Review Round 6, 2025 - Brisbane Lions vs. Collingwood

[Nathan Barley]

Will be interesting to see where Dev plays today with only really Noah being able to play a lockdown defensive role last night. We were exposed with that and with Starc at least another month+ away I wonder if it’s something we need to look at.

I'm assuming he'll play midfield again

 

[Schache_off]

Tried to pay a bit more attention to the centre square set up for a lot of the first half. We seemed to be too worried about Daicos and rightly so. Hugh, Cam, Lachie and Ashcroft all had him at different times and it seemed like being aware of his speed and where he was just stopped our guys going for the ball. It's not our style to do a hard tag so I think we went with the right approach, just somehow didn't utilise the quick hands of Lachie and Ashcroft to get the kind of clearances we needed.

Think it was umpire no. 16 which had a few of the howlers. Pies seemed to get a number of free kicks, marks not paid to us and also too many "Not 15"'s applied to Zorko in the 2nd and 3rd quarter when we had momentum. Margin still felt fair, they were right onto slowing down our ball movement and we couldn't find our way through.

 

[martinson]

Just on the Logan push Damo is at it begging for a suspension.

I'd be interested in others thoughts but Logan barely touched Moore who propelled himself into the contest maybe looking for a free. I didn't detect any push. He just had his hand there.

Is that one eyed ? Watched it a few times and that's my conclusion.

 

[Tom14]

Just on the Logan push Damo is at it begging for a suspension.

I'd be interested in others thoughts but Logan barely touched Moore who propelled himself into the contest maybe looking for a free. I didn't detect any push. He just had his hand there.

Is that one eyed ? Watched it a few times and that's my conclusion.

I think he might get cited but has a chance to get off at the tribunal. Can argue that his eyes were on the ball and force was minimal.

 

[martinson]

I think he might get cited but has a chance to get off at the tribunal. Can argue that his eyes were on the ball and force was minimal.

From a couple of angles it looked like he pushed him but from the first angle put up there was clearly no push imo.

The talking heads will ensure he gets cited inevitably.

 

[Tom14]

Belted in the middle, defensive application off, only 37 inside 50s....

Yet expected score loss of 15:



No excuse for the performance but it's not as bad as it looks. The ball movement being so shut down is the biggest concern, and reinforces to me that Kiddy is an auto inclusion when he is fit. Need a player who can genuinely break the lines with a 50m kick.

We can't get shut down when Zorko is quiet.

 

[Paul Mac]

We didn’t use the corridor at all until the final 15 minutes of the last quarter. I am not sure if that was our plan or Collingwood didn’t allow us to go there. I don’t like losing to them but they looked the better team all night. We definitely lacked energy and maybe it’s the kick in the pants we needed.

Maybe the players and coaches knew we were fatigued/not at 100% with our previous games in warm weather , 5 day break etc etc, maybe they wanted to try and play a slow possession game and not make it a quick game as we would have been found out. we were commenting watching the game that we never really tried to play on quickly after a mark or change direction to the middle but personally maybe they just weren't right physically on the night. A game tonight that will not cause me major drama, Only my opinion but the way we played i think the players knew they were going to be in trouble being able to run the game out.

 

[Paul Mac]

It’s definitely evidence of the structure we are missing. Truth is Sam Day’s presence just isn’t being felt.

It’s not about goals but about competing in the air, bringing the ball to ground and pinch hitting in the ruck.

I’m not fussed if Day scores goals but he needs to be capable of impacting the game better. That goes for Eric too last night.

What i am missing most about Joe is him roaming around the ground when playing that second ruck role and getting those 15 odd disposals. 90% of the time Joe would get it and automatically play on and stroll on the left foot and bang 60metres down the ground.

 

[Squizz89]

What i am missing most about Joe is him roaming around the ground when playing that second ruck role and getting those 15 odd disposals. 90% of the time Joe would get it and automatically play on and stroll on the left foot and bang 60metres down the ground.

The one thing that was also particularly obvious with Day’s game last night was just how slow he was to make a decision when he had the ball. I hadn’t particularly noticed that before, so maybe it was a coaching directive to slow down a bit, as you said we may not have had the legs to run the game out otherwise (even though we didn’t anyway). It’s a watch though moving forward.

Back to Joe and you’re right, even though he’d get himself in trouble on occasions you could never fault him for taking the game on. We’re missing a bit of that spark with him gone and Charlie seemingly on the decline. Zac has definitely lifted in this area this year, but he is really the only one forward of centre right now showing anything like that right now.

 

[martinson]

The one thing that was also particularly obvious with Day’s game last night was just how slow he was to make a decision when he had the ball. I hadn’t particularly noticed that before, so maybe it was a coaching directive to slow down a bit, as you said we may not have had the legs to run the game out otherwise (even though we didn’t anyway). It’s a watch though moving forward.

Back to Joe and you’re right, even though he’d get himself in trouble on occasions you could never fault him for taking the game on. We’re missing a bit of that spark with him gone and Charlie seemingly on the decline. Zac has definitely lifted in this area this year, but he is really the only one forward of centre right now showing anything like that right now.

Ah Chee's been good all year and just couldn't get in it much last night though he was ok in defence in the 2nd quarter and we're missing Lohman as well.

 

[Dalions]

It's evident how important Joe was to us.

I really don’t think the forward line was the issue last night

 

[martinson]

I really don’t think the forward line was the issue last night

I was thinking more the total package especially his impact in the centre clearances, around the ground and as a competitive target on the wings.

 

[Section 5]

Belted in the middle, defensive application off, only 37 inside 50s....

Yet expected score loss of 15:



No excuse for the performance but it's not as bad as it looks. The ball movement being so shut down is the biggest concern, and reinforces to me that Kiddy is an auto inclusion when he is fit. Need a player who can genuinely break the lines with a 50m kick.

We can't get shut down when Zorko is quiet.

Credit to the Pies for stopping us going inside the vast majority of the game.
It did not appear we had a plan B last night at all.
We tried stuff for sure but mostly moving a few players around to try to negate the Pies better players.
Continued the mark kick game across half back trying to find a hole that rarely appeared.

The result a low number of I50's as you mentioned
Kiddy would have helped even Reville (injured though) when Zorko penetration is limited.
Pies forcing us wide so even if we marked, that still has us shooting from acute angles and mostly missing.

Lack of players work rate resulted in nobody to kick to, so the backs just shared it around until that long kick down the line.
Falling into the Pies plan of an intercept/spoil/stoppage as there mids were well on top.

 

[Section 5]

Fletcher has been good in defense.
However, the Lions have taken 3 years to end up with a decent group of wingers
In my opinion this was the missing link in our years at or near the top but could not progress come finals time.
Berry, Fletcher and finally Bailey as relief wing/forward made a formidable combination. Some cameos from McCluggage.
This year Levi was given the role as wing relief and that was okay as Bailey was doing a good job forward with a little wing time at stages.
But then moving Fletcher further broke that good combination.

Yesterday Berry for about a half. He also was sent to defense, then a Nic Dacos tag for the 3rd quarter that did not work.
Tunstill & Levi for the game and Bailey. Noticed Willmot for a period and in the last McCluggage for a short time.
I would rather see Fletcher return to the wing and stabilize that area. Someone else in defense until Starch returns.

In no particular order: McKenna, Robertson, Brain, Reville, maybe Levi Ashcroft & Doedee if/when the club think he is ready.

 

[Toffee Lion]

What i am missing most about Joe is him roaming around the ground when playing that second ruck role and getting those 15 odd disposals. 90% of the time Joe would get it and automatically play on and stroll on the left foot and bang 60metres down the ground.

That’s it Paul. It’s not about the goals, Joey himself could give us 1.4 as much as 4.1 but his presence around the ground was immense.

I’m not an Oscar Allen watcher so I can’t comment but if we are into him, I’m not too sure if he brings that presence (He may). I just hope the real replacement (Sorry but Day is a stop-gap) can emulate Joe’s presence.

 

[Tricky Dicky]

I really don’t think the forward line was the issue last night

apart from missing several very kickable set shots.
Bailey, Raynor, Cameron, Morris, Eric?

 

[Toffee Lion]

I really don’t think the forward line was the issue last night

It definitely was a factor. I’m not team hate on forwards when midfield sucks but they’re not immune to criticism.

Last night all 3 areas broke down, some more than others (Midfield) but it was a total team letdown.

Andrews defensively last night was poor again, not having an amazing season to date.

 

[SeaOfFire]

VERDANT FLUFFY FIELDS remain the elusive Shangri-La of the wandering mendicant

Still....5-1, take that every day of reality. Disappointed that we failed to turn up, but, as every bloke at the gents at quarter time will attest.....sometimes you get stage fright

There are bigger challenges ahead, file it, learn from it, move on.

Ezpz lemon skweezy

LIONS
LIONS
LIONS
LIONS
LIONS
LIONS

 

[thedaz]

Tough watch thats for sure. I was bummed before the game, but maybe I was fortunate to be sick enough to not be able to take up my usual seat in the members.

Thought Answerth was the only one who could perhaps hold their head high last night as he seemed to have a very solid game. Most other players were way down on form. Fatigue perhaps?

While I don't necessarily think the forward line is dysfunctional, I think there are some clear underperformers - Day and Charlie Cameron

23

Charlie Cameron

Age

31

Ht

180cm

Wt

76kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

12.1

3star

K

8.4

3star

HB

3.7

3star

M

3.0

3star

T

3.2

5star

G

1.5

5star

D

9.6

2star

K

7.9

3star

HB

1.7

1star

M

3.6

4star

T

1.7

3star

G

1.9

5star

D

9.6

3star

K

5.4

2star

HB

4.2

4star

M

1.4

2star

T

3.4

5star

G

1.2

4star

(unforunately). We haven't been singing 'country roads' a lot recently.

But the midfield was really shown up, with Daicos annihilating us. Ashcroft had his worst ever match if you trust AFL Player Ratings - stark considering he had one of his best ever v the Bulldogs last week.

I've got my own somewhat data-driven match report here if you fancy a read.

 

[scoman]

Midfields need to keep evolving in personnel as much as tactics. We have seen this at the Lions over the years, with only Neale remaining from our first-choice midfield since our return to relevance in 2019. Neale appears to be sliding somewhat and can't really be expected to be our leading possession/ clearance player anymore. For us to continue to compete for flags Clugga will have to continue his early season form, and WAshcroft will need to step up as well. Neale can't/ isn't going to lead our midfield any longer.

 

[TheZork]

Midfields need to keep evolving in personnel as much as tactics. We have seen this at the Lions over the years, with only Neale remaining from our first-choice midfield since our return to relevance in 2019. Neale appears to be sliding somewhat and can't really be expected to be our leading possession/ clearance player anymore. For us to continue to compete for flags Clugga will have to continue his early season form, and WAshcroft will need to step up as well. Neale can't/ isn't going to lead our midfield any longer.

I personally don't agree Neale has dropped off, I just think the effort hasn't been there this year across all midfielders and if I do have one criticism we look one paced.

Ashcroft, Neale, Dunkley and McCluggage are not quick, so we're getting exposed on the spread. This is usually covered up as we win the clearances.

We certainly have a fair bit of shuffling and experimenting to do that with Fort/Smith, Coleman, Doedee, Starce. Fletcher will have to go back to the wing which leaves a spot for say Starce. Still have no idea how we get Coleman and Doedee in the team and stay balanced.

 

[TheZork]

Also I just checked and Cameron is signed until end of 2028, potentially a very poor list decision, his game is based on his athleticism and has slowed the last year or so.

 

[HereIGoAgain]

Inclined to give Fletcher a pass on last night. That match up on Mihocek was a poor decision by the coaches and gave him no chance. Wasted playing off the halfback flank though considering the options on our list.

 

[thedaz]

I personally don't agree Neale has dropped off,

Looking at ratings data, this is so far Neale's fourth worst season start out of a total of around ~10 seasons.

HOWEVER, Neale also started slowly last year as well, and he's not that far off the 2023 pace, when he won a Brownlow.

 

[mpal6]

Also I just checked and Cameron is signed until end of 2028, potentially a very poor list decision, his game is based on his athleticism and has slowed the last year or so.

Can still use his athletic ability to bring a lot of pressure between the arcs.

Charlie has a superior closing speed than many of the midfielders out there. We just need to make him accept that goals are not his priority anymore and he need to get comfortable playing high half forward. Lohmann's return would help in this regard, he can play closer to goal and release Charlie further up.