Maybe he is spooked by the walkout of 4 Brisbane players - does anyone recall what was behind that?
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Analysis Selection Integrity
- Thread starter The Old Dark Navy's
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Doc was one of them.
Perhaps that is why Voss is turning a blind eye to what’s going on atm …
- Mar 25, 2019
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Selection this week is embarrassing. How Doch, Haynes, Gov and Motlop survived is mind boggling to me.
Bad signs for the club when selection becomes about reputation and not form.
Bad signs for the club when selection becomes about reputation and not form.
Fair, but which players would you have included to replace all 4
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What are senior coaches on these days … give or take a million a year ?
Let’s face it, this will be Voss’ last senior gig and that is pretty tasty coin.
As his job, he’ll probably do whatever he thinks will extend that salary for as long as possible.
Keeping the senior players onboard would fit that description.
He would be well aware Doc is an extremely popular figure at Carlton and shooting Bambi is probably not good for bu$ine$$.
Ultimately, winning is the only thing that will save Voss and conditional footballers never deliver the goods in the end.
Wakey wakey, Michael …
any selection integrity issue could be the consequence of being trigger happy with coaches. you could expect that requiring standards from your players comes second to picking someone with the most runs on the board or seen as the most trustworthy players. coaches will naturally be more risk averse if they're on shaky ground.
i agree that any replacements may not be up to scratch. but without consequences for performance, does it actually drive any improvement?
what's to be said about your on ground systems, and player development if you're reluctant to pick someone from the lower levels to slot in?
i agree that any replacements may not be up to scratch. but without consequences for performance, does it actually drive any improvement?
what's to be said about your on ground systems, and player development if you're reluctant to pick someone from the lower levels to slot in?
Criticism of not dropping under performing senior players is fair. There's only so long you can continue backing in the same underperforming players before it starts to become detrimental. I'm sure they're held to account internally and efforts like Gov's and Doc's are highlighted, but at some point need to make a statement.
Don't buy into the claim that Voss doesn't play kids. I think it's more accurate to state that he doesn't play underperforming kids or kids with questionable AFL attributes. The calls to play Moir were ridiculous and premature. Binns has performed well in the VFL but clearly they have question marks about how transferable that is to AFL level. Dow was similar.
We've seen with Hollands, Cowan, Lord, now Carroll that there's a willingness to play kids who are performing. Smith would have been a lock had he not gone down with the ACL. Lord being in and out of the side is stiff, but as we've seen with Kennedy and Hewett, the MC are reluctant to go in with 5 mids. The fact he's been picked at all despite Walsh, Cerra, Hewett and Cripps all available is testament to how highly they rate him.
Don't buy into the claim that Voss doesn't play kids. I think it's more accurate to state that he doesn't play underperforming kids or kids with questionable AFL attributes. The calls to play Moir were ridiculous and premature. Binns has performed well in the VFL but clearly they have question marks about how transferable that is to AFL level. Dow was similar.
We've seen with Hollands, Cowan, Lord, now Carroll that there's a willingness to play kids who are performing. Smith would have been a lock had he not gone down with the ACL. Lord being in and out of the side is stiff, but as we've seen with Kennedy and Hewett, the MC are reluctant to go in with 5 mids. The fact he's been picked at all despite Walsh, Cerra, Hewett and Cripps all available is testament to how highly they rate him.
Nailed it
It's NOT that at all. He plays them and then dumps them or uses them as subs. It's the way he uses them that is the issue IMO
They seem to be the ones that are the scapegoats for our poor form and NOT the senior players
This I agree with and have stated it all pre season. It was a desperate selection to try and get some extra goals
Issue is with Moir he has no tank. He blows up so easily. Even last week he came on half way through the first qtr and could only play 55% game time as a deep forward and had TWO possessions. His opponent kept running off him. He was cooked early
Issue is we knew it. Now after picking him he is dropped the next week and doesn't get any games this weekend. How does this help his match fitness let alone his confidence?
Madness
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It's like I touched on in the preview thread... Carroll will be given a lock down role... that's NOT his game.
It's ruined Cowan too...
So many times these kids are playing their natural pos in the VFL and then in AFL they're being used as stop gaps.
- Oct 4, 2015
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3. Play them in the right position.
White should be given at least 4 games to prove himself. Carroll the same. As long as they bring some effort, give them a decent chance
Another great point.
I was a massive fan of Cowan when drafted. What I liked is he was tough and ran and created and kicked the ball long to advantage. IMO he had a game for AFL football
Like many players he has become defensive and reactive. None of his natural talents shine
We are so much about defence and contest we ruin any natural development.
Seriously, how many of our young players come in and look positive and play with their own natural flair? How many have improved? White Carroll Lord Lucas are good ball users and can run. Let them and give them a chance
CarmenSandiego
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A bit off topic, but I find the 'no tank' thing really confusing.
How can you complete a full AFL pre-season and blow up after 1 quarter playing as a deep fwd? Surely, if you're coming from that far back, you're rarely going to make it as a player?
Like, he had 54% TOG, 5 pressure acts and laid 0 tackles - anyone got the GPS numbers?
How do you even get a bloke like that fit?
Came to the club with an incorrectly diagnosed hip issue, so they needed to start from scratch to build strength and endurance, which has improved dramatically
While not elite and never will be compared to the likes of Binns, Walsh, Ollie, etc, its really not too dissimilar to the likes of Motlop, Durds, Williams early in their careers.
That's the question. As was said to me I could train every day for 10 years to be a marathon runner and still never break 3 hours. I just don't have it
Fitness, like skills in AFL can be improved with time but you need a good base to start with.
and Billy WIlson!!
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Kennedy,Owies,Fish,Wilson-oh that's right- the first three were shafted and no longer play for us and Billy Wilson apparently is not one of Voss's favourites!
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This is a huge issue, if we dont have 2-3 players of acceptable standard to come in and replace underperforming players, we are in a huge mess.
I wouldn’t drop all 4 but I would have kept Lord in and dropped one of Haynes, Gov or Doc, i see the issue with Lords stamina but im yet to question his intent and attack on the opposition and the ball.
I remember picking my sides when i played cricket and on reflection i gave a lot more rope to people i liked or who’s quality I knew compared to players coming up through the grades, after a while people notice and it causes issues when you or they continue to not perform.
To me Doch is really struggling and so is Williams, yet we keep picking them.
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This doesn't surprise me whatsoever given the numpties at the club that thought Zac Williams could be a mid-fielder.
Never mind the recruiting of injury prone players in the hope that they come right at Carlton who is just so famous for healing up players (sic).
Too much time spent watching moneyball?
Yep. The other point to this is how do young players prove themselves without getting games? The VFL is poor and doesn't play every week
I reckon it would be hard to improve and prove yourself in our current system
By giving kids exposure he makes them more ready when needed.
Billy needs to get the ball in the 2s. He had problems with continuity last season. He was below VFL standard last week. Don't set him up to fail like Josh Honey and Durds last year who were selected when out of form at a lower level.
Dunna Heartknee
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Alot of smart coaches play through the youth to give them confidence.
Unfortunately our coaches have a fixation on defense first, when sometimes the best form of defense is attack.
I know there is more to it but, releasing the players to play their natural game and enjoy the game again is a good starting point. At the moment they are clearly not enjoying it and it shows, arguing on field (for all to see) about positioning instead of just playing and enjoying the game.
This fairly and squarely lies with the coach I reckon he is crap, very similar situation when he was at Brisbane before a player walk out. I don't think he is capable of change he clearly can't see his own wrong doings, and it's further emphasized with team selection.
Haven't watch a great deal of us this year Soap I reckon we play fake, a lot like the personality of our front man.
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