuries, favourable draw and maybe the inclusion of a free agent or trade tseget to slot into the best 22 and we are away.

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[Psicosis]

Im not expecting to play finals but it is a distinct possibility. A bit of luck with injuries, favourable draw and maybe the inclusion of a free agent or trade tseget to slot into the best 22 and we are away.

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Sure it’s possible. I think it’s unlikely though, the rate of improvement would be too steep. A lot depends on Our injury list, ability to master the game plan this preseason & the continued development of our young players. Pushing the 8 would require a near perfect run, which given everything that’s gone wrong this year (injury wise), just seems a bit unrealistic to me.

Suppose my point is, that people shouldn’t be disappointed if things don’t magically click in 2022. As long as we keep improving at the rate we have been, I’ll be happy.

 

[Only Forwards]

Sure it’s possible. I think it’s unlikely though, the rate of improvement would be too steep. A lot depends on Our injury list, ability to master the game plan this preseason & the continued development of our young players. Pushing the 8 would require a near perfect run, which given everything that’s gone wrong this year (injury wise), just seems a bit unrealistic to me.

Suppose my point is, that people shouldn’t be disappointed if things don’t magically click in 2022. As long as we keep improving at the rate we have been, I’ll be happy.

My desire is for us to be mid 6.

1-6 massive over achievement ridiculously excited if we got here.
7-12 - where I want us. Brilliant if we wind up in 7-8th. Good improvement if we wind up 9-12.
13-18 we will clearly have more to work on.

I think this is more realistic in expectations.

I believe with a full preseason under Noble our top end will get better but also our floor will lift significantly.

 

[the flying ham]

Sure it’s possible. I think it’s unlikely though, the rate of improvement would be too steep. A lot depends on Our injury list, ability to master the game plan this preseason & the continued development of our young players. Pushing the 8 would require a near perfect run, which given everything that’s gone wrong this year (injury wise), just seems a bit unrealistic to me.

Suppose my point is, that people shouldn’t be disappointed if things don’t magically click in 2022. As long as we keep improving at the rate we have been, I’ll be happy.

The dees won 5 games in 2019. Sydney 5 games last year. Not sure it is as steep as you think.


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[the flying ham]

My desire is for us to be mid 6.

1-6 massive over achievement ridiculously excited if we got here.
7-12 - where I want us. Brilliant if we wind up in 7-8th. Good improvement if we wind up 9-12.
13-18 we will clearly have more to work on.

I think this is more realistic in expectations.

I believe with a full preseason under Noble our top end will get better but also our floor will lift significantly.

Yep, i think somewhere in the 7-12 range is where we will end up

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[shintemaster]

Great fight back but if we're being really honest the Swans are a far superior side to us at this stage as they missed a lot of chances and had a lot of good players out and their young kids are great kicks of the footy and apply elite pressure.
Also our senior players try their guts out but aren't really of the same quality as Heeney, Papley and Parker etc. Swans are probably a top 4 side next year.
We will most likely be a 6-8 win bottom 6 team but not unexpected given we have to keep adding young talent and that means inconsistency will follow.
Also our defensive pressure is the worst in the comp, in some part due to young guys not quite being fit enough and having to learn and apply those habits every week but a massive preseason could improve these areas. A guy like Phoenix might also help as well.
One thing is clear that the players will know what areas they need to get better at and will be encourage and challenged by the coaching staff.
You can see the young guys taking steps forward and are often not the ones making costly errors that cost goals and are often involved in our chains of possession that create most of our scoring opportunities. Exciting times ahead watching these young guys develop.

I know not the point of your post, but Papley got destroyed last night after quarter time.

Banter aside .... I actually don't mind Bonar. I'm not going to write off a player so quick who is under 21-22 years of age who's only played 20 odd games.
Truth of the matter is whether it be by a run of injuries (although at times unlucky) . You got to admit he has had a few , bad luck , wrongly positioned by our coaches , bad form etc. Out of those 20 odd games (what is it ? lets be real here 3-4 games ?) where he has actually really shown something and would warrant him being ahead of others in our team ? I'm still perplexed how / why Atu got dropped and is not playing in Bonar's position ? I actually think Bonar was selected too premature after his latest injury set back. VFL is not playing at the moment so its difficult ( I get it) but its not like we were desperate for someone in that position.
We have a very fit P Walker who deserves a chance soon , Atu & even Young (medical sub yesterday) who would be ok to be played there. Bonar has proven before that it takes him a while to get match fitness after injury. So why expose him directly in the AFL after 1-2 VFL games ? and vs teams like the Tigers and Swans ? This not fair on him at all.
BS aside . I actually hope Bonar makes it.
For me , once Flynn & Corr get back along the with the players I previously mentioned . Bonar is depth. Good depth mind you. Pressure for spots is what makes Premiership teams successful.
Lastly as for me being clueless? Franky Thing , Thring whoever you are ... what can I say ? I better not dig up some of the vomit you have posted previously here on BF cos it isn't going to be pretty.
Love you too Franky .

Nah, there's still a spot for him at the moment - particularly with JZ & Tarrant closer to the end and Walker realistically journeyman quality. When give a genuine defensive task and fit Bonar seems to have that ability to make his opponent disappear. You need a could of genuine stoppers amongst the attacking backs.

 

[Merlin007]

Anyone going into next year with huge expectations is going to be disappointed. Not due to our young players, but our experience. Goldy isn’t getting better, Cunners coming back from serious surgery, another year into our experienced backline.

It’s going to take a couple years till our 22-23 year olds (Jy, McKay, LDU, Steph, Bonar etc.) are ready to lead consistently.

Im not expecting to play finals but it is a distinct possibility. A bit of luck with injuries, favourable draw and maybe the inclusion of a free agent or trade tseget to slot into the best 22 and we are away.

On SM-G950F using BigFooty.com mobile app

Sure, on balance I'm bullish as well, and I'm not expecting miracles next year, I just think there's a fair way to go: there's not much KPD depth; the HB flankers are either coming to the end (Ziebell, Hall) or not shown enough durability (Perez, Bonar); Mahony is the first choice small forward without much else to pick from. This draft is crucial, and some moneyball recruits who blossom (eg Hind at Essendon) would be a bonus. In Brady, Clayton and Luff, we trust

 

[Psicosis]

Sure, on balance I'm bullish as well, and I'm not expecting miracles next year, I just think there's a fair way to go: there's not much KPD depth; the HB flankers are either coming to the end (Ziebell, Hall) or not shown enough durability (Perez, Bonar); Mahony is the first choice small forward without much else to pick from. This draft is crucial, and some moneyball recruits who blossom (eg Hind at Essendon) would be a bonus. In Brady, Clayton and Luff, we trust

Spot on. The list has come a long way, but we still have a way to go.

 

[Passmore]

Anyone going into next year with huge expectations is going to be disappointed. Not due to our young players, but our experience. Goldy isn’t getting better, Cunners coming back from serious surgery, another year into our experienced backline.

It’s going to take a couple years till our 22-23 year olds (Jy, McKay, LDU, Steph, Bonar etc.) are ready to lead consistently.

We could top up and have a crack at 7-12, but I doubt that'll be a path we go down. The message from the club has been consistent.

We're building around the time that Jy, LDU, Stepho, TT, McKay, Larkey, Zurhaar get to the 24-26 age bracket. 2024 is when s**t gets real IMHO.

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[franjon]

How many on here got a feeling when we got to a goal the difference in the last quarter, we are going to blow the number 1 pick.

Never. It may seem appropriate in the aftermath while discussing the game or the outcome but I couldn't imagine going into a game not wanting to win. Its part of why I get annoyed with performances like our first half and frustrated with momentary lapses like allowing 2 goals in 2 minutes when we are so close. I'm aware that we need to get some genuine draft talent into the team, but, the focus should always be trying to win the game.

 

[leighlee13]

A bit to hate… a lot to like
Ford has looked like a goer from the start, Jy and LDU been good
Tarryn 17 or so touches and a snag and zurhaar was fantastic I thought.
Curtis Taylor building by the week also.

Impressed by the fight back especially after our dead in the water 2nd quarter performance.

When we were 38 points down i thought it might blow out to a massive loss. What I forgot is thats what we did in the past but not with this group. Love what they are building.

 

[Shagga is all Class]

I think it’s pretty clear that despite finishing 18th, we have some pretty important pillars in place, hence the optimism.

Our list is now regarded as one of the best young groups in the competition (adding pick 1 to that). We have a very respected coach in his first season. We have a clear direction around both list and game plan.

In previous years, we have finished 9th without any of those three things.

We tried the mid table, “improving” on the run option. It did not work.

Call me crazy, but I know what I prefer.

Anyone who watches us play, including the commentators are shocked at the stellar games some of our under 23s are putting out. 38 possession games from LDU and Stephenson? Thomas smooth moving through the guts/forward and kicking 4? Not sure about Simpkin's age but gee he does seem to get 30 on a regular basis. Young forwards kicking regular goals.

And these are not Tom Mitchell possessions either. Or Danger midfield possessions where he looks great on the burst in the midfield and then can't hit the side of a barn with the hype of his getting the ball causing the commentators to need windex, regardless of the outcome. Our boys are actually doing something with it.

Yes, we are last and not firing on all cylinders but never underestimate the fact that pick 1 will give the club some hype for years. Yes, we got a spoon but our pick 1 next season will not be expected to carry the side and be the messiah like Jack Watts. If that were the case, then indeed, we are a rabble.

 

[Heaps of fun]

I agree with the posters who are pushing up the positives, and they are real enough - TT, LDU and Jy against Kennedy, Parker etc was a good effort, Ford looks to have all the tools, Curtis Taylor is showing he's going to be a good ordinary footballer (I mean that in the positive), more game time for Phillips and his ball use is first class etc etc

But I must say the thing I took away from last night was just how much further we have to go. If we're honest with ourselves, the last two weeks have been against sides with as many youngsters as us, and with more significant 'outs' among senior players. It's just a reminder that other teams have good young players too, and we have big holes. I hope I'm wrong, but Goldy and Taz look to me to be fading - Xerri may took over from Goldy, but it's not certain, and Edwards is years away. As for Taz, Corr - assuming he is fully recovers - is not really like for like. And then there's the known gaps - lack of small forward with scoreboard impact (not a knock on Mahony, he's on the improve, but we need more competition for that role) and apart from Hall, there's not much leg speed from HBF (and even then, his kicking can be either death or glory).

So happy days, we win the Horne Handicap, but we're going to need more than that to keep the green shoots sprouting up

Hopefully we can address our KPD, small forward and rebounding issues at this current draft. Another KPD FA stopgap is needed in my mind, can't rely on Corr and Tarrant both getting on the park. Ruck will be a bit of short-term pain once Goldie retires but at least we've added Edwards already this year. 2022 will be another development year and another top 10 pick will be incoming. The good news is that the midfield is already basically sorted and after we grab Horne we can spend the next 8-10 picks in the ND over '21 and '22 to select purely for need.

 

[Merlin007]

Hopefully we can address our KPD, small forward and rebounding issues at this current draft. Another KPD FA stopgap is needed in my mind, can't rely on Corr and Tarrant both getting on the park. Ruck will be a bit of short-term pain once Goldie retires but at least we've added Edwards already this year. 2022 will be another development year and another top 10 pick will be incoming. The good news is that the midfield is already basically sorted and after we grab Horne we can spend the next 8-10 picks in the ND over '21 and '22 to select purely for need.

agree, there's not much to choose from down there; I would think a KPD in the draft will be a priority as well, to which end, if we keep #1, I'd be going hard at trading our first from next year to get another first rounder this year.

 

[Istanbul Roo]

First and second quarter we got beaten around the ball, and a few times out of the centre. Defence then became under pressure and forwards hardly got any ball.
Second half was a good improvement. For me, JZ seemed a bit slow all match - I wonder whether he was carrying something? And it looked like Goldy and Tas are starting to show their age. We clearly need a KPD to replace Tarrant and/or Walker. And then a Ziebell replacement.

 

[franjon]

Hopefully we can address our KPD, small forward and rebounding issues at this current draft. Another KPD FA stopgap is needed in my mind, can't rely on Corr and Tarrant both getting on the park. Ruck will be a bit of short-term pain once Goldie retires but at least we've added Edwards already this year. 2022 will be another development year and another top 10 pick will be incoming. The good news is that the midfield is already basically sorted and after we grab Horne we can spend the next 8-10 picks in the ND over '21 and '22 to select purely for need.

Edwards needs to do what McKernan did - eat the house down, hit the gym and train hard. He has the football ability, he can also go forward and kick goals, also like McKernan.

 

[berniemccarthy]

Mate, we have TWELVE first round draft picks in our best 22. Top end talent is not our issue.

GW

He lacks any weapons outside of hardness.

This is untrue. Most of Jeds possessions he gets because he is so hard at it. Other players would not even get possession to be able to dispose of it either well or badly.

 

[Snojet]

Unfortunate, but this is pretty clear to see. Our game now relies on link up and clean disposal…any top side does really.

If he can play to his limitations he could be a real asset, but he and Dumont, too many times get the footy in hand, panic and bang the ball on the boot. Mcdonald and even Ziebell do this at times when the side is struggling, but I’ve seen enough from those two to suggest they are coming around to the game plan.

Those hack kicks, burning multiple handball options just kills our system of play and halts momentum like no end. It basically gives the footy back to the opposition who set up well behind the ball.

When the players you mentioned started linking up together and got their hands on the footy we just looked a totally different side.

Interesting how it’s our older players who make panicked errors or basic skill errors and cost us momentum and goals.
Is this a hangover from the Scott coaching and training standards?

 

[Roosurgence]

If the tree keeps shaking at the Blues as they chase Cerra, I wonder if someone like Dow can become this year’s Jayden Stephenson?


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You wonder if Dow would just say * you Carlton and be happy to walk to the PSD or is he still contracted?

If I was him I would have no hesitation in walking to the PSD since Carlton seem happy to throw away players for shiny new toys who they pay massive contracts.