Autopsy Round 7, 2020: Sydney vs Gold Coast @SCG

[mikey_san]

If Reid is back I’d be persisting with Allir up forward and second ruck and send McCartin down back. Blakey up to a wing.

If O’Riordan is out it might be time to unleash the Ling. *Nup. Managed minutes. Ok, Bell and Wicks. Need to play blokes who have been in the system and have the strength and fitness.

Out:O’Riordan, Stoddart, Warner.
In: Reid, Bell, Wicks.

Blakey badly needs two weeks rest and a reset. Maybe bring him back on the HB line like Lukosius is playing. Agree AA is worth some time up forward - he and McCartin can switch. But having Reid as 2nd or 3 rd tall is going to hurt the opposition so keeping 3 of them forward is a great option - surrounded by Wicks and Papley.
Bell didn't previously show me much to convince. He is good in the NEAFL and a good club guy seemingly.

 

[caesar88]

Would this be a Horse thing or a Cox thing you reckon?

Probably a combination of things. Haven't we also had Kirk and now McVeigh as midfield coaches over the last handful of years?

I think it's more so that Kennedy and Parker are two strongest mids, and our leaders. The coaching staff, Horse especially, cannot imagine the midfield without them, they've been warriors for years with great success and so they are engineering the midfield around them. I get the logic: you set up around your most dominant players. But in the case of our midfield, our most dominant players aren't necessarily our most effective.

5 or 6 years ago you could revolve your midfield around two warriors like JPK and Parker and you'd be a force. Hell, we were! But by 2016, the signs were already there that we'd become a little stale and predictable, as our midfield lost the same way (lack of spread/killed by opposition spread) to the same teams (GWS/Bulldogs.) Incidentally both teams who are now doing significantly better in this regard than we are.

Four years removed from 2016 and it's no longer stale. It's flat out archaic. We need the guy getting first hands to it to provide something different - a burst of pace, attack the contest with speed, the agility to sidestep an opponent, the awareness to assess his surroundings. Horse has to give up the crash, bash, scrap, kick style from the centre. It worked well for years, earned him a flag, but the game is different now, the team is different. He has to embrace this ASAP or the midfield rebuild will never get anywhere.

 

[BloodySwan]

Blakey badly needs two weeks rest and a reset. Maybe bring him back on the HB line like Lukosius is playing. Agree AA is worth some time up forward - he and McCartin can switch. But having Reid as 2nd or 3 rd tall is going to hurt the opposition so keeping 3 of them forward is a great option - surrounded by Wicks and Papley.
Bell didn't previously show me much to convince. He is good in the NEAFL and a good club guy seemingly.

Would rather Blakey play in reserves than in defence. He'd be against VFL level opposition in the scratch matches. He's not going to get much better until he's put on some bulk though

 

[Joycerama]

Could not be more unimpressed with stoddart. Happy to delist at half time. Been on the list a couple of years now and does not look like a league footballer. He torched it every time he touched it, blazed away and even missed basic handballs. The moment he had to be instructed to by Parker to put a block on was enough for me. Completely ruined a potential fast break due to pure incompetence.

COR tries hard but he’s not at state level let alone AFL. First minute of the game he runs up the middle and kicks it straight to a suns player, ball then waltzes down for a goal. Did it 4 or 5 times last week aswell.

Taylor had a solid debut. Excellent composure and good skills. Showed enough to suggest he will be dangerous.

Unless we are getting a player back of similar ilk, we cannot trade papley. Absolute superstar.

Hayward played his best game in years. Taking solid marks, kicking goals and providing dash. Easily in our best.

Stephenson is showing enough. Very clean hands and a heap of speed. I think he lacks a little confidence atm but that is to be expected at this stage of his career. Very happy with him.

McCartin was terrific. Extremely strong hands and set shot looked reliable. We need to invest in him as a key forward for the next 10 years and move Reid to chb

Sinclair was destroyed today, but witts is a very very good ruckman

Parker really stepped up his leadership in jpk’s absence, good to see

Blakey again was very poor

Florent first bad game of the year but until this week he has been great

Rowbottom looks more and more like a senior player every week, might not star but he is making the right plays.

Not sold at all on warner, kicking was atrocious tonight

I think this is an accurate assessment, with the exception of Florent, who I think cancels out every good thing he does by being bloody lazy defensively. I just don’t see any potential elite midfielders in the side, with the exception of rowbum. Without a couple more we will struggle for years.

 

[Dubai Quacker]

I think this is an accurate assessment, with the exception of Florent, who I think cancels out every good thing he does by being bloody lazy defensively. I just don’t see any potential elite midfielders in the side, with the exception of rowbum. Without a couple more we will struggle for years.

Stephens could be elite - but we won’t know for a couple of years.

Hewett would get a spot in pretty much any side, ditto Parker.

Our issue is depth - the bottom 4 or 5 just rotate in & out, in the hope they’ll have a decent game occasionally - better sides don’t do that.

 

[Punts]

Aliir won’t do that against a experienced backline and KD

Doesn’t know how to use his body and like Tippett he basketball jumps

Watch and see imo

Needs to play McGovern role

 

[Punts]

We also won’t get away just bombing into50 against the best defensive sides

Got away with a few yesterday

It’s not a structure

Did we hit up a leading forward yesterday

 

[Millky95]

Did we hit up a leading forward yesterday

We hit Papley in the 4th for McCartin to whack someone in the face and turn the ball over

 

[Punts]

We hit Papley in the 4th for McCartin to whack someone in the face and turn the ball over

Not enough

 

[caesar88]

We also won’t get away just bombing into50 against the best defensive sides

Got away with a few yesterday

It’s not a structure

Did we hit up a leading forward yesterday

And every time we went for a short/low pass (a miracle), our forwards were behind their men. Beyond frustrating.

 

[caesar88]

I'm really not seeing what Warner is offering that Wicks or Foot couldn't offer

 

[SSwans2011]

Pretty excited to see what this list is capable of in a few years time if we can keep all of the kids. Hypothetically in a few years from now, even with Kennedy, Buddy, and maybe Rampe gone, and not factoring in other draftees, could look something like:

FB: Cunningham - Brand - Lloyd
HB: Gould - Melican - Mills
C: Stephens - Florent - Blakey
HF: Hayward - McCartin - Dawson
FF: E Taylor - McLean - Papley
Foll: Aliir* - Rowbottom - Heeney
I/C: Warner - McInerney - Hewett - Ronke

Obviously still a number of holes (most notably lack of long-term ruck option lol), but plenty to work with, and with some astute recruiting and drafting, and a few of the kids coming good, I'm pretty excited about our future. Plenty to like given you'd imagine we could only go forward from here, given the age of the list and current injuries meaning there's very few players presently in the side that you'd expect to retire any time soon.

 

[SSwans2011]

Also, not gonna lie, after what this team has put my heart through in plenty of close matches over the last decade, I'm kind of enjoying going in to each match not being too desperate for a win.

 

[caesar88]

I was really disappointed in Florent's game last night.

 

[mtooler]

I'm really not seeing what Warner is offering that Wicks or Foot couldn't offer

Correct, when he's being played out of his normal position which is something us fans just have to get used to sometimes.

 

[mtooler]

I was really disappointed in Florent's game last night.

What was unique to it in your eyes, looked fairly usual game to me from him.

 

[caesar88]

Correct, when he's being played out of his normal position which is something us fans just have to get used to sometimes.

It's dumb. Why play Warner instead of a more experienced kid more suited to the role?

 

[mtooler]

Pretty excited to see what this list is capable of in a few years time if we can keep all of the kids. Hypothetically in a few years from now, even with Kennedy, Buddy, and maybe Rampe gone, and not factoring in other draftees, could look something like:

FB: Cunningham - Brand - Lloyd
HB: Gould - Melican - Mills
C: Stephens - Florent - Blakey
HF: Hayward - McCartin - Dawson
FF: E Taylor - McLean - Papley
Foll: Aliir* - Rowbottom - Heeney
I/C: Warner - McInerney - Hewett - Ronke

Obviously still a number of holes (most notably lack of long-term ruck option lol), but plenty to work with, and with some astute recruiting and drafting, and a few of the kids coming good, I'm pretty excited about our future. Plenty to like given you'd imagine we could only go forward from here, given the age of the list and current injuries meaning there's very few players presently in the side that you'd expect to retire any time soon.

This years and next years drafts will see a lot of those players delisted or play in our 2s, that is a horrid 22.

 

[caesar88]

What was unique to it in your eyes, looked fairly usual game to me from him.

You watched the game did ya? Ran out of champion data books to read?

He didn't get enough of the ball (not his fault as I've spent the last few pages ranting about) but didn't work hard enough off the ball and didn't seem to want it enough (entirely his fault and within his control.)

 

[mtooler]

It's dumb. Why play Warner instead of a more experienced kid more suited to the role?

Yeah, I know, I'll just get wound up by thinking about it too much.

 

[Punts]

Pretty excited to see what this list is capable of in a few years time if we can keep all of the kids. Hypothetically in a few years from now, even with Kennedy, Buddy, and maybe Rampe gone, and not factoring in other draftees, could look something like:

FB: Cunningham - Brand - Lloyd
HB: Gould - Melican - Mills
C: Stephens - Florent - Blakey
HF: Hayward - McCartin - Dawson
FF: E Taylor - McLean - Papley
Foll: Aliir* - Rowbottom - Heeney
I/C: Warner - McInerney - Hewett - Ronke

Obviously still a number of holes (most notably lack of long-term ruck option lol), but plenty to work with, and with some astute recruiting and drafting, and a few of the kids coming good, I'm pretty excited about our future. Plenty to like given you'd imagine we could only go forward from here, given the age of the list and current injuries meaning there's very few players presently in the side that you'd expect to retire any time soon.

That’s very average

 

[Heeney2Franklin]

Pretty excited to see what this list is capable of in a few years time if we can keep all of the kids. Hypothetically in a few years from now, even with Kennedy, Buddy, and maybe Rampe gone, and not factoring in other draftees, could look something like:

FB: Cunningham - Brand - Lloyd
HB: Gould - Melican - Mills
C: Stephens - Florent - Blakey
HF: Hayward - McCartin - Dawson
FF: E Taylor - McLean - Papley
Foll: Aliir* - Rowbottom - Heeney
I/C: Warner - McInerney - Hewett - Ronke

Obviously still a number of holes (most notably lack of long-term ruck option lol), but plenty to work with, and with some astute recruiting and drafting, and a few of the kids coming good, I'm pretty excited about our future. Plenty to like given you'd imagine we could only go forward from here, given the age of the list and current injuries meaning there's very few players presently in the side that you'd expect to retire any time soon.

Would struggle to win more than 2-3 games with that 22 unless the starting center improves 10x fold, i also dont think the club knows what Blakey best position is.

 

[mtooler]

You watched the game did ya? Ran out of champion data books to read?

He didn't get enough of the ball (not his fault as I've spent the last few pages ranting about) but didn't work hard enough off the ball and didn't seem to want it enough (entirely his fault and within his control.)

There was an interesting moment in the game where a ball carrier closing in on forward 50 having pressure to his left had Florent unmarked right next to him and instead of handballing it to him, ignored him and took the kick under pressure. Perhaps Florent is starting to get down about his kicking and the team is looking for alternate avenues into forward 50.

 

[caesar88]

Would struggle to win more than 2-3 games with that 22 unless the starting center improves 10x fold, i also dont think the club knows what Blakey best position is.

They will never know what Blakey's best position is. I'd like to think Horse will figure it out but he won't.

 

[mtooler]

Probably a combination of things. Haven't we also had Kirk and now McVeigh as midfield coaches over the last handful of years?

I think it's more so that Kennedy and Parker are two strongest mids, and our leaders. The coaching staff, Horse especially, cannot imagine the midfield without them, they've been warriors for years with great success and so they are engineering the midfield around them. I get the logic: you set up around your most dominant players. But in the case of our midfield, our most dominant players aren't necessarily our most effective.

5 or 6 years ago you could revolve your midfield around two warriors like JPK and Parker and you'd be a force. Hell, we were! But by 2016, the signs were already there that we'd become a little stale and predictable, as our midfield lost the same way (lack of spread/killed by opposition spread) to the same teams (GWS/Bulldogs.) Incidentally both teams who are now doing significantly better in this regard than we are.

Four years removed from 2016 and it's no longer stale. It's flat out archaic. We need the guy getting first hands to it to provide something different - a burst of pace, attack the contest with speed, the agility to sidestep an opponent, the awareness to assess his surroundings. Horse has to give up the crash, bash, scrap, kick style from the centre. It worked well for years, earned him a flag, but the game is different now, the team is different. He has to embrace this ASAP or the midfield rebuild will never get anywhere.

Yes, very much agree, some of us were shouting out that we were vulnerable to the top pacey teams, but could outslog lower and middle teams. Wasnt shocked with the losses we had, was fairly predictable at the time.