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Autopsy Round 6 = Collingwood 85-109 Essendon

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lack of forwards and kicking remain our ongoing issues, easy to blame the coach for that and he takes some of the blame but they deal with what they have and it hasn’t been a recruiting focus from list management. Mihocek was drafted as a back! Buckley is trying to solve it making a lot of changes and moving players around, it hasn’t made much of a difference to be honest.

Its list management that’s been our biggest problem and they remain in their roles with no pressure on any of them as Buckley is. I don’t think that’s right. Ned Guy inherited Derek Hines salary cap mistakes because he was doing two jobs and they brought Ned guy into solve it, he decided to pull the trigger last year on fixing it. Why was it so bad? Hine. Geoff Walsh had him doing two roles now we just moved Hine back to a key role of focusing on recruiting players as he always should have been. What other club has done that with their head recruiter. Been no acknowledgement of this mistake his eye was clearly off the ball for 2-3 years and we are feeling the pain from that now.

Graham Wright plays a massive role and decisions at the end of the year this season, if changing coach that’s fine he has had 10 years but he has to review list management that’s where our problems start and Hine needs to be under the same pressure to deliver. It can turn quickly with just a couple of good decisions
 
Hardas said:
A lot of them certainly aren't playing like they have much belief in the message.
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I'll be interested to see what happens to Ruscoe. I saw two of the weakest efforts in a long time when it came to putting his body on the line. It shows how rare it is in today's football. It looked so out of place and more like something you'd see in an under 12's game.
 
Well, I never thought I would say this, but I think now is the time for Bucks to announce his retirement. We need to appoint a new head coach in the next couple of months. (Don Pyke is my pick). If we do not want an extended re-build period, we need to show potential FA's that we are a club heading in the right direction. Sure, we will get Nick Daicos, but we need to gain some serious experienced talent into the club. I think there is still scope for some serious salary cap relief at season's end but there is no point in having that if nobody wants to come. 2021 is now dead. Thanks to Bucks for all he has given to the club. I still admire and respect you but I think we all know that it's time.
 
grayza2018 said:
Plenty want to have their cake and eat it, too. Especially on the back of contending years and hanging in there, it's hard to accept.

Hopefully we nail a mid season pick, get Nick Daicos in, and some green shoots start coming through quickly with the current squad, and the pain of this list transition doesn't last too long
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sounds nice and wholesome but it isnt that simple.

for example, I have seen that Matt Rendell has been promoting the prospects of the young collingwood players. I dont have access to the herald sun so others might know more about this.

I saw a reference that said that he thought they were the best set of young players.

Now he's either saying that to promote himself as he was part of the selection or to support his mate Derek Hine. I've watched the VFL matches and there are some good signs from a couple of players but a lot of them are not that inspiring. I was watching carlton the other day and particularly liam jones and amazing transformations do occur, but you normally see something when a kid is 18 or 19. You especially see something when a kid is older like the browns.

The point that i'm making is Rendell is doing a number on Pies supporters to promote his career as a pundit. He knows if he feeds pie fans dreams that he will asked back for further interviews at SEN etc. In short, its good for business and it helps out his mate Derek.

So unrealistic expectations will be fed long after buckley is gone. In fact, we will still have "blame bucks" threads long after he is doing 9 to 5 at SEN. Put that down in the predictor.
 

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kickitolachie said:
It was obvious at the start of the season that if there were any absentees from the top group of players, there was nothing behind them and the team would crash. Even that thin crust was only enough for a competitive but not contending team.
..........................................................................................................................................................................................................

The appalling treatment of the good players we unloaded through poor management severely damaged my faith in the club, but if you are going to support a team, you do it through thick and thin. If they are trying to correct past mistakes, you support them. You don't if they don't try. I believe that they clearly are making all the effort that the system allows them to. There is no point in endlessly bagging our own players, or calling for the coaches head when the fault lies elsewhere. With management if you need it spelled out.
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I agree with your basic premise that if people are trying to correct past mistakes they should be supported. However, in our case, the people trying to correct the mistakes are the one's who made the mistakes (Hine, Guy, Buckley et al), and in the case of the coaches, I see little evidence of a genuine attempt to correct the game plan or adjust the selection process to bolster weaknesses and inject the right kind of youth into the side.

In fact, IMO the coaches are themselves mistakes that need to be corrected. Buckley surely bears some responsibility for the state of our list and the types of players that have been recruited. The coaching panel certainly are responsible for a dreadful game plan and the poor skills and option selections of the players moving out of defensive 50 and entering forward 50. I will be calling for their heads until changes occur. The selectors inexplicably retain players in the side who offer little week after week then omit the likes of Sier who offers a partial solution to our lack of players of size in their clearances. I fail to see how a player like Ruscoe could possibly be seen to offer more than Sier to our team.

Grundy may well not be to blame for his absurd contract, but he held out for the generous financial and 7 year terms, obviously believing he is worth this kind of deal. He has also played down the value of winning premierships which is not what supporters wish to hear from their most highly paid player. If he wants to take some heat off himself, he has two choices. He can improve his tap work and marking, provide more of a target in the forward line, and quit making dinky little kicks out of clearances that all too often go straight to the opposition and rarely seem to advantage our side. Or he can eat humble pie, admit that he is a fake messiah, and take a significant pay cut in order to allow more flexibility in player recruitment. In the meantime, he deserves the flak he is copping for ordinary performances, and is well insulated from the criticism by the yearly million dollar salary he is on.
 
Carringbush2010 said:
No one here or in the supporter base has an option to 'accept', we've gone into rebuild whether or not by necessity is regardless. As soon as we got pineappled up the rear in the 'trade' period us fans knew we were no longer in contention. Some wouldn't 'accept' that but have to now.

Club knew much earlier, would've been nice if the club was / is transparent and just admit we threw the window out the window - again.

Buckley by reading his demeanour and language has already resigned to the fact that he's cooked, something we have to accept.

For me that's hard to take, so so wanted him to hoist the cup with Pendles above his head. But hey the club fkd over the last decade and have to accept criticism now. Gonna be hard for them to regain our trust.
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I think we'll make sure that whoever takes over will need to win a premiership before they get our trust again. So in the leadup to that premiership they will have to wear this anchor around their necks as an added burden.

In the meantime, we're going to be blaming bucks for every game lost and every failed season. You know it and I know it. It will go on and on and on and on. Endless "analysis" of the mistakes of the 2020 trade period. The mistakes in retrospect of the various drafts. If you thought the last 2 years was bad, stick around for the next 5.
 
PonsfordMagpie said:
Buckley's time is up and it's just a matter of waiting now. I think if we lost to Gold Coast and North Melbourne, the club will pull the pin immediately.

The club won't get fresh air until his future is clarified, whether the club says he's getting a renewal but they give him the rest of the year to play youth and see out his contract, or we cut ties instantly.

The last decade will be seen as a "failure" for all intents and purposes. The succession plan will be viewed as a short-term success with the impacts it had in 2010 but a medium to long-term failure. It had its moments and glimpses, but it's been a long grind for much of it.

Positives

• Cameron hit the scoreboard and was actually a decent forward option.
• McCreery has some flair and aggression about him that stands out and he can kick. A lot of Buckley's teams have been "vanilla" over the past decade so it makes for a change.
• Quaynor's development is coming along nicely. I think moving him up to the midfield should be contemplated.
• Murphy didn't look out of place. Better we persist with him than revert back to Mayne.

Negatives

• Played well for the first ten minutes, and then looked second best for the rest of the game. I felt the scoreline flattered us for a lot of the game.
• We don't know how to stick tackles.
• Game plan is mundane and predictable. Zone defences are no longer fashionable, and Buckley hasn't adjusted to it.
• We're now officially a bottom 2 team, and we have no 1st round draft pick at the end of it. At least we have Nick Daicos to look forward to.

It's going to be a hard year. Certainly the worst I've seen since 2004/05. Fast tracking the development of our young players and preparing for a future post-Buckley should be the main priority of the club this year.
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Buckley is a club champion and life member, he will not be sacked mid season.
 
TheGreatGrundy said:
Grundy may well not be to blame for his absurd contract, but he held out for the generous financial and 7 year terms, obviously believing he is worth this kind of deal. He has also played down the value of winning premierships which is not what supporters wish to hear from their most highly paid player. If he wants to take some heat off himself, he has two choices. He can improve his tap work and marking, provide more of a target in the forward line, and quit making dinky little kicks out of clearances that all too often go straight to the opposition and rarely seem to advantage our side. Or he can eat humble pie, admit that he is a fake messiah, and take a significant pay cut in order to allow more flexibility in player recruitment. In the meantime, he deserves the flak he is copping for ordinary performances, and is well insulated from the criticism by the yearly million dollar salary he is on.
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He is well insulated from criticism by his yearly million dollar salary? Does he pay someone to cut out the bad bits in newspapers? Does he pay people who he meets not to mention the criticism that he is getting? I'm curious to know how his fat contract insulates him.
 
Lip Gallagher said:
He will make a great coach IMO.
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Agree and to say he is inexperienced is an insult imo. Has a great work ethic. Played and coached under Clarko, Assistant mids coach at Eagles for their flag year :( He may be arrogant, he may be a bit of a flog. But he knows all about professional culture. You need a coach that is a bit of a C!NT as well.
 
Markfs said:
He is well insulated from criticism by his yearly million dollar salary? Does he pay someone to cut out the bad bits in newspapers? Does he pay people who he meets not to mention the criticism that he is getting? I'm curious to know how his fat contract insulates him.
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It's much easier to live with criticism on a million dollars than on 100000 a year. However, his hefty pay check probably attracts an extra layer of criticism from those of us who don't believe he is value for money. If he feels hurt by supporter's comments, he can always negotiate a pay cut to take some heat off himself.
 
TheGreatGrundy said:
It's much easier to live with criticism on a million dollars than on 100000 a year. However, his hefty pay check probably attracts an extra layer of criticism from those of us who don't believe he is value for money. If he feels hurt by supporter's comments, he can always negotiate a pay cut to take some heat off himself.
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well it might be easier to live with criticism at the level he is getting paid, but i wouldnt think he is immune to it because of the money. I think the fans are doing a good job in making him think that signing a contract was a bad idea. He is far more likely to want to leave the club than to negotiate a pay cut. He played with great passion in the years up to signing the contract. He didnt show that last year. This year he has been better but the fans here haven't let up. They will never let up. I suggest that he should have been advised that the fans would never accept the salary level, even if he had maintained it at 100%. There are obviously some benefits of being with a club like collingwood, but i doubt that enjoyment of footy would be one of them.... maybe you have to wait until youre a few years retired like dane swan.
 

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domus said:
I'll be interested to see what happens to Ruscoe. I saw two of the weakest efforts in a long time when it came to putting his body on the line. It shows how rare it is in today's football. It looked so out of place and more like something you'd see in an under 12's game.
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McCreery brings so much more. I dont think he's a forward, try him defence
Ruscoe out for DeGoey
 
domus said:
I'll be interested to see what happens to Ruscoe. I saw two of the weakest efforts in a long time when it came to putting his body on the line. It shows how rare it is in today's football. It looked so out of place and more like something you'd see in an under 12's game.
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i like his reactions when things dont go his way. He gets a look on his face of disbelief... as if he cant understand why life is treating him so bad..

And yet, he gets this look of enjoyment after goals...sharing with the boys.

I sense extreme immaturity.... which seems to be a speciality with Hine these days. His mum must have wiped his arse until the day he left for Melb.
 
barrackers said:
Despite how bad our kicking was without the horrible misses by Cameron and the boundary ump the first goal of the last quarter would have put us 2 goals up. Do we still lose from that position?
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Irrelevant, our play was too often insipid - it says more about how poor they were than anything else.
 

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Markfs said:
well it might be easier to live with criticism at the level he is getting paid, but i wouldnt think he is immune to it because of the money. I think the fans are doing a good job in making him think that signing a contract was a bad idea. He is far more likely to want to leave the club than to negotiate a pay cut. He played with great passion in the years up to signing the contract. He didnt show that last year. This year he has been better but the fans here haven't let up. They will never let up. I suggest that he should have been advised that the fans would never accept the salary level, even if he had maintained it at 100%. There are obviously some benefits of being with a club like collingwood, but i doubt that enjoyment of footy would be one of them.... maybe you have to wait until youre a few years retired like dane swan.
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I didn't say he would be immune to criticism but rather insulated from it. So he feels it but not to the extent he might if on a greatly reduced salary. His passion for the game does seem reduced, and his comment regarding the worth of grand final wins to players and his use of hub life to excuse his disappointing 2019 performance only fuelled speculation that his determination has dropped a level since 2018. I would have thought that any highly skilled player at the peak of their form would be able to enjoy their football, even at a club like Collingwood. I bet Buckley or Robbie Flower still felt positive about their personal playing experience despite playing in weak teams.
 
Markfs said:
i like his reactions when things dont go his way. He gets a look on his face of disbelief... as if he cant understand why life is treating him so bad..

And yet, he gets this look of enjoyment after goals...sharing with the boys.

I sense extreme immaturity.... which seems to be a speciality with Hine these days. His mum must have wiped his arse until the day he left for Melb.
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I understand his mother's scepticism when she quipped, 'Did the whole team fall over?' during the entertaining phone home call when he debuted. You are right about his facial expressions - I particularly noted his look of utter disbelief when he gave away the 50 meter penalty.
 
Matt_352 said:
Agree and to say he is inexperienced is an insult imo. Has a great work ethic. Played and coached under Clarko, Assistant mids coach at Eagles for their flag year :( He may be arrogant, he may be a bit of a flog. But he knows all about professional culture. You need a coach that is a bit of a C!NT as well.
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I agree with the last sentence completely. I don't think we will achieve a flag or success of any kind whilst the entire club is embracing wokeness!!!
 
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