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djpaulydemon

All Australian
Oct 19, 2013
766
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The most worrying aspect for me isn't W/L it's that the style that got us to a prelim last year had obvious holes against good sides who belted us pretty easily last year, rather than make any progress on fixing those issues this year we have continued to play the same way but far less successfully and rather than try and change it up, every press conference is now about our brand and our contested ball numbers.

His only answer to our bees to the honeypot issues has been to move Brayshaw out of the middle and Jones to the HBF.. now we are playing Lewis inside who runs like he's in a jar of honey.

I'm worried he's too stubborn to realize we have a terrible game style that isn't sustainable and we are gonna have another go at it next year with a 'fit list
I get the feeling the coaches didn't even review the prelim loss. I understand from a motivational standpoint not to show the players, as you want to show them playing their best to instill confidence. But the coaching group honestly seem so stubborn that they would write the prelim and QB as one offs without thinking of ways to get better.
 

SugarHealey

Team Captain
Dec 15, 2008
423
85
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Melbourne
Okaaaaaaaay
This is why I know how to build a list, from the kids up. And how we should have been going about it, in the past. And we are doing it right now, this time.
We are doing it from the non-negotiables, if you like. It's why watts is no longer with us, and one or two others, as well, since.

All our players now are goers, except Petracca, but he, finally looks to be shaping up, as we speak. I hope so as he is expendable if he doesn't shape up. He is no good to us, if he's not busting his poofer.
Spargo I think will come good as well. He has the attitude but has to overcome his body. same with JKH. both these kids have the tough stuff. The stuff that garlett does not have.

So we add some bits we are lacking (the speed and the gut-run), Coniglio and Langdon + Jones jnr.? Hopefully... and continue to draft kids, for the after StMays, and TMcD's, and Jones's. That next-gen and layers.
 

SugarHealey

Team Captain
Dec 15, 2008
423
85
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Melbourne
I get the feeling the coaches didn't even review the prelim loss. I understand from a motivational standpoint not to show the players, as you want to show them playing their best to instill confidence. But the coaching group honestly seem so stubborn that they would write the prelim and QB as one offs without thinking of ways to get better.
Think about what your saying, you want to undermine our ability to grow the list. As we are not good enough, yet. Good enough to get to 8th or so, but that is all.
And then be overtaken, in the rush coming from behind us.
In that scenario we slide back down, as the up'n'comers get over us. That is what has happened in the past, apart from us being soft, too often in past Era's.
Our time is now, inside this next 5 years. It is do or die, right now, Re recruiting.
 

Topkent

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Aug 29, 2010
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If you compare our team on paper to others I can't see any world that has us top 6.
Our midfield which is our flagship is over rated and barely good enough to be ranked in the top 8. Compare it to Geelong or Collingwood and it's sickengly far off.
 

stabler

Premiership Player
Feb 7, 2008
4,136
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If you compare our team on paper to others I can't see any world that has us top 6.
Our midfield which is our flagship is over rated and barely good enough to be ranked in the top 8. Compare it to Geelong or Collingwood and it's sickengly far off.
It doesn't help that Goody keeps trumpeting that we are a "contested ball team" and that our game plan is "built from the contest out". Makes it pretty simple for other teams in oppo analysis to say, "righto boys, these guys think theyre the midfield kings. If we can take up the challenge and roll them in there, we can take their entire game from them then cut them up on the outside"
 

SugarHealey

Team Captain
Dec 15, 2008
423
85
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AFL Club
Melbourne
If you compare our team on paper to others I can't see any world that has us top 6.
Our midfield which is our flagship is over rated and barely good enough to be ranked in the top 8. Compare it to Geelong or Collingwood and it's sickengly far off.
We are not top 6, 'tk'.
We need to build the mdfdield further, and refine it, with more class.
But you put a young running gun on half-back, and move Salem to the centreline, and we are looking better. Put Coniglio in the centre, and we are looking better moving the ball, which takes a lot of pressure off Oli, and Brayshaw.

If, Petracca fires the 'F' up next year in the Mids, and fights hard on HFF like he did this week, then things turn around quickly.

The Cats gun mids are nearly cooked, as is half of the Pies senior Mids. Nearly cooked like Jones'y is. Past his best, but still jhold a spot, for a year or so.

Attrition waits for no-one.
This why we have to draft, and trade, this year.
Maybe like Roosy did when in charge at Sydney. He would trade some picks for players, but also take an early kid in the draft.
 

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Proper Gander

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Feb 15, 2015
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We are not top 6, 'tk'.
We need to build the mdfdield further, and refine it, with more class.
But you put a young running gun on half-back, and move Salem to the centreline, and we are looking better. Put Coniglio in the centre, and we are looking better moving the ball, which takes a lot of pressure off Oli, and Brayshaw.

If, Petracca fires the 'F' up next year in the Mids, and fights hard on HFF like he did this week, then things turn around quickly.

The Cats gun mids are nearly cooked, as is half of the Pies senior Mids. Nearly cooked like Jones'y is. Past his best, but still jhold a spot, for a year or so.

Attrition waits for no-one.
This why we have to draft, and trade, this year.
Maybe like Roosy did when in charge at Sydney. He would trade some picks for players, but also take an early kid in the draft.
So wait, your strategy is to replace some players with better players, persuade the key free agent of this years trade period that he wants to come to Melbourne and take a kid with an early draft pick? Then we ask some guys to please play better.

My God - it’s genius. I’m emailing the club directly.
 

Demon bhoy

Team Captain
Oct 7, 2017
576
292
AFL Club
Melbourne
So wait, your strategy is to replace some players with better players, persuade the key free agent of this years trade period that he wants to come to Melbourne and take a kid with an early draft pick? Then we ask some guys to please play better.

My God - it’s genius. I’m emailing the club directly.
It’s a bold strategy Cotton, let’s see if it pays off
 

SugarHealey

Team Captain
Dec 15, 2008
423
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It doesn't help that Goody keeps trumpeting that we are a "contested ball team" and that our game plan is "built from the contest out". Makes it pretty simple for other teams in oppo analysis to say, "righto boys, these guys think theyre the midfield kings. If we can take up the challenge and roll them in there, we can take their entire game from them then cut them up on the outside"
It is... nah you've got it wrong.
We build the team around the contest, to win the hard ball, and then when we have that down, we start to add the other, finer layers, onto that, once the harder base is in place.

You don't start off building with the mortons, gysberts, garletts, of the footy world, not with the LNeale's... thay are the 3rd layers, lets say.

Think Pyramid, and the base is strong and broad, and carries all the upper layers. The finer additions go on after everything is solid. And those finer attributes had better carry their own load, or they go out, quick smart.
 

SugarHealey

Team Captain
Dec 15, 2008
423
85
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AFL Club
Melbourne
So wait, your strategy is to replace some players with better players, persuade the key free agent of this years trade period that he wants to come to Melbourne and take a kid with an early draft pick? Then we ask some guys to please play better.

My God - it’s genius. I’m emailing the club directly.
This is what we have to aim for, to aim for the best we can find. If we want to get Coniglio, we will have to make a huge deal, and we will need to find space in the cap. So others might have to go.
Who, I am not privy to the books. So I can't say, but this is the direction we must travel from here. The standard is lower this past few years, than it was, and we have to move quickly, because the competition is evening up rapidly, and the Doggies are nearly cherry ripe.

# We don't need our early draft pick, to get Coniglio. If he wants to come over, we might need to do some bartering. But in the end, it will be his decision. We have to convince him.

I would use our 1st pick hopefully on LAsh. But the club might try to trade it, to turn it into 2 early picks. > my early hope as well, but I've changed my thinking.

I, gut-feel, think Ash might be a beaut. We have not had a top-line halfback flanker of the competition, since I've known. (sorry robbie was one)... the kid is elite with kicking to team-mates, and a dasher. We need that, more than almost anything.

If we pass on our early pick for two, we will get something's, maybe a kid tall, but these will take years to come on. I think Ash can mature quick.
 
Last edited:

Topkent

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Aug 29, 2010
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We are not top 6, 'tk'.
We need to build the mdfdield further, and refine it, with more class.
But you put a young running gun on half-back, and move Salem to the centreline, and we are looking better. Put Coniglio in the centre, and we are looking better moving the ball, which takes a lot of pressure off Oli, and Brayshaw.

If, Petracca fires the 'F' up next year in the Mids, and fights hard on HFF like he did this week, then things turn around quickly.

The Cats gun mids are nearly cooked, as is half of the Pies senior Mids. Nearly cooked like Jones'y is. Past his best, but still jhold a spot, for a year or so.

Attrition waits for no-one.
This why we have to draft, and trade, this year.
Maybe like Roosy did when in charge at Sydney. He would trade some picks for players, but also take an early kid in the draft.
That's not even close to true about Geelong or Collingwood.

Danger, Kelly, Menegola, Duncan, Cockatoo, Clark and Parfitt

It's even worse at Collingwood.
Treloar, Adams, Sier, De Goey, Phillips, Crisp, Sidebottom, Beams, Quaynor etc.

We have Oliver Brayshaw Harmes Viney .... Petracca?
Then no wings or running mids or goal kicking mids.
 

SugarHealey

Team Captain
Dec 15, 2008
423
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That's not even close to true about Geelong or Collingwood.

Danger, Kelly, Menegola, Duncan, Cockatoo, Clark and Parfitt

It's even worse at Collingwood.
Treloar, Adams, Sier, De Goey, Phillips, Crisp, Sidebottom, Beams, Quaynor etc.

We have Oliver Brayshaw Harmes Viney .... Petracca?
Then no wings or running mids or goal kicking mids.
Selwood, Danger is feeling his Klms. He will fall off the cliff quickly in a year or two.
hTaylor is cooked, and running on fumes, They will need a large rejig soon enough, and they have already been in transition. They were lucky in getting Rohan, who can do a number of roles.

Kelly will end up in WA at some stage... and maybe, that means Hill gets to Catland.?

Things happen quickly in older teams. See the Hawks are now struggling to rebound.

Pies will lose Pendlebury soon, Wells, Dunn, Goldsack, Varcoe, Greenwood, Reid, Beams and Howe, and then Sidebottom is 29Yrs in January.
 

SugarHealey

Team Captain
Dec 15, 2008
423
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Further to that Coniglio is a RFA so GWS will do their best to match it.
Naturally they will. But they have to do that with all their guns, and they have more guns than most. They won't be able to keep them all. A couple will no doubt want too come home... so we have to make sure we are the team they want to come to, instead of the bummers, dawks, whiteants, pussies, oh and Tiges these days as well. And the roos and saints money.

We have to make ourselves the team to be with.
 

Topkent

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Selwood, Danger is feeling his Klms. He will fall off the cliff quickly in a year or two.
hTaylor is cooked, and running on fumes, They will need a large rejig soon enough, and they have already been in transition. They were lucky in getting Rohan, who can do a number of roles.

Kelly will end up in WA at some stage... and maybe, that means Hill gets to Catland.?

Things happen quickly in older teams. See the Hawks are now struggling to rebound.

Pies will lose Pendlebury soon, Wells, Dunn, Goldsack, Varcoe, Greenwood, Reid, Beams and Howe, and then Sidebottom is 29Yrs in January.
None of the players except Sidebottom you named played in the side that just beat WC. Collingwood will be fine. If Kelly goes to WC then Geelong get Coniglio. Plus everyone assumes GWS will lose more players but
they let Shiel go to keep Kelly and Coniglio. He's staying
 

SugarHealey

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Dec 15, 2008
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None of the players except Sidebottom you named played in the side that just beat WC. Collingwood will be fine. If Kelly goes to WC then Geelong get Coniglio. Plus everyone assumes GWS will lose more players but
they let Shiel go to keep Kelly and Coniglio. He's staying
They be OK for two years, and then they will wobble a bit. It depends on how they recruit now, and the next 2 seasons. I don't know of the kids they have recently recruited, if they have any good one's coming, but they are about to lose a lot of senior players. That will hot them.

And Grundy has ambitions of going back to SA.

You really mist stop adoring other power clubs... and start to look at them, as a punching bag you want to split open. That the way to trat them. the pies and bummers.
 

Topkent

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Aug 29, 2010
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They be OK for two years, and then they will wobble a bit. It depends on how they recruit now, and the next 2 seasons. I don't know of the kids they have recently recruited, if they have any good one's coming, but they are about to lose a lot of senior players. That will hot them.

And Grundy has ambitions of going back to SA.

You really mist stop adoring other power clubs... and start to look at them, as a punching bag you want to split open. That the way to trat them. the pies and bummers.
None of those senior players played in their win against WC except Sidebottom. You are just rambling nonsense now without doing research.
 

saj_21

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Aug 30, 2007
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We are better than 10 or 11 other teams, at this point, right now, List wise. Just not on the ladder.

We lack in a couple of list positions, as we all know well. Re, the running area of our game
SMay is a help in this area, even as a key tall player. So will, I hope, Lever.

Lockhart is a win, over our 2018 season. oBaker is also a win, over last season's list. Dunkley looks like he could help. So we don't need too many others, to make a big difference.

We need Hannan to find form and fitness next year.

Petracca is starting to show just now, lately, what I've been hoping for, from him. A more robust physical effort.
... Next, he has to get mentally tougher, generally... and in front of the big sticks. He is taking the step now... he should have taken last season. So IMO, he is a season behind in mental toughness.
Lets hope he continues to UP the Ante for the remainder of this season... so he can build ontop of that again, next year.
He could be a Dynamo... or he could just flop about aimlessly again next year.
It depends on his attitude, whether he wants to sulk, or to get on with his career, and work his ring off.

I can just tell from being around vfl/afl, a long time.
I will agree with you on that one, call it blind faith but i think we are just horribly out of form, low on confidence. I've got the faith the club as a whole will turn it around next year.
 

Klyntonius

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So wait, your strategy is to replace some players with better players, persuade the key free agent of this years trade period that he wants to come to Melbourne and take a kid with an early draft pick? Then we ask some guys to please play better.

My God - it’s genius. I’m emailing the club directly.

 
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