Sacramento are this good without C-Webb. Thoughts?

[jod23]

The kings are sitting second in the Pacific divsion at 8-3 behind the LA Lakers. Chris Webber is arguably the best 4 in the game and a big time player yet without him the Kings are pretty much cruising...

There losses coming against the Pacers, a 44 point effort from T-Mac and the Magic and then a couple of days ago against the Lakers. I saw the game against the Lakers and the Kings were in control the whole game and led by 9 with about 4 minutes to go in the third. A big final quarter from the Lake show got them home.

All this without one of the best players in the league. Now will his return upset team chemistry and result in losses or will his return just make the team even stronger.

If the latter happens which i suspect it will then i think the Lakers have a serious problem. The Kings have probably the best starting 5 in the league with quality at all 5 spots.

Bibby at PG is averaging 14.2 ppg and 4.5 apg - he needs to up his assists average which i suspect will happen with the comeback of Webber.

Christie at SG is averaging 13.9ppg and 5 rpg - just where he wants to be, he's shooting the ball well and is a threat from 3 point range and will get a lot more looks when C-Webb is commanding doubles in the post.

Stojakovic at SF is averaging 23.7 ppg and 6.1 rpg - his numbers wont go anywhere when Webber returns as he will remain a go to guy on offence. Will obviously be the second option but he's such a great player he will still rack up points. Averaged 20.4 last season alongside Webber so expect the same.

Webber at PF - cant give you averages as he is yet to play a game but you know he will be around 25+ and 10+. Last season he was at 27 and 11 so i expect the same type numbers. He is a monster and is one of the most dominant players in the league.

Divac at C is averaging 15.1 ppg and 9.2 rpg - Divac also amazingly leads the team in assists at 5.3 a game, that proves what an all around game Divac has, he is all class.

There bench is also not too bad, Funderburke is useful (6.9 ppg & 5.2 rpg) Pollard in a starting role until C-Webbs return will be a very handy 6th man off the bench and will rest Webber and Divac (6.6 ppg & 7.8 rpg) Turkoglu provides more size off the bench (9.6 ppg & 5.5 rpg) and Bobby Jackson is an able backup at point for Bibby and provides some quickness and scoring off the bench (9.0 ppg)

There whole starting 5 when Webber returns will be averaging double figures in points. With 2 guys coming off the bench Jackson and Turkoglu averaging 9. Sure some there averages and minutes may go down a touch with Webbers return but this team has it all.

Overall i cant really find a standout weakness and if all these Lakers fans think a three peat is a certaintly, i'd think again..

Thoughts?

 

[DEVO]

I said at the start of the season, the Lakers will either threepeat or miss the final altogether, and Sacremento are the team I believe is the most equipped to stop the Lakers. I do believe the Lakers have the personnel to beat the Kings. They are better or their equal in every position except Power Forward. And unfortunately the Kings Power Forward is Webber.

Shaq V Divac - Divac's is a very good centre, but the best centres in the NBA can't stop Shaq. Shaq may need to up his scoring to compensate for Webber.
Edge - Shaq

Walker V Webber - A player who would not start for any other team in the League against the best Power Forward in the game. If the Lakers lose, this is where they will lose.
Edge - Webber

Fox V Stojankovic - Fox is under rated, especially by Jod23, but he is doing what his coach and team require of him. He is a defensive player more than offensive and is very capable of reducing Stojankovic's impact, and that is what he will be required to do. Stojankovic though is very dangerous player and whether Fox can do it for seven games is another thing.
Egde - Stojankovic

Bryant V Christie - Bryant is the best young player in the league and currently one of the leading scorers in the league. Christie will have his work cut out for him, but Bryant can not rest either. Christie can cause problems offensively, but not to Bryant's extent.
Edge - Bryant

Fisher V Bibby - Fisher's return from injury last season was the catalyst for the Lakers dream run at the end of the year. He is the third string to the Lakers bow, and Bibby will have his work cut out for him.
Edge - Even. Maybe Fisher

As for the bench - Kings are definitely stronger on the bench, but the Lakers bench has surprised this season. I think they have outscored the opposition's bench on five occasion this season, which mighten sound great, but for the Lakers it's a godsend.
Edge - Kings

 

[coxon]

Originally posted by DEVO

Bryant V Christie - Bryant is the best young player in the league and currently one of the leading scorers in the league. Christie will have his work cut out for him, but Bryant can not rest either. Christie can cause problems offensively, but not to Bryant's extent.
Edge - Bryant

Fisher V Bibby - Fisher's return from injury last season was the catalyst for the Lakers dream run at the end of the year. He is the third string to the Lakers bow, and Bibby will have his work cut out for him.
Edge - Even. Maybe Fisher

christie is a great option to take on bryant... christie's main asset is his defense and athleticism.. easily one of the best defensive guards in the league.. close to best defensive player of the yr last season... also a great dunker!

but then.... bibby sh1ts all over fisher!...

 

[Booze Hound]

Got to agree with Coxon's assessment on Christie and Bibby.

The former is a good team player and the latter is, IMO, way better than Fisher. Both are excellent locker room influences too.

My only concern about Webber is that he's not always shown up when he needs to but teamed with Divac in the frontcourt he gives the Lakers a problem. If they were to switch O'Neal to cover him Vlade would have a field day against the LA power forward. Kings would probably accept Shaq's points, look to run different people at Bryant and try to contain any 3rd option scorers. With the Lakers PF situation and the new zone rules they could even double team Shaq with some degree of freedom. If the Lakers restrict CWebb there are still four decent/good scorers starting and two or three off the bench. Brent Barry isn't the worst back up 2 in the League by a long shot.

Mind you, if either Bryant or Shaq (in particular) went down injured............

 

[jod23]

Originally posted by DEVO
I said at the start of the season, the Lakers will either threepeat or miss the final altogether, and Sacremento are the team I believe is the most equipped to stop the Lakers. I do believe the Lakers have the personnel to beat the Kings. They are better or their equal in every position except Power Forward. And unfortunately the Kings Power Forward is Webber.

Shaq V Divac - Divac's is a very good centre, but the best centres in the NBA can't stop Shaq. Shaq may need to up his scoring to compensate for Webber.
Edge - Shaq

Walker V Webber - A player who would not start for any other team in the League against the best Power Forward in the game. If the Lakers lose, this is where they will lose.
Edge - Webber

Fox V Stojankovic - Fox is under rated, especially by Jod23, but he is doing what his coach and team require of him. He is a defensive player more than offensive and is very capable of reducing Stojankovic's impact, and that is what he will be required to do. Stojankovic though is very dangerous player and whether Fox can do it for seven games is another thing.
Egde - Stojankovic

Bryant V Christie - Bryant is the best young player in the league and currently one of the leading scorers in the league. Christie will have his work cut out for him, but Bryant can not rest either. Christie can cause problems offensively, but not to Bryant's extent.
Edge - Bryant

Fisher V Bibby - Fisher's return from injury last season was the catalyst for the Lakers dream run at the end of the year. He is the third string to the Lakers bow, and Bibby will have his work cut out for him.
Edge - Even. Maybe Fisher

As for the bench - Kings are definitely stronger on the bench, but the Lakers bench has surprised this season. I think they have outscored the opposition's bench on five occasion this season, which mighten sound great, but for the Lakers it's a godsend.
Edge - Kings

Your on the money with Shaq and Divac, Divac is good in his own right but Shaq is the best centre in the league. Although at least Divac presents a problem to Shaq on the defencesive end. Divac can play away from the ring and hit jumpers which will draw Shaq away from the keyway. The Lakers may try to play a zone to prevent this from happening but Christie and Stoja are both zone breakers and can drive and score too easily. The other option is to put somebody else on Divac like Walker but Divac is also quick for a bigman and has great passing abilities. Divac could end up being a big headache for LA. On the other Shaq is no could he IS a headache.

I dont underestimate Fox, he is a good player but instead of being a ministar a few years back he is now just a role player for the Lakers. Stojakovic is one of the best SF going around and can cut you up with big numbers, Fox has to stay offensive minded to make Stoja play D so he isnt just worried about dropping 30 point on you.

Fisher v Bibby is a no contest, dont know why you think Fisher could have an edge over Bibby, Bibby is all class and will completely outplay Fisher.

The bench is also onesided, the Kings have guys who can come on and score and give guys a rest whereas you will always see Kobe and Shaq playing 48 mins as nobody is good enough to come on and give them a rest. If its goes 7 it will start to show.

But all this is a long way away, but i am really hoping for a Western Conference Finals featuring the two teams...

 

[DEVO]

Bibby is an excellent player, I don't doubt that, but Fisher proved himself last season in the Finals, and is still to play his best Basketball. He'll never be a superstar, but Jackson is steadily turning him into the Lakers third side of the triangle.
I gave Fisher the nod, just, because of what he achieved last year in the Finals. I'm not sure about Bibby, and the fact Sacremento bombed out early suggests he and the rest of his team didn't perform so well when the glory was greatest.

 

[jod23]

Originally posted by DEVO
Bibby is an excellent player, I don't doubt that, but Fisher proved himself last season in the Finals, and is still to play his best Basketball. He'll never be a superstar, but Jackson is steadily turning him into the Lakers third side of the triangle.
I gave Fisher the nod, just, because of what he achieved last year in the Finals. I'm not sure about Bibby, and the fact Sacremento bombed out early suggests he and the rest of his team didn't perform so well when the glory was greatest.

Yeah but Bibby wasnt a King last year. He was still in Vancouver. With a very good point guard at the helm i can see Sacramento going all the way. Oh and Devo, 1 finals series or 5 games doesnt make a player as you seem to think that applies for Fisher.

 

[DEVO]

Originally posted by jod23



Yeah but Bibby wasnt a King last year. He was still in Vancouver. With a very good point guard at the helm i can see Sacramento going all the way. Oh and Devo, 1 finals series or 5 games doesnt make a player as you seem to think that applies for Fisher.

No, But Phil Jackson does, I'd take his word over yours anyday.

 

[Bucks]

the success of the kings can be largely credited to Peja Stojakovic and Vlade Divac. Them both have played exceptionally well in their positions. Vlade has been important under the rim collecting boards and scoring about 12-16 points per game, and then Peja scoring at 25ppg he has been an impressive perimiter shooter and he plays a tall gaurd/foward.

players like Bibby and Christie have also been important to gell the team together to make them smooth. When Chris Webber returns Sac will only get better and unfortuntley i believe Divac's impact in games will be less significant.

 

[DEVO]

Lakers beat Denver 105-98 to go 12-1. The "over-rated", "pathetic" Derek Fisher, in his first game back from injury, scores a lazy 14 points in 19 minutes, including 4 from 4 from 3pt land.

Chicago's record is looking a possibilty.

 

[Bucks]

dont wanna get too hyped up about fishers performance... last year he mised 60 games at the start of the season from a broken foot and hit 26 for the comeback game.. case of dejavu.

 

[jod23]

Originally posted by Bucks
the success of the kings can be largely credited to Peja Stojakovic and Vlade Divac. Them both have played exceptionally well in their positions. Vlade has been important under the rim collecting boards and scoring about 12-16 points per game, and then Peja scoring at 25ppg he has been an impressive perimiter shooter and he plays a tall gaurd/foward.

players like Bibby and Christie have also been important to gell the team together to make them smooth. When Chris Webber returns Sac will only get better and unfortuntley i believe Divac's impact in games will be less significant.

I think what your getting at is that its been a great team performance to trudge on and bring up win after win without C-Webb. Everyone has just lifted there game a notch to cover for the absence of the best 4 in the game. I dont think Divac's numbers will suffer when C-Webb returns as he will still be playing the same amount of minutes. Sure his scoring adn rebounding will go down maybe 2 - 4ppg and 1 or 2 boards but Divac is a quality player.

I expect big things from the Kings this year.

 

[jod23]

Originally posted by DEVO
Lakers beat Denver 105-98 to go 12-1. The "over-rated", "pathetic" Derek Fisher, in his first game back from injury, scores a lazy 14 points in 19 minutes, including 4 from 4 from 3pt land.

Chicago's record is looking a possibilty.

So what if the Lakers are 12 - 1. The Bucks are 9 -1, the T-Wolves 10 - 2. Its not that impressive. Big game today however with the Bucks taking on the Lakers, should be interesting to see who comes out on top.

Trust me Devo, the Lakers wont get Chicago's record.

 

[DEVO]

Originally posted by jod23


So what if the Lakers are 12 - 1. The Bucks are 9 -1, the T-Wolves 10 - 2. Its not that impressive. Big game today however with the Bucks taking on the Lakers, should be interesting to see who comes out on top.

Trust me Devo, the Lakers wont get Chicago's record.

No one can predict the future, so we'll have to wait and see, but the Lakers have started well, and have a lot of improvement still in them. If Phil Jackson has his way, the Lakers are going to give the record a real shake.

 

[jod23]

Originally posted by DEVO


No one can predict the future, so we'll have to wait and see, but the Lakers have started well, and have a lot of improvement still in them. If Phil Jackson has his way, the Lakers are going to give the record a real shake.

Well you can keep dreaming son, it wont happen.

 

[Booze Hound]

One small point.

For my money the best '4' in the NBA is Tim Duncan, without a doubt. Swop him for Webber in Sacremento and they'd be clear favourites for the title.

 

[coxon]

Originally posted by Booze Hound
One small point.

For my money the best '4' in the NBA is Tim Duncan, without a doubt. Swop him for Webber in Sacremento and they'd be clear favourites for the title.

true..

but then again, with someone of the calibre of tim duncan...
slotting him in with orlando, philadelphia, milwaukee, dallas would guarantee clear favouritism for a title...

is that you carlos boozer?

 

[jod23]

Originally posted by Booze Hound
One small point.

For my money the best '4' in the NBA is Tim Duncan, without a doubt. Swop him for Webber in Sacremento and they'd be clear favourites for the title.

I dont know about that. Duncan is the better rebounder but Webber the better scorer, although Duncan is great on the defensive end too but i feel that C-Webb is more of a big game player..

Tough to call...

 

[Booze Hound]

Duncan's a proven big game player, more so than CWebb. Webber may score more but there's no doubt Duncan's a better team player and can score heaps on anyone when he has to. Duncan also runs the floor consistently and well, neither of which can be said for Webber. CWebb is a fine player with room to grow but I don't think, even at his max, I'd take him over Duncan.

btw there's a rumour in the wind of a trade (possibly three way) involving Karl Malone going to Dallas and Juwan Howard going elsewhere. My American spies have confirmed the talk. That could make Dallas pretty hard to stop.

 

[jod23]

Originally posted by Booze Hound
Duncan's a proven big game player, more so than CWebb. Webber may score more but there's no doubt Duncan's a better team player and can score heaps on anyone when he has to. Duncan also runs the floor consistently and well, neither of which can be said for Webber. CWebb is a fine player with room to grow but I don't think, even at his max, I'd take him over Duncan.

btw there's a rumour in the wind of a trade (possibly three way) involving Karl Malone going to Dallas and Juwan Howard going elsewhere. My American spies have confirmed the talk. That could make Dallas pretty hard to stop.

I dont know ... if Duncan was such a big game player do you think they would have being swept last season in the playoffs...i think not. Still i think there both great players and you could take your pick on who better.

I heard those rumors about Malone too but i doubt he'll go anywhere. However if a trade does surface and he ends up in Dallas, they could be real dangerous.