"Sack Goodwin!"

[Gysberts2Bate]

Coniglio is a better player than Kelly mate.

rubbish. At no stage has Coniglio produced anything like Kelly’s 2017 season, mostly because of his disposal.

 

[demondavey]

Coniglio is a ****ing gun, end of story.

 

[demondavey]

Coniglio is a better player than Kelly mate.

Agree. Campaigner can play.

 

[Topkent]

Cogs has never gone above 71% DE in his career (2017). Going at 60% this year. The Brayshaw comparison is a very good one. He went at 72% in 2017 but has yet to exceed that. Both at 66 last season. 22 and 23 goals respectively last year too. Both have 6 this year. Cogs has just been around longer so had learned how to make the most of his slightly dodgy boot, Gus has some time to go. There's a reason Gus is rated super highly by every opposition fan, but a handful of Dees fans aren't big on him. The grass is always greener on the other side, and opposition fans tend to overlook faults in players that aren't theirs.

Would ya say over look? I'd say it's just I watch every minute of Gus's games but say only ever 3rd or 4th of Powell Peppers games so it's mostly highlights. No doubt if I only saw highlights of Brayshaw he would looks a superstar and if he fixes his composure and kicking he still might be.

I've watched a fair bit of GWS this year,
Whitfield > Coniglio > Kelly
Despite their couple losses I reckon they are a huge flag chance this year, they don't rely on stars anymore and it feels like they can play any sorta game now

 

[Crusty Demon]

Can we change the title of the thread? Goodwin isn't getting sacked. At least not in the next couple of years. He might appear clueless at times and we are having a horror year, but he has a contract for at least the next 3 years after this one right? So even if we all want him gone, he's not going anywhere unless the players revolt against him, which by all reports the players love him, so that's not happening. Maybe 'Crazy Goodwin' would be more appropriate because he sure isn't going anywhere anytime soon..

 

[Cannon82]

Would ya say over look? I'd say it's just I watch every minute of Gus's games but say only ever 3rd or 4th of Powell Peppers games so it's mostly highlights. No doubt if I only saw highlights of Brayshaw he would looks a superstar and if he fixes his composure and kicking he still might be.

I've watched a fair bit of GWS this year,
Whitfield > Coniglio > Kelly
Despite their couple losses I reckon they are a huge flag chance this year, they don't rely on stars anymore and it feels like they can play any sorta game now

Always felt GWS are less than the sum of their parts. On paper, great team, but against the better teams in the competition they seesaw between good and terrible. They bleed 3 or 4 good players every year but seem to pluck a few academy kids and high draft picks to fill the holes, but that should be just about running dry given their fire sale trading method. I think they're falling further away from a flag now; Shaw should be retiring soon, Ward out for the year, de-mothballing Mumford was an interesting call, they've got a large portion of inexperienced players now coming in for he likes of Scully, Shiel, Lobb, Smith, etc etc... they're a threat in the same way any team that makes the finals is a chance, but I don't see them being a consistently good team that'll finish top 4 and come in as one of the favourites.

 

[Topkent]

Always felt GWS are less than the sum of their parts. On paper, great team, but against the better teams in the competition they seesaw between good and terrible. They bleed 3 or 4 good players every year but seem to pluck a few academy kids and high draft picks to fill the holes, but that should be just about running dry given their fire sale trading method. I think they're falling further away from a flag now; Shaw should be retiring soon, Ward out for the year, de-mothballing Mumford was an interesting call, they've got a large portion of inexperienced players now coming in for he likes of Scully, Shiel, Lobb, Smith, etc etc... they're a threat in the same way any team that makes the finals is a chance, but I don't see them being a consistently good team that'll finish top 4 and come in as one of the favourites.

I dunno mate just feels like they have a more even contribution all over the field rather than relying on a powerful midfield.
Win against Geelong is looking even better
Collingwood my favourites
Then Richmond WC and GWS

 

[Tulip]

I dunno mate just feels like they have a more even contribution all over the field rather than relying on a powerful midfield.
Win against Geelong is looking even better
Collingwood my favourites
Then Richmond WC and GWS

Agree. They're more balanced than they were, even with the loss of talent. Cameron is having a good season, and they've found a couple of good ones like Himmelberg and Finlayson to sit up there with him. Greene is Greene. Davis has become an awesome KPD, and Haynes and Williams are really good medium-sized backs. Cogs, Whitfield, Kelly are all superstars. Hopper and especially Taranto look like excellent young mids. They've then got a whole bunch of b and c-grade players holding down the other roles to good effect. They could definitely use Smith out there, but every other position looks covered.

 

[Topkent]

Agree. They're more balanced than they were, even with the loss of talent. Cameron is having a good season, and they've found a couple of good ones like Himmelberg and Finlayson to sit up there with him. Greene is Greene. Davis has become an awesome KPD, and Haynes and Williams are really good medium-sized backs. Cogs, Whitfield, Kelly are all superstars. Hopper and especially Taranto look like excellent young mids. They've then got a whole bunch of b and c-grade players holding down the other roles to good effect. They could definitely use Smith out there, but every other position looks covered.

Yep I think the only weakness I see is a 2nd key defender to fill in if Davis is injured or being beaten. They've got Reid, Finlayson can go back aswell but that's the only area the feels thin. Guess maybe they don't have a true small forward either but that's probably a luxury for them

 

[demondavey]

I dunno mate just feels like they have a more even contribution all over the field rather than relying on a powerful midfield.
Win against Geelong is looking even better
Collingwood my favourites
Then Richmond WC and GWS

Every chance Richmond could bounce back into another flag. Personally I am sticking with Eagles.

 

[Topkent]

Our last 4 drafts have been pretty rubbish with hindsight. No first round pick for 3 years but also not alot of anything late.

2018
Sparrow, Jordan, Nietshcke, Hore, Bedford, C.Wagner, J.Lockhart, Walker, Bradke

2017
Spargo, Fritsch, Petty, Baker

2016
Hannan, Johnstone, Filipovic, T.Smith, Keilty, Maynard

2015
Oliver, Weideman, King, Hulett, J.Wagner, Michie, J.Smith

In fact since Oliver and Weid to an extent, the only successes have been mature age recruits. I think this has gone quietly under the radar, sure with alot of them being late picks there will be misses but **** thats a shit list of players. We have added any youth to our list for 4 seasons now.

If you include the stalling of the 2014 draft class in Petracca, Neal Bullen and Omac plus the injuries to AVB then no wonder this team has fallen off a cliff.

Dont care the club traded 5 last year, we needed a Key defender seeing as everyone unanimously agreed Omac and Frost wasnt good enough so Im glad the club was proactive in trying to solve it. However we need to address why we havent been able to get a single good 18 year old draftee in 4 straight drafts as of now ( this years crop could change that)

 

[saj_21]

Our last 4 drafts have been pretty rubbish with hindsight. No first round pick for 3 years but also not alot of anything late.

2018
Sparrow, Jordan, Nietshcke, Hore, Bedford, C.Wagner, J.Lockhart, Walker, Bradke

2017
Spargo, Fritsch, Petty, Baker

2016
Hannan, Johnstone, Filipovic, T.Smith, Keilty, Maynard

2015
Oliver, Weideman, King, Hulett, J.Wagner, Michie, J.Smith

In fact since Oliver and Weid to an extent, the only successes have been mature age recruits. I think this has gone quietly under the radar, sure with alot of them being late picks there will be misses but **** thats a shit list of players. We have added any youth to our list for 4 seasons now.

If you include the stalling of the 2014 draft class in Petracca, Neal Bullen and Omac plus the injuries to AVB then no wonder this team has fallen off a cliff.

Dont care the club traded 5 last year, we needed a Key defender seeing as everyone unanimously agreed Omac and Frost wasnt good enough so Im glad the club was proactive in trying to solve it. However we need to address why we havent been able to get a single good 18 year old draftee in 4 straight drafts as of now ( this years crop could change that)

Oliver is the only player we've drafted since Gawn that has become a genuinely elite player. Brayshaw getting there but needs to work on his kicking, Petracca and Weid had shown glimpses. Neal Bullen, AVB, Hannan, Fritta all good role players.

Recruiters have been good with our 30 plus picks finding some handy types, but what we really need is to find and develop some elite players from those later picks.

Look at the pies, taking swan in the 50's in 2001? and then some real top end talent in pendles and Daisy, all three peaked in 2008-2011 era when the won a GF......mind you if it was as easy as just saying "find elite talent" in the later rounds then all clubs would do it, but unfortunately it comes down to how hard the kid works, being in the right environment at the right time and a bit of luck.

 

[blitznu]

Oliver is the only player we've drafted since Gawn that has become a genuinely elite player. Brayshaw getting there but needs to work on his kicking, Petracca and Weid had shown glimpses. Neal Bullen, AVB, Hannan, Fritta all good role players.

Recruiters have been good with our 30 plus picks finding some handy types, but what we really need is to find and develop some elite players from those later picks.

Look at the pies, taking swan in the 50's in 2001? and then some real top end talent in pendles and Daisy, all three peaked in 2008-2011 era when the won a GF......mind you if it was as easy as just saying "find elite talent" in the later rounds then all clubs would do it, but unfortunately it comes down to how hard the kid works, being in the right environment at the right time and a bit of luck.

The problem with Fritta being a role players is he clearly is a match winner. can take a beauty and slot a goal or hit up players i50. He does everything match winners do. We are wasting his talents down back. but hey this is Melbourne we'll soon turn you into potatoes play you out of position til you have no confidence whatsoever then delist ya

 

[Topkent]

The problem with Fritta being a role players is he clearly is a match winner. can take a beauty and slot a goal or hit up players i50. He does everything match winners do. We are wasting his talents down back. but hey this is Melbourne we'll soon turn you into potatoes play you out of position til you have no confidence whatsoever then delist ya

I thought it was a good move originally but he would be one of our laziest players, so many times he is jogging back into D50 as the ball enters. He should be forward

 

[stEdy]

Still have high-ish hopes for 2017; Fritsch if played up forward is just so effective at everything he does, Spargo will become a very nifty small forward in a functioning forward line (especially if we can partner him with someone genuinely quick), Petty will overtake Frost/OMAC relatively soon and Baker has played some great VFL games and has something we genuinely lack, just has struggled with injuries

It's also a stupid idea to rate our lists when literally everyone is stinking it up, if we string a few wins together all these predictions will suddenly become a lot more rosy

 

[Crusty Demon]

Still have high-ish hopes for 2017; Fritsch if played up forward is just so effective at everything he does, Spargo will become a very nifty small forward in a functioning forward line (especially if we can partner him with someone genuinely quick), Petty will overtake Frost/OMAC relatively soon and Baker has played some great VFL games and has something we genuinely lack, just has struggled with injuries

It's also a stupid idea to rate our lists when literally everyone is stinking it up, if we string a few wins together all these predictions will suddenly become a lot more rosy

Exactly. You look at this exact same list 7 matches ago and Taylor and Viney are geniuses! Lose this weekend and I reckon we go down the path of giving some of these blokes a go at the top level to see what they have got.

 

[Toump Ass]

Can't remember the last time one of our players got a rising star nom.

Obvs we've traded our 1st round picks for players which is a good idea in theory, but unfortunately we ended up dropping a hefty price for Lever and got not much back for Hogan which we then used on another over-priced backman... ¯\_(ツ)_/¯.

Yeah we needed defenders but I reckon a more pressing need was someone who could kick a ****ing ball reliably.

I also still think we're a bit light on "experience", a few more senior players would help.

 

[Toump Ass]

Also I think Fritsch and Spargo are good picks.

 

[deeco]

Our last 4 drafts have been pretty rubbish with hindsight. No first round pick for 3 years but also not alot of anything late.

2018
Sparrow, Jordan, Nietshcke, Hore, Bedford, C.Wagner, J.Lockhart, Walker, Bradke

2017
Spargo, Fritsch, Petty, Baker

2016
Hannan, Johnstone, Filipovic, T.Smith, Keilty, Maynard

2015
Oliver, Weideman, King, Hulett, J.Wagner, Michie, J.Smith

In fact since Oliver and Weid to an extent, the only successes have been mature age recruits. I think this has gone quietly under the radar, sure with alot of them being late picks there will be misses but **** thats a shit list of players. We have added any youth to our list for 4 seasons now.

If you include the stalling of the 2014 draft class in Petracca, Neal Bullen and Omac plus the injuries to AVB then no wonder this team has fallen off a cliff.

Dont care the club traded 5 last year, we needed a Key defender seeing as everyone unanimously agreed Omac and Frost wasnt good enough so Im glad the club was proactive in trying to solve it. However we need to address why we havent been able to get a single good 18 year old draftee in 4 straight drafts as of now ( this years crop could change that)

Agree big time, was going to make a similar post to this but I was too lazy and didn't know where it'd fit. The draft can be a crap shoot, but the team not going in with a first rounder in forever is really starting to show. At least Lever was young and ACL is bad luck so I'll cop that, but dropping so much on May is where I'd differ on opinion. Age profile is how you create sustained success, if we aren't winning a flag in the next 1-2 years which it doesn't look likely why blow so much on someone who will be on a downward trend if we aren't?

Clearly the club over rated the current list and didn't actually watch any of the games last year, teams who win 1-2 quarters a game (on a good day...) aren't flag fancies unless the stars align.

 

[blitznu]

Agree big time, was going to make a similar post to this but I was too lazy and didn't know where it'd fit. The draft can be a crap shoot, but the team not going in with a first rounder in forever is really starting to show. At least Lever was young and ACL is bad luck so I'll cop that, but dropping so much on May is where I'd differ on opinion. Age profile is how you create sustained success, if we aren't winning a flag in the next 1-2 years which it doesn't look likely why blow so much on someone who will be on a downward trend if we aren't?

Clearly the club over rated the current list and didn't actually watch any of the games last year, teams who win 1-2 quarters a game (on a good day...) aren't flag fancies unless the stars align.

Hindsight is a beautiful thing isnt it.. whered you have us finishing in that poll that was put up? Cause not many people thought we werent right in the flag race for the next few years. Thats including the 'experts' so wasnt just the club that thought our list was better than it is ATM but with so many off season surgeries and rehab we could and should easily bounce back next year with a few tweaks. FYI i had us 9th and still thought May/Hogan trade was worth it. Plus side this year is Frost is really showing something so should get 2nd best defender next year while Lever can get 3rd while fat boy gets 1st. Depths always gonna look like shit when ya got 8 players from 23rd to 35th on ya list all playing at once

 

[Topkent]

Agree big time, was going to make a similar post to this but I was too lazy and didn't know where it'd fit. The draft can be a crap shoot, but the team not going in with a first rounder in forever is really starting to show. At least Lever was young and ACL is bad luck so I'll cop that, but dropping so much on May is where I'd differ on opinion. Age profile is how you create sustained success, if we aren't winning a flag in the next 1-2 years which it doesn't look likely why blow so much on someone who will be on a downward trend if we aren't?

Clearly the club over rated the current list and didn't actually watch any of the games last year, teams who win 1-2 quarters a game (on a good day...) aren't flag fancies unless the stars align.

Because at the end of last year everyone acknowledged we needed more work on our defence and no one thought we would fall off this cliff.
Point is it's easy to sit here with hindsight and complain but no one saw this coming.
Port flogged off Polec and Wingard last year for top picks, no reason we can't do the same if we wanna go rebuild again.

Like I've said before, take another look at the key defenders we ran with 2000-06
Our lack of dare at the trade table was one of the reasons we never progressed. Not gonna bag the club for putting it's eggs in a premiership basket by getting the best available key defender

 

[00Stinger]

Also I think Fritsch and Spargo are good picks.

Fritsch yes.

Spargo will be delisted in 3 years time

 

[Topkent]

Fritsch, Hannan and Hore were hardly surprise picks though were they? All highly rated VFL players. Kind of easy picks

 

[deeco]

Hindsight is a beautiful thing isnt it.. whered you have us finishing in that poll that was put up? Cause not many people thought we werent right in the flag race for the next few years. Thats including the 'experts' so wasnt just the club that thought our list was better than it is ATM but with so many off season surgeries and rehab we could and should easily bounce back next year with a few tweaks. FYI i had us 9th and still thought May/Hogan trade was worth it. Plus side this year is Frost is really showing something so should get 2nd best defender next year while Lever can get 3rd while fat boy gets 1st. Depths always gonna look like **** when ya got 8 players from 23rd to 35th on ya list all playing at once

I'd have had us in the 6-10 range unless every thing either went perfectly or badly, or very badly, or very very VERY badly. We were (probably still are to be honest, despite start to the season..) 2-3 years away from a real solid tilt at it. We didn't finish top 4 for a reason last year, we just ran into beatable teams in the finals.

Because at the end of last year everyone acknowledged we needed more work on our defence and no one thought we would fall off this cliff.
Point is it's easy to sit here with hindsight and complain but no one saw this coming.
Port flogged off Polec and Wingard last year for top picks, no reason we can't do the same if we wanna go rebuild again.

Like I've said before, take another look at the key defenders we ran with 2000-06
Our lack of dare at the trade table was one of the reasons we never progressed. Not gonna bag the club for putting it's eggs in a premiership basket by getting the best available key defender

Not going to argue with you over them picking him up, he was the best available for what our needs were. Just our luck he's a fat lazy campaigner with a history of belting blokes. We could have picked up someone solid from the draft which would have better suited our age profile, or not got bent over pick-wise for him as well.

 

[Topkent]

I'd have had us in the 6-10 range unless every thing either went perfectly or badly, or very badly, or very very VERY badly. We were (probably still are to be honest, despite start to the season..) 2-3 years away from a real solid tilt at it. We didn't finish top 4 for a reason last year, we just ran into beatable teams in the finals.


Not going to argue with you over them picking him up, he was the best available for what our needs were. Just our luck he's a fat lazy campaigner with a history of belting blokes. We could have picked up someone solid from the draft which would have better suited our age profile, or not got bent over pick-wise for him as well.

If you take someone in the draft they may never play a game. May has played 10 years and he's never belted anyone. He's been suspended for mostly fair hip an shoulders and one bad one.

We probably would have taken the King kid who is 5 years away, again people would have sooked about that decision after the prelim last year saying the club doesn't take any risks and we needed a key back etc. 2-3 years from now Steven May will be the same age as Rance is now