News Sam Murray Asada Investigation

(Log in to remove this ad.)

DinoSoar

Club Legend
Sep 30, 2013
2,689
4,147
Outer Fringes
AFL Club
Collingwood
I agree except for the wording of your last line. The AFL will not be the ones giving out the punishment. This is very different to the Essendon saga, where I don't believe there were any individual positive tests (which would've been dealt with automatically by ASADA) but the exposure of team-wide doping with a very likely (99%) banned substance, and the coverups by the club (+/- AFL) that followed. It only escalated because ASADA/WADA were not happy with how the AFL dealt with it.

Murray's result goes straight to ASADA, and they will be the ones handing down the punishment - which they AFL will very likely have to comply with. AFAIK, the AFL are not really supposed to have involvement in the actual process, but it's very likely that they will be scheming to get the best outcome for the AFL. (which could be try to push for soft sentence, which would go along with their s**tty illicit drugs policy, and appease the AFLPA, or less likely, try and push for a harder sentence, if they want to make an example out of this case) - ultimately though, ASADA decide.
Incorrect, refer to my post 1367 with the screenshot from ASADA’s website describing the process of a doping violation. It is the applicable sporting body’s tribunal that determines and hands out the penalty, so it is definitely the AFL here. If ASADA disagrees with the finding and/or penalty then they can appeal to CAS, as they did in the case of the AFL’s decision in regards to Essendon’s team wide doping program. The whole process is clearly detailed on ASADA’s website.
 

didaksrightfoot

Premiership Player
Sep 12, 2013
4,849
5,424
AFL Club
Collingwood
Other Teams
SA Spurs, Juventus
Like seriously how long can it take to achieve a result from a secondary sample. It's been over 7 months since he initially tested positive!
Shouldn't be that hard, it's either 2 years or 4 years.
I think you've kinda answered your own question.

Firstly, it will not be reported until a decision is made - not just when the B sample comes in (which must have already happened). The AFL (via Barrett, on afl.com.au) had no legal right to publish the initial result when they did, and it would not surprise me if Murray's lawyers have also raised this in whatever discussions are happening right now.

But the fact that there has been no finding yet, IMO, suggests that ASADA has been quite open to, or is at least willing to listen to, the complicating factors that Murray's team will be arguing: that he admits willingly taking Cocaine, but will argue it was 3-4 days before the game, and they will try to argue that it would not have performance enhancing effects 3-4 days later, even though the newer test may now be able to detect it then. The one thing in their favour is that if tested on a non-gameday sample, ASADA would not care about a positive test for cocaine (as opposed to most other PED's, or masking agents) - and the AFL's own drug policy would treat it as a "1st strike". It will come down to how well his team can argue that, what level of science they can use to back it up, and how much ASADA are willing to consider it as an argument.
I would suggest that the longer this takes, and the more time there is for these arguments, the more likely Murray does not face the maximum 4-year suspension, but probably some sort of comprimise like 2 years.
 

didaksrightfoot

Premiership Player
Sep 12, 2013
4,849
5,424
AFL Club
Collingwood
Other Teams
SA Spurs, Juventus
Incorrect, refer to my post 1367 with the screenshot from ASADA’s website describing the process of a doping violation. It is the applicable sporting body’s tribunal that determines and hands out the penalty, so it is definitely the AFL here. If ASADA disagrees with the finding and/or penalty then they can appeal to CAS, as they did in the case of the AFL’s decision in regards to Essendon’s team wide doping program. The whole process is clearly detailed on ASADA’s website.
my bad
 

barrackers

Premium Gold
Sep 4, 2016
6,127
10,343
AFL Club
Collingwood
The AFL leaks like a sieve, so it's surprising we haven't heard what delay is. Maybe there's legal action or threats stopping leaks?
There's only so many possible reasons for the delay though:
  • ASDA is still putting together it's case. Murray may have extenuating circumstances? Perhaps the matter has gotten bigger/more complicated than the initial leak suggested?
  • It's been through the AFL tribunal and is now waiting on an appeal (Murray or ASDA) to CAS

In terms of his footy our game plan has shifted since his recruitment. Would a line breaker with somewhat erratic kicking fit into the pinpoint keepings off style?
 

Timmy from Thomastown

TheBrownDog
May 25, 2006
52,283
26,547
Beach
AFL Club
Collingwood
The AFL leaks like a sieve, so it's surprising we haven't heard what delay is. Maybe there's legal action or threats stopping leaks?
There's only so many possible reasons for the delay though:
  • ASDA is still putting together it's case. Murray may have extenuating circumstances? Perhaps the matter has gotten bigger/more complicated than the initial leak suggested?
  • It's been through the AFL tribunal and is now waiting on an appeal (Murray or ASDA) to CAS

In terms of his footy our game plan has shifted since his recruitment. Would a line breaker with somewhat erratic kicking fit into the pinpoint keepings off style?
If he improves his kicking he'd suit our style perfectly. Given his career is only approx 10 games old I'd be happy to give him the chance to improve his kicking should his ban end up being short. I'm sure you can agree that players can improve in this department, given time and experience. I can name 3-4 2010 premiership players for a start!!!
 

Fruit

Club Legend
Jul 24, 2012
1,787
1,248
AFL Club
Collingwood
My mail is that ASADA have just taken their time dealing with it and it’s of no concern to them that he and everyone else wants a result quickly. An AFL Player doesn’t get special treatment. It’s apparently a massive frustration for the family who are hoping for a shorter sentence than what’s been reported as possible.
 

(Log in to remove this ad.)

sr36

Brownlow Medallist
Aug 20, 2009
12,003
15,722
Vietnam
AFL Club
Collingwood
In terms of his footy our game plan has shifted since his recruitment. Would a line breaker with somewhat erratic kicking fit into the pinpoint keepings off style?
Do you reckon that style is going to be ongoing, or is it just for select teams?
 

Tarkyn_24

Brownlow Medallist
Dec 23, 2006
29,865
25,522
AFL Club
Collingwood
Do you reckon that style is going to be ongoing, or is it just for select teams?
Was gonna say this, I’ve seen no evidence that the style from Thursday is planned as a consistent thing.

I think we need to be flexible in how we approach different sides. Makes us a lot more fluent translating to a plan B if we do.
 

Darkyprotector

Premiership Player
Apr 10, 2017
3,809
1,769
AFL Club
Collingwood
So what happens if the b comes back with a lower level
Or
If the bs been contaminated , not secure or varies

Something's going on

Hope Sam gets barretts new mustang
 

Saintly Viewed

So You Think
Aug 10, 2015
45,801
36,830
AFL Club
Collingwood
So what happens if the b comes back with a lower level
Or
If the bs been contaminated , not secure or varies

Something's going on

Hope Sam gets barretts new mustang
The B sample would be back and long tested.

If in anyway the B sample was different to A sample, the case would be dismissed and thrown out. That is the simple part.

What is likely happening now is the legal manoeuvring to have a verdict reached and agreed upon as to circumstances.
 

TradeDraft

Premium Gold
Oct 18, 2009
119,526
49,500
Mornington Peninsula
AFL Club
Collingwood
My mail is that ASADA have just taken their time dealing with it and it’s of no concern to them that he and everyone else wants a result quickly. An AFL Player doesn’t get special treatment. It’s apparently a massive frustration for the family who are hoping for a shorter sentence than what’s been reported as possible.
No wonder the AFL think they are a Joke
 

Bad Horse

Thoroughbred of Sin
Mar 26, 2016
4,235
11,429
Josh Schache's underwear drawer
AFL Club
Collingwood
So what happens if the b comes back with a lower level
Or
If the bs been contaminated , not secure or varies

Something's going on

Hope Sam gets barretts new mustang
I think its more likely that I am Barrett's new mustang than anything like this is going on.*

*For the record, I am not. If anyone is riding anyone, its me riding Barrett. Wait, that sounds worse...


fu** me I think I need some cocaine now.
 

Saintly Viewed

So You Think
Aug 10, 2015
45,801
36,830
AFL Club
Collingwood
I think its more likely that I am Barrett's new mustang than anything like this is going on.*

*For the record, I am not. If anyone is riding anyone, its me riding Barrett. Wait, that sounds worse...


**** me I think I need some cocaine now.
You went through the purple patch their horse.

Any which way riding purple is never a good thing.
 

barrackers

Premium Gold
Sep 4, 2016
6,127
10,343
AFL Club
Collingwood
Do you reckon that style is going to be ongoing, or is it just for select teams?
Likely we’ll switch depending on the opposition, and potentially across games. Ideally we need all players capable of playing all styles in case we switch during games and to minimise changes from game to game.

As seen with Thomas players can come back from lengthy bans, but it will take time and there’s the chance someone might take the spot.
 

The Royal Sampler

Floreat Pica, Bitch!
Nov 26, 2006
25,776
17,152
Hooray For Science, Woo!
AFL Club
Collingwood
Other Teams
VFL Magpies
Likely we’ll switch depending on the opposition, and potentially across games. Ideally we need all players capable of playing all styles in case we switch during games and to minimise changes from game to game.
Having a “brand” of football you impose on the opposition is old school/stick in the mud/bring your mouthguards to training/done a cartilage/189cm ruckman stuff.

Find out what your opponent doesn’t do well and exploit it to the best of your ability.
 

FrakturedHalo

The Voice of Reason
May 6, 2017
428
491
Melbourne
AFL Club
Collingwood
Honestly, this is turning into something out of Yes Minister, the whole thing gets shadier and shonkier week by week. Why is he allowed to train and play with his old club? If you’ve been hit with a doping code violation you aren’t even allowed to be the water bottle runner at your nephews under 11’s game in the MSJFL, are they just making up rules as they go along “no you can’t play footy at AFL level, but we’ll allow you to still be involved in your little regional league?”?? And what exactly is there even to be negotiated/circumstances agreed upon and legally wrangled? It’s an in-competition gameday test, either it’s positive or it’s not, since when in the entire history of enforcing the anti-doping code across any sport has it ever been accepted as a mitigating factor “well yes the sample may have tested positive, but because I consumed XxX substance actually 4 days before gameday not up to 48 hours before which is what we all got told was the window that could produce a positive reading, my metabolism is just obviously a bit more sluggish than your average Joe’s, you should take that into consideration and downgrade my sanction from the automatic 4 year penalty the code stipulates?” Or if the b test was negative or inconclusive, then throw the thing out already metabolites aren’t going to just spontaneously grow outta nowhere in a frozen piss sample. The only brand damage that’s being done is by the AFL and ASADA to themselves by acting like a bunch of dithering ducks quacking at each other
 

regpies

Club Legend
Sep 19, 2011
2,402
3,005
AFL Club
Collingwood
ASADA should be up for an award for the slowest bureaucracy there is.

Can you imagine how long it must take ASADA to order stationary? It would have to go through 5 mid level managers, then would need to be approved by 3 other managers before final approval via a capex through the head of finance.

Maybe that’s why the Murray case is delayed, they are all sitting around waiting for the stationary order of pens to arrive. Should be another 6-9mths.
 
Top Bottom