Autopsy Shameful game V Dees - tell it like it is right here.

[Reginald0]

I’m not usually an excuses sort, and I think the team selection was a bit bizarro But we folded after half time cos everyone is exhausted And we got thrashed, not denying that

hall does actually get his hands on the ball but nah No good
Tarrants disposal is woeful This seems to be ignored by everyone
Higgins not much point continuing

major worry is Simpkin...where is he when we need him Invisible

Ando is one of the ones who earns his money
Make him captain

 

[GreatBradScott]

Just smash the list. This is the year to be s**t. Can plan ahead with list changes from HQ.

Seen much worse over the years. Just fix it and commit to the bit. No stone unturned.

 

[remfan101]

My slight worry from the Presser was Shaw saying we did things right in the first quarter then we went away from it. Without knowing the intimate game plan, to me it wasn't that we went away rather Melbourne adjusted. They realised the style, altered their game plan and we did not adjust after that. And it again comes down to not having the players to execute the plan. We are not precise so was always going to come undone. We don't have speed so we can't get into space or create separation. It was a nice idea, and it works against really bad teams, but it is pretty easy to counter once it becomes apparent.

imo, we played like pure s**t in the first quarter, but were saved by a couple of flukey goals, winning contested possession (which seems to be literally the only thing Rhyce bases our game around), and Melbourne being pathetic. If that's what 'our brand' is then we need to take a good hard look at where we're trying to go.

 

[Shagga is all Class]

Just smash the list. This is the year to be sh*t. Can plan ahead with list changes from HQ.

Seen much worse over the years. Just fix it and commit to the bit. No stone unturned.

Club made the hard calls on Boomer and company.

Unfortunately, BS and his mates the likes of JMAC and Atley get extensions. Plus Wood, Garner and so on.

NMFC is not a job for life or to subsidise real estate portfolios.

Time to set standards even if it means spoons in the short term.

 

[benbanjo]

I’m not usually an excuses sort, and I think the team selection was a bit bizarro But we folded after half time cos everyone is exhausted And we got thrashed, not denying that

hall does actually get his hands on the ball but nah No good
Tarrants disposal is woeful This seems to be ignored by everyone
Higgins not much point continuing

major worry is Simpkin...where is he when we need him Invisible

Ando is one of the ones who earns his money
Make him captain

Based on what?

 

[scooby1279]

Club made the hard calls on Boomer and company.

Unfortunately, BS and his mates the likes of JMAC and Atley get extensions. Plus Wood, Garner and so on.

NMFC is not a job for life or to subsidise real estate portfolios.

Time to set standards even if it means spoons in the short term.

Yep that is what has been so frustrating with the club, made the big calls yet kept the average players on....

 

[TennisPlayerAndy]

Based on what?

I will say, Taz does just seem to roost the footy from kickouts without ever looking for a 40m pass to keep possession.

 

[Event Horizon]

Brad Scott was a better coach.

On Pixel 3a using BigFooty.com mobile app

Yes. But it doesn't change for me, that he had to go. We might have just made the wrong appointment.

 

[Snake_Baker]

Just smash the list. This is the year to be sh*t. Can plan ahead with list changes from HQ.

Seen much worse over the years. Just fix it and commit to the bit. No stone unturned.

How?

There's hidden draft gold waiting at picks 55, 62, 77, 95 and 113? There's eye catching blokes standing out in the non existent VFL?

Putting list changes aside, I can't see us dropping more than 6 blokes off the list, depending upon who we can actually trade in to the list, and we're going to have to accept less than top shelf in that instance.

My take -

Delist: Jacobs (tragic), Durdin, Murphy, MacGuinness (sorry kid), Hosie and Wood (for his sake)

3 year contracts: Brown, Anderson,
2 year contracts: Bonar, Scott, Taylor, MacMillan, Pittard, J. Walker, Turner, Hayden, Xerri, W. Walker
1 year contracts: EVW, Crocker, Daw, Williams, Ahern, Garner

If we can trade in more that 2 blokes then some of the blokes on 1 year contracts might also be in trouble, likewise if the lists get cut back, but this is relistically how it will work.

It's not ideal, and there's a few more I would prefer to move on, but sticking it out for another season is better for the list than picking up picks 80 onward in the draft.

 

[Event Horizon]

Our hope should be that WC wins another flag this year or next, and then Simmo follows Brady home.

Not too many would be looking to come back to Victoria from WA at the moment

 

[Kanga Glory]

It's not that limited KG, what if it's just a sh*t game plan strategy?

Can "change" be a bad thing also?



Agree, talk like that at this stage is ridiculous.

Change the cattle to suit game plan. Remember, Rome wasn’t built in a day, time is needed

 

[Event Horizon]

My 5 cents.
I am not going to repeat the obvious about how s**t we were and have been for some time.
The bigger question is what to do from here. I agree with Teff that we can't simply get rid of 15 blokes, as there is only so many decent draft picks that we have. Trading wise, other than Brown, not a lot of options. Blokes like Cunnington aren't up for trade in any scenario.
I think the onus is on the coach and on the footy department to do better with the current list, and make hard decisions on mediocre players who have no future.

Shaw is the biggest question for me. I have no doubt if we had Clarkson, we'd be fighting for a finals spot next year. Shaw can prepare for next season, but he should be under no illusion - his job isn't safe. It just can't be given what has transpired this season.

 

[Scallop Industry Thug]

We don’t get rid of coaches. Admittedly this is much worse than anything in 30 years but Pagan, Laidley and Scott all had at least 7 years.

 

[Cyber_punk]

Shaw isn't the problem, at least not the biggest. He and Brady have been there 5 minutes.

The problem lies with a "near enough is good enough" and "we'll get em another day" attitude Brad Scott instilled in our mature players. Most of them are just happy to show up and get a payday. Just think of how many games were lost during 2014-15 to inferior opposition with lazy ass performances which cost us top 4 spots. The team believed they had the talent to turn it on when they felt like it. This bullshit has persisted to this day along with constantly playing spuds who wouldn't get a game at any other club. The lack of killer instinct that reeks from the club is what is killing us.

I agree with Snakes delisting takes except I would also add Dumont, Hall, MacMillan and possibly even Ziebell.

The remaining group need to be kept on their toes and kept from getting too comfortable.

 

[TennisPlayerAndy]

The complete inability to move the ball from the back half is all on Shaw.

 

[Moti]

We don’t get rid of coaches. Admittedly this is much worse than anything in 30 years but Pagan, Laidley and Scott all had at least 7 years.

I think the lack of exposed form of the under age kids might actually help us. Our lack of decent talent spotting means that the other clubs come back in the pack a little towards us. I want us to shoot 7-8 picks this year within the first 4 rounds. Whatever we need to do to achieve selections needs to be looked at. If we don't select some obscure indigenous player then we aren't trying hard enough. The Academy selections should eat picks up, meaning better access to mid draft picks. Lets load up and go shopping

 

[Moti]

Shaw isn't the problem, at least not the biggest. He and Brady have been there 5 minutes.

The problem lies with a "near enough is good enough" and "we'll get em another day" attitude Brad Scott instilled in our mature players. Most of them are just happy to show up and get a payday. Just think of how many games were lost during 2014-15 to inferior opposition with lazy ass performances which cost us top 4 spots. The team believed they had the talent to turn it on when they felt like it. This bullshit has persisted to this day along with constantly playing spuds who wouldn't get a game at any other club. The lack of killer instinct that reeks from the club is what is killing us.

I agree with Snakes delisting takes except I would also add Dumont, Hall, MacMillan and possibly even Ziebell.

The remaining group need to be kept on their toes and kept from getting too comfortable.

I think it was 2002 and when I started to really rip into Pagan for not investing in the midfield. Every single false dawn since (finals appearances) were on the back of numerous games where we were badly beaten or win games where we just willed ourselves to. 2007 was probably the only year I had a real positive feeling that a strong group could be formed but once JWS went down and we started our run of crappy 1st round selections, it just fell away.

In this time, we have never had a midfield that would be ranked in the top 4 of the competition and I would dare say that we would rarely have had any of the three areas be a top 4 ranked group. It says that we just don't build a team right.

We have some interesting young players at the moment, probably our most varied group in a while, but there is a massive hole in terms of speed that is still there. Just order it with a pinch of accurate kicking please.

 

[wolvesRoos]

Honestly I think you are going early on Shaw.

Last year and in his first two games this year we consistently did things Scott was unable to do. Come back to win, hold it leads then smash teams (that weren't Carlton), not sh*t the bed when we had a lead. He made changes during games that brought results.

I think the last game we went to we took Port Adelaide apart and Ben Brown kicked 10. Things can change quickly

 

[Horace]

Obviously this team will never run out for us, but on our list and not playing yesterday and some out of position, are:

Backs: Williams, Vickers-Willis, Hayden
Half Backs: Murphy, Xerri, Wood
Centres: Ahern, Tyson, Taylor
Half Forwards: W Walker, Garner, Turner
Forwards: Thomas, Brown, Hosie
Rucks: Campbell, Cunnington
Rover: Ziebell

And then there is Jacobs.

There are some handy names there and I would venture to say that team, fit and well, would be competitive.

More than anything though it does, in my view, highlight why we are having such a horrible year.

On present ladder position we are in line for picks 3, 10 and 21. Beyond that who knows what this coming draft might hold. With no form to go on it will be a recruiting nightmare, but surely we will get at least one good footballer in the coming draft.

Eventually this will turn. We are far better than yesterday. Maintain the faith.

 

[Snake_Baker]

Change the cattle to suit game plan. Remember, Rome wasn’t built in a day, time is needed

Spend 3-4 years rebuilding fro a game plan that could very well be redundant by then? What if the game plan is crap?

A good coach takes what they have and then optimizes it.

 

[Gasometer]

I think the last game we went to we took Port Adelaide apart and Ben Brown kicked 10. Things can change quickly

Great night. I even videoed the 10th goal

 

[Merlin007]

How?

There's hidden draft gold waiting at picks 55, 62, 77, 95 and 113? There's eye catching blokes standing out in the non existent VFL?

Putting list changes aside, I can't see us dropping more than 6 blokes off the list, depending upon who we can actually trade in to the list, and we're going to have to accept less than top shelf in that instance.

My take -

Delist: Jacobs (tragic), Durdin, Murphy, MacGuinness (sorry kid), Hosie and Wood (for his sake)

3 year contracts: Brown, Anderson,
2 year contracts: Bonar, Scott, Taylor, MacMillan, Pittard, J. Walker, Turner, Hayden, Xerri, W. Walker
1 year contracts: EVW, Crocker, Daw, Williams, Ahern, Garner

If we can trade in more that 2 blokes then some of the blokes on 1 year contracts might also be in trouble, likewise if the lists get cut back, but this is relistically how it will work.

It's not ideal, and there's a few more I would prefer to move on, but sticking it out for another season is better for the list than picking up picks 80 onward in the draft.

I think they'll go harder than that. You point out that list numbers might get cut back; I think that's pretty much guaranteed in the current fiscal climate. Obviously that means we have to go harder just to make room for (say) four draftees (plus the possibility of moneyball pick-ups like Josh Walker), in which case I'd say Crocker, Williams, Ahern and esp. Garner are in trouble.

I also think if we got pick offers for any of Brown, Higgins, Goldstein and Polec then the club would take them - I'm not advocating, just saying that's how I read it. Cunnington, Taz and JZ are the only seniors they wouldn't consider, and anybody else probably doesn't have currency

 

[Hearts to hearts]

Yeah, that was appalling. I lasted a little longer then Jed before being “done for the day” so I missed what sounds like the worst if it - and given what I did see was the worst footy I’ve ever watched, that’s been not good.

I also saw almost they same list - less injuries - take apart some very good teams last season including the premier. That didn’t make us a better side than Richmond any more than this week makes us worse than the wooden spooners. It does mean a lot of these players are capable of much more than they are showing now.

The coaches need to work out whether each of them can sustain the higher level of performance in future and how to make that happen, or move them on. It might be that adding a little more top end talent this year and giving them a run in 2021, and letting a few go who aren’t going to lift for us, could see a Port-type turnaround fairly quickly.

I wouldn’t be pushing out a player like Ben Brown, though.

 

[Long Live the King]

Somewhere at the club will be a whiteboard with 3 columns..........keep / delist / trade. It has probably existed for some months now

 

[Supreme_Chancellor]

Our biggest problem for 10 years has been player development, blokes just don’t get any better and continue to be played.

How many players who played yesterday wouldn’t get a game at other clubs? Plenty

Our list management is just a disgrace

How many years on a list do guys like Durdin, Garner, McKay get? Just a free pay check for doing nothing. Even Mason Wood who has at least shown something at senior level shouldn’t be on the list.

As for Ben Jacobs, well who even knows what’s happened there.

We aren’t a charity, and yes it’s sad if nice blokes get a lot of injuries but it shouldn’t be at the clubs expense.

*20 years