Current Royal Commission into Lawyer X gangland convictions on tainted evidence & police corruption

[sprockets]

When you testify to destroying a document. And then it shows up in an email.

Supposedly-destroyed evidence showing double-crossing lawyer Nicola Gobbo's influence in a gangland murder case appears to have turned up in an email.

It comes after a detective told a royal commission into Victoria's 'Lawyer X' scandal that he destroyed a document, which has now turned up in an electronic cache.

According to the detective, the unsigned and draft statement from a hitman-turned-police informer was destroyed after the man altered his statement about whether the killing was planned.

The man's story - which implicated other crooks including prolific gangland killer Carl Williams - changed after his lawyer, Ms Gobbo, labelled it "ridiculous".

It's OK to be lawyer and informer: Vic cop - 9News

Evidence a Victorian detective says he destroyed in a gangland murder case involving turncoat lawyer Nicola...

www.9news.com.au

Shoddy reporting for a start. It's not ok for a barrister to be an informant? Before we get uppity it doesn't say 'an informant against her own clients'.

As for the email, If I emailed someone a copy of a document and then destroyed the document the copy doesn't get destroyed at the same time. That doesn't mean the document wasn't destroyed. Unless there's more to it it's a nothing story, as is usual these days.

 

[sprockets]

Does this Nicola Gobbo & co are proofing informant's statements, editing or rewriting them so the story makes sense and fits logically into the narrative?

They're cooked imo.

That was reported and commented on in here a month ago.

 

[Snake_Baker]

Was she also acting for this informant while stitching the gangland murders series up like a patchwork quilt that falls apart on the first good wash?

This is what the RC are attempting to uncover, despite the best efforts of VicPol to keep it buried.

 

[Kurve]

That was reported and commented on in here a month ago.

I think they might have edited that article after I posted it.

 

[Kurve]

Shoddy reporting for a start. It's not ok for a barrister to be an informant? Before we get uppity it doesn't say 'an informant against her own clients'.

It says in the article this informant was also her client. Also Bateson is off his head. imo.

It's okay for a barrister to also be a police informer, a Victorian detective has told a royal commission into the 'Lawyer X' scandal.

While being grilled about the force's use of lawyer Nicola Gobbo to snitch on her gangland clients, Detective Stuart Bateson revealed he did not believe the two roles were incompatible.

 

[Snake_Baker]

While being grilled about the force's use of lawyer Nicola Gobbo to snitch on her gangland clients, Detective Stuart Bateson revealed he did not believe the two roles were incompatible.

He's basically checkmated at this point.

 

[Kurve]

New pod out 'Hunting Warhead'. Episode 2 or 3 iirc covers a police undercover operation where the target was one of the biggest child abuse/pr0n sites on the dark web. Essentially, the police were forced to reveal their tactics because a hacker and a journalist independently had tracked down the owner of the site to find the police had already arrested 'Warhead' the administrator and had stepped in taking over the running of the site themselves.

Hacker and journalist watched the police sharing kiddy pr0n for eleven months. I personally was a bit squirmy about that but the reasoning behind it was sound. The cops were under the supervision of a judge and they were covered by secret legislation in order to do it, so it was interesting in that regard. Does it have any relevance here? The server for 'Childs Play' their target site was in Australia.

That operation was probably done right if morality was questionable, the gangland series of murders was not IMO.

 

[sprockets]

It says in the article this informant was also her client. Also Bateson is off his head. imo.

It's okay for a barrister to also be a police informer, a Victorian detective has told a royal commission into the 'Lawyer X' scandal.

While being grilled about the force's use of lawyer Nicola Gobbo to snitch on her gangland clients, Detective Stuart Bateson revealed he did not believe the two roles were incompatible.

It says:

"A barrister can represent criminals at the same time as acting as a police informer, a Victorian detective has told a royal commission into the Lawyer X scandal.
While being grilled about the force's use of lawyer Nicola Gobbo to inform on her gangland clients, Detective Stuart Bateson revealed he did not believe the two roles were incompatible.
"I think you can do two things," he told counsel assisting the commission, Chris Winneke QC, on Thursday."

He's not saying it's ok for a barrister to inform on their own clients. The author is clearly attempting to muddy the waters (as the media always seem to do these days - and people fall for it/jump on it) by saying he was "being grilled about the police's use of lawyer Nicola Gobbo ...". Sure the inquiry is about that but was his answer in response to a question that specifically included Gobbo informing on her own clients? I'll check the transcript if or when it becomes available but I'll bet you.

 

[Snake_Baker]

The High Court states that covertly informing on clients is a "fundamental and appalling breach" of a barrister's obligations.

Of course, their rulings pale in to insignificance in comparison to the opinions of Senior Detective Des Docket.

 

[Kurve]

It says:

"A barrister can represent criminals at the same time as acting as a police informer, a Victorian detective has told a royal commission into the Lawyer X scandal.
While being grilled about the force's use of lawyer Nicola Gobbo to inform on her gangland clients, Detective Stuart Bateson revealed he did not believe the two roles were incompatible.
"I think you can do two things," he told counsel assisting the commission, Chris Winneke QC, on Thursday."

He's not saying it's ok for a barrister to inform on their own clients. The author is clearly attempting to muddy the waters (as the media always seem to do these days - and people fall for it/jump on it) by saying he was "being grilled about the police's use of lawyer Nicola Gobbo ...". Sure the inquiry is about that but was his answer in response to a question that specifically included Gobbo informing on her own clients? I'll check the transcript if or when it becomes available but I'll bet you.

ta dah ...

"I think you can do two things," he told counsel assisting the commission, Chris Winneke QC, on Thursday.

"Would this ever happen again? Clearly not. But my view is you can be a human source and a barrister at the same time."
Mr Bateson was being questioned about Ms Gobbo representing an accused murderer in a gangland killing, after helping turn a hitman-turned-informer into a prosecution witness for the same case in 2004.

This prompted Commissioner Margaret McMurdo to ask: "Can you be a human source and a barrister acting for someone, when you've also acted for the key witness against that person?"

"Well that, Your Honour, is, I guess, where I feel it's a bit murky," Mr Bateson replied.

It's OK to be lawyer and informer: Vic cop - 9News

Evidence a Victorian detective says he destroyed in a gangland murder case involving turncoat lawyer Nicola...

www.9news.com.au

 

[Snake_Baker]

ta dah ...

"I think you can do two things," he told counsel assisting the commission, Chris Winneke QC, on Thursday.

"Would this ever happen again? Clearly not. But my view is you can be a human source and a barrister at the same time."
Mr Bateson was being questioned about Ms Gobbo representing an accused murderer in a gangland killing, after helping turn a hitman-turned-informer into a prosecution witness for the same case in 2004.

This prompted Commissioner Margaret McMurdo to ask: "Can you be a human source and a barrister acting for someone, when you've also acted for the key witness against that person?"

"Well that, Your Honour, is, I guess, where I feel it's a bit murky," Mr Bateson replied.

It's OK to be lawyer and informer: Vic cop - 9News

Evidence a Victorian detective says he destroyed in a gangland murder case involving turncoat lawyer Nicola...

www.9news.com.au

How do they sit there straight faced and state this stuff?

 

[Kurve]

How do they sit there straight faced and state this stuff?

Can you imagine what's going on behind closed doors?

 

[sprockets]

BTW we know why there's such a thing as client lawyer privilege don't we?

ta dah ...

"I think you can do two things," he told counsel assisting the commission, Chris Winneke QC, on Thursday.

"Would this ever happen again? Clearly not. But my view is you can be a human source and a barrister at the same time."
Mr Bateson was being questioned about Ms Gobbo representing an accused murderer in a gangland killing, after helping turn a hitman-turned-informer into a prosecution witness for the same case in 2004.

This prompted Commissioner Margaret McMurdo to ask: "Can you be a human source and a barrister acting for someone, when you've also acted for the key witness against that person?"

"Well that, Your Honour, is, I guess, where I feel it's a bit murky," Mr Bateson replied.

It's OK to be lawyer and informer: Vic cop - 9News

Evidence a Victorian detective says he destroyed in a gangland murder case involving turncoat lawyer Nicola...

www.9news.com.au

"He said Ms Gobbo had told the court she had acted for a witness in the case and the Office of Public Prosecutions, if not the judge, knew."

So this person, whom she acted for previously, was a witness in this case... Why should that preclude her from acting for the (now) defendant? What she shouldn't be doing is using client lawyer privilege and passing that information on to the cops. It matters not that she might know everything there is to know about the witness.

But again, I'll wait for the transcript.

 

[sprockets]

Lawyer X inquiry still waiting on Gobbo

Nicola Gobbo's lawyers say she's too unwell to front up to the royal commission she sparked but the informing barrister could still be forced to give evidence.

www.news.com.au

Incl:

"Lawyer X inquiry still waiting on Gobbo
Double-crossing lawyer Nicola Gobbo is set to learn within weeks whether or not she'll be forced to front up to the royal commission she sparked.

Georgie Moore
Australian Associated PressNOVEMBER 22, 20195:21PM
Nicola Gobbo's lawyers say she's too unwell to front up to the royal commission she sparked but the informing barrister could still be forced to give evidence.
The turncoat barrister, who informed on her gangland clients to Victoria Police on-and-off between 1995 and 2012, still hasn't provided a requested statement to the inquiry into the scandal.
She was asked to provide one by this week but missed the deadline and cannot be compelled to hand it over.
But it's still unclear whether she'll be forced to appear before the inquiry, after Ms Gobbo's lawyers asked that she be excused on physical and mental health grounds. ..."

PS. Just noticed that in the first 3 sentences they've given a different adjective to describe her each time, with all having the same meaning - Double-crossing, informing and turncoat. Good work News Ltd...

 

[Crimewavex]

Nicola Gobbo will be forced to give evidence to police informer inquiry

Despite arguing she was too unwell, the disgraced lawyer and informer has been ordered to appear before royal commission over the phone on January 29 next year.

www.theage.com.au

 

[Redacted]

Nicola Gobbo will be forced to give evidence to police informer inquiry

Despite arguing she was too unwell, the disgraced lawyer and informer has been ordered to appear before royal commission over the phone on January 29 next year.

www.theage.com.au

Extract 》
"Through the evidence so far, the inquiry has unearthed serious allegations that could warrant criminal charges, including perverting the course of justice."



Sent from my SM-A305YN using Tapatalk

 

[Kurve]

Comment from McMurdo:

“I accept from the medical reports tendered by Ms Gobbo that she is in poor physical and mental health and is presently prescribed extensive medication for these various conditions. I also note that earlier this year, the commission was prepared to accept that Ms Gobbo at that time had demonstrated a reasonable excuse for not appearing before the commission.

“Since then, however, she has had ample time to adjust to her changed circumstances and provide more certainty around her personal life. The opinion of her treating medical practitioners, whose expertise I accept for the proposes of today’s application, suggests at times that she may be so unwell that she cannot give evidence before the commission. But largely for the reasons set out in the written and oral submissions from the counsel assisting, I consider those opinions do not sufficiently take into account the fact that the commission is willing to take her evidence over short periods by telephone to accommodate her medical conditions. Commission is also able to control and limit any cross-examination.

“It is true the medical evidence relied upon by Mr Nathwani on behalf of Ms Gobbo is unchallenged. But the commission has no power to order a medical examination of Ms Gobbo and in any case, it would be difficult to do because of security concerns and the circumstances in which Gobbo now founds herself. Further, the accuracy of those opinions are based on the accuracy of what Ms Gobbo tells her medical practitioners as to her various symptoms. And whilst I accept that she is very unwell, I am also cognitive of the fact that in evidence before this commission, she told her handlers of her preparedness to falsely provide medical conditions to mislead the court to falsely obtain an adjournment of a case to suit her own needs .

“The medical reports are not all one way. Some suggest that her medical problems may be able to be managed and several speak of her resilience. After conversing with her together with her lawyers and the commission lawyers over many hours over several days earlier this year, despite the medical reports tendered on her behalf and the submissions of her counsel and given the commissions preparedness to accommodate her health and personal circumstances by sitting short hours, taking her evidence by telephone and at times reasonable convenient to her, I am not presently persuaded on the balance of probabilities that she has established a reasonable excuse for failing to comply with the notice to attend.

“What I intend to do is to vary the notice to attend to provide that Ms Gobbo will give evidence by telephone, commencing on January Wednesday 29, 2020 and that will be varied and served by the commission lawyers shortly.

“Mr Nathwani, if you have further evidence at that point that her circumstances have changed or deteriorated, you can of course provide that material and renew that application.”


☺

 

[Kurve]

Significant snippet from yesterday.


04/12/2019 15:14
Public hearings round nine day 11

There was a briefing around 2008 on media attention into Operation Petra and Briars, which a journalist had discovered was covering matters like the Hodson murders. Victoria Police were concerned they would discover the role of Gobbo in all of this.

 

[Kurve]

Six bombshell moments, get ready for more apparently.

Nicola Gobbo's fear of being found out led her to break into a fellow barrister's office
Death threats came in thick and fast
Within a year of being registered as a police informer for what was her third and most prolific period of snitching, Ms Gobbo began receiving death threats.

Professional lines crossed between Ms Gobbo and officers
As if the relationship between Ms Gobbo and the gangland clients she was informing on wasn't complicated enough, it also seems she had blurred lines with some police officers.

Ms Gobbo played a critical role in the tomato tin ecstasy bust

Her role in a miscarriage of justice saw a convicted murderer freed
On July 26 this year, Faruk Orman took his first steps as a free man after 12 years behind bars for murder.
He became the first person to get out of jail as a result of Victoria Police's use of Nicola Gobbo.

And she doctored her clients' statements
One of Ms Gobbo's clients-turned-supergrass made more than 30 statements to police helping secure jail time for multiple criminals, but Ms Gobbo bragged to her police handlers that she had edited them all.

Six bombshell moments from the Lawyer X royal commission

A flurry of death threats, doctored witness statements, sexual flings with police officers and a convicted murderer walking free — the Lawyer X royal commission has turned up no shortage of bombshells.

www.abc.net.au

 

[sprockets]

Six bombshell moments, get ready for more apparently.

Nicola Gobbo's fear of being found out led her to break into a fellow barrister's office
Death threats came in thick and fast
Within a year of being registered as a police informer for what was her third and most prolific period of snitching, Ms Gobbo began receiving death threats.

Professional lines crossed between Ms Gobbo and officers
As if the relationship between Ms Gobbo and the gangland clients she was informing on wasn't complicated enough, it also seems she had blurred lines with some police officers.

Ms Gobbo played a critical role in the tomato tin ecstasy bust

Her role in a miscarriage of justice saw a convicted murderer freed
On July 26 this year, Faruk Orman took his first steps as a free man after 12 years behind bars for murder.
He became the first person to get out of jail as a result of Victoria Police's use of Nicola Gobbo.

And she doctored her clients' statements
One of Ms Gobbo's clients-turned-supergrass made more than 30 statements to police helping secure jail time for multiple criminals, but Ms Gobbo bragged to her police handlers that she had edited them all.

Six bombshell moments from the Lawyer X royal commission

A flurry of death threats, doctored witness statements, sexual flings with police officers and a convicted murderer walking free — the Lawyer X royal commission has turned up no shortage of bombshells.

www.abc.net.au

"... no faith in the system". Neither has anyone else thanks to people like Gobbo. And, of course, we also have no faith that crims will be held to account, also thanks to people like Gobbo.

 

[Kurve]

Simon Overland, Graham Ashton, Sir Ken Jones and Christine Nixon to appear over the next two weeks. O_Ooh

The commission is still to unravel just how high up the chain the approval for the decision to use a barrister against her clients went — and whether judges, prosecutors and politicians were in the know.

 

[Snake_Baker]

Ashton knew Gobbo was an informant 12 years ago.

Victoria Police Chief Commissioner Graham Ashton takes stand at Lawyer X royal commission

By Sarah Farnsworth

Posted: 26 minutes ago

Victoria Police Chief Commissioner Graham Ashton has denied he was involved in a deliberate cover-up over the prolific use of gangland lawyer Nicola Gobbo as a police informer.

Key points:

• Graham Ashton said he was not aware of the extent of Ms Gobbo's involvement in 2011
• Counsel assisting, Chris Winneke, accused him of trying to "keep a lid" on the information
• Commissioner Ashton agreed it would be wrong to hide the fact police used Ms Gobbo to encourage criminals to roll on each other

Commissioner Ashton is the first of the top brass to take to the stand at the royal commission that is scrutinising Ms Gobbo's use as a source. He was quickly asked if he had tried to stop the information getting out.

He told the inquiry he had known Ms Gobbo was a source but was shocked to learn of the full extent of her use in 2011.

"I was aware she was a human source before that, but certainly not aware of the extent of it until that period of time," Commissioner Ashton said.

He said he asked for the Australian Federal Police and the Office of Public Prosecutions to be told, but did not realise that information was not passed on.

At the time, Tony Mokbel's drug trial and the infamous tomato tins drug smuggling case were before the courts.

Counsel assisting the commission Chris Winneke accused Commissioner Ashton of trying to "keep a lid" on the information so people did not find out.

"If you were serious that you were concerned about appropriate disclosure being made, if that was your real concern, then appropriate disclosure would have been made rather than an attempt to conceal, I suggest, what has occurred since you became aware of this information," Mr Winneke challenged.

"There was no attempt to conceal," Commissioner Ashton responded.

He also told the inquiry he had not known about Ms Gobbo's previous registrations as a source in 1995 and 1999 until recently.

Evidence before the inquiry suggests the police chief was told about her role as a double agent in 2006.

But Commissioner Ashton said he first learnt Ms Gobbo was a police informer in 2007, when he was the deputy commissioner with the Office of Police Integrity (OPI), the body set up to stamp out corruption, the inquiry heard.

Gobbo involved with lots of people on different sides

As the OPI deputy commissioner, he was overseeing two police taskforces, including Taskforce Petra, which was investigating the murder of the police informer Terence Hodson and his wife Christine.

The inquiry was told Commissioner Ashton had also been looking into the affairs of Ms Gobbo in 2005, including her possible involvement in the leaking of a police file that revealed Hodson was a police informer.

A probe, Commissioner Ashton agreed, painted a "troubling picture" of Ms Gobbo, but did not question why police would use her as an informer.

Mr Winneke said it was clear she was "someone who would get herself involved with lots of people on different sides" and that she was suggesting clients roll on one another.

When pressed, Commissioner Ashton said it was wrong for police to use her to get criminals to roll on each other — if they did not disclose that information.

"It would be wrong to permit that to occur and then not to disclose that, yes," he said.

Commissioner Ashton agreed that the royal commission had uncovered several instances where that occurred.

"It's troubling, yes," he told the inquiry.

He agreed it could amount to a perversion of the course of justice in certain circumstances.

When the Lawyer X scandal first broke, Commissioner Ashton defended the use of Ms Gobbo, saying her use as an informer came as at a "desperate and dangerous" time for Melbourne, during the gangland war.

Asked to explain why he has previously defended police actions, Commissioner Ashton said he was not excusing any behaviour, but trying to explain what officers were thinking at the time.

Police chief questioned at royal commission, denies 'attempt to conceal' Lawyer X info

Victoria Police Chief Commissioner Graham Ashton denies he was involved in a deliberate cover-up over the prolific use of gangland lawyer Nicola Gobbo as a police informer.

www.abc.net.au

 

[Snake_Baker]

So there you go.

We are expected to believe that the deputy commissioner of the OPI was not aware of the extent of Gobbo's informing until 2011, even though he was privvy to the investigations of police corruption with her involvement at the time.

Hilarious stuff. It's like trying to cover a Jumbo Jet with a single bed doona.

Of course, that reliable old police defence staple "the gangland war" got another run today.

 

[Snake_Baker]

Former director of public prosecutions John Champion learnt lawyer Nicola Gobbo was a police informer in 2012 but it took another six years for her clients, many of whom were in jail, to be told.

Mr Champion, who is now a Supreme Court judge, cannot be compelled to give evidence before the royal commission probing Ms Gobbo's role as the notorious Informer 3838. But details about what the Office of Public Prosecutions knew of Ms Gobbo's role and when it knew are expected to come out when Victoria Police's head of legal services Fin McRae gives evidence at the inquiry early next year.

State's top prosecutor knew Gobbo was an informer in 2012

Former Director of Public Prosecutions John Champion learnt lawyer Nicola Gobbo was a police informer in 2012. But it took another six years for her clients to be told.

www.theage.com.au

 

[Kurve]

saying her use as an informer came as at a "desperate and dangerous" time for Melbourne, during the gangland war.

If I hear that one more time I might scream.