Analysis Same Structures vs Radical Change?

Slots and structures for 2018?


  • Total voters
    20

John Who

Norm Smith Medallist
Apr 16, 2017
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With the 3 main losses over the preseason in Smith, Cameandgone and Leaver, there are 3 possible paths we can go (and for Pyke to scratch his head over the summer):
1. Find replacements that are most "like-for-like" to the 3 players from above.
2. Make a new structure and game plan and pick the players best suited for the new game plan.
3. Wait over the summer period to see who has the most hunger and who is the most improved, and allow these types to slot into the missing positions.

What do you guys think should happen?
 

Jenkins4

All Australian
Oct 23, 2017
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With the 3 main losses over the preseason in Smith, Cameandgone and Leaver, there are 3 possible paths we can go (and for Pyke to scratch his head over the summer):
1. Find replacements that are most "like-for-like" to the 3 players from above.
2. Make a new structure and game plan and pick the players best suited for the new game plan.
3. Wait over the summer period to see who has the most hunger and who is the most improved, and allow these types to slot into the missing positions.

What do you guys think should happen?

I voted for number 2 as any good game plan should never be stagnate. Wheather thats new players or players moving into a new position gives enough change to keep things fresh.

Therefore, we should be selecting new players and adjusting the game plan to stay in front of the curve.
 

John Who

Norm Smith Medallist
Apr 16, 2017
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I voted for number 2 as any good game plan should never be stagnate. Wheather thats new players or players moving into a new position gives enough change to keep things fresh.

Therefore, we should be selecting new players and adjusting the game plan to stay in front of the curve.
So your response is more a combination of 2 and 3? Or if it's number 2, which 3 do you think should get the nod?
 

John Who

Norm Smith Medallist
Apr 16, 2017
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Why change a winning formula?

Milera for Smith
Doedee for Lever
Galluci for Cameron

Just don't bring in Otten when Gov is injured.
Bringing in Often for Gov WAS our winning formula! Until the Grand Final... :*(
 
May 25, 2009
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The first two options are too extreme in my opinion. We shouldn't keep a gameplan exactly as is when weaknesses in it have been exposed, but nor should we throw it out entirely when it got us a minor premiership and our first grand final berth in a long time.

The wait and see approach of the third option feels like not having a plan.
 

CrowBloke

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May 14, 2017
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1. Find replacements that are most "like-for-like" to the 3 players from above.
2. Make a new structure and game plan and pick the players best suited for the new game plan.
3. Wait over the summer period to see who has the most hunger and who is the most improved, and allow these types to slot into the missing positions.
1) like-for-like is not a Coach's priority, surely? The team will evolve naturally as personnel leave and new blokes come in. eg Brodie Smith is irreplaceable, but somebody might stand up and do a good job in their own way.
2) No and no.
Pyke's not going to do either, although Hart and Francou will make some changes reflecting their styles. I hope Francou inspires and gets some mongrel out of our forwards, especially JJ.
3) This is the most logical and pragmatic approach. I suspect Pyke's got a few ideas of his own to make the Crows better/stronger and even more competitive, which would be Flag-winning. I'd like to see Gibson and Fogarty in the senior side asap. Gibson for his team ethic, fitness, preparation and tagging ability. Fogarty for his pack-breaking, skilled aggro, IF his engine tunes up to AFL level.
 
Aug 7, 2015
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The first two options are too extreme in my opinion. We shouldn't keep a gameplan exactly as is when weaknesses in it have been exposed, but nor should we throw it out entirely when it got us a minor premiership and our first grand final berth in a long time.

The wait and see approach of the third option feels like not having a plan.
Why not have a combination of the first two options?

Our team already has a lot of practice at the existing game plan and we can probably still win a lot of games with it so keep it as plan A.

If we can tweak our team structure, develop and practice a new plan B game plan that would more suit the pressure cooker environment of a grand final, then we would be in a better place.
 

marty36

Brownlow Medallist
Aug 17, 2009
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1) like-for-like is not a Coach's priority, surely? The team will evolve naturally as personnel leave and new blokes come in. eg Brodie Smith is irreplaceable, but somebody might stand up and do a good job in their own way.
2) No and no.
Pyke's not going to do either, although Hart and Francou will make some changes reflecting their styles. I hope Francou inspires and gets some mongrel out of our forwards, especially JJ.
3) This is the most logical and pragmatic approach. I suspect Pyke's got a few ideas of his own to make the Crows better/stronger and even more competitive, which would be Flag-winning. I'd like to see Gibson and Fogarty in the senior side asap. Gibson for his team ethic, fitness, preparation and tagging ability. Fogarty for his pack-breaking, skilled aggro, IF his engine tunes up to AFL level.

Will francou help Sloane deal with a tag he was pretty much like Sloane and learnt how to deal with it

I’m hoping francou can do that for Sloane


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May 26, 2013
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Why change a winning formula?

Milera for Smith
Doedee for Lever
Galluci for Cameron

Just don't bring in Otten when Gov is injured.
The main reason to change is Doedee + Gallucci = 1 game.

Now they might be good, but they are basically rookies (in the US meaning) And as a result they might be good enough to be in our best 22 and replace Lever and CC but not to play the exact role those two did. Doedee will likely need a bit more protection than Lever - similar to Lever in his first two years.
 
Nov 6, 2003
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I voted for number 2 as any good game plan should never be stagnate. Wheather thats new players or players moving into a new position gives enough change to keep things fresh.

Therefore, we should be selecting new players and adjusting the game plan to stay in front of the curve.
The "so called experts" (ex AFL Coaches) believe all teams are tweaking their gameplans every 6 weeks or so ......as you say, to stay ahead of the curve, as opposition seek to counter a teams strength

Why your 2nd point is floored ....is that the basis of a good team is cohesion & familiarity with players around you & how they play
Bit like the Coxed 8 in rowing ....teamwork is the essence & you don't change oar positions, or bring new team members in, unless you are forced
 
Nov 6, 2003
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No player should or Sloanes mid season slump would be criticised a great deal more considering what he is paid


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Was Sloane good in the GF ? ......i didn't watch the 2nd half, but didn't notice him much in the first half?
 
May 25, 2009
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Why not have a combination of the first two options?

Our team already has a lot of practice at the existing game plan and we can probably still win a lot of games with it so keep it as plan A.

If we can tweak our team structure, develop and practice a new plan B game plan that would more suit the pressure cooker environment of a grand final, then we would be in a better place.
I'm not sure it's possible to have two distinct gameplans to switch between in games. Variations of plan A sure, but an entirely new plan often requires changes of personnel which you can't do in a game.

My preference would be to keep what we have but alter it to be able to deal with our weaknesses without it costing our strengths. For starters I would like Lever's vacant spot to be filled by someone faster and more agile than he was, but who's also a decent intercept marker and spoiler. In our forward line I'm willing to tolerate four talls but only if the fourth is McGovern, no exceptions.
 
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marty36

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Aug 17, 2009
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Was Sloane good in the GF ? ......i didn't watch the 2nd half, but didn't notice him much in the first half?

The one that has escaped criticism from the board is Betts Vlastuin was rated one of their best players and I know most would ask who Vlastuin is

But yeah bag JJ or Otten

But Betts has shown a lot while at Adelaide unfortunately not in the biggest game of his career


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Nov 6, 2003
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The one that has escaped criticism from the board is Betts Vlastuin was rated one of their best players and I know most would ask who Vlastuin is

But yeah bag JJ or Otten

But Betts has shown a lot while at Adelaide unfortunately not in the biggest game of his career


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But this was my point re outside players & small forwards .......history shows that if you're not winning the ball at the coalface, these players struggle

It's not Betts, or Atkins, or Mackay .......too many looking at the stats & not looking at the cause of the problem .......in a scoring chain, it's often initiated by a tackle, a knock on, smart decision, or a contested mark

The thing i like about Lynch is that as a leadup forward ......he makes elite decisions with his disposals ....down the line, 45 degree kick, handball, that sets up scoring chains ......others simply continue to take the poorer / easy options ....this is where Matt Crouch has really gone to another level in decision making
 

Jenkins4

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Oct 23, 2017
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The "so called experts" (ex AFL Coaches) believe all teams are tweaking their gameplans every 6 weeks or so ......as you say, to stay ahead of the curve, as opposition seek to counter a teams strength

Why your 2nd point is floored ....is that the basis of a good team is cohesion & familiarity with players around you & how they play
Bit like the Coxed 8 in rowing ....teamwork is the essence & you don't change oar positions, or bring new team members in, unless you are forced

We have been forced. Smith, Lever and Cameron are no longer at the club. They are forced changes.

If we then predict a few more players movement, like Laird to a midfield role we could then have a very different looking back 6.

Those changes are best implemented during a pre-season, not on the fly caused by a few injuries.
 
Nov 6, 2003
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We have been forced. Smith, Lever and Cameron are no longer at the club. They are forced changes.

If we then predict a few more players movement, like Laird to a midfield role we could then have a very different looking back 6.

Those changes are best implemented during a pre-season, not on the fly caused by a few injuries.
I agree that changes will in part be forced on us ......but Pyke has shown that he subscribes to the theory, familiarity = cohesive teamwork

With Gibbs & Gibson coming in, and having lost Smith & Lever .....i think the chances of a Laird move to the midfield is 0%
 

Jenkins4

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Oct 23, 2017
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I agree that changes will in part be forced on us ......but Pyke has shown that he subscribes to the theory, familiarity = cohesive teamwork

With Gibbs & Gibson coming in, and having lost Smith & Lever .....i think the chances of a Laird move to the midfield is 0%

You maybe right but as they say familiarity breeds contempt and I think Pyke is too smart to keep rolling the same plan out year after year. He will tweak it slightly to keep everyone* interested.

*players not fans.
 
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