Second Tier AFL league

[Thetrader15]

Well according to most including the media the AFLW can stand on their own to feet. The Broadcasters are making millions off the womans product so put the TV rights for that out to bid with the commercial stations, start charging entry for the games.
It seems a no brainer with its popularity.

Its going to make more $$$ than the state leagues combined

 

[Thetrader15]

Why does a 2nd tier need to be a national comp ?

Thats right...we can just do one in each state. Lets call them the sanfl, wafl and vfl

 

[greatwhiteshark]

Its going to make more $$$ than the state leagues combined

Not apples and apples, provide the exposure, media coverage and money to the WAFL or SANFL and it would be chalk and cheese.
But as all of that is being thrown at the AFLW then of course it will make more money.

 

[Kwality]

Not apples and apples, provide the exposure, media coverage and money to the WAFL or SANFL and it would be chalk and cheese.
But as all of that is being thrown at the AFLW then of course it will make more money.

As a Melbourne resident these days, its not the VFL IMHO, year on year the rules change, traditional clubs fold ... I cant see AFLW as anything but 2nd tier, the market doesn't do lite. Yes I know the PC types want to close down such thoughts !!!

 

[underthestars]

would attend a reserves game for the right price - decent quality, my team, see the rising stars, and get a good picture of the clubs depth. be interesting to see if womens footy could survive an entrance fee for long. you get to cheer your club, and that's it. i have a hard time watching the local footy when a much superior product is available. its the same with A league - pretty poor standard compared to the tv options. once the hype and novelty dies down, just how many would be willing to attend the aflw?

 

[Jim Prideaux]

If you disclude AFL players (which is the only way it could work) there's no way either would get there.

Fair enough, I wouldn't as these teams (WAFL SANFL VFL) play with them anyway. Why would you exclude AFL players?

 

[eth-dog]

Fair enough, I wouldn't as these teams (WAFL SANFL VFL) play with them anyway. Why would you exclude AFL players?

Only two SANFL and WAFL teams do that. The AFL players would make it unfair, there's a different level of professionalism with them.

 

[Power Raid]

Seeing the 'AFL 2050' thread got me thinking, will the AFL ever have a second tier national league?

For example the league could have reserve AFLs sides aswell as the best teams from the VFL, SANFL, WAFL etc.

Do you think this could ever happen and if so when?

Can you make money from it? Gambling? Foxtel? Selling pain killers?

 

[greatwhiteshark]

As a Melbourne resident these days, its not the VFL IMHO, year on year the rules change, traditional clubs fold ... I cant see AFLW as anything but 2nd tier, the market doesn't do lite. Yes I know the PC types want to close down such thoughts !!!

Purely from a footy perspective I see the AFLW as around 8th to 10th tier footy, on a par with junior men's footy. But that is purely from just a footy perspective.
It is the elite of the woman's footy and I am very pleased there is a pathway for woman to play our game, I am not into it as yet but that may change in time and the level improves.

 

[Jim Prideaux]

Only two SANFL and WAFL teams do that. The AFL players would make it unfair, there's a different level of professionalism with them.

Agree on that, but since it already happens in all 4 of the leagues, I wouldn't change anything with regard to that.

 

[eth-dog]

Agree on that, but since it already happens in all 4 of the leagues, I wouldn't change anything with regard to that.

It won't happen in any case. I would also put forward Essendon as a team that will be successful in this format (our VFL list is actually elite)

 

[telsor]

If you disclude AFL players (which is the only way it could work) there's no way either would get there.

If you make it so AFL players can't play, there wont be much from the VFL left.

That said, the AFL reserves teams in the VFL might not want to play in more games regardless. A lot of the time they treat VFL games are practice/training runs after all.

 

[eth-dog]

If you make it so AFL players can't play, there wont be much from the VFL left.

That said, the AFL reserves teams in the VFL might not want to play in more games regardless. A lot of the time they treat VFL games are practice/training runs after all.

It's the only fair way of doing it. Hence my comment that Port or Willy would win every time.

 

[footyfan1978]

I talked about turning all the VFA, SANFL and WAFL clubs into under 23 teams and that be their own league as third tier below a full 18 club AFL reserves competition.
However changed my mind on that. Think it would be more interesting to remove under 18 comps and simply make those clubs under 21 teams and all the best 17 to 21 year olds play with those clubs as the third tier and where the AFL clubs draft their talent from.
There would still be an under 18 state championship as we have now but rest of the year the 17 to 21 year olds play with those clubs in each state. It would mean removing things like the TAC Cup in Victoria and they all going in the VFA as the pathway. Think it could re-purpose all those old clubs roles in the football landscape that has changed so much in the traditional mainland footy states in last three decades. People would take an interest as they would know those clubs are fielding the best young talent out of AFL system and think it would make AFL clubs look a little wider each draft than just the new batch of 18 year olds.
19 year olds and 20 year olds would have a lot clearer path of sticking to same club they been with since 17 year olds and not looking to find some other new club the moment they turned over 18 and still harbour hopes of being drafted a year or two later.

 

[DemonTim]

Would prefer they just keep state leagues but actually put some money into them, and give them exposure. The fact that divi 2 country footy players earn more than VFL players is ridiculous.

 

[greatwhiteshark]

Would prefer they just keep state leagues but actually put some money into them, and give them exposure. The fact that divi 2 country footy players earn more than VFL players is ridiculous.

Some may get paid more but the vast majority don't.

 

[DemonTim]

Some may get paid more but the vast majority don't.

The vast majority of country?
I can say my club pays more for its top 10 (and we aren't a highly paying club) than any player rated 18 or so up in a VFL club

VFL pays * all. It's meant to help with exposure. It's why so many leave the VFL after one contract.

 

[greatwhiteshark]

The vast majority of country?
I can say my club pays more for its top 10 (and we aren't a highly paying club) than any player rated 18 or so up in a VFL club

VFL pays **** all. It's meant to help with exposure. It's why so many leave the VFL after one contract.

What does your club spend on paying players per year on average? When you say Division 2 what league are you talking? The Salary cap for the VFL would be minimum 350-400k I would guess. Is your club spending this type of money on its players? Must be one hell of a social club or some very wealthy sponsors chipping in.
Just trying to think comparison to Perth Div 2 which would be A grade amateur footy. A couple of players per team might be getting 500 per game but the rest get nothing. In the WAFL every player playing league would get a minimum of $100 per game with the best 10-12 getting easily 300-800 per game, some even more.

 

[DemonTim]

What does your club spend on paying players per year on average? When you say Division 2 what league are you talking? The Salary cap for the VFL would be minimum 350-400k I would guess. Is your club spending this type of money on its players? Must be one hell of a social club or some very wealthy sponsors chipping in.
Just trying to think comparison to Perth Div 2 which would be A grade amateur footy. A couple of players per team might be getting 500 per game but the rest get nothing. In the WAFL every player playing league would get a minimum of $100 per game with the best 10-12 getting easily 300-800 per game, some even more.

Some VFL get no pay, a lot of the 15-40 get between 50-150 a game. playing in development you're likely to be on $50 a game

Country footy pays more than city footy, but plenty of divi 1 country clubs pay 500k+ a year. A divi one club near me (suburban league) offered three VFL players contracts. For between 30-50k a season.

The highest paid player at my club is on 500+, every senior player gets paid. The lowest I've heard is $50. My club pays modestly. I know blokes in my division getting 800-900 a game

 

[greatwhiteshark]

Some VFL get no pay, a lot of the 15-40 get between 50-150 a game. playing in development you're likely to be on $50 a game

Country footy pays more than city footy, but plenty of divi 1 country clubs pay 500k+ a year. A divi one club near me (suburban league) offered three VFL players contracts. For between 30-50k a season.

The highest paid player at my club is on 500+, every senior player gets paid. The lowest I've heard is $50. My club pays modestly. I know blokes in my division getting 800-900 a game

The salary cap in the VFL is 300k, someone must be getting this money. Even as an average over a 21 week season it works out at over $600 per game per player, or are they not paying it out??
You would know a lot more about Vic footy than I do and thats why I am asking.
Can you define what you call divison 1 and 2 footy, what leagues are we talking here? I have no idea how it works in Victoria, are these metro leagues or Country leagues?

In WA we have the following
WAFL
A grade Amateurs/ South West football league would sit next
Peel Sunday league
B Grade Amateurs
etc

How does it work in Victoria?

 

[DemonTim]

The salary cap in the VFL is 300k, someone must be getting this money. Even as an average over a 21 week season it works out at over $600 per game per player, or are they not paying it out??
You would know a lot more about Vic footy than I do and thats why I am asking.
Can you define what you call divison 1 and 2 footy, what leagues are we talking here? I have no idea how it works in Victoria, are these metro leagues or Country leagues?

In WA we have the following
WAFL
A grade Amateurs/ South West football league would sit next
Peel Sunday league
B Grade Amateurs
etc

How does it work in Victoria?

That's the current ranking but doesn't include VAFA which would be between 1-3. My league hasn't released salary cap info for this year and many leagues are only just beginning to implement caps

EFL division 1 cap is 225k. EDFL is 250k (although I know a particular club was spending around 550k pre cap). The difference is though, 99% of VFL players would be paid something, whereas, in local and country footy you'd basically pay your best 22 plus a few fringe and only really pay when they play seniors, so you're splitting 300k between 40-50 over 18 games (plus finals incentives). Local footy you're most likely splitting say 200k over 25 for 16 games plus incentives.

Just basic calcs on that
VFL: average $370 a game
Local footy: $500 a game

You can pay your top players more at local level, and fringe players less. Plus throw in that a bloke who walks out of the VFL will most likely be the highest paid at a local club, you're almost always going to get more.

The seniors I referred to would've taken around 14-20% of the local clubs cap, I doubt the VFL would've offered them 60k to stay while trying to keep another 39-49 blokes happy.

And then you have to take into account how much more heavily the VFL books are scrutinised, plenty of local footy blokes "work" for the coache or presidents business.

 

[NoobPie]

The salary cap in the VFL is 300k, someone must be getting this money. Even as an average over a 21 week season it works out at over $600 per game per player, or are they not paying it out??
You would know a lot more about Vic footy than I do and thats why I am asking.
Can you define what you call divison 1 and 2 footy, what leagues are we talking here? I have no idea how it works in Victoria, are these metro leagues or Country leagues?

In WA we have the following
WAFL
A grade Amateurs/ South West football league would sit next
Peel Sunday league
B Grade Amateurs
etc

How does it work in Victoria?

Presumably talking about the metro leagues. There are 5 senior metro leagues (excluding the amateurs):

• Eastern FL (4 divisions)
• Northern FL (3 divisions)
• Essendon District (3 divisions)
• Western Region FL (3 Divisions)
• Southern FNL (3 Divisions)

Presumably most of the money is on the top divisions of these leagues?

The amateurs (which are overwhelmingly metro) has 7 divisions. I don't know where the amateurs sit but, interestingly, there seems to be league rep games from which rankings are derived....

http://www.aflvic.com.au/blog/2016/05/21/geelong-fnl-ranked-no-1-community-football-league/

 

[Balance]

What's league?

A league? 5556 metres.

 

[McCrann]

Seeing the 'AFL 2050' thread got me thinking, will the AFL ever have a second tier national league?

For example the league could have reserve AFLs sides aswell as the best teams from the VFL, SANFL, WAFL etc.

Do you think this could ever happen and if so when?

Funny you mention it. I own it. www.afl2050.com.

Plans shortly to be revealed.

 

[McCrann]

Seeing the 'AFL 2050' thread got me thinking, will the AFL ever have a second tier national league?

For example the league could have reserve AFLs sides aswell as the best teams from the VFL, SANFL, WAFL etc.

Do you think this could ever happen and if so when?

To expand slightly, no need to go a make a Tier 2, better to follow the American sports.

18 Teams
then 20 Teams (By 2025 - www.afl2025.com - Plans shortly).
...

Then 24 Teams.

Essentially, we already have enough teams for this.

WHITTEN CONFERENCE

AFL West (4 Teams)
Adelaide
Fremantle
Port Adelaide
West Coast Eagles

AFL South (5 Teams)*
5 VIC Teams

BARASSI CONFERENCE

AFL North (4 Teams)
Brisbane Lions
Gold Coast
Greater Western Sydney
Sydney Swans

AFL Central (5 Teams)*

Play every team in your Conference Twice (16 games), play the teams in the other Conference once (9). 16+9=25.

12 Home Games, 12 Away Games, 1 Development Game (Total of 9 - to be sold to Cairns, Wellington, Newcastle, Darwin, Alice Springs, China? etc. - means clubs don't have to sell so many home games). Teams playing in these games split the proceeds.

Final Ladder is unified with all 18 teams.

Teams winning their Divisions automatically make the finals plus the next 4 best teams.

Theoretically, all the teams in AFL Central could finish 1-5 on the ladder if they're the best teams, and the other 3 teams to qualify would be the other 3 Division Winners.

No splitting of teams in Finals - same Finals system as we have now.

Works perfectly - but with 25 Rounds of 9 games that means 225 Games + finals - an increase of 27 games. More content.

This is to be ready to go in 2020..... In time for the next TV Rights negotiations.

Fixes the issue of a meaningless pre-season in one fell swoop.....

*VIC teams are allocated on a yearly basis - Odds in one Division, Evens in the other. Pure luck essentially (after finals).