Autopsy Round 9, 2021: St.Kilda v Geelong *WEBSTER 100TH* *WILKIE 50TH*

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Agree. But hit that gold in the draft and they can make an immediate impact just like any trade.. we should get a top 6 pick this year. Imagine adding a Smith or Bont or Serong ect to this midfield. Adds depth, future and creates a strong playing group.

This year has been a disaster. Our draw, injuries - basically everything that could go wrong has. It has to turn. Just think to next year with an easier draw, top draft pick and some luck. Will change.


Yeah, it was like everything went right last year, every mature player seemed to play to a good standard, didn't have many injuries in the home and away season, youth adapted to hub life, short quarters helped young legs, all our kids looked to have progressed, competition for spots etc.

This year was the opposite, plenty have dropped away, lost depth and bought in spuds, look rattled, injury, confidence down, no depth etc.

When you bring youth into a bottomed out list they find it hard to hit the ground running, we have enough mature GOPs to keep it together for the kids to shine now. We look 2 plus years off a serious top 4 side still if we get everything right and if we have another year with luck on our side we could jump up early but doubtful of us winning a prelim with what we have unless guys like Bytel and Byrnes turn out to be stars well ahead on expected development and King becomes what we hope he does.

At least we have obvious holes to fill now, Richo had a sieve. Need a long term ruck option, a KPF to replace Membrey and incase Battle doesn't come on, better small forwards and a few mids like Merrett and a couple of developing types. Obviously a gorilla full back as well.
 
Out Marshall

In McKernan

Pretty much sums up the year.


Mc Kernan will be better with out having to be the main ruck or second string to Hunter. Ryder will improve Mc Kernan. Smack's good for half a dozen really good games a year. He's probably the most likely player to kick a bag on our list with the side playing well and getting the ball in to him quickly. He's actually a good lead up forward which are the players who are most advantaged by the new rules. We lose out in the ruck though.
 
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Yeah, it was like everything went right last year, every mature player seemed to play to a good standard, didn't have many injuries in the home and away season, youth adapted to hub life, short quarters helped young legs, all our kids looked to have progressed, competition for spots etc.

This year was the opposite, plenty have dropped away, lost depth and bought in spuds, look rattled, injury, confidence down, no depth etc.

When you bring youth into a bottomed out list they find it hard to hit the ground running, we have enough mature GOPs to keep it together for the kids to shine now. We look 2 plus years off a serious top 4 side still if we get everything right and if we have another year with luck on our side we could jump up early but doubtful of us winning a prelim with what we have unless guys like Bytel and Byrnes turn out to be stars well ahead on expected development and King becomes what we hope he does.

At least we have obvious holes to fill now, Richo had a sieve. Need a long term ruck option, a KPF to replace Membrey and incase Battle doesn't come on, better small forwards and a few mids like Merrett and a couple of developing types. Obviously a gorilla full back as well.
Don’t need anywhere near that many players. You don’t need the perfect list to be top 4. You need a 2 or 3 elite players. They may actually be on our list already. Petracca wasn’t elite 2 years ago. Gawn wasn’t elite until about his 6th year. Salem wasn’t elite 2 years ago.
 

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Jan 10, 2011
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Mc Kernan will be better with out having to be the main ruck or second string to Hunter. Ryder will improve Mc Kernan. Smack's good for half a dozen really good games a year. He's probably the most likely player to kick a bag on our list with the side playing well and getting the ball in to him quickly. He's actually a good lead up forward which are the players who are most advantaged by the new rules. We lose out in the ruck though.
He is certainly not the most likely player to kick a bag on our list. King and membery are certainly more likely. Even butler is more likely. Maybe even Paton is more likely.
 

Mikka84

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Mc Kernan will be better with out having to be the main ruck or second string to Hunter. Ryder will improve Mc Kernan. Smack's good for half a dozen really good games a year. He's probably the most likely player to kick a bag on our list with the side playing well and getting the ball in to him quickly. He's actually a good lead up forward which are the players who are most advantaged by the new rules. We lose out in the ruck though.
I guarantee he’ll have a really good game at some point.. just that sort of player. Just hope he can put a couple more into the mix. Get us through the tough Roma period.
 

lewdogs

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If Marshall ends up missing 4 weeks, it probably couldn't come at a better time. We have four games then the bye. Get him back fresh after the bye.

It's hard to take after such a frustrating loss but we are probably in the best position we've been all season. Coming off a good performance against one of the better sides, Sandy just had a win, Geary back soon.

Problem is we take on the Dogs this week but a few things could work in our favour. They have lost Wood who I think is important to them. They are coming off less of a break and an interstate trip. They have ruck issues and Ryder should dominate.

Very tough ask but win next week and the season is well and truly alive. Lose and we are back playing catch up.
 
Don’t need anywhere near that many players. You don’t need the perfect list to be top 4. You need a 2 or 3 elite players. They may actually be on our list already. Petracca wasn’t elite 2 years ago. Gawn wasn’t elite until about his 6th year. Salem wasn’t elite 2 years ago.

That's true but you need a few absolute superstar dominators to overcome a poo list. Freo have a few elite players on their list but it falls away. Carlton have a couple looking elite like Walsh and Mc Kay and already have Cripps who looks like he's dropped away a bit but their bottom end looks a bit lightweight. Geelong and Richmond are probably sides that have a couple of guns and then a solid spread though.

If we can get King to actually look like a star and Marshall, Gresh, Jones types consistently on the park we are a lot more advanced but then I would be careful about banking on guys with significant injury histories ever becoming reliable best 22 players. Once injuries start hitting players rarely get more resilient. Burgoyne is about the only player I can think of that looked done and came good.

To me the players who are probably depth and not improving are:

Hill, Membrey, Ross, Lonie, Billings, Butler, Mc Kenzie, Sinclair, Webster and Ryder. We need to start to push some of these guys out to the margins.

We have developing high potential in Clark, King, Coffield, Paton, Higgins, Battle, Byrnes and Bytel.

Best 22 locks for the foreseeable future, Howard, Crouch, Wilkie, Steele, Marshall and probably King, Clark and Coffield soon.

At the end Geary, Roberton, Carlisle, Ryder, Frawley, Kent, Wood, Mc Kernan, Hanners, Dunstan, Hunter and probably Clavarino.

Crossroads Long, Lonie, Butler, Webster, Clavarino, Alabakis and Battle.

Injury concerns about playing to their long term potential, Jones, Gresham, Marshall, Paton, Webster.

To early to tell, Allison, Connelly, Alabakis (but probably gone).
 

Veer Right

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Wood for Marshall looks a given looking at Woods numbers yesterday. Nice to see him respond.

Are we getting a votes thread mods or have you all gone on strike because a few posters on here had stern things to say? :D
 

Veer Right

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Mc Kernan will be better with out having to be the main ruck or second string to Hunter. Ryder will improve Mc Kernan. Smack's good for half a dozen really good games a year. He's probably the most likely player to kick a bag on our list with the side playing well and getting the ball in to him quickly. He's actually a good lead up forward which are the players who are most advantaged by the new rules. We lose out in the ruck though.

Eight disposals yesterday? That will equate to three next week, one shot at goal and 6 ineffective hitouts. Love the positivity Gringo but i hope he never plays seniors again.
 
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That's true but you need a few absolute superstar dominators to overcome a poo list. Freo have a few elite players on their list but it falls away. Carlton have a couple looking elite like Walsh and Mc Kay and already have Cripps who looks like he's dropped away a bit but their bottom end looks a bit lightweight. Geelong and Richmond are probably sides that have a couple of guns and then a solid spread though.

If we can get King to actually look like a star and Marshall, Gresh, Jones types consistently on the park we are a lot more advanced but then I would be careful about banking on guys with significant injury histories ever becoming reliable best 22 players. Once injuries start hitting players rarely get more resilient. Burgoyne is about the only player I can think of that looked done and came good.

To me the players who are probably depth and not improving are:

Hill, Membrey, Ross, Lonie, Billings, Butler, Mc Kenzie, Sinclair, Webster and Ryder. We need to start to push some of these guys out to the margins.

We have developing high potential in Clark, King, Coffield, Paton, Higgins, Battle, Byrnes and Bytel.

Best 22 locks for the foreseeable future, Howard, Crouch, Wilkie, Steele, Marshall and probably King, Clark and Coffield soon.

At the end Geary, Roberton, Carlisle, Ryder, Frawley, Kent, Wood, Mc Kernan, Hanners, Dunstan, Hunter and probably Clavarino.

Crossroads Long, Lonie, Butler, Webster, Clavarino, Alabakis and Battle.

Injury concerns about playing to their long term potential, Jones, Gresham, Marshall, Paton, Webster.

To early to tell, Allison, Connelly, Alabakis (but probably gone).
Seems a very half empty list. I don’t see anywhere near the problems with our list compared to a side like Carlton. If Cripps doesn’t come good their midfield stinks. Our list is very well balanced. Just needs a king or a Clark or a Gresham to become elite. If they don’t we finish middle of the road for a few years. If they do the list is good enough for a top 4 finish
 

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He is certainly not the most likely player to kick a bag on our list. King and membery are certainly more likely. Even butler is more likely. Maybe even Paton is more likely.


Membrey is s**t these days and playing a more mobile role. King will do it one day but he looks as mentally fragile as any player in footy at the moment. It will come one day but he looks like even when he does kick a few he's scared of what becoming good might mean. Unless we get him a sports shrink we have the potential to derail a career that should be unlimited in scope. If we * him up and his brother comes good it should be time to hand back the keys to the AFL and move the club to Tassie.

Mc Kernan is a boom bust player, he's got very little middle ground, he can kick four goals in a game or not get touch and you never know which one you'll get. He leads straight lines at the ball and is actually a good kick on goal. He's exactly the type who should kick seven goals with the play on rules....then not get a touch again the next week.
 
Eight disposals yesterday? That will equate to three next week, one shot at goal and 6 ineffective hitouts. Love the positivity Gringo but i hope he never plays seniors again.

Someone wrote yesterday that he was helped off the ground with what appeared to be a significant shoulder injury so he may not even be an option.
 
Seems a very half empty list. I don’t see anywhere near the problems with our list compared to a side like Carlton. If Cripps doesn’t come good their midfield stinks. Our list is very well balanced. Just needs a king or a Clark or a Gresham to become elite. If they don’t we finish middle of the road for a few years. If they do the list is good enough for a top 4 finish

I agree, our best quality is our beige blanket of good but not extraordinary talent. Our best midfield is good enough to trouble anyone especially with Ryder here still. We probably have to find a viable ruck option or have Marshall become an elite first ruck and find another forward/ruck. We are a solid full back off a completed list and probably need a gun balanced mid like Merrett to take over from Hanners. Luckily we have a lot of mid career players and not much in the really old category so have a few years building up before we need to start again.

If King and the smalls don't fire our forward line is a liability too. Bytel and Byrnes would make a massive difference if they can jump up.
 

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That's true but you need a few absolute superstar dominators to overcome a poo list. Freo have a few elite players on their list but it falls away. Carlton have a couple looking elite like Walsh and Mc Kay and already have Cripps who looks like he's dropped away a bit but their bottom end looks a bit lightweight. Geelong and Richmond are probably sides that have a couple of guns and then a solid spread though.

If we can get King to actually look like a star and Marshall, Gresh, Jones types consistently on the park we are a lot more advanced but then I would be careful about banking on guys with significant injury histories ever becoming reliable best 22 players. Once injuries start hitting players rarely get more resilient. Burgoyne is about the only player I can think of that looked done and came good.

To me the players who are probably depth and not improving are:

Hill, Membrey, Ross, Lonie, Billings, Butler, Mc Kenzie, Sinclair, Webster and Ryder. We need to start to push some of these guys out to the margins.

We have developing high potential in Clark, King, Coffield, Paton, Higgins, Battle, Byrnes and Bytel.

Best 22 locks for the foreseeable future, Howard, Crouch, Wilkie, Steele, Marshall and probably King, Clark and Coffield soon.

At the end Geary, Roberton, Carlisle, Ryder, Frawley, Kent, Wood, Mc Kernan, Hanners, Dunstan, Hunter and probably Clavarino.

Crossroads Long, Lonie, Butler, Webster, Clavarino, Alabakis and Battle.

Injury concerns about playing to their long term potential, Jones, Gresham, Marshall, Paton, Webster.

To early to tell, Allison, Connelly, Alabakis (but probably gone).
Harsh on Battle (constantly played out of position) and Butler who 100% has the X Factor we know we need.
 
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Membrey is sh*t these days and playing a more mobile role. King will do it one day but he looks as mentally fragile as any player in footy at the moment. It will come one day but he looks like even when he does kick a few he's scared of what becoming good might mean. Unless we get him a sports shrink we have the potential to derail a career that should be unlimited in scope. If we fu** him up and his brother comes good it should be time to hand back the keys to the AFL and move the club to Tassie.

Mc Kernan is a boom bust player, he's got very little middle ground, he can kick four goals in a game or not get touch and you never know which one you'll get. He leads straight lines at the ball and is actually a good kick on goal. He's exactly the type who should kick seven goals with the play on rules....then not get a touch again the next week.
He has kicked 4 goals for 4 times in 10 years. He certainly isn’t the most likely to kick a bag. History tells us that. King has already kicked 5 this season. Membery certainly isn’t s**t. I find it strange you are rapping a seconds player but calling a very good player s**t.
 
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I agree, our best quality is our beige blanket of good but not extraordinary talent. Our best midfield is good enough to trouble anyone especially with Ryder here still. We probably have to find a viable ruck option or have Marshall become an elite first ruck and find another forward/ruck. We are a solid full back off a completed list and probably need a gun balanced mid like Merrett to take over from Hanners. Luckily we have a lot of mid career players and not much in the really old category so have a few years building up before we need to start again.

If King and the smalls don't fire our forward line is a liability too. Bytel and Byrnes would make a massive difference if they can jump up.
And you could even glass half full and say if king and the smalls do fire our forwards looks bloody good.
 
Harsh on Battle (constantly played out of position) and Butler who 100% has the X Factor we know we need.


Butler looks done, he was worked out towards the end of last year and doesn't seem to have another gear. He's looking like another Lonie that is a good place holder but not quite good enough to bank on being best 22 in a few years time. His one trick is getting out the back in space, teams have someone sit behind him and give him no space and he can't do anything about it.
 
And you could even glass half full and say if king and the smalls do fire our forwards looks bloody good.


King looks then only one that has a huge scope for improvement IMO. The others are known quantities. I don't see Butler making it long term, he's doing what he did at Richmond where he looks a million bucks then drops off a cliff. Lonie has gone backwards this year. I can't see him being on the list long term either. Membrey has had 2 below average years now, at some point you'd say he's not going to improve unless King can become so dominant that he takes 2 defenders so that Membrey has free rein in space.
 
He has kicked 4 goals for 4 times in 10 years. He certainly isn’t the most likely to kick a bag. History tells us that. King has already kicked 5 this season. Membery certainly isn’t sh*t. I find it strange you are rapping a seconds player but calling a very good player sh*t.


Since 2017 Membrey has only kicked more than 3 goals 5 times. In a year where lead up forwards are finding it easier to kick bags he's only kicked 10 goals. Only kicked 20 last year when everyone said he was going to be a gun without Bruce getting in his way. His one trick is jumping at the ball and converting his chances at a higher than average rate, he seems to have lost his accuracy. Last week he was worst on ground apart from the last quarter where he was so bad that they dropped him behind the defence to mop up and make something of his embarrassing night......and he's one of our leaders.

TM's an older third tall forward who needs others to do the prime moving. Mc Kernan is a spud that is either awesome or s**t, if he has a good game he could rip the new rules apart. Worst case he opens the forward line up for others. I don't mind him coming in as a forward ruck behind Paddy.
 
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King looks then only one that has a huge scope for improvement IMO. The others are known quantities. I don't see Butler making it long term, he's doing what he did at Richmond where he looks a million bucks then drops off a cliff. Lonie has gone backwards this year. I can't see him being on the list long term either. Membrey has had 2 below average years now, at some point you'd say he's not going to improve unless King can become so dominant that he takes 2 defenders so that Membrey has free rein in space.
Membery doesn’t have to improve. He is good enough anyway. We also have Marshall and unlike you I’m certainly not writing off butler. I think the forward line is good enough especially if king keeps improving
 
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Since 2017 Membrey has only kicked more than 3 goals 5 times. In a year where lead up forwards are finding it easier to kick bags he's only kicked 10 goals. Only kicked 20 last year when everyone said he was going to be a gun without Bruce getting in his way. His one trick is jumping at the ball and converting his chances at a higher than average rate, he seems to have lost his accuracy. Last week he was worst on ground apart from the last quarter where he was so bad that they dropped him behind the defence to mop up and make something of his embarrassing night......and he's one of our leaders.

TM's an older third tall forward who needs others to do the prime moving. Mc Kernan is a spud that is either awesome or sh*t, if he has a good game he could rip the new rules apart. Worst case he opens the forward line up for others. I don't mind him coming in as a forward ruck behind Paddy.
You really confuse me. Membery is no good now but your happy to call a player who has never been awesome either awesome or s**t. And I reckon you are overrating the new rules on the ability for forwards to kick goals. As the weeks go on forwards are kicking less and less goals than the start of the season
 

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