Rupert Betheras

[MarkT]

Delisting Betheras cost us a premiership? even if it was just a little bit

**** me dead mark thats just attacking MM for the sake of attacking

Or are you guilty of what you accuse me of? Where did I say delisting Betheras cost us a premiership?

For what it’s worth, again it’s just my opinion, he should have played in the 2003 GF. That alone wouldn’t have won us that game but hell if it doesn’t start at the selection table where does it start. We selected poorly for that game (as I said at the time) as well as in 2002.

Fact is the TEAM was not good enough to win a flag.
When the TEAM is good enough they will.

Ah, so you do get it. We need a good enough team. How do we get that? What part is the coach responsible for? How many pointy end picks is sufficient?

 

[Optimax]

Mark Betheras would of made little to no differnce in 03

McGough probably should of played in 02 but it wasnt our midfield that struggled that day and McGough was never a small defender or tagger.

 

[Col Davies]

Don't pay too much attention to Mark, he just likes to cry a lot.

 

[Johnson#26]

Mark Betheras would of made little to no differnce in 03

McGough probably should of played in 02 but it wasnt our midfield that struggled that day and McGough was never a small defender or tagger.

Adding Betheras, Freeborn, Molloy, McKee and Richardson to the 2003 team (not to mention Rocca ) would change the entire structure for the better. What's done is done, and hindsight is a wonderful thing, however.

 

[Zeke]

Time moves on Opti ..... time moves on.

Wish you would.

 

[Optimax]

Adding Betheras, Freeborn, Molloy, McKee and Richardson to the 2003 team (not to mention Rocca ) would change the entire structure for the better. What's done is done, and hindsight is a wonderful thing, however.

Yes if we added all of them but betheras on his lonesome wouldnt do diddly squat

 

[Stifler's mom]

Mark Betheras would of made little to no differnce in 03

McGough probably should of played in 02 but it wasnt our midfield that struggled that day and McGough was never a small defender or tagger.

This is off the Rupe topic but we lost 02 GF because we had too many inside players and not enough pure outside midfielders. Yes, the type who are treated like the plague on BF.
Apparently if you are an outside player you are inferior to the inside player.

Truth is you need both equally.

 

[MagpieGirl_13]

I don't really remember much of Rupe, I was probably too young to remember players by name or anything, but I've been told lots about him. I wish I could have seen more of him play because I think he was great!
It's annoying.....

 

[shawthing09]

This is off the Rupe topic but we lost 02 GF because we had too many inside players and not enough pure outside midfielders. Yes, the type who are treated like the plague on BF.
Apparently if you are an outside player you are inferior to the inside player.

Truth is you need both equally.

Again getting off topic but the problem isn't the outsideness it's being "soft" or being exclusively outside.

Guys like Bateman, Davis, Thomas, Harvey, Cooney are all naturally more outside as players. However when it's their time to go and make a contest they do so with conviction.

People get being "soft" and being outside confused and as such outside players get treated harshly on these boards. That said getting first hands on the ball is vital in football and so any player who has that attribute is well on their way to being a better player then one who is reliant on others feeding him.

People associate being inside with having no skill and being outside with being soft. The best midfields are those with a good balance of both and the best way to get that is having outside players who can win their own ball and inside players who can use the ball well.

 

[Pie eyed]

Or are you guilty of what you accuse me of? Where did I say delisting Betheras cost us a premiership?

For what it’s worth, again it’s just my opinion, he should have played in the 2003 GF. That alone wouldn’t have won us that game but hell if it doesn’t start at the selection table where does it start. We selected poorly for that game (as I said at the time) as well as in 2002.

Ah, so you do get it. We need a good enough team. How do we get that? What part is the coach responsible for? How many pointy end picks is sufficient?

You are still focused on the "player" not the "team".

Good teams are made up of good players. Throw in a few stars sure but it is the team which wins flags not individuals.

 

[MarkT]

You are still focused on the "player" not the "team".

Good teams are made up of good players. Throw in a few stars sure but it is the team which wins flags not individuals.

It's both. Neither aspects have been good enough though have they?

 

[Pie eyed]

It's both. Neither aspects have been good enough though have they?

Well that goes without saying unless I somehow slept through a flag year......

 

[The Royal Sampler]

I loved Rupe, but at times he infuriated me too. The fact is that he was on the fringe at the end of 2003 and we needed to make some changes. As has been pointed out, you can't take the attitude of being ruthless with list management and yet complain when favourite players are axed.

 

[Pie eyed]

"The Rupe, The Rupe, The Rupe is on fire. We don't need no water let the etc"

 

[Expatriation]

One of the best names to grace an AFL list anywhere. Right up there with Henry Playfair. Come on bring out your best names ever.

 

[Johnson#26]

I loved Rupe, but at times he infuriated me too. The fact is that he was on the fringe at the end of 2003 and we needed to make some changes. As has been pointed out, you can't take the attitude of being ruthless with list management and yet complain when favourite players are axed.

Have to take issue with this:

a) His form in 2003, all things considered, wasn't that bad. Limited game time in the early rounds as Williams stole the show (at the time Williams was in better form), then was brought back for round 13 vs WB when we were struggling. He ignited us with three goals, one of the BOG, then gradually had his TOG eaten into as Williams and Kinnear were preferred to him on the field, yet really gave us little. Rupe played in the early minutes of R18 vs Geelong, kicked one out on the full, and that was that. Despite this, Williams struggled big time, and Kinnear was just a filler (Molloy was a better option in this regard, how he was discarded so soon after kicking four against Richmond in R16 is beyond me, he was on fire that night). He was only on the fringe because it seemed nothing would get in the way of Andrew Williams playing a game. Would you have preferred another two years of Rupe? Or another two years of Williams? It almost shouldn't be a question.

b) Did we need to make some changes? Yes, I'll argue we did, but in terms of team structure. Lokan, Williams, Kinnear and Walker all got games that were, IMO, debatable from round 12 onwards.

 

[The Royal Sampler]

You've said nothing to convince me that Rupe wasn't on the fringe of our best 22 at the end of 2003. Pointing out that he was in and out of the side only strengthens my argument, if anything.

 

[Pie eyed]

Have to take issue with this:

a) His form in 2003, all things considered, wasn't that bad. Limited game time in the early rounds as Williams stole the show (at the time Williams was in better form), then was brought back for round 13 vs WB when we were struggling. He ignited us with three goals, one of the BOG, then gradually had his TOG eaten into as Williams and Kinnear were preferred to him on the field, yet really gave us little. Rupe played in the early minutes of R18 vs Geelong, kicked one out on the full, and that was that. Despite this, Williams struggled big time, and Kinnear was just a filler (Molloy was a better option in this regard, how he was discarded so soon after kicking four against Richmond in R16 is beyond me, he was on fire that night). He was only on the fringe because it seemed nothing would get in the way of Andrew Williams playing a game. Would you have preferred another two years of Rupe? Or another two years of Williams? It almost shouldn't be a question.

b) Did we need to make some changes? Yes, I'll argue we did, but in terms of team structure. Lokan, Williams, Kinnear and Walker all got games that were, IMO, debatable from round 12 onwards.

All you say is with merit but...in 2003 did we make the GF?
Who got us there?
Case closed.

 

[Johnson#26]

You've said nothing to convince me that Rupe wasn't on the fringe of our best 22 at the end of 2003. Pointing out that he was in and out of the side only strengthens my argument, if anything.

The reasoning behind his inability to remain in the side strengthens the argument - his game time was minimal. Yet Williams was persisted with and did absolutely nothing.

Pie eyed - in hindsight, it was more or less on the back of having our top six firing on all cylinders, and a very stable back six of Presti, Wakelin and Clement.

The 2003 side was only a flashier, slightly quicker upgrade on the 2002 model. The 2002 side had way more grit and played the contested ball far better IMO. Additionally, what gets overlooked is Clokey's role in 2002. He was vital to our charge that season, and he struggled a lot in 2003.

 

[Genc the Magpieman]

No that was Magpie Greg

No, it was actually a guy called LV Morris.

 

[ROYAL EAGLE]

I will always remember Rupert Betheras playing for east perth back in the 90's it was our first Grand Final in about 15+ plus years.

We played claremont in a wafl grand final that was unusal for its quality,
it is still one of the best matches I have ever seen.

We lost by 3 points it was heart breaking even more so because with 20 seconds left we had the ball deep in our foward 50.

Rupert jumped on a claremont players shoulders to take a mark and it bounced of his chest.

It would have been a amazing mark and he would have had a shot after the siren to win the game.

Unfortunately for my mighty royals he didn't hold on to it.

 

[pendles]

Mick Malthouse!

Back in days of Mick playing his favorites.... shhhhh apparently it doesn't happen anymore.

Ben Davies says "hi".