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Schapelle Corby

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Ferris_rules said:
Do you get paid to be a Mod ?
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No, it's entirely voluntary.
Ferris_rules said:
I ask this because you do undertake an important job in terms of ensuring that no one here crosses the legal line.
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It's a matter of using common sense. Opinion is fine, discussing the events of the case is also fine. Statements along the lines of "it's common knowledge on the GC that the Corby family are drug dealers" is defamatory and has to be deleted.

There are a number of issues which are not allowed to be discussed on BigFooty, because they are the subject of legal injunctions. Most of the BF members know what they are and know to expect an infraction when they cross the line.

This one is somewhat trickier. Corby and her brother have both been tried and convicted. The events surrounding Corby's arrest and trial have been well documented by the media at the time and now by Channel Nein's "documentary". However, allegations similar to those recently leveled at Mercedes Corby, while possibly having basis in fact remain potentially defamatory.
 
jenny61_99 said:
I think "reasonable doubt" is fairly self-explanatory. If the person is caught stuffing the bag of drugs into the boogie bag, then there is no doubt. If the person says they have no knowledge of it, then you have to look at all the evidence and the burden of proof is on the prosecution. This definition might help:

REASONABLE DOUBT - The level of certainty a juror must have to find a defendant guilty of a crime. A real doubt, based upon reason and common sense after careful and impartial consideration of all the evidence, or lack of evidence, in a case.

or this:

Beyond a reasonable doubt is the standard required by the prosecution in most criminal cases within an adversarial system, also called the "Burden of Proof". This means that the proposition being presented by the prosecution must be proven to the extent that there is no "reasonable doubt" in the mind of a reasonable person that the defendant is guilty. There can still be a doubt, but only to the extent that it would not affect a "reasonable person's" belief that the defendant is guilty. If the doubt that is raised does affect a "reasonable person's" belief that the defendant is guilty, the jury is not satisfied beyond a "reasonable doubt".


The reason juries came about was to eliminate the possibility of bias or corruption within a 3 judge panel system. Of course we all know that juries can be tampered with and aren't as fallible as one would hope, but on the main part, juries are successful.

I think there are so many questions with this case that it is very hard to determine beyond reasonable doubt that Shapelle Corby was a knowing participant. We are not talking about her brothers/sister or anyone else because they are not the ones serving the prison sentence.
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The one weakness in all your arguments jenny is that you're quoting the situation as it is in Australia.

Under Balinese law it's very simple, did you have drugs in your possession?

Schapelle unfortunately did.

They're not interested in the whys and wherefores - possession alone makes her guilty under their law.

FWIW my opinion is that the marijhuana belonged to her half brother, and that Schapelle was probably aware of it being there (not totally sure of this last point).

If she was aware then IMO she claimed it as hers thinking that a pretty young woman had more chance of getting off lightly than a hairy-arsed male.

I don't buy the baggage handling story though.
 

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I must've hit a nerve (truth?).....my post has been deleted, along with another poster who responded to it (and agreed with me).....I am so naughty apparently;)...I have duly reprimanded myself:eek:
 
jenny61_99 said:
How come the baggage handler that was brought in to testify said that a boogie board weighing that much (4 kilos more than normal) would have been picked up by the handlers and supervisors made to know that something was not right? It was also mentioned that the closed circuit tvs were not working in Brissie that day. As for there being enough evidence to convict her in an Australian court... I disagree.
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what's to disagree with. numerous lawyers and experts said at the time, she would still have been convicted here.

who cares about this girl. just another dumb guilty idiot, who wants to play the racist justice system against me thing.

smoking gun, caught. nothing to see here.


There was poor handling of the "evidence" - no fingerprinting of either external or internal bag to find evidence of her fingerprints. Add to that that every man and his dog handled the bag AND the gunja. No tests were done on the gunja to see where it was grown.
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so?


There was no motive (ie. not a drug user (urine test was clear), no urgent need of cash, was planning to stay 2 weeks rather than the quick turn around trip of a usual drug mule - as the criminal expert pointed out).
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motive is subjective and easily presented in whatever light you like.

this is all vague circumstantial nonsense, supposed to contradict hard evidence?

I'm sure the australian jails are full of people a lot more innocent than this girl. they may not be so today-tonight photogenic however.

Combine that with the baggage handlers comments and there was enough "reasonable doubt" to see the prosecution lose in our law courts.
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ah yes, the expert legal opinions of the bagge handlers.
c'mon, how many straws can you clutch in one hand?


As with Lindy Chamberlain 20 years before her, Schapelle is being hung drawn and quartered by every man and their dog without knowing the full story. She's being judged on her looks, the families looks, the bloke who stepped in to help her... etc.etc.etc.
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BTW my mum sat on the lindy chamberlain royal commission, and if you think that's cut n dried even today - you're dreaming.

but more to the point that's another irrelevancy. just an over-empotional crutch to imply doubt where the evidence does not.

bottom line, there is NOTHING to see here, except to play the "foreigners who don't look like us, can't be trusted" race card, overlayed on the a pretty girl can't be guilty heartstrings violin.

if you're genuinely concerned about unsafe convictions, our prisons are full of them. I'm sure they could use a voice to stand up for them.
 
relapse said:
The purpose of taking that much dope to Bali doesnt make sense and there is a higher street value in Australia than over there for it.
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I know that's something that has been disputed before.

I don't know whether it's true or not, but i'm pretty sure there is some argument that this is not the case.
 
Didn't ya just love it last night how all the 'Corby' family friends are 'cannabis growers'. Neighbour-Cannabis Grower.

They are the biggest bogan family going around, step brothers, Bogan sister, Bogan Mum, Bogan Dad, Bogan Bogan Bogan.


And to make it worse she looks like this girl I work with.


Whose a Bogan.
 
KingsCrow said:
Didn't ya just love it last night how all the 'Corby' family friends are 'cannabis growers'. Neighbour-Cannabis Grower.

They are the biggest bogan family going around, step brothers, Bogan sister, Bogan Mum, Bogan Dad, Bogan Bogan Bogan.


And to make it worse she looks like this girl I work with.


Whose a Bogan.
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The Power would gladly take the Corbys and their bogan friends on board as members as it would instantly double their crowds ... as long as they are not too high to remember the game is on or too behind bars to get to AAMI.
 

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Bosley said:
The Power would gladly take the Corbys and their bogan friends on board as members as it would instantly double their crowds ... as long as they are not too high to remember the game is on or too behind bars to get to AAMI.
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The Kuta Beach Power.

Could work.

But honestly, the Boganess of the family just shits me to tears. These people shouldn't be famous.

'AHHHWHHHH SCHAPELLE'YYY AINT GUILTY!!! ONLY SOME BOOOOOOOOOGEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE BOARD IN THAT BAG. I SAWWWW IT WITH ME OWWWNNNNN ONE...TWO EYESSSSSSSS!!!!'

Slaughtering the English language.
 
Bosley said:
Remember the Paxtons?

The Corbys are the Paxtons repackaged for a new decade ... both families loved by turgid tabloid "journalism" shows which screen at 6:30pm.
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Big difference though. The Paxtons were the fallguys, with Channel Nein deliberately setting them up to tear them down. The Corby's on the other hand milked the media for all they were worth. One group were victims, the other were beneficiaries.
 
jo172 said:
Pretty much sums it all up.

What was outrageous is all the public sympathy which should have gone to equally guilty but much more deserving causes like the Bali 9 and Van Nguyen.
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I fail to see why the Bali 9 should have attracted any sympathy at all (not that Corby should have either). Van Nguyen on the other hand at least had a good motivation for doing what he did - not that I disagree with the penalty he paid for his crime.
 
Vader said:
I fail to see why the Bali 9 should have attracted any sympathy at all (not that Corby should have either). Van Nguyen on the other hand at least had a good motivation for doing what he did - not that I disagree with the penalty he paid for his crime.
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The Bali Nine are just drop out, drop kicks. Thank god they aren't getting much attention either.


I just hope they don't get executed, but saying that I don't know whether its actually a better option to live in an idonesian prision for the rest of your life?
 

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KingsCrow said:
The Bali Nine are just drop out, drop kicks. Thank god they aren't getting much attention either.


I just hope they don't get executed, but saying that I don't know whether its actually a better option to live in an idonesian prision for the rest of your life?
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She got 20 years. 15 years for being a bogan and 5 years for a bit of bad luck. Sounds about right to me.
 
Vader said:
I fail to see why the Bali 9 should have attracted any sympathy at all (not that Corby should have either). Van Nguyen on the other hand at least had a good motivation for doing what he did - not that I disagree with the penalty he paid for his crime.
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The Bali 9 deserve no sympathy whatsoever. I don't agree that they should be killed but geez how stupid can you get.

The Corby family really don't do their daughter any favours by attracting the media. If they lived in SA there is no doubt in my mind they would be Port Adelaide supporters :)
 
macca23 said:
The one weakness in all your arguments jenny is that you're quoting the situation as it is in Australia.

Under Balinese law it's very simple, did you have drugs in your possession?

Schapelle unfortunately did.

They're not interested in the whys and wherefores - possession alone makes her guilty under their law.

FWIW my opinion is that the marijhuana belonged to her half brother, and that Schapelle was probably aware of it being there (not totally sure of this last point).

If she was aware then IMO she claimed it as hers thinking that a pretty young woman had more chance of getting off lightly than a hairy-arsed male.

I don't buy the baggage handling story though.
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Agreed Macca... I know the law is different (possession) in Bali which is why anyone who attempts to traffic drugs there is an idiot. But I feel had the case been tried in Australia - despite what Crow-mo says, then the verdict may well have been different based on poorly handled evidence and lack of forensic evidence. Could be wrong though. It's just an opinion.

I honestly don't know if she did it or not, or knew that it was being done or not. I can't believe she or anyone of her party would think a girl would get off easier than a guy in Bali though?

I don't buy the baggage handling story either but I do believe it was a plausible explanation, and really, that's what defence lawyers are expected to provide. I think it's all very interesting how all this is coming out NOW when the ex-lawyer is facing charges and has a serious grudge against the Corby's. Just seems too.... convenient.
 
I gotta say that I'm not 100% sure if she knowingly transported the dope. But I'm 100% sure that at least 1 member of the Corby family knows what is going on and packed the dope in the bag. And if she has been left to hang out to dry by a family member, is pretty despicable.

The first reason I had doubts was that it is well known that dope is cheaper in Bali than Oz. But later I heard some media reports about it being a mid point to more lucarative markets. That made sense of why someone would try it. If I then still had any real doubts it was dispelled in this story on the ABC's 7.30 report in January 2006. It looks at the relationship between Michael Corby and a neigbour who was arrested and charged with running a sophisticated, commercial marijuana operation just one month before Schapelle Corby's trip to Bali. These two men were neighbours twice in the 90's. The two different locations were 500kms apart. However, I like this bit in the story.

http://www.abc.net.au/7.30/content/2006/s1558393.htm

JOHN STEWART (reporter): Forensic scientists have not yet tested the cannabis found inside Schapelle Corby's boogie board bag, saying it could not be done without a comparative sample. The origins of the drugs remain a mystery.

SIMON GILMORE, FORENSIC RESEARCHER: There are a couple of conditions that would have to be met. As I mentioned before you need a comparison sample. You may have a sample from the cannabis that was seized in Bali, and then if you suspected it came from a particular individual, if they had some cannabis in their possession, you would be able to do a DNA comparison of that cannabis with the cannabis seized in Bali.

JOHN STEWART: Simon Gilmore is a forensic researcher who has been working with the Australian Federal Police on cannabis DNA identification.

SIMON GILMORE: There's been research into DNA profiling of cannabis since probably the early 1990s. The Australian National University and the Australian Federal Police have been involved in it and there's a number of overseas groups that have been involved, as well.

JOHN STEWART: Sources close to the AFP who have viewed photographs of the cannabis found inside Schapelle Corby's boogie board bag support the view it's most likely to be hydroponically grown.

SIMON GILMORE: Now in some cases the DNA may match exactly. Much of the cannabis produced commercially is done using hydroponic systems and with those hydroponic systems what the growers often do is use a single or just a few plants and then take cuttings from those plants, which are, if you like, genetically identical to the mother plant. In those cases, the two plants that are grown together would have exactly the same DNA profile.

JOHN STEWART: But a DNA comparison is unlikely to happen. The Australian Federal Police have told the ABC's investigative unit that when the AFP offered to forensically test Schapelle Corby's boogie board bag and its contents, her lawyers rejected the offer. When the Australian Federal Police explained to Schapelle Corby's lawyers that any result from the testing for fingerprints inside the bag or DNA testing of the marijuana would also be passed onto the Indonesian police, her lawyers declined the offer to carry out the tests. We approached the AFP to ask if they were investigating the relationship between Michael Corby and the neighbour accused of cultivating a substantial amount of cannabis, and whether this had any connection to Schapelle Corby's case. The AFP declined to comment saying, it's a matter for the Queensland State police. Late today, the Queensland Police said: "Unfortunately, it's not possible to provide information on individuals without appropriate lawful reason. There was no other person connected with the charges which are subject to the upcoming court matters. As these matters are before the court, it is not appropriate to comment further."

The relationship between Michael Corby and his neighbour is not evidence he or anyone else in the family are involved with illicit drugs. However, this series of events does suggest that further investigation into any possible association could be worthwhile.
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All the evidence has been destroyed. You would have thought that the white knight(s) would have even offered to buy the evidence and hold in in a secure facility in Bali for futher assessement if they thought if could help her in the future, rather than watch it be burnt in a public ceremony.

It's been an interesting trial by media of what I call the reverse Chamberlin effect. In Lindy Chamberlain's case she was judged by the public because she had a sour look on her face and didn't break down and cry on camera. In this case the use of a nice fresh, young, good looking, happy go lucky character has been used to go the other way. There will always be a big percentage of people who make up their mind based on how a character looks, talks and acts despite what the facts may say. It's just human nature. We all do it some degree or an other in many different circumstances.
 
RussellEbertHandball said:
I gotta say that I'm not 100% sure if she knowingly transported the dope. But I'm 100% sure that at least 1 member of the Corby family knows what is going on and packed the dope in the bag. And if she has been left to hang out to dry by a family member, is pretty despicable.

The first reason I had doubts was that it is well known that dope is cheaper in Bali than Oz. But later I heard some media reports about it being a mid point to more lucarative markets. That made sense of why someone would try it. If I then still had any real doubts it was dispelled in this story on the ABC's 7.30 report in January 2006. It looks at the relationship between Michael Corby and a neigbour who was arrested and charged with running a sophisticated, commercial marijuana operation just one month before Schapelle Corby's trip to Bali. These two men were neighbours twice in the 90's. The two different locations were 500kms apart. However, I like this bit in the story.

http://www.abc.net.au/7.30/content/2006/s1558393.htm



All the evidence has been destroyed. You would have thought that the white knight(s) would have even offered to buy the evidence and hold in in a secure facility in Bali for futher assessement if they thought if could help her in the future, rather than watch it be burnt in a public ceremony.

It's been an interesting trial by media of what I call the reverse Chamberlin effect. In Lindy Chamberlain's case she was judged by the public because she had a sour look on her face and didn't break down and cry on camera. In this case the use of a nice fresh, young, good looking, happy go lucky character has been used to go the other way. There will always be a big percentage of people who make up their mind based on how a character looks, talks and acts despite what the facts may say. It's just human nature. We all do it some degree or an other in many different circumstances.
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Now that's something I hadn't heard. Interesting.... Do you think the Bali officials would have let the AFP test the evidence in the first place knowing how much they hate foreign intervention in their domestic matters??? I seriously doubt it somehow.
 
jenny61_99 said:
Now that's something I hadn't heard. Interesting.... Do you think the Bali officials would have let the AFP test the evidence in the first place knowing how much they hate foreign intervention in their domestic matters??? I seriously doubt it somehow.
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Bali police worked very closely with AFP police on the Bali bombings. The relationship between the two police forces is pretty strong as a result of all that joint work. If a request had come in from the top level of the AFP to the top level of the Bali police I have no doubt they would have let them have a sample.

So what were Corby's legal team so afraid of?
 

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