Autopsy Round 4, 2020 vs Western Bulldogs

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TheMase

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Sorry I personally don’t see it. You either have natural talent or you work hard to get there.

You can argue for the first but my opinion is that he’s just not that good compared to other 19yo. In fact, McCartin showed much more

And no he does not work hard enough on the ground as a kid.
McCartin scored 8 goals in 15 games in first season playing exclusively forward (defence in parts during 2019).

Blakey scored 19 goals in 21 games first season playing almost exclusively forward.

Finding hard to see how McCartin has shown more, in fact he has struggled as much if not more than Blakey this year.

As for hard work, Blakey is averaging around high teens to early 20s for pressure acts. He would be top 5 at the Swans. So work rate I am not sure is the issue.

The kid will come good and he’ll be bloody good in time.



McCartin should also be good, not having a go at him just illustrating a point.
 

TheMase

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It seems pretty damn obvious to me that a number of players last night just didn’t have their head in the game, almost certainly because of Kennedy Snr passing (and the impacts on Kennedy and Longmire).

For that reason I am just writing the game off and moving on.
 

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caesar88

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Derm been saying that for years.
I've never agreed with him in the past because he generalises. His default setting is "Sydney are too defensive" every time we lose without actually acknowledging the changes we try to make and that they won't always work.

On this occasion though he's bang-on with particular reference to our midfield and the way it operates. Opposition defenders would sleep like babies the night before they encounter our forward entries from the centre.

He even names and shames Parker who is easily our biggest culprit in this regard.
 

caesar88

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It seems pretty damn obvious to me that a number of players last night just didn’t have their head in the game, almost certainly because of Kennedy Snr passing (and the impacts on Kennedy and Longmire).

For that reason I am just writing the game off and moving on.
There were many variables at play that's for sure. But to write it off is a little short-sighted as at the end of the day, many of the recurring issues that have plagued us for a few years now reared their head again. Just as they did a few weeks earlier against Essendon. And just as they will probably do at various stages of the season to come.

It's no reason to panic as it will be that type of season where we will fluctuate, but there are big problems that we need to address if we are to become a 'winning' side.
 

TheMase

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There were many variables at play that's for sure. But to write it off is a little short-sighted as at the end of the day, many of the recurring issues that have plagued us for a few years now reared their head again. Just as they did a few weeks earlier against Essendon. And just as they will probably do at various stages of the season to come.

It's no reason to panic as it will be that type of season where we will fluctuate, but there are big problems that we need to address if we are to become a 'winning' side.
I am not so sure, of course we have things to work on but when I see Kennedy waiting OUTSIDE the contest and not digging in.... things just aren’t normal. I can’t ever recall seeing that but I saw it at least a couple of times last night (probably first half, totally understand the reasons).

The rest of the players then flow from there. Some players heads were clearly not fully in the game, and from a mental point of view you only need to be a few % off for it to all fall apart.

We went too tall and the ball walked out of our forward half (as I said as much I didn’t like Sinclair up forward!!) certainly did not help.

The “problems” can’t be fixed overnight in any case, and are a journey. Not going to hit the panic button from last night particularly given the circumstances.

So yes I am writing it off and we will see what happens next week.
 

caesar88

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I am not so sure, of course we have things to work on but when I see Kennedy waiting OUTSIDE the contest and not digging in.... things just aren’t normal. I can’t ever recall seeing that but I saw it at least a couple of times last night (probably first half, totally understand the reasons).

The rest of the players then flow from there. Some players heads were clearly not fully in the game, and from a mental point of view you only need to be a few % off for it to all fall apart.

We went too tall and the ball walked out of our forward half (as I said as much I didn’t like Sinclair up forward!!) certainly did not help.

The “problems” can’t be fixed overnight in any case, and are a journey. Not going to hit the panic button from last night particularly given the circumstances.

So yes I am writing it off and we will see what happens next week.
Yep Kennedy's game I can understand and write off. But for me it wasn't too dissimilar a performance from the Bombers loss a fortnight ago, only against a better team who punished us more. With many of the hallmarks of our losses going back to 2018.

So while I agree that the problems aren't an overnight fix, at some point they have to be addressed, and not just written off as a bad night.
 

Kummerspeck

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caesar88

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I seriously don't get how someone can look at our game plan this year ( or last year, really) and say "They're doing the same thing they've always done under Longmire".
Agree. It's because these "experts" don't know or care enough about our list to even understand any changes we try to make. A lot of them still refer to Heeney and Mills when talking about our young list and rebuild.

However I agree with Brereton in regards to our midfield, which I still am not sure has changed enough, though the addition of Florent has been a very good move.
 

Skeparovic

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One observation I have made over a number of seasons now is either a lack of trust in their team mates amongst Swans players or a complete breakdown in communication. During almost every game I see three Swans flying for the same ball only to pole axe their team mates whilst the opponents have players stay down who then waltz the ball away. It happens in the forward line, the wings and in defence. If you don't trust your team mate to spoil and halve a contest you fly also and give a structural advantage to your opposition who are waiting front and centre to clean up the crumbs.

There are generally no crumbers in the forward line because Heeney, Blakey and Hayward are all flying for the same contest. Who is remaining front and centre to clean up the spillage from the contest?

Swans need to improve their trust in their team mates or communication to reduce the frequency of this happening.
 

bungee

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McCartin scored 8 goals in 15 games in first season playing exclusively forward (defence in parts during 2019).

Blakey scored 19 goals in 21 games first season playing almost exclusively forward.

Finding hard to see how McCartin has shown more, in fact he has struggled as much if not more than Blakey this year.

As for hard work, Blakey is averaging around high teens to early 20s for pressure acts. He would be top 5 at the Swans. So work rate I am not sure is the issue.

The kid will come good and he’ll be bloody good in time.



McCartin should also be good, not having a go at him just illustrating a point.
Blakey's doing all the pressure stuff to give himself every opportunity but he appears to be stuck in the second year blues. He's not the first young player to struggle second year. If he's got to the point where his fear of under-performing is affecting his game then the worse that can happen is he could be dropped.

So maybe he should be dropped for a week or two. There's no shame in it. If you're not producing your best you're probably keeping someone else from getting a chance, and besides, when your worst fears come to pass you can deal with them and get yourself going again with fewer expectations.
 

bungee

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One observation I have made over a number of seasons now is either a lack of trust in their team mates amongst Swans players or a complete breakdown in communication. During almost every game I see three Swans flying for the same ball only to pole axe their team mates whilst the opponents have players stay down who then waltz the ball away. It happens in the forward line, the wings and in defence. If you don't trust your team mate to spoil and halve a contest you fly also and give a structural advantage to your opposition who are waiting front and centre to clean up the crumbs.

There are generally no crumbers in the forward line because Heeney, Blakey and Hayward are all flying for the same contest. Who is remaining front and centre to clean up the spillage from the contest?

Swans need to improve their trust in their team mates or communication to reduce the frequency of this happening.
I think it just eagerness to compete. It's hard to work as a unit when you've blooded 16 new players in just 3 years. That kind of cohesion takes time to develop. Covid lockdowns have made it harder to train as a group when we really do need to as a young group. Our structures have been further thrown into disarray because of injuries to key position players.

Give them time. I commented last week that our players need to gel and when they do this will be a far more effective team.
 

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bungee

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I am not so sure, of course we have things to work on but when I see Kennedy waiting OUTSIDE the contest and not digging in.... things just aren’t normal. I can’t ever recall seeing that but I saw it at least a couple of times last night (probably first half, totally understand the reasons).

The rest of the players then flow from there. Some players heads were clearly not fully in the game, and from a mental point of view you only need to be a few % off for it to all fall apart.

We went too tall and the ball walked out of our forward half (as I said as much I didn’t like Sinclair up forward!!) certainly did not help.

The “problems” can’t be fixed overnight in any case, and are a journey. Not going to hit the panic button from last night particularly given the circumstances.

So yes I am writing it off and we will see what happens next week.
Kennedy was entirely in the wrong headspace. He's quite a private guy but he had a camera right on his face while everyone reminded him that his grandad had just died. Then on his 250th game he was expected to lead the team in the manner of a true champion. I really felt for him.
 

bungee

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I've never agreed with him in the past because he generalises. His default setting is "Sydney are too defensive" every time we lose without actually acknowledging the changes we try to make and that they won't always work.

On this occasion though he's bang-on with particular reference to our midfield and the way it operates. Opposition defenders would sleep like babies the night before they encounter our forward entries from the centre.

He even names and shames Parker who is easily our biggest culprit in this regard.
Dermott is a complete tosser. I wouldn't piss on him if he was on fire.
 

The King!

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Kennedy was entirely in the wrong headspace. He's quite a private guy but he had a camera right on his face while everyone reminded him that his grandad had just died. Then on his 250th game he was expected to lead the team in the manner of a true champion. I really felt for him.
Must have been and it looked uncomfortable standing to a tribute to your grandfather the day he died when you have to play
 

The King!

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Blakey's doing all the pressure stuff to give himself every opportunity but he appears to be stuck in the second year blues. He's not the first young player to struggle second year. If he's got to the point where his fear of under-performing is affecting his game then the worse that can happen is he could be dropped.

So maybe he should be dropped for a week or two. There's no shame in it. If you're not producing your best you're probably keeping someone else from getting a chance, and besides, when your worst fears come to pass you can deal with them and get yourself going again with fewer expectations.
You should tell Shane Warne it doesn’t matter if you get dropped
 

bungee

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fu** me I hate the brave dogs ..
Me too, more than any team. Possibly even more than Hawthorn. I despise the dogs, their coach, their fans, their families, their friends, their neighbours, their neighbours' neighbours, their neighbours' neighbours' dogs. I especially hate their bogan haircuts. I hate listening to commentators bang on about them (hey, we were playing too, at least for the last quarter). I hate their umpires who clearly flew up in the plane with them and joined the commentators in the love-fest of brave-dog worship. It brought me back to the 2016 GF and the premiership we were cheated out of. A GF that cut down our Hanners in his prime and saw that money-grubbing Mitchell abandon us for the lure of filthy Hawthorn cash.
 

bungee

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Sad for Naismith,

Disgraceful performance.

Without papley this side would struggle to kick a goal.
As good as Papley is he really pisses me off when he turns his back on the goals as he walks back for a set shot, especially when he's at the edge of his range and missing quite a few. There's always a chance that someone will lead to a better position but nah, not Papley. There was a time when that would have got you shot by a coach. FFS. Are we so far away from the basics ? The only Swan who could ever justify doing that was Plugger, as he was a better set shot from 50m than practically anyone else from anywhere inside 50..
 

bungee

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Final vent. What the fu** does Aliir bring to our team ? He can't kick. He can't take a contested mark and struggles with uncontested marks sometimes. He can't think. You can almost see his brain trying to tick over. He can't run. He can't contest one on one....oh, hang on. He's lazy. He has no physical presence. In fact, he's a lot like Lloyd. Great that we have them both in defence (rolls eyes).

Heeney needs to start playing football. His deft little kicks and wonderfully soft hands are all well and good but I prefer Parker's bash down the door approach. Brutal but mostly effective.

McInerney and Rowbottom were good again. Mills great in the mids on Bont but if he leaves defence there's only Rampe with any hardness. Bring in Gould.
 

TheMase

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Kennedy was entirely in the wrong headspace. He's quite a private guy but he had a camera right on his face while everyone reminded him that his grandad had just died. Then on his 250th game he was expected to lead the team in the manner of a true champion. I really felt for him.
Absolutely he would have been and understandably so. It then flowed through his team mates unfortunately, not anyone’s fault just human nature.
 

The King!

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Absolutely he would have been and understandably so. It then flowed through his team mates unfortunately, not anyone’s fault just human nature.
I think his leadership has a massive influence on the side

our best quarter was the third when Kennedy seemed to collect his thoughts and re engage
 

dosser

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I don't get the criticism of Cunningham in here. His role this year has been as a run-with player and he has generally been pretty good. Last week he completely shut down Polec who was the Roos' highly paid recruit and he is doing a job each week. I'm not sure what is expected in here? Shut his man down as well as be accountable for everyone else's man plus win the Coleman? He is in the team each week for a reason and generally does his role well.
Some people in here need to open their eyes more when they watch a game.
 

wills2g

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I don't get the criticism of Cunningham in here. His role this year has been as a run-with player and he has generally been pretty good. Last week he completely shut down Polec who was the Roos' highly paid recruit and he is doing a job each week. I'm not sure what is expected in here? Shut his man down as well as be accountable for everyone else's man plus win the Coleman? He is in the team each week for a reason and generally does his role well.
Some people in here need to open their eyes more when they watch a game.
lets see...

can only play a shutdown role on players who dislike contact as much as he

cant hit a target with time and space

when he doesnt *think* he has time and space he does the ol’ hack kick forward to no one

cant really defend either

hes been on the list for god knows how long (probably cus hes from nsw - there were a fair few interviews and stuff from the swans website afewyears back that kept mentioning nsw nsw nsw nsw) and is probably the same player as when he first started?
 

dosser

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lets see...

can only play a shutdown role on players who dislike contact as much as he

cant hit a target with time and space

when he doesnt *think* he has time and space he does the ol’ hack kick forward to no one

cant really defend either

hes been on the list for god knows how long (probably cus hes from nsw - there were a fair few interviews and stuff from the swans website afewyears back that kept mentioning nsw nsw nsw nsw) and is probably the same player as when he first started?
So you are saying he is like 50% of our squad?
 

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