Coach Sam Mitchell's direction for the club

Remove this Banner Ad

Status
Not open for further replies.

TheFourPillars

Brownlow Medallist
May 6, 2009
11,707
27,150
AFL Club
Hawthorn
I think we will keep the defensive setups as we seem to be a solid team defensively. It's when we tried to move the ball forward, once we gained possession, that the slow movement issues arose.

Hopefully the changes come from players moving the ball quickly through the corridor, as opposed to slowly down the flanks. With a backline that should include at least three of Scrimshaw, Sicily, Impey, Hardwick and CJ we will have the players that can go on a tear or take the inboard kick through the corridor if it's there.
Quickly through the corridor thats if the opposition allow it mate. Under clarkson when we were playing well we certainly didnt. Other teams will also flood the corridor. You need to be able to transition using the width of the ground switching the play and going quickly. There were times last year where we just focused on getting the ball down the ground. It was a work in progress and we did get better. Walk before you can run analogy.
 

CaptainWorpedo

Senior List
Feb 15, 2021
246
436
AFL Club
Hawthorn
I think we need to hit the draft, recruit well, back the future generation and implement a game plan that can beat anyone, not just be competitive against most on our day, or look good in the 2nd half of the year. I feel it isn't as simple as game plan in isolation, but drafting, trading, recruiting, development, and prioritising the longer term to become the team we need to be again seemed to be slightly opposed to each other, as there seemed to be more than half an eye on the now as well, and holding on to elements that had won us a threepete.

This is why I feel a change (no doubt it also a risk) was needed and Sam in the best place to keep the best of Clarko (loved the intercepting high up the ground later in the year), but also a new vision for what is needed. I remember Zac Dawson being the symbol of an ultra focused youth policy even when he was getting smashed, it was about development and learning over wins. Joel Smith was (unluckily) moved on in 2008 when he was still playing good football because of the focus on youth and development. It makes me wonder why things seemed to have changed, and (just 1 example) why Downie wasn't played off the sub position more this year, and use that rule change as a way to give him a taste, given wing is an area we are crying out for depth and he had a good pre-season and looks the type we need. I understand his Box Bill form played a big part, but that one AFL game did him a world of good, so why not try to give him 6-7 given Philipps wasn't setting the world on fire? We did this with Brad Hill before he was physically ready to great effect, and I feel the Clarko of 2005 would have thrown him in the deep end more often. We could have prioritised youth, and if it meant shorter team pain we'd probably be picking up Callaghan in the draft this year as the downside.

Our recent business plan was premierships, so can't blame Clarko solely as the club put in writing and made public our want for (multiple) premierships in the pretty short term, but I don't think that was realistic. Our first 5250 plan was based on the drafting and situation of the club, where the latest one seemed just to be 'cause we're Hawthorn', rather than an astute look at the list to see where we were at and what was needed to get back to a side consistently able to make top 4. Clarkson has said how his loyalty to players he's brought over and the promises he made about the direction also played a part in his thinking; so it seemed a different Clarkson to the one who came over and stripped the club right down to be in a position to rebuild when he started. Scully and Patton would have been playing as well if not for external 'circumstances' causing a premature retirement, meaning more impact on development of some younger guys if they had been playing.

So with Mitchell I think a change was needed given the above, not because Clarko isn't brilliant or capable, but because I think we need Clarko of 2005 not the one who has loyalty and relationships to players we need to evolve on from and start a new era. Mitchell would understand as much as anyone how much our defensive pressure and structures won us flags in 2008, 2013, 2014, and 2015, but also how we had multiple avenues to score, and how our footskills made us impossible to defend against, and also the journey we went on to get there. I think that experience he had going through the journey for the whole duration (especially given his own personal one of needing to work to even get on a list), combined with his IQ and determination (and Clarko like ruthlessness to succeed) make him as good an option to takeover from Clarko that we could ask for, given how enormously difficult it is to move on from the greatest coach of all time.
Also Clarko was burnt out, he needs a rest. An could return to the AFL sharper than ever in 2023.
 

Log in to remove this ad.

toomanysquibs

Premiership Player
Nov 25, 2006
3,033
3,666
Hawthorn
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Other Teams
Hawks
Have you slept yet mate?

ha ha, nice try.

Know where I live, do you?

Sam Mitchell thread wasn't it, not pivot to try and one up everyone?

What is interesting for most of us, is what Sam does with our back six once they're all on deck. Who goes into the middle or forward, and who stays in the fast rebounding positions on the HBFs.
 

jenniferHAWKinS

Club Legend
Jul 6, 2015
2,075
4,696
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Our ball movement post bye was so much quicker (played on a lot more) and we took the corridor on a lot more. I am excited what we can do when Day, Bramble, Downie, Scrimshaw and Ward/Sinn? replace the likes of Howe, Phillips, Morrison and Shiels as our main outside midfield distributors (massive upgrade in pace and skill).
 

Stratton24

Club Legend
Aug 29, 2003
2,535
4,715
Melbourne
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Our ball movement post bye was so much quicker (played on a lot more) and we took the corridor on a lot more. I am excited what we can do when Day, Bramble, Downie, Scrimshaw and Ward/Sinn? replace the likes of Howe, Phillips, Morrison and Shiels as our main outside midfield distributors (massive upgrade in pace and skill).
We played on less but were smarter after the bye. Early season we were playing on way to much and turning it over. It culminated in the Adelaide shoot out game in Tassie. After that game up to the bye we went back to way to slow and then lost all confidence and form. After the bye we struck a much better balance.
 

2OLD 2SLOW

Debutant
Jun 13, 2021
103
574
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Does anyone think Sam will really push the way he use to kick particularly with both sides, did he do anything unique at box hill with kicking?
I watched 5 or 6 Box hill matches, a few of them a couple of times over (looking for certain players) and I can't say I noticed anything revolutionary - just tough, contested football and relatively direct, swift ball movement to leading forwards. When we got on top, as we did in most matches, it was great to watch.
He did have a little dig at Connor Downie for not using his right foot ... and if anyone would know a thing or two about which kicks to bite off and which kicks to put in the locker, you'd think it'd be Sam. So maybe we will see some new trend around our kicking?? Something to look out for.

I get the feeling Sam is a bit like Clarko in that he doesn't have an absolute blue-print - the game plan will evolve from the personnel and certain non-negotiables (around the contested ball, running patterns, defensive set-ups and the like). The fact that we have recruited some quick, skilled young players makes it almost certain we'll be a more dangerous transition team (a trend that I think was already emerging under Clarko).

Based on Sam's time at Box Hill, what I'm expecting to see next year is

... big demands on toughness at the contest - with the acid on the younger, outside types as much as the inside guys (I suspect any player who is iffy at the contest will get it between the eyes). I think both Connor and Finn have been pushed by Sam to improve their contested footy, and both visibly improved in this area. For this reason I am more bullish about their future than some BF posters (Then again, they're two of my favourites and I am as biased as F*ck).

Based on Box Hill, what I'm hoping to see next year is

... key forwards (in fact, forwards in general) constantly looking to create clear contests for one another, and looking to get separation from their marker. This has also improved this year in the seniors, after being pretty dire in the previous couple of years. I have a sneaky feeling (again, probably just bias) that Jeka might be a favourite of Sam's, and the key to his forward line in a year or 2.
 

Milkshaker

Club Legend
Nov 6, 2014
2,703
5,993
24 Barrack Street
AFL Club
Hawthorn
I’m still not sure moving Nash into middle was some smart calculated move by Sam or just a bit of dumb luck at BH where there’s a bit more flexibility (ie let’s chuck Nash in middle for a quarter as we are down a mid). If I recall he was playing as wing/hff for first half of bhh season.
Not sure why someone would laugh at this. Shane Ellen had never played full forward in his life until the1997 gf. Good coaching, a hunch or good luck? You get lucky sometimes. 5 in a gf? If Modra had not been injured never would have happened.
 
Last edited:

perrdan86

Senior List
Mar 2, 2013
170
416
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Other Teams
Lakers - Man Utd - Rams - Yankees
I watched 5 or 6 Box hill matches, a few of them a couple of times over (looking for certain players) and I can't say I noticed anything revolutionary - just tough, contested football and relatively direct, swift ball movement to leading forwards. When we got on top, as we did in most matches, it was great to watch.
That's enough to get me excited!
 

CHUBBSS

Club Legend
Apr 6, 2010
1,830
4,991
AFL Club
Hawthorn
I watched 5 or 6 Box hill matches, a few of them a couple of times over (looking for certain players) and I can't say I noticed anything revolutionary - just tough, contested football and relatively direct, swift ball movement to leading forwards. When we got on top, as we did in most matches, it was great to watch.
He did have a little dig at Connor Downie for not using his right foot ... and if anyone would know a thing or two about which kicks to bite off and which kicks to put in the locker, you'd think it'd be Sam. So maybe we will see some new trend around our kicking?? Something to look out for.

I get the feeling Sam is a bit like Clarko in that he doesn't have an absolute blue-print - the game plan will evolve from the personnel and certain non-negotiables (around the contested ball, running patterns, defensive set-ups and the like). The fact that we have recruited some quick, skilled young players makes it almost certain we'll be a more dangerous transition team (a trend that I think was already emerging under Clarko).

Based on Sam's time at Box Hill, what I'm expecting to see next year is

... big demands on toughness at the contest - with the acid on the younger, outside types as much as the inside guys (I suspect any player who is iffy at the contest will get it between the eyes). I think both Connor and Finn have been pushed by Sam to improve their contested footy, and both visibly improved in this area. For this reason I am more bullish about their future than some BF posters (Then again, they're two of my favourites and I am as biased as F*ck).

Based on Box Hill, what I'm hoping to see next year is

... key forwards (in fact, forwards in general) constantly looking to create clear contests for one another, and looking to get separation from their marker. This has also improved this year in the seniors, after being pretty dire in the previous couple of years. I have a sneaky feeling (again, probably just bias) that Jeka might be a favourite of Sam's, and the key to his forward line in a year or 2.
Great post, yer I’m really keen to see how the key forwards develop. Kozzi and callow sound like extremely hard workers that will no doubt rub off and Jeka and Lewis. All have the tools so it will be exciting to see them develop and through nothing else but competition for game day spots they will all get better. Jekas kicking gets me going…
 

Brishawk

Brownlow Medallist
Jan 17, 2008
23,542
43,119
Brisvegas
AFL Club
Hawthorn
I watched 5 or 6 Box hill matches, a few of them a couple of times over (looking for certain players) and I can't say I noticed anything revolutionary - just tough, contested football and relatively direct, swift ball movement to leading forwards. When we got on top, as we did in most matches, it was great to watch.
He did have a little dig at Connor Downie for not using his right foot ... and if anyone would know a thing or two about which kicks to bite off and which kicks to put in the locker, you'd think it'd be Sam. So maybe we will see some new trend around our kicking?? Something to look out for.

I get the feeling Sam is a bit like Clarko in that he doesn't have an absolute blue-print - the game plan will evolve from the personnel and certain non-negotiables (around the contested ball, running patterns, defensive set-ups and the like). The fact that we have recruited some quick, skilled young players makes it almost certain we'll be a more dangerous transition team (a trend that I think was already emerging under Clarko).

Based on Sam's time at Box Hill, what I'm expecting to see next year is

... big demands on toughness at the contest - with the acid on the younger, outside types as much as the inside guys (I suspect any player who is iffy at the contest will get it between the eyes). I think both Connor and Finn have been pushed by Sam to improve their contested footy, and both visibly improved in this area. For this reason I am more bullish about their future than some BF posters (Then again, they're two of my favourites and I am as biased as F*ck).

Based on Box Hill, what I'm hoping to see next year is

... key forwards (in fact, forwards in general) constantly looking to create clear contests for one another, and looking to get separation from their marker. This has also improved this year in the seniors, after being pretty dire in the previous couple of years. I have a sneaky feeling (again, probably just bias) that Jeka might be a favourite of Sam's, and the key to his forward line in a year or 2.
Great observations. I think Sam values the tough competitiveness in the midfield, which is why he pushed for Nash and Newcombe into the senior midfield.

And I don’t think he likes trading out a mid at the stoppages for the extra in defence.

I think we gave up to many easy clearances at stoppages over the past couple of years because we had our mids trying to play frantic pressure footy while being one short and often getting drawn too close to the contest and getting burnt on the outside. I’m confident sam will fix that problem for us.
 

2OLD 2SLOW

Debutant
Jun 13, 2021
103
574
AFL Club
Hawthorn
I think Sam values the tough competitiveness in the midfield, which is why he pushed for Nash and Newcombe into the senior midfield.

And I don’t think he likes trading out a mid at the stoppages for the extra in defence.

I think we gave up to many easy clearances at stoppages over the past couple of years because we had our mids trying to play frantic pressure footy while being one short and often getting drawn too close to the contest and getting burnt on the outside. I’m confident sam will fix that problem for us.
All very true. A change to this 'And I don’t think he likes trading out a mid at the stoppages for the extra in defence' alone could make our midfield look more damaging (and at the same time, give us more presence at the back of the stoppage). Would be great to see oppo mids looking to burst through the stoppage only to consistently run into one of Nash or Newcombe.

Will also be interesting to see how O'Meara is used. Personally, I'd like to see him be the guy keeping his feet on the rim of the stoppage, rarely going right inside for the hot ball - leave that to the specialists TOM and Worps. Would give us a consistent outside mid who always keeps their feet, has some speed and the power to exit the stoppage front-on. Would also stop O'Meara from getting banged up.
 

(Log in to remove this ad.)

Pessimistic

Make me an Admin!
Sep 13, 2000
81,947
38,792
Melbourne cricket ground. Australia
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Other Teams
Horks
Also Clarko was burnt out, he needs a rest. An could return to the AFL sharper than ever in 2023.
‘is there an alternate reality where Clarko could have been refreshed in place? You get the feeling this wasn’t explored for several 8cough8jeff8 reasons
 

rogiebear93

Norm Smith Medallist
May 17, 2017
7,890
19,772
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Great observations. I think Sam values the tough competitiveness in the midfield, which is why he pushed for Nash and Newcombe into the senior midfield.

And I don’t think he likes trading out a mid at the stoppages for the extra in defence.

I think we gave up to many easy clearances at stoppages over the past couple of years because we had our mids trying to play frantic pressure footy while being one short and often getting drawn too close to the contest and getting burnt on the outside. I’m confident sam will fix that problem for us.
Indeed, Clarko's focus on defense meant that we were always preparing to protect the back 6 instead of move forward. That doesn't work for the cattle we've got at the moment because we don't have the midfielders who can use it like Hodge, Lewis and Sam could. Those guys could get the ball back and attack from there, where there's not as much decisiveness with ball in hand from the current midfield unit.
 

CaptainWorpedo

Senior List
Feb 15, 2021
246
436
AFL Club
Hawthorn
I am wondering where the Welcome Coach Mitchell presser is from the club. An i would really like the man himself address our fans. Everything has been very quiet and i feel there is a lot at play right now.
 

hawkman

Brownlow Medallist
Jun 7, 2007
22,706
27,381
Melbourne
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Other Teams
Tottenham Hotspur
Really interesting comment from Chad. "We're going to challenge each other, and Sammy's going to be huge on that, bringing that competitive instinct back into the club and its only going to drive us forward".

Did we not have it?

I think that competitive instinct did leave for awhile. Senior premiership players got comfortable, there was no really selection pressure on them as they would stay in the team despite performances.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Remove this Banner Ad

Remove this Banner Ad