Review Round 6, 2023 - GWS vs. Brisbane Lions

[buttermuffs]

A simple analogy is the running shot for goal from 50 on the boundary when you have a loose team mate at the top of the goal square. You might kick the goal, but you still should have kicked it to your team mate. The process is more important than the outcome.

Funnily enough this happened twice in the game and both players made different choices that could be seen as the wrong ones.

Clugs ran into the fifty with a 3 on 1 decided to pass off but completely missed the targets and caused a ball up.

Daniher ran in to the fifty later and decided to have a shot instead of passing to a leading Charlie.

In the end though you’re right that I would always prefer Clugs or Daniher to try and kick to an open man for a easier set shot than attempt a running kick from fifty.


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[Tom14]

Yeah so we just weren't good enough to kick straighter or getting easier shots

Norf kicked 12.5 last week and 7.12 this week. Their expected score last week was 61.7 points, and 72 this week - yet they put up 77 against us but only 54 this week.

Were we just not good enough to make Norf kick less accurately?

 

[alscotoz2]

Honestly we aren’t really a ruthless team. We get a few goals up and start to lay off the pedal. Has been like this for years. Even the Norf game we could have won by 100 easy that’s how s**t they were but really didn’t sink the dagger in when we could have. Under Matthews and Voss those guys wanted to not only win but hurt opposition on the scoreboard. I think Fagan and our leaders at the club are too passive.

Assuming you mean Voss the player, yeah, the lions teams that won three in a row were relentless. Maybe we were spoiled?

 

[Nathan Barley]

Norf kicked 12.5 last week and 7.12 this week. Their expected score last week was 61.7 points, and 72 this week - yet they put up 77 against us but only 54 this week.

Were we just not good enough to make Norf kick less accurately?

Think last week was an anomaly. Wind picked up in the second half when we did a greater portion of the scoring

 

[Tom14]

Think last week was an anomaly. Wind picked up in the second half when we did a greater portion of the scoring

I'm sorry, I was there - it really did not pick up a lot.

 

[Nathan Barley]

I'm sorry, I was there - it really did not pick up a lot.

Definitely looked liked it on the footage. McKennas set shot being an example

 

[Grasshopper17]

Yeah so we just weren't good enough to kick straighter or getting easier shots

Perhaps. But we shot the lights out earlier in the game. So much so that our expected score was only 102, even after missing all those easy ones in the last quarter.

I'm at a bit of a loss I must admit, but our accuracy seems to decline throughout the game, indicating fatigue may be a contributing factor?

 

[dlanod]

We need to be more ruthless in these types of games. You only have to look at what the Cats did to the Swans to see the difference between Premiers and Wannabes.

Someone tell West Coast, Dogs, and Richmond they need to give back their premierships because neither had a winning margin anywhere near Saturday's game during their winning season, so they were obviously just wannabes.

 

[Grasshopper17]

I'm sorry, I was there - it really did not pick up a lot.

Yeah there was no breeze at all. So little in fact that fog was coming in late in the game.

 

[Nathan Barley]

Yeah there was no breeze at all. So little in fact that fog was coming in late in the game.

Must have just been some tired boys with kicks not carrying or having much penetration

 

[Bucking Beads]

Someone tell West Coast, Dogs, and Richmond they need to give back their premierships because neither had a winning margin anywhere near Saturday's game during their winning season, so they were obviously just wannabes.

Fair point but I'm comfortable with my belief that sometimes we just aren't ruthless enough. I'd like to see teams fear us a bit more.

 

[Grasshopper17]

Someone tell West Coast, Dogs, and Richmond they need to give back their premierships because neither had a winning margin anywhere near Saturday's game during their winning season, so they were obviously just wannabes.

Richmond won a Grand Final by 89 points and their opposition only managed 3 goals for the whole game. That will do me.

 

[martinson]

Is it a case of not being ruthless or just not being good enough?

I don't understand what people say when they say we're not ruthless enough. Maybe we're just not good enough to control the games for long enough.

Our expectations are high for a team that has yet to be a Grand Finalist.

 

[dlanod]

Richmond won a Grand Final by 89 points and their opposition only managed 3 goals for the whole game. That will do me.

Different year, 2019 was sufficiently ruthless by the metric of "won a game by more than us last week" (since apparently we're not ruthless enough) with a 92 point win over the Suns in Round 16. Interestingly, we also met that ruthlessness threshold in 2019 (Suns), 2021 (Pies) and 2022 (Roos), and would have this year if only we'd kicked an extra point last week.

In case it's not obvious, I think using a margin in a random regular season game as a proxy for "ruthlessness" is silly and not reflective of much in general especially when we're just coming off a massive win.

 

[Grasshopper17]

Say what you like about Aker, but I think he's pretty much on the money when he says this is the best team we've had since 2004.

 

[M Malice]

Richmond won a Grand Final by 89 points and their opposition only managed 3 goals for the whole game. That will do me.

LOL! I would be happy with a golden point win in the GF... preferably over a heartbroken Collingwood, Dogs, Demons or Tigers after we kicked the last 6 goals in the last 5 minutes of regulation time to even the scores.

BTW I know there are now no more GF replays but is it actually golden point or do you need to kick a golden goal to win?

 

[Haso]

Kicking 2.7 in the last quarter was the biggest reason the margin wasn't bigger. Just as kicking 22.20 rather than 26.16 was why we didn't win by 100 last week. Pretty simple really.

Score goes up, score goes down. Never a miscommunication. You can't explain that!

 

[M Malice]

Say what you like about Aker, but I think he's pretty much on the money when he says this is the best team we've had since 2004.

When did he say that Grassy? Recently? I'd love to read/watch it if you have a link.

 

[M Malice]

Score goes up, score goes down. Never a miscommunication. You can't explain that!

Thanks Bill..... Bread goes in toast comes out.. you can't explain that. LOL!

 

[martinson]

I'm in the camp of being happy with any win. And keeping our injury list somewhere where it is now would be an unbelievably outstanding outcome.

It's not much use smashing teams by 100 points at this stage of the season except for your percentage. Likewise who says 1 point wins can't be 'ruthless' .You might have had to be really ruthless at some point in the game to get that win.

Neale in particular is playing a bit within himself this year . Last year he wanted to win the Brownlow, this year he is focused on his leadership and the ultimate prize . Bringing on younger players who can take M/F minutes.

The finals is virtually a whole new season . What you did to get there is immaterial and you get no free shot at it because you've smashed the opposition during the year. The idea for us is to get the advantage of home finals and try to keep our list in the best physical and mental state possible.

I like the way we're going about it this year. Our list has more depth . I like the idea of resting players where appropriate . I'm happy to bank any win however we do it . Playing not so well and banking a win is awesome.

Whether we're good enough and fit enough in September is the question .

 

[lioninthesand]

It's ingrained into the "Ozzy culcha." Blame the victim, not the perpetrator.

I don’t know why people are being defensive at the suggestion. If anything (if true) it just suggests Lachie is an absolute animal who is willing to do anything for the team to get an advantage. It’s not like the ‘ducking’ label players recieve. He didn’t seek to instigate or cheat, no one is suggesting that. If anything it’s a brave thing to do, like standing under ball hoping someone takes you out.

Like EVERY rule in the AFL that gets a focus or is introduced, players will always explore how best to put themselves in a position to get that freekick.

It’s slowly happening more league wide, I noticed lesser versions on a few occasions last week, players when held up in a tackle appear to be going deadweight which dares the tackler to dump them. Why wouldn’t you if you have been caught - you fight it’s holding the ball, you stand still it’s a ball up, you get slung or dumped… it’s a free.

We will never know what Lachies intention was, it looked to me like he went still and dared the tackler to drop him off his feet - the tackler did and he got the free.

I am SURE this will be the first of many examples/discussions where players appear to use this tactic.

 

[M Malice]

I'm in the camp of being happy with any win. And keeping our injury list somewhere where it is now would be an unbelievably outstanding outcome.

It's not much use smashing teams by 100 points at this stage of the season except for your percentage. Likewise who says 1 point wins can't be 'ruthless' .You might have had to be really ruthless at some point in the game to get that win.

Neale in particular is playing a bit within himself this year . Last year he wanted to win the Brownlow, this year he is focused on his leadership and the ultimate prize . Bringing on younger players who can take M/F minutes.

The finals is virtually a whole new season . What you did to get there is immaterial and you get no free shot at it because you've smashed the opposition during the year. The idea for us is to get the advantage of home finals and try to keep our list in the best physical and mental state possible.

I like the way we're going about it this year. Our list has more depth . I like the idea of resting players where appropriate . I'm happy to bank any win however we do it . Playing not so well and banking a win is awesome.

Whether we're good enough and fit enough in September is the question .

Is he playing within himself or is it the arrival of Ashcroft and Dunkley that has lessened his raw numbers output?

BTW I think spreading the load is a fantastic thing for September, we will be harder to shut down through the midfield.

 

[M Malice]

I don’t know why people are being defensive at the suggestion. If anything (if true) it just suggests Lachie is an absolute animal who is willing to do anything for the team to get an advantage. It’s not like the ‘ducking’ label players recieve. He didn’t seek to instigate or cheat, no one is suggesting that. If anything it’s a brave thing to do, like standing under ball hoping someone takes you out.

Like EVERY rule in the AFL that gets a focus or is introduced, players will always explore how best to put themselves in a position to get that freekick.

It’s slowly happening more league wide, I noticed lesser versions on a few occasions last week, players when held up in a tackle appear to be going deadweight which dares the tackler to dump them. Why wouldn’t you if you have been caught - you fight it’s holding the ball, you stand still it’s a ball up, you get slung or dumped… it’s a free.

We will never know what Lachies intention was, it looked to me like he went still and dared the tackler to drop him off his feet - the tackler did and he got the free.

I am SURE this will be the first of many examples/discussions where players appear to use this tactic.

I could be wrong but to my ear the whistle went a split second before Lachie submitted to the tackle, IMO he did nothing wrong or unsportsmen like either way.

 

[martinson]

I don’t know why people are being defensive at the suggestion. If anything (if true) it just suggests Lachie is an absolute animal who is willing to do anything for the team to get an advantage. It’s not like the ‘ducking’ label players recieve. He didn’t seek to instigate or cheat, no one is suggesting that. If anything it’s a brave thing to do, like standing under ball hoping someone takes you out.

Like EVERY rule in the AFL that gets a focus or is introduced, players will always explore how best to put themselves in a position to get that freekick.

It’s slowly happening more league wide, I noticed lesser versions on a few occasions last week, players when held up in a tackle appear to be going deadweight which dares the tackler to dump them. Why wouldn’t you if you have been caught - you fight it’s holding the ball, you stand still it’s a ball up, you get slung or dumped… it’s a free.

We will never know what Lachies intention was, it looked to me like he went still and dared the tackler to drop him off his feet - the tackler did and he got the free.

I am SURE this will be the first of many examples/discussions where players appear to use this tactic.

Don't go along with that at all Lionsinthesand. No sane player wants to be dumped into the ground with no protection and hitting their head.

Lachie knew there was nothing he could do and was just going to hold the play up if the free went against him or hope for a ball up . IMO.

 

[Dalions]

Someone tell West Coast, Dogs, and Richmond they need to give back their premierships because neither had a winning margin anywhere near Saturday's game during their winning season, so they were obviously just wannabes.

Richmond were at their most dominant in the 2018 season where they lost a Prelim to the American.