Current Royal Commission into gangland convictions on tainted evidence & police corruption

skipper kelly

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Don't make the assumption that many of these people have any level of competence.

When you spend 150 years of doing what you like without little external oversight, you would tend to get lazy and take things for granted.
I also think that they know this is a toothless tiger and comments like he said yesterday will have no bearing on anything so why bother wasting time and doing proper research. I am moreso amazed that a lawyer would hand over a 2 page summary and think that is sufficient evidence for their client to make comments at a Royal Commission about a High Court judgement.
 

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Snake_Baker

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I also think that they know this is a toothless tiger and comments like he said yesterday will have no bearing on anything so why bother wasting time and doing proper research. I am moreso amazed that a lawyer would hand over a 2 page summary and think that is sufficient evidence for their client to make comments at a Royal Commission about a High Court judgement.
SK, if you go waaaaaay back in this discussion you will see that I predicted this would be nothing more than a sham.

The people who have been procedurally wronged will slip through the cracks that will be laid open for them, in a stage managed process that is designed to avoid the glare of the High Court, and not a single act of this systematic criminality will render a criminal charge upon a state agent.

I predict Karam will walk next, they will probably stage manage Cvetnovski by granting his earliest parole next year, then attempt to shut him down with a big compensation/non disclosure payout, then the bigger headline names like Mokbel/Barbaro etc., etc., will get reduced sentences.

Folks need to wake up to the fact that we live in an inherently corrupt state that puts on a play in the tabloid media in order to placate the gullible masses.

The state is a gang, and it will always protect its gangsters.
 

skipper kelly

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SK, if you go waaaaaay back in this discussion you will see that I predicted this would be nothing more than a sham.

The people who have been procedurally wronged will slip through the cracks that will be laid open for them, in a stage managed process that is designed to avoid the glare of the High Court, and not a single act of this systematic criminality will render a criminal charge upon a state agent.

I predict Karam will walk next, they will probably stage manage Cvetnovski by granting his earliest parole next year, then attempt to shut him down with a big compensation/non disclosure payout, then the bigger headline names like Mokbel/Barbaro etc., etc., will get reduced sentences.

Folks need to wake up to the fact that we live in an inherently corrupt state that puts on a play in the tabloid media in order to placate the gullible masses.

The state is a gang, and it will always protect its gangsters.

You did snake. Personally, I had no idea that a Royal Commission did not have the powers it needs to properly investigate and expose. It's a shame really. I suppose the whole thing would fall over if from the Government down it could be truly investigated.

I predict one of the recommendations will be greater oversight of PII and disclosure as per the last paragraph of the submission by the Criminal Bar Association. (its on the website).
 

sprockets

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SK, if you go waaaaaay back in this discussion you will see that I predicted this would be nothing more than a sham.

The people who have been procedurally wronged will slip through the cracks that will be laid open for them, in a stage managed process that is designed to avoid the glare of the High Court, and not a single act of this systematic criminality will render a criminal charge upon a state agent.

I predict Karam will walk next, they will probably stage manage Cvetnovski by granting his earliest parole next year, then attempt to shut him down with a big compensation/non disclosure payout, then the bigger headline names like Mokbel/Barbaro etc., etc., will get reduced sentences.

Folks need to wake up to the fact that we live in an inherently corrupt state that puts on a play in the tabloid media in order to placate the gullible masses.

The state is a gang, and it will always protect its gangsters.
You've made predictions (well, you stated as fact) lots of things, some of which you got right and some you got wrong. Mokbel and Barbaro can't possibly get reduced sentences, they were found guilty of crimes and sentenced. The courts can't simply come out and now say 'Well they may not be guilty afterall so we'll reduce their sentences'. You sure you studied law?
 

sprockets

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You did snake. Personally, I had no idea that a Royal Commission did not have the powers it needs to properly investigate and expose. It's a shame really. I suppose the whole thing would fall over if from the Government down it could be truly investigated.

I predict one of the recommendations will be greater oversight of PII and disclosure as per the last paragraph of the submission by the Criminal Bar Association. (its on the website).
Royal commissions aren't all they're trumped up to be. Even this one has found that other lawyers are in Gobbo's position yet the Terms Of Reference haven't been changed to include them, even though they've been changed once already. They also don't have the powers of a normal, every day criminal trial. After all that it's then up to the government how much weight they put on the findings and take (or not take) action.
 

Snake_Baker

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You did snake. Personally, I had no idea that a Royal Commission did not have the powers it needs to properly investigate and expose. It's a shame really. I suppose the whole thing would fall over if from the Government down it could be truly investigated.
The RC has powers, but those are limited by political decree and the cast of characters assembled to conduct them.

I predict one of the recommendations will be greater oversight of PII and disclosure as per the last paragraph of the submission by the Criminal Bar Association. (its on the website).
I doubt VicPol will "officially" ever use lawyers again, but the process will still be wide open to favor the interests of the state.

This is the vacuum we have leftover from the withdrawal of British constitutional oversights.
 

Opine

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The RC has powers, but those are limited by political decree and the cast of characters assembled to conduct them.



I doubt VicPol will "officially" ever use lawyers again, but the process will still be wide open to favor the interests of the state.

This is the vacuum we have leftover from the withdrawal of British constitutional oversights.
If your referring to Privy Council, which was/is essentially the only British mechanism with powers for Australian Constitutional oversight, British constitutional oversight has not been withdrawn; it still exists, but simply requires leave of the High Court to access it. Although the High Court has stated that it is unlikely to give such leave.
 

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Snake_Baker

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I sense your frustration Snake; and I consider your sentiment is not without good reason. I just want to say, perhaps naively, that the best State oversight we have is WE.
Absolutely, but how often do WE ever get to reasonably exercise it?

Our political systems treat us like cattle to be herded.
 
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Opine

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Absolutely, but how often we WE ever get to reasonably exercise it?

Our political systems treat us like cattle to be herded.
This is true. Which is why I think Victorians should support whichever political administration genuinely commits to pursuing an adequate increase in powers and resources for IBAC to carry out its functions, and more.
 

shellyg

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Mr White from SDU again, digging his own hole. I wonder who they have tagged for Mr Pink.

But he admitted arresting her to end the conflict was an option.

"It did cross my mind that might be an option, but there's no powers of arrest for a conflict of interest and I didn't think it would be sufficient to justify an arrest for a perverse of the course of justice," he said.

Mr White said he had no issue with Ms Gobbo's information and the only problem with the cook was that she continued to represent him.

"She didn't do that for anyone else," he said.

But counsel assisting the commission Chris Winneke QC disagreed, pointing to the prison release of Faruk Orman on Friday.

 

shellyg

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petedavo

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Yeah, I read them over the last few days. Very informative in totally. Liked the telephone intercepts and the court of appeal reasons for dismissing each ground.

One of the SDU officers gave evidence yesterday with the first part being public before it went to a closed hearing. He criticised the HC comment about 'reprehensible conduct' but then admitted he hadn't read the full judgments or seen the Comrie and Kellam reports. He had only seen a 2 page summary given to him by his lawyer. I don't get why he wouldn't have read them all including the redacted versions of the reports. Why would a lawyer not prepare their client better than that? It seemed weird to me.
Maybe he doesn't trust lawyers. ;)

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petedavo

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You did snake. Personally, I had no idea that a Royal Commission did not have the powers it needs to properly investigate and expose. It's a shame really. I suppose the whole thing would fall over if from the Government down it could be truly investigated.

I predict one of the recommendations will be greater oversight of PII and disclosure as per the last paragraph of the submission by the Criminal Bar Association. (its on the website).
No, the RC has already been hobbled from any real potential to discover evidence of a conspiracy between Gobbo's handlers, the Prosecutors who prosecuted those cases of Gobbo's clients , and possibly the beaks.
But who's surprised, when there's a big huge serial killing case that could be seriously disrupted should the lead prosecutor have to come back to Victoria to spend her valuable time with a little old royal commission talking about Barty Rizzo and other such matters.

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skipper kelly

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No, the RC has already been hobbled from any real potential to discover evidence of a conspiracy between Gobbo's handlers, the Prosecutors who prosecuted those cases of Gobbo's clients , and possibly the beaks.
It certainly dulled my enthusiasm when I realised that Crown Prosecutors and DPP are not compelled by law to give evidence at the RC.

I still reckon that the last paragraph of the Criminal Bar Associations submission will be recommended in some form by the RC and they will thank the Criminal Bar Association for their assistance.
 

skipper kelly

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This isn't okay either imo. White again, what a creep.

"When she (Gobbo) had a stroke I thought she might have been vulnerable to an approach by police," he told the commission.

I've found the limited amount of his evidence that has been made public to be quite refreshing. Much better than I don't recall
 

petedavo

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Vicpol issues veiled prosecution threat (via the age) against Mokbel if he rennegs on the plea deal that put in inside...

Tony Mokbel: Up a legal creek without a paddle https://www.theage.com.au/national/victoria/tony-mokbel-up-a-legal-creek-without-a-paddle-20190801-p52ctk.html via theage


"If Tony thinks he can row away from his past on a technicality he should know that if that happened he would be hit with a tidal wave of new charges. Sometimes you need to be careful what you wish for."




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shellyg

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Vicpol issues veiled prosecution threat (via the age) against Mokbel if he rennegs on the plea deal that put in inside...

Tony Mokbel: Up a legal creek without a paddle https://www.theage.com.au/national/victoria/tony-mokbel-up-a-legal-creek-without-a-paddle-20190801-p52ctk.html via theage


"If Tony thinks he can row away from his past on a technicality he should know that if that happened he would be hit with a tidal wave of new charges. Sometimes you need to be careful what you wish for."




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Thanks PD but I can't get into that article. Having a laugh at Sly though, has he specified what those new charges might be?
 
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