Autopsy Round 9, 2021: Hawks get bounced

[Sleutheren]

Who is our midfield coach.

It might be time to give Reeves and Downie a debut game soon. If Brockman is not in the team next week, then Clarkson needs to retract from his comments about embracing a rebuild when he’s essentially picking the same players every week and getting the same result.

I'm not necessarily disagreeing with you but I do think we need to remember that playing at Box Hill is still development. For the most part, it doesn't suit young players to come straight into the seniors without first developing an understanding of the gameplan and honing skills against lesser opponents in a slower paced game.

But yes, I'm completely disheartened by the a lot of the players in the seniors that have has this time. We just didn't end up with many quality youngsters who developed their craft from 2012-2017 - given our success in that period, it makes sense... But it's still goddamn frustrating.

 

[JoeHawk]

I've felt pretty positive about things this season but not today. That was a terrible second half effort today.
Should not have let that game slip like that.

Yep. Really noticeable having played the winless team. That said, we’re equal if not worse than Norf right now.

 

[Lotus]

What stage is everyone at?

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What's after acceptance?

 

[Bumps"N"Grins]

Bring on rebuild. Starts in 3 weeks. Put Sicily LTI, S. Mitchell on inactive list and take 3 picks in MSD. They play straight away for O’Brien, Phillips and Moore/Morrison/Hartley. Out with the list cloggers.

And what you are saying is bring in more of the same, list cloggers. Mostly players that have been deemed not worthwhile taking in previous drafts, this is what we have been doing since 2016, try and bring in a player of high known quantity at the cost of four players inside the top 36 in the draft.
I love the likes of JOM, Wingers and Tom Mitchell but as we are learning slowly is that three stars doesn't equal up to 12 top 40 picks in those years.

 

[satan1]

What's after acceptance?

Grief.

 

[rei154]

Question: How do we go about getting multiple first round picks this season and next without trading out picks? Would require a miracle and an ABI to a list manager to provide us with a first rounder for anyone on our list currently.

Question: What do we need to see from BHH players like Downie, Finn, Jeka and Brocky to get them into a side in as dire straights as we are currently?

Question: How big of a list clean out will we have at seasons end?

Question: How was Shiels named in our best? Didn't look like he'd had a good one from what I've read online.

 

[Mercy Seat]

It's game plan.
There's no freedom for the players.
Only hope is clarko gone so the limited talent we have can play their natural game

This is so stupid it doesn’t really deserve a response. But if you can’t see that our list is the issue, I’m not sure why you are bothering with this sport.

 

[Slow Love]

Yes to both.

Can't get him that close and not give it to him.

Agreed he's earned it. You wouldn't nurse him there if it was detrimental to our success or finals hopes. It won't be and he played a vital role in our 2013-2015 premierships. A Hawk Great

 

[Simon Crawshay]

What stage is everyone at?

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Depression

 

[TylerDurden]

Don't know what else to say anymore. The coaches clearly don't know a way out. Neither do the fans. The list is just s**t and we have to accept it. I've pretty much given up and am looking to the draft.

I think it's worse than 2004. That was the worst I'd seen in following Hawthorn for 40 years. But I think this is worse. Today was a dark day for the club. No other way to skin it. Whether it's rock bottom or not, we'll soon find out.

Heat is on Clarko now. Fair and square. The buck stops with him. Fascinated to see how this plays out.

 

[MrPremiership]

Our midfield was really disappointing. Just fail to win midfield battles every week, which flows on to pressure the rest of the team.

Some big name midfielders not delivering.

 

[Mitchell Madness]

This is so stupid it doesn’t really deserve a response. But if you can’t see that our list is the issue, I’m not sure why you are bothering with this sport.

If you can't see its gameplan, that's on you.
I'm not saying we are a top 4 team, but this team isn't bottom 4. Gameplan has us playing like it though

 

[satan1]

And what you are saying is bring in more of the same, list cloggers. Mostly players that have been deemed not worthwhile taking in previous drafts, this is what we have been doing since 2016, try and bring in a player of high known quantity at the cost of four players inside the top 36 in the draft.
I love the likes of JOM, Wingers and Tom Mitchell but as we are learning slowly is that three stars doesn't equal up to 12 top 40 picks in those years.

Particularly when the stars wouldn't be in our top 5 in our premiership years. There's value if we had one freak to at least enjoy watching whilst we draft. Oh Cyril, where is your clone.

 

[Mercy Seat]

Not that we are looking for silver linings, but north would have been pretty much guaranteed a priority pick had they gone winless. This at least makes it a 50-50....

 

[Simon Crawshay]

I'm no fan of Hartigan Frost and co down back but in the last 3 games we have been -63 inside 50's. -63. Let that sink in.
They aren't the best players but I'd get pretty pissed off chasing tail constantly. Those numbers are outrageous

Those numbers are country seconds style statistics

Probably lucky we haven't been absolutely belted given that differential

 

[macdaddio]

I'm 29, hawks supporter since birth, is this the worst the club has been in my lifetime? I feel we were rough in the mid 90s but damn. Trash.

I’m 48 and no it’s not the worst, but it feels like it !

 

[dipper86]

I'm not sure what everyone is upset about ....it was predictable and inevitable.

We have the worst list in the league along with the worst list of young talent coming through.
The fact that Clarkson had us playing competitive football at the start of the year was testament to his coaching.
The reality is we're void of talent and Clarkson ain't god.
5 years of shoddy trades and recruitment has left our list decimated.
The bandaid is finally off.........full rebuild in order, which means some extended pain.
A lot of us have been through it, and well do it again.....

 

[Davo-27]

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My mind is doing this right now

 

[Mojo]

This is so far removed from a Hawthorn team. I hope we recognise exactly where the club is at and make the necessary harsh calls.

 

[westhawk]

So does Burgoyne get to 400 games now? Or was keeping him on the list another mistake?

Was a huge mistake. he was poor last year.

 

[Mercy Seat]

If you can't see its gameplan, that's on you.
I'm not saying we are a top 4 team, but this team isn't bottom 4. Gameplan has us playing like it though

Our list is rubbish. Most people had us, including our own supporters in the bottom 1-4 at the beginning of the year, and that was before we saw the game plan.

Edit: I won’t disagree that we are playing worse than we should be and our confidence is shot.

 

[Hong Kong Hawk]

OK - I’m calling it. Plenty of people say we have to bottom out. Calling bottom. Will always love the club and players who are the elite athletes out there doing it. Hard to read certain posts in here from people almost hating on the players and club. I was born in 1971 and have watched great success in that time with a few lean patches. Anyone who thinks we won’t bounce back hasn’t had the ride I’ve had.

And to people slagging off individual players - say what you like but I wish you were following Richmond circa 1982 to 2016 - that was them all over.

 

[hfc70]

No doubt that we have hit close to rock bottom.

Sadly there is no magic wand. We need to strip the team right back, go to the draft and trade strategically (no ‘top dollar’ players)

Top up players - Hartigan, Hartley, (Scully/Patton - fail), Phillips just don’t seem to have worked.

We need to remember we have the likes of Sicily, Day, Gunston that are Top 10 players.

Young draftees - Brockman , DGB, Donnie...yet to make an impact

There are positive signs but it’s not an instant fix.

Players, I think, won’t be in our next Premiership...Morrison, McEvoy,Burgoyne, Nash, Hanrahan, Howe, Ceglar, Phillips, Shields, Hartley, Hartigan, Cousins, Brooksby, Moore. Thats 14 players that need turning over

Also don’t think Clarko can/will get us there. So we need to start looking....not just assume it will be Sam Mitchell...but thoroughly exhaust our search for the next Premiership coach....like we did when we appointed Clarko ahead of Wallace, Eade & Ayres.

Be patient people. We’ve done it before and we will definitely do it again.

Stick fat.

 

[WWSD]

Our midfield was really disappointing. Just fail to win midfield battles every week, which flows on to pressure the rest of the team.

Some big name midfielders not delivering.

Mitchell, O’Meara and Worpel as the three starting midfielders = same result

The midfield is slow, predictable and lacks talent. Perhaps it might be time to play Impey in the midfield? He’s one of the few players that takes the game on and does everything really well.

 

[Notsoyabby]

Exactly the point.. game in balance first half, and we were getting a few frees.. when the fk balance goes against us, the effect is very clear... when you're a struggling team it obviously hurts

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Yes found some stats; 8 for us at half time and 9 to them so 5 vs 16 in the second half. Question is did we fall off so much that they won 11 more free kicks in the second half which depending upon where paid could be worth a few goals? Will be interesting if Brett Ratten's comments on last night's game has an affect.