SFNL Div 1 2018

[2s Hack]

How does that work? As if clubs wanna play in div 4 if Cerberus won every year

It depends on who's posted & when at Cerberus I guess as to the year they'll have & how competitive they'll be

Just heard from someone else in Div 4 that they believe they won't be accepting promotion if they win it, claiming the above ^^

 

[Tigersman]

Other div 4 clubs would jump at the chance to get out of the div. I’m sure CPL would say yes if offered the opportunity. Div 4 should stay I reckon.
Yes a few clubs are looking shakey but there are just as many new clubs about to pop up in the new estates in the southeast

 

[Bunk Moreland]

Cranbourne won't come in as they'll only be offered division 2 & no higher. Chelsea Heights may be going to MPNFL so an opening may appear there. But SFNL Div 2 is beneath Cranny.

Cerberus look have Div 4 run and won but they won't come up so that leaves Hallam staying up in Div 3 for another year of beltings. Can't cover the loss of 30 players in 2 seasons
Add to that Dandy & Sandown & perhaps Moorabbin. What about Lyndale too? div 4 look on shaky ground

It'll be back to 3 divisions before you can say TwoThousandandTwenty

Would have to be huge doubts on Chelsea Heights getting into MPNFL, same process as Cranbourne, need to get 75% of 22 clubs vote them in.

Same issues, southern clubs are strongly opposed to travel and didn’t even want the divisional structure - they want to play locally among themselves. Can’t see any way they’d vote in another northern club like CH.

 

[Sratsky]

Would have to be huge doubts on Chelsea Heights getting into MPNFL, same process as Cranbourne, need to get 75% of 22 clubs vote them in.

Same issues, southern clubs are strongly opposed to travel and didn’t even want the divisional structure - they want to play locally among themselves. Can’t see any way they’d vote in another northern club like CH.

Chelsea is already in the mpnfl so it's no difference travel wise to go to Chelsea heights..... they wouldn't be considered as an "outsider" as much as clubs from down this way. cranny and HP have both already been in the mpnfl. both were successful too, however the mpnfl supporters wont travel to those parts..... we had terrible home attendances while providing those clubs with their best home attendance of the year. it wont change.....

 

[Bunk Moreland]

Chelsea is already in the mpnfl so it's no difference travel wise to go to Chelsea heights..... they wouldn't be considered as an "outsider" as much as clubs from down this way. cranny and HP have both already been in the mpnfl. both were successful too, however the mpnfl supporters wont travel to those parts..... we had terrible home attendances while providing those clubs with their best home attendance of the year. it wont change.....

Yeah it is, just the clubs down south don’t like travelling up to Chelsea so don’t think they’d want to add another club there. As you say they don’t want to make the trip. You only need 6 clubs to vote no and it doesn’t happen.

They see themselves as a country league, maybe they should just form their own. It’s all going to be a bit of a hotchpotch with MPNFL, SNFL and the new Outer East thing.

 

[Dicky Ballsack]

Chelsea is already in the mpnfl so it's no difference travel wise to go to Chelsea heights..... they wouldn't be considered as an "outsider" as much as clubs from down this way. cranny and HP have both already been in the mpnfl. both were successful too, however the mpnfl supporters wont travel to those parts..... we had terrible home attendances while providing those clubs with their best home attendance of the year. it wont change.....

They will take Chelsea Heights because they pose no threat whatsoever, they don’t want Cranny because they are a powerhouse in a growth corridor with great facilities that will entice players and a strong junior club with alliances to Narre South and it won’t be long until they are all over a new junior club at Clyde.
You can’t tell me it’s a travel factor when everyone has been heading down the road to Devon Meadows for years

 

[Tigersman]

Yeah it is, just the clubs down south don’t like travelling up to Chelsea so don’t think they’d want to add another club there. As you say they don’t want to make the trip. You only need 6 clubs to vote no and it doesn’t happen.

They see themselves as a country league, maybe they should just form their own. It’s all going to be a bit of a hotchpotch with MPNFL, SNFL and the new Outer East thing.

It’s crazy that these leagues don’t seem to be following any plan or design. Surely there needs to be some boundaries or plan for growth put in place.

 

[gelder01]

Confirmed, AFLSE says no right to appeal for Cranbourne, AFL lawyers say MPNFL constitution to vote on incoming clubs can not be overturned. Cranbourne currently homeless, SFNL, one of many possibilities now!

 

[Bunk Moreland]

It’s crazy that these leagues don’t seem to be following any plan or design. Surely there needs to be some boundaries or plan for growth put in place.

The whole breakup of the SE league seems very piecemeal. I get you want clubs to control their destiny to a point but jeez... this Outer East thing? It’s basically pits some of the biggest, most populous and fastest growing suburbs in Melbourne against genuinely small and shrinking towns up in the hills.

Even if they didn’t go into the SFNL, it’s the MPNFL thing they’re stuffed up. An outer south east league with the northern MPNFL clubs would be a better bet.

 

[gelder01]

If the AFLSE had some nuts, it would pull support for MPNFL. For the greater good of footy in the se/peninsula area They have to blow up the MPNFL and start again with a new name for a power league.

 

[Tigersman]

The answer in my opinion is to water down the talent pool by adding new clubs in the new estate areas between Berwick, Clyde and Cranbourne and put limits on the junior feeder systems that currently all funnel into Berwick, Narre and Cranbourne.

It will take a few years to have an influence but then they will be on a level playing field with their neighboring clubs and won’t be such a troubling proposition when and if they are taken into the surrounding leagues.

The problem is it may kill off a couple of the clubs on the other side of Casey/Dandenong that also draw most of their players from that area.

The Berwick Springs start up is a step in the right direction.

The only other viable alternative to me would have been to put the “big 3” into the EFL where they will find sides that are their equal in div 1 and 2.

 

[hansie]

The thing with the peninsula comp is that if a ‘southern’ peninsula league was started sorrento would dominate. They are top of the table in the premier comp and roll out blokes like Dawes tapscott and hallahan. Agree that the northern clubs are nowhere near country footy and should be in a suburban comp - perhaps with cranny, narre and berwick


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Bunk Moreland]

TBF to some of the MPFNL clubs, they have their own priorities and each know what’s best for their club... and looking from the outside I’m not sure it’s all been weighed up and worked out properly from a whole of area point of view.

I mean... the three leagues were in three seperate geographic conferences, plus you had the SFL.

It was then decided that they wanted to switch the three conferences to three pro-rel divisions... a move many of the clubs did not want and fought against.

So that was canned, and they moved to two divisions for Peninsula and Nepean. A move which still many of the clubs did not want, but it got pushed through anyway.

Then you have the SEFNL clubs out of their own and without a home.

So you have a “solution” in place that many of the included clubs didn’t want anyway, and that excludes a whole bunch of other clubs who’ve now gone off to this “Outer East” thing.

If you look at what’s important at local footy, for most it’s probably geographic closeness (within reason) and an even competition.

None of the three old conferences now have the geographic closeness they previously had. As for an even comp, there's no solution at all for the SEFNL clubs, I doubt the YVMDFL merger will work.

 

[Bunk Moreland]

Bit of a whack too



Interesting a complimentary note from The Pines president in the comments, clearly not all clubs were opposed:

“Tough outcome Shane. On behalf of Pines Football Netball Club we wish you all the best. We know how hard you worked in trying to enter the MPNFL. There’s no comfort in knowing that many clubs shared our view that there was great opportunity in having Cranbourne be part of the competition. It’s our loss and I feel we have collectively let down future generations of football.”

I think there’s a fair chance they’ll be in the SFL next year. Perhaps an 11 club D1 that will see two relegations in 2019. Or 12 clubs if they can convince another D2 club to make the leap.

 

[Dragan]

Dont need cranbourne rather get back parkdale and beaumaris etc

 

[DangerousD]

Great win by the dogs today, holding off a strong finishing East Malvern to win by 13 points.

The Dogs started stronger kicking 4 goals straight to a wasteful 1.4, the scoreline at quarter time didn't reflect what had unfolded and i thought the Panthers would close the gap in the 2nd quarter. The Dogs however cam out and dominated the 2nd quarter without truely putting the Panthers away and with a goal seconds before the half time siren saw them go in to the main break full of confidence.

After half time was a totally different ball game, the breeze picked up and so did the Panthers but for all their possession they only managed to cut the lead by 6 points and went in to 3/4 time with confidence but trailing by 22 points. The Panthers kept pushing in the last quarter and were full of run but like in the third quarter the Panthers forward entries continually broke down and the Dogs were able to pinch a goal and soak up a lot of time denying the Panthers a comeback win.

Go Dogs.

 

[Moody Blue]

I think the 36 sfnl teams should vote on all changes. The board is not true representation of the clubs and self interest. And the league should be careful who they let in

Back in the early 90's the SFL agreed to allow all of the clubs from the now defunct Churches League into the competition. The theory was that the SFL would become a super league with the injection of all these clubs. Happy days at SFL HQ. Lot's of revenue, 5 Divisions, and no need for junior competitions in their mind. Five years later, most of these clubs had merged or ceased to exist, foundation member clubs like Beaumaris and South Districts left to join the Ammo's, Balwyn and Canterbury went to the EFL, there were no juniors and the SFL nearly went under. The clubs had a big say in that decision, and it was all about money. In the end costs went through the roof which resulted in a lot of clubs leaving the competition.

Talk to the clubs, get their perspectives, but ultimately the final decision rests with the committee. Local clubs are only interested in what will strenghten their position. They do not care about the overall health of the competition.

Local footy is in real trouble, and until the AFL does something about it, the metro competitions will continue to shrink. Juniors are getting harder to find. Local councils cannot accommodate the demand for local soccer clubs needing grounds, and they will start to snap up grounds that are not being fully utilized. The AFL has gone to sleep in the last decade, and now the surge of interest in women's footy has sucked the AFL into believing all is good with the game when it is not. The euphoria with women's AFL at the local level will settle and then they will be in the same spot as the men. Trying to coax people to play.

In ten years, 25-50% of the current teams in Div 1 & 2 will have either merged or folded. Once upon a time AFL clubs had a lock with the primary schools. That has changed drastically.

 

[Moody Blue]

Dont need cranbourne rather get back parkdale and beaumaris etc

No chance of getting either team back. South Melbourne Districts will probably fold in a few years.

 

[Moody Blue]

Cranbourne won't come in as they'll only be offered division 2 & no higher. Chelsea Heights may be going to MPNFL so an opening may appear there. But SFNL Div 2 is beneath Cranny.

Cerberus look have Div 4 run and won but they won't come up so that leaves Hallam staying up in Div 3 for another year of beltings. Can't cover the loss of 30 players in 2 seasons
Add to that Dandy & Sandown & perhaps Moorabbin. What about Lyndale too? div 4 look on shaky ground

It'll be back to 3 divisions before you can say TwoThousandandTwenty

Exactly my point. Local footy is really struggling, and recruiting clubs with no junior structure is a recipe for disaster. The AFL keep throwing millions at the GWS and Gold Coast but forget to look in their own backyard. Rugby Union is dying a slow death, well we better be careful, because Aussie rules will be next.

 

[Bunk Moreland]

Back in the early 90's the SFL agreed to allow all of the clubs from the now defunct Churches League into the competition. The theory was that the SFL would become a super league with the injection of all these clubs. Happy days at SFL HQ. Lot's of revenue, 5 Divisions, and no need for junior competitions in their mind. Five years later, most of these clubs had merged or ceased to exist, foundation member clubs like Beaumaris and South Districts left to join the Ammo's, Balwyn and Canterbury went to the EFL, there were no juniors and the SFL nearly went under. The clubs had a big say in that decision, and it was all about money. In the end costs went through the roof which resulted in a lot of clubs leaving the competition.

Talk to the clubs, get their perspectives, but ultimately the final decision rests with the committee. Local clubs are only interested in what will strenghten their position. They do not care about the overall health of the competition.

Local footy is in real trouble, and until the AFL does something about it, the metro competitions will continue to shrink. Juniors are getting harder to find. Local councils cannot accommodate the demand for local soccer clubs needing grounds, and they will start to snap up grounds that are not being fully utilized. The AFL has gone to sleep in the last decade, and now the surge of interest in women's footy has sucked the AFL into believing all is good with the game when it is not. The euphoria with women's AFL at the local level will settle and then they will be in the same spot as the men. Trying to coax people to play.

In ten years, 25-50% of the current teams in Div 1 & 2 will have either merged or folded. Once upon a time AFL clubs had a lock with the primary schools. That has changed drastically.

You make some very good points but I think some of it is also geographic movement, young families continue shifting out and the ridiculous situation with house prices has only accelerated that. We may well see the end of some clubs in coming decades but I suspect we’ll see some new senior clubs as well.

Of course existing clubs in growth areas like Cranbourne and Narre would like to be the only clubs in their area as it makes them enormous, but numbers will take over you’d think. There’ll be a second club in Berwick (third if you count Beac) before long. Frankston clubs are going well and another one started last year.

It’s the same out the other side, 15 years ago there were no football clubs in Point Cook, there’s now two senior clubs and both have big numbers of juniors too. Geelong football is also very strong and a second senior club in Torquay would not be far away.

I think the problem with the south east is there hasn’t been a proper whole of region review and plan for what’s best for everybody, there just seems to be different leagues and bodies making moves with no overall planning. The SFL, MPNFL, SEFL and all the junior leagues should be doing a proper strategy and work out what’s best for clubs and football.

- what’s best for the outer south east such as Cranbourne, Narre Warren, Officer

- what’s best for the clubs in and around Frankston

- what’s best for the clubs on the peninsula / south of Frankston

- what’s best for the clubs around Dandenong

- what’s best the the older clubs in the inner southern suburbs

I think they could come up with a better structure which makes things easier for all in terms of attracting and retaining junior and senior players. This Outer East thing is a perfect example, it’s a bizarre merger of enormous clubs from the SEFL with tiny country clubs in the hills, there’s some big travel distances and it has excluded Cranbourne who are now scratching for a solution. The MPNFL divisions is another, many clubs didn’t want it and it’s clearly contributed toward them rejecting Cranbourne on the basis of more travel.

Anyway I’m waffling but if set up properly the South East should be the new heartland of football and a powerhouse of quality - much like the EFL rode the huge growth in the eastern suburbs which has now stabilised somewhat, all the growth is in the South East.

 

[2s Hack]

Exactly my point. Local footy is really struggling, and recruiting clubs with no junior structure is a recipe for disaster. The AFL keep throwing millions at the GWS and Gold Coast but forget to look in their own backyard. Rugby Union is dying a slow death, well we better be careful, because Aussie rules will be next.

All good points above Moody Blue
I'm so glad in a way that Springy Districts have done so well this year, as I'm told by people in the know that The ''Greater" City of Dandenong have been waiting for them to slowly fade away to not exist at all. Such is the pressure on available grounds of local soccer clubs in the area that the council waiting to pounce to put a couple of onion bags either end. As along as SDFC go well and are financially viable they will keep the wolves at bay

Another point you raise is junior structure within clubs or lack there of. Very hard for a club to start up juniors or maintain when some Old Boys team (and credit to them) have multiple U/19s teams whilst a neighbouring SFNL club can't get one off the ground.

In the strong 6 division U19s comp in the VAFA, clubs with multiple sides consist of

St Bedes x 3 teams
De La Salle x 3 teams
St Kevins x 3 teams
Old Xaverians x 3 teams
Old Scotch x 3 teams

Not sure if the Ammos come under the AFLVic banner but something needs to be done at capping Under 19s to 2 teams per club. 6 divisions is a lot for an underage competition, some with only 7 teams. Limiting it to 2 teams each across 4 divisions whilst dispersing some low end talent across to neighbouring would help metro footy clubs & still have a strong U/19s comp. As many are well aware underage competitions across Melbourne & regional Victoria are shot and the SFNL only 8 teams from 36 clubs the competition is on its knees.

Not looking good also for the division 1 reserves comp where it was the worst standard I've seen for quiet some time with players well into their mid to late forties having to fill positions on the ground. Massive problem that the CEO has on his hands

 

[Blood Stained Angels]

All good points above Moody Blue
I'm so glad in a way that Springy Districts have done so well this year, as I'm told by people in the know that The ''Greater" City of Dandenong have been waiting for them to slowly fade away to not exist at all. Such is the pressure on available grounds of local soccer clubs in the area that the council waiting to pounce to put a couple of onion bags either end. As along as SDFC go well and are financially viable they will keep the wolves at bay

Another point you raise is junior structure within clubs or lack there of. Very hard for a club to start up juniors or maintain when some Old Boys team (and credit to them) have multiple U/19s teams whilst a neighbouring SFNL club can't get one off the ground.

In the strong 6 division U19s comp in the VAFA, clubs with multiple sides consist of

St Bedes x 3 teams
De La Salle x 3 teams
St Kevins x 3 teams
Old Xaverians x 3 teams
Old Scotch x 3 teams

Not sure if the Ammos come under the AFLVic banner but something needs to be done at capping Under 19s to 2 teams per club. 6 divisions is a lot for an underage competition, some with only 7 teams. Limiting it to 2 teams each across 4 divisions whilst dispersing some low end talent across to neighbouring would help metro footy clubs & still have a strong U/19s comp. As many are well aware underage competitions across Melbourne & regional Victoria are shot and the SFNL only 8 teams from 36 clubs the competition is on its knees.

Not looking good also for the division 1 reserves comp where it was the worst standard I've seen for quiet some time with players well into their mid to late forties having to fill positions on the ground. Massive problem that the CEO has on his hands

Good summary but I've got to differ on a couple of points.
Most of the teams you have mentioned that have multiple 19's have good numbers obviously, but their 2nd and 3rd teams are mostly made up of lesser talent that just want to play with their mates, so the standard from Div- 3 to 6 is reasonable at best. As well, in some of the lower divisions you get maybe 1 field umpire, maybe 1 boundary and no goalies which puts more strain on the clubs volunteers. At least with SFL the umpiring in the 19's is fully covered every game as kids and some older umpires simply do not want to travel the length of the straight on a Saturday morning. The top 3 teams are a bit in front of the 4th and 5th teams, then 6th and 7th are a fair way back, but that happens in allot of comps. I agree that its hard for SFL clubs to entice younger players as this stems from the inherent attitude generated by Ammo clubs about the SFL which they label [ S..T Football League ] and with their private school back grounds deem it below them to play SFL. If you look at Chelt merging with St Pauls this season and only lasting 4 to 5 games, the situation seems dire, but in this case you'll find that the better 19's ended up playing in their ressies and both clubs made finals. Is that good for the 19's comp ? probably not but its good for their club. I believe that their may be 2 or more teams coming in next season so 10 teams will be good. Not sure the comp is on its knees just yet, but maybe ankle deep at this point.

 

[Bunk Moreland]

Not sure how you solve the VAFA U19 thing. If you think back to when we were all that age, obviously all your mates etc are from school and it’s probably only natural you want to play footy together. The old boys clubs obviously have a massive inside running on securing those kids.

 

[Billy the Lid]

Not sure how you solve the VAFA U19 thing. If you think back to when we were all that age, obviously all your mates etc are from school and it’s probably only natural you want to play footy together. The old boys clubs obviously have a massive inside running on securing those kids.

All really good points in above few posts. Not just old boys clubs with multiple 19s. Beaumaris usually have 2, Williamstown 2, even Parkdale had 2 last year. While the SFL keeps giving themselves black eyes we will struggle to recruit at entry level. Say what you like about the VAFA but they don’t tolerate the crap that we have seen in the SFL this year, the origins of which are likely caused by pathetic responses to similar events in recent seasons.

On to the weekends footy. Surely no one saw yesterday’s result coming and like most I had Dingley pencilled in for a comfortable win. No question that Dingley have earned the right to be confident but early on they seemed more interested in talking trash than winning the footy. Mordy were fierce and much harder at the contest. Never thought I would see it happen but Dingley were actually bullied. An amazing run of 4 GF’s in a row for 3 flags is finally at end - respect. If Mordy bring that sort of intensity next week they are a chance but otherwise EM’s class will be too much. Now that Dingley are out St P’s looking odds on for the flag.

Dingley and Mordy 1s and 2s playing yesterday so well attended by supporters of those clubs but did not seem like many neutrals bothered to turn up. I heard that Saturday’s crowd was very poor. I know we have this tender process but reckon Springy might be on the nose and time to look at other options.

 

[Thewiz99]

Not just old boys clubs. Beaumaris usually have 2, Williamstown 2, even Parkdale had 2 last year. While the SFL keeps giving themselves black eyes we will struggle to recruit at entry level. Say what you like about the VAFA but they don’t tolerate the crap that we have seen in the SFL this year, the origins of which are likely caused by pathetic responses to similar events in recent seasons.

On to the weekends footy. Surely no one saw yesterday’s result coming and like most I had Dingley pencilled in for a comfortable win. No question that Dingley have earned the right to be confident but early on they seemed more interested in talking trash than winning the footy. Mordy were fierce and much harder at the contest. Never thought I would see it happen but Dingley were actually bullied. An amazing run of 4 GF’s in a row for 3 flags is finally at end - respect. If Mordy bring that sort of intensity next week they are a chance but otherwise EM’s class will be too much. Now that Dingley are out St P’s looking odds on for the flag.

Dingley and Mordy 1s and 2s playing yesterday so well attended by supporters of those clubs but did not seem like many neutrals bothered to turn up. I heard that Saturday’s crowd was very poor. I know we have this tender process but reckon Springy might be on the nose and time to look at other options.

Springy definitely on the nose. Lacks atmosphere and is an ordinary venue. Time for a change. Is Linton Street still an option?