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Preview Round 22 St Kilda vs GWS

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Sep 7, 2008
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Inside The Circle Of Zen
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St Kilda
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It’s been a long time coming but in Round 22 for the very first time St Kilda will face the AFL new comers, GWS at Etihad Stadium on Saturday afternoon.

GWS have surprised quite a few this season and have pushed sides in most of their games. Most people expected them to be pushovers and that their recruiting of older players was bad idea, but it has had completely opposite effect. With Power, McDonald, Cornes and Brogan in the team it has really fast tracked the development of quite a few of the kids.

Toby Greene has been the standout this year, averaging an incredible 27.5 disposals a game. He will easily win Giants B&F and if it wasn’t for a week’s suspension he would win Rising Star Award by length of Flemington straight.

GWS are already looking at next season having put a host of their young stars in for surgery.

St Kilda’s season all but came to end last Friday night when they were defeated by Geelong. With only 2 games to go it will be interesting to see how the Saints manage their players, especially this week against Giants who teams normally rest their stars against.

In back of Saints minds will be that their VFL affiliate club, Sandringham will be playing in finals for first time in 4 years and face an elimination final in Round 23. They may decide that it will be more beneficial to kids that they play finals football, even if it is at lower level and pass on opportunity to give them taste of AFL.

Its hard to know what to expect from this game, the Saints should get the job done but they will need to make sure they are on their game and not thinking about post season otherwise Giants are team that could cause big upset.

KEY MATCHUPS
Lenny Hayes vs Toby Greene – From GWS perspective I would be looking at playing Greene on Hayes so he can learn how a champion goes about his business.

Tommy Bugg vs Stephen Milne – The Tommy Bugg will have his hands full against the game’s best small forward. Milne has kicked 50 goals in 2012 and is only 10 goals behind Coleman Medal leader, Mathew Pavlich.

Chad Cornes vs Sean Dempster – In past years at Port Adelaide Chad has gone to Fisher as defensive forward to try shut his run down, but given Dempster now plays that role and is All Australian form its only matter time until clubs start trying to tag him.

Other matchups might be: Devon Smith vs Leigh Montagna andTaylor Adams vs Nick Dal Santo

MEDICAL ROOM
Nick Riewoldt failed to be get up for last week and given Saints season is all but over would be surprised if we saw him again this year.

Rhys Stanley will need to pass fitness test after suffering nasty knock to ribs in a sickening collision with Geelong’s Tom Lonergon. He has been cleared of any structural injury but you have to wonder given how important he is to future of club if they’ll just put him on ice for remainder of season as he can’t seem to get through one game without injury.

SAINTS CHANGES
Sam Dunell (24 disposals, 10 marks, 3 tackles) was easily Saints best in Sandringham’s loss to Williamstown on Saturday. But given the state of the ground, I don’t think you can read into anyone’s performances. There was a staggering 116 stoppages in game, so that alone gives you idea of how game was played.

Jack Newnes (17 disposals, 3 tackles, 1 mark) was another one that stood out along with Raph Clarke (15 disposals, 4 marks) and Jason Blake (18 disposals, 3 marks, 3 tackles, 8 hitouts).

Arryn Siposs (21 disposals, 2 tackles, 4 marks) wasn’t too bad although he was named in the ‘best’. Once again he appeared to play limited game time, so not sure if he’s carrying an injury and they are just managing him through season as he is vital for Zebras finals campaign.

Terry Milera (8 disposals, 2 marks) and Seb Ross (14 disposals, 2 tackle, 2 marks) were both extremely disappointing. Thought they might enjoy the conditions.

Clint Jones (14 disposals, 13 tackles, 1 mark, 1 goal) was amongst it all day but his kicking was once again well below par.

I think it’s fair to say Justin Koschitzke will find it hard to keep his spot in team after a 1 disposal game and being subbed off just after half time. Kosi didn’t record a single stat for entire first half.

When James Gwilt is at full flight he is vital to Saints success, but ever since he has returned from injury he appears to have lost all confidence and is shadow of his former self. He might benefit from playing out season in VFL and regaining some confidence.

ON THE BLOCK: Justin Koschitzke, Jamie Cripps, Rhys Stanley (injury), James Gwilt
IN THE MIX: Sam Dunell, Jack Newnes, Jason Blake, Raph Clarke, Clint Jones

MILESTONE: Jack Steven 50 games
OPEN TRAINING: Friday August 24th from 10.45am at Linen House Centre.

GIANTS CHANGES
ON THE BLOCK: Given Giants have about 7 changes a week, the entire team is on block!
IN THE MIX: Ward (if fit),Bruce, Ugle, Hombsch, Wilson, Whiley, Cooyou
 
I'd certainly be resting one or two this week I reckon. Hayes, if he isn't suspended, maybe someone like Joey. I'd prolly send Ray back to the VFL to give someone like Newnes or Ledger another taste. I don't care so much about structure for the rest of this year, so Kosi is out, especially if Rhys is good to go. Goddard, Dunell, Markworth, or Siposs to play up forward in his absence. If anyone is out for the year I'd like to see Ferguson upgraded and given a run, too.
 
I'd prefer people not to be gifted games - Daniel Markworth included.

Didn't look at all interested in getting his hands dirty yesterday, and has had a number of very quiet games this year (most games have been less than 15 possessions and 7 goals in 12 games is a poor return).

Maybe next year, but we are already giving Cripps a fairly easy ride given his less than fanatical intensity, very ordinary kicking, and average of 9 possessions a game.

I find it amusing that Gram gets plenty of heat from supporters, yet they seem quite comfortable with Cripps always trying to duck out the back door for the easy touches (as long as he occasionally wobbles one through).
 

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Yep, give a youngster or two another taste. It shouldn't matter, considering we are playing against a team of 18 year-old players and St.Kilda are completely out of the finals race.
 
Time to roll out the kids with Geary captain and Saad vice captain.

The man that lives in garage to kick a bag just to rub salt into the wounds of GWS for trading him to us, they must be kicking themselves for letting him go, the recruit of the year without a doubt.
 
I'd certainly be resting one or two this week I reckon. Hayes, if he isn't suspended, maybe someone like Joey. I'd prolly send Ray back to the VFL to give someone like Newnes or Ledger another taste. I don't care so much about structure for the rest of this year, so Kosi is out, especially if Rhys is good to go. Goddard, Dunell, Markworth, or Siposs to play up forward in his absence. If anyone is out for the year I'd like to see Ferguson upgraded and given a run, too.

Please no more yo-yoing for Ray this year. He performed well on Fri night, doesn't deserve to be dropped again. I'd much rather one of our superstars are rested than Ray being dropped.
 
If Siposs can't get through games wouldn't mind seeing Dunell come back in. That way we can roll with Stanley and Wilkes as the two key forwards and a medium in Dunell. If not Dunell then any of Milera, Ledger, Ross or Newnes I'll be happy with.
 
I'd like to see us give kids like Winmar, Ledger, Milera, Newnes against other Kids. Good time to see if Winmar is up to the challenge aswell by starting him off against GWS.
 
IN: Milera, Blake, Newnes
OUT: Koschitzke (omitted), ------, ------​
The two other outs should come from Stanley, Steven, Gwilt, Hayes, Dal Santo and Cripps, depending on whether anyone is sore or unfit.​
Milera / Stanley / Schneider​
Milne / Wilkes / Saad​
As good a game as any to try a forward line with all the smalls. Lots of weapons, surely with that many forwards one of them will fire on any given day.​
 

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If Siposs can't get through games wouldn't mind seeing Dunell come back in. That way we can roll with Stanley and Wilkes as the two key forwards and a medium in Dunell. If not Dunell then any of Milera, Ledger, Ross or Newnes I'll be happy with.

Gee, Dunnell is a cracker. Can't help thinking that Essendon's decision not to father-son him is going to go down as a legendary error.
 
I'd like to see Ledger, Milera, Siposs, Dunell and Newnes get another crack this week along with Winmar who I still think has something to offer us.

I'd also like to see Ross and Markworth get a game, haven't seen them play yet but there are some big raps on them going by the VFL thread.

Please no more yo-yoing for Ray this year. He performed well on Fri night, doesn't deserve to be dropped again. I'd much rather one of our superstars are rested than Ray being dropped.

Yeah Ray deserves to stay in the team and on our list past this year, if only he lived in a garage he would be a certainty to get picked every week, if BT was one of our selectors.
 
IN: Milera, Blake, Newnes
OUT: Koschitzke (omitted), ------, ------​
The two other outs should come from Stanley, Steven, Gwilt, Hayes, Dal Santo and Cripps, depending on whether anyone is sore or unfit.​
Milera / Stanley / Schneider​
Milne / Wilkes / Saad​
As good a game as any to try a forward line with all the smalls. Lots of weapons, surely with that many forwards one of them will fire on any given day.​
I'd be giving Koschitzke this weekend and if he can not dominated against a bunch of kids then i'll agree that he should be gone and not on the list for 2013.
 

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What we dont know is if any of the guys have any "elective " surgery needs. If so it makes sense to do it now, get them right for a good long pre-season. Onto the long term list, straight into the seniors for 1. Curren, 2 Ferg, 3 Arch.

As well as some youth, I wouldn't mind if they gave Raph, Peake, and Polo a send off. Whatever their flaws they've all worked hard for the club.
 
I'll assume Stanley is fit to play, put Roo and Blake on the LTI and promote Curren and Ferg.

B: Ferguson - Gwilt - Geary
HB: Dempster - Simpkin - Gilbert
C: Gram - Newnes - Goddard
HF: Ross - Wilkes - Ray
F: Siposs - Stanley - Saad
R: McEvoy - Armo - Steven
I: Cripps - Winmar - Curren
S: Schneider

OUT: Fisher, Hayes, Kosi, Milne, Dal and Joey
IN: Ferguson, Newnes, Siposs, Ross, Winmar and Curren

It'll never happen but I would love to put our youth up against GWS this week and just see where we are at compared to the mountain of top end talent they have. Dempster, Gram and Schneider would be our oldest players at 28 and we would have 12 players 23 or under including 4 teenagers.

- Let Ferg and Simpkin start on Patton and Cameron. Regardless of what happens just leave them there and let them learn. They will be playing on this duo for the next decade, might as well try and get some sort of mental edge early on.

- Put the heat on Stanley and Saad as the #1 tall/small forwards. No Roo, no Kosi and no Milne means these 2 will cop the best defenders. Let's see how they handle it.

- Give Seb and Curren a taste of seniors to reward their great VFL form this season and so they know how hard they have to work over the summer.

- Try to get Winmar to run out 2 full games, back to back and decide if we keep him on the senior list or rookie him next year.

- Leave Schneider as the sub. I want to see how our young mids go against theirs early on. Schneider will come on in the 2nd half and rack 'em up. Even if we are only a couple of goals up (or even behind) he doesn't come on until late in the 3rd and then we can let the senior guys have a bigger impact through the middle. I want to put in on the kids to win it early though.

- Name BJ the captain and put the onus on him to lead these kids. He has said he wants to be a 1 club player and that he wants to captain the club. Roo has said that BJ is the obvious successor and that he would step aside for the good of the club in 2013, so let's find out how far the kids are willing to follow Beeg. If he can lead this team to a big win over GWS and then get them to back it up against the Blues in round 23 it will tell us alot about how serious he is on leading the next generation for 4-5 years.
 
I'd be giving Koschitzke this weekend and if he can not dominated against a bunch of kids then i'll agree that he should be gone and not on the list for 2013.

Seriously? If Kosi has a good game against a team of 18 year olds we keep him on the list? Unfortunately we dont play teams of kids each week, so performing or not, has no relevance here.
 
I'll assume Stanley is fit to play, put Roo and Blake on the LTI and promote Curren and Ferg.

B: Ferguson - Gwilt - Geary
HB: Dempster - Simpkin - Gilbert
C: Gram - Newnes - Goddard
HF: Ross - Wilkes - Ray
F: Siposs - Stanley - Saad
R: McEvoy - Armo - Steven
I: Cripps - Winmar - Curren
S: Schneider

OUT: Fisher, Hayes, Kosi, Milne, Dal and Joey
IN: Ferguson, Newnes, Siposs, Ross, Winmar and Curren

It'll never happen but I would love to put our youth up against GWS this week and just see where we are at compared to the mountain of top end talent they have. Dempster, Gram and Schneider would be our oldest players at 28 and we would have 12 players 23 or under including 4 teenagers.

- Let Ferg and Simpkin start on Patton and Cameron. Regardless of what happens just leave them there and let them learn. They will be playing on this duo for the next decade, might as well try and get some sort of mental edge early on.

- Put the heat on Stanley and Saad as the #1 tall/small forwards. No Roo, no Kosi and no Milne means these 2 will cop the best defenders. Let's see how they handle it.

- Give Seb and Curren a taste of seniors to reward their great VFL form this season and so they know how hard they have to work over the summer.

- Try to get Winmar to run out 2 full games, back to back and decide if we keep him on the senior list or rookie him next year.

- Leave Schneider as the sub. I want to see how our young mids go against theirs early on. Schneider will come on in the 2nd half and rack 'em up. Even if we are only a couple of goals up (or even behind) he doesn't come on until late in the 3rd and then we can let the senior guys have a bigger impact through the middle. I want to put in on the kids to win it early though.

- Name BJ the captain and put the onus on him to lead these kids. He has said he wants to be a 1 club player and that he wants to captain the club. Roo has said that BJ is the obvious successor and that he would step aside for the good of the club in 2013, so let's find out how far the kids are willing to follow Beeg. If he can lead this team to a big win over GWS and then get them to back it up against the Blues in round 23 it will tell us alot about how serious he is on leading the next generation for 4-5 years.

This is bold thinking and if Watters were to do this, it would be a clever move and encourage youth on the list to have a huge pre-season and that there are opportunities available for those who deserve them.

I would bring in Milera instead of Winmar, he seems from our Sandy scribes that he is not up to this yet and its time Milera had another go in senior team.

Wasn't it the second last round of season when Lyin left out 7 (I think) of team to rest them before finals for a match in Tasmania, that we ended up winning with fill in players? This is the sort of thinking that captures imagination and sets the club alight with possibilities, opportunities and a glimpse of the future.

There is no downside with this approach. We win, no matter what the result is.
 

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Preview Round 22 St Kilda vs GWS

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