Solved Shanann Watts - American Murder: The Family Next Door

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Kurve

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I wondered about steroids.
He looks quite ripped in some pics but I haven't found a before and after pic yet. His mistress said he lost 13 pounds in five weeks, that's not really a lot imo. Bulking might account for that given muscle is heavier.
 

PetterdHoisted

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There's a clip of Watts talking to the press here and unlike other men who have killed their wives where most of us can read their nerves and guilt, Watts doesn't falter. It's really disturbing.

I think he slips up at the end, uses past tense, 'she was going to have started kindergarten next week'

Otherwise, I agree, but as others said, too cold/calm
 

johnymac1

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Yes, there was the point where the neighbour says he’s acting really strangely and actually describes the difference and the cop is saying, “Well his wife’s missing so he’s probably not his normal self” and the neighbour is like, “Nah dude, that isn’t it.” I’m not sure if it is in that clip or in the extended one I saw. The neighbour was completely onto it. I got the impression in the documentary that he was itching to say what he thought from the moment he realised there were police next door.
The neighbour had a gut feeling. he recognised changes in behaviour.

But the FBI detective had Chris sussed, she would know the statistics. This type of disappearance is normally is down to a family member.
 

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ms finch

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I came across this when I was looking for a before photo.

“The couple got married in 2012 and public records show that each were arrested multiple times in North Carolina; the charges are not known. Chris had been arrested three times before and Shanann had 15 arrests to her name.”

I wonder what that was about? Not that it means anything necessarily, could be something innocuous, or just the two of them being a bit wild before they settled down.


As for before photos, there’s a few in the Netflix documentary. He was really overweight beforehand - I was quite shocked given his current physique. Nicole, Shanann’s friend, thinks he lost about 70-80 pounds over 6 months, which seems about right to me from what I could see. He was using the nutritional supplement Shanann sold. Given what is said in this article, ice actually sounds like a possibility.

 

zedx

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There's a clip of Watts talking to the press here and unlike other men who have killed their wives where most of us can read their nerves and guilt, Watts doesn't falter. It's really disturbing.

In the clip, he shows no emotion, he is just talking. To me (maybe in hindsight) this is very telling. He is just rambling on like he is telling a story. i would have expected to see some emotion. I also noticed some unusual body language movements being-
Shifting Your Weight From Side to Side or Front to Back
“The way you move your body reflects your attitude,” says Goman. Constantly transferring your weight from one foot to the other or rocking forward and backward is a comforting movement that indicates you are anxious or upset. Basically, this is a physical representation of what is going on in your head: You are betwixt and between many unsettling thoughts and can’t stop moving from one to the other. Moving your feet also is an indication you are lying.
Shoulder shrug
Is a gesture that in the extreme interpretation means "I give up". It could mean that person doesn't really have a strong opinion about what you are discussing or may not even care. Again, it is important to look for this gesture in context.
Crossed arms
Crossing arms across the chest is a classic gesture of defensiveness. This defensiveness usually manifests as discomfort, uneasiness, shyness, or insecurity.
Avoiding eye contact
Is one of the first non verbal cues people will interpret as being dishonest. ... Furthermore, good liars also aware of that notion that "eyes cannot lie", that avoiding eye contact is a sign of deception and lying.
Although the interpretation of these movements need to be put into context with each individual situation, i think they are very telling that Watts is either lying or not being completely truthful.
 

zedx

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Also after watching the Police interview with Nichol kessinger, all I can say is she is a cold hearted b***ch, showing no empathy or care for the deceased or remorse for her role in their deaths. Any one else who was the indirect cause of an others murder would be absolutely devastated.
 

ms finch

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Watts Killed his family to be with her, a fact you cannot dismiss. It may not have been a active role, but it sure was a role.
She was lied to as well. He told her he and Shanann were separated, and given he managed to fool everyone else that he was a calculating psychopath capable of murder for many years, it’s not hard to believe he fooled her for a couple of months.

After Shanann and the kids went missing, she went to police and expressed her concerns precisely because she was worried he had done something and actively participated in trying to resolve the matter. She may not have come across as someone with concerns in the way she spoke, but her actions speak for themselves. An uncaring person or enabler would have buried their head in the sand or, worse, stood by him. She did not, in any way, support him and clearly, on no level, had any acceptance of what he might have done.

It was BECAUSE she came forward that police had conclusive evidence he was a liar and were able to start to piece him together. It also enabled them to construct a polygraph that was more reliable - if he had been asked about an affair in that polygraph because they were fishing for information he would have been able to claim that the reason he failed it was due to the affair. They explained this when they questioned him afterward.

I do not see any evidence that she knowingly enabled him or enabled him when she should have known, either before or after the murders. That’s not having a role; that’s being a third party manipulated and ending up in someone else’s mess and then unraveling it. Why do we so often turn on (unwitting) women men are having affairs with for the behaviour of those men?

It would also, in my view, be reasonable to believe she was suffering from shock and fear herself. She was coming to terms with the fact that the guy she was with was not only lying to her but probably a cold blooded killer. This was only hours after she had started to see the situation unraveling.
 

zedx

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She was lied to as well. He told her he and Shanann were separated, and given he managed to fool everyone else that he was a calculating psychopath capable of murder for many years, it’s not hard to believe he fooled her for a couple of months.

After Shanann and the kids went missing, she went to police and expressed her concerns precisely because she was worried he had done something and actively participated in trying to resolve the matter. She may not have come across as someone with concerns in the way she spoke, but her actions speak for themselves. An uncaring person or enabler would have buried their head in the sand or, worse, stood by him. She did not, in any way, support him and clearly, on no level, had any acceptance of what he might have done.

It was BECAUSE she came forward that police had conclusive evidence he was a liar and were able to start to piece him together. It also enabled them to construct a polygraph that was more reliable - if he had been asked about an affair in that polygraph because they were fishing for information he would have been able to claim that the reason he failed it was due to the affair. They explained this when they questioned him afterward.

I do not see any evidence that she knowingly enabled him or enabled him when she should have known, either before or after the murders. That’s not having a role; that’s being a third party manipulated and ending up in someone else’s mess and then unraveling it. Why do we so often turn on (unwitting) women men are having affairs with for the behaviour of those men?

It would also, in my view, be reasonable to believe she was suffering from shock and fear herself. She was coming to terms with the fact that the guy she was with was not only lying to her but probably a cold blooded killer. This was only hours after she had started to see the situation unraveling.
Sure I understand what you are saying, but you are misunderstanding my use of the word 'role'. I also said she was the 'indirect cause', no where did I say it was her fault or she was involved. Quite likely if he hadn't fallen in love with her, he could have fallen in love with some one else with the same result. Unwitting? She became aware he was still with his wife and kids quite a while before the murders, but chose to ignore that knowledge. I am not victim blaming, I am merely looking into the evidence and there is fair bit to say she was aware things were amiss.
 

ms finch

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Sure I understand what you are saying, but you are misunderstanding my use of the word 'role'. I also said she was the 'indirect cause', no where did I say it was her fault or she was involved. Quite likely if he hadn't fallen in love with her, he could have fallen in love with some one else with the same result. Unwitting? She became aware he was still with his wife and kids quite a while before the murders, but chose to ignore that knowledge. I am not victim blaming, I am merely looking into the evidence and there is fair bit to say she was aware things were amiss.
Role to me implies responsibility. Nobody close to him on Shanann’s side, with years to assess him, has any idea he was likely to kill Shanann, let alone the kids. How could the woman he was having an affair with know? Things being amiss to do equate to “I think this person is a killer”, in foresight.

I recall one of the things she said in her interview - that in the few days before the murders he stopped using gift cards and started paying for things on his credit card. It’s all very well to say in hindsight that there were behavioural changes, but I struggle to believe that anyone at the time would have thought, “Hmmm, I think this guy is planning a murder of his wife and kids.” I mean, if you went to the police with what she had beforehand, they would have laughed her out of the station.

Finding out that he was still with Shanann and that it was an affair doesn’t equate to the fact that she knew what was going on, even in terms of their relationship. He was always lying to her; that much was obvious, in the same way as he persisted in lying to the police. The story was changing, and she was getting more truth, but she was still being led to believe that he and Shanann no longer had a full relationship.

You also did say she was a cold-hearted b****. I don’t understand how someone can be labelled that when they put their own humiliation aside out of concern for the welfare of others. That’s what she did. She had no obligation to come forward, because an affair is not a crime or even necessarily relevant to a murder. She has set herself up to be judged and maligned and criticised. There is no self serving motive there. She sacrificed her reputation in the hope or saving their lives, if they were still alive, or getting them justice. Doing that, in my book, whatever your personality otherwise, is the sign of a decent human being.
 

revo333

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You also did say she was a cold-hearted b****. I don’t understand how someone can be labelled that when they put their own humiliation aside out of concern for the welfare of others. That’s what she did. She had no obligation to come forward, because an affair is not a crime or even necessarily relevant to a murder. She has set herself up to be judged and maligned and criticised. There is no self serving motive there. She sacrificed her reputation in the hope or saving their lives, if they were still alive, or getting them justice. Doing that, in my book, whatever your personality otherwise, is the sign of a decent human being.
Did you watch the video?

She basically got caught telling a web of lies to police when she came forward.

And also did research on goggle on how to make money from the situation.
 
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zedx

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Role to me implies responsibility. Nobody close to him on Shanann’s side, with years to assess him, has any idea he was likely to kill Shanann, let alone the kids. How could the woman he was having an affair with know? Things being amiss to do equate to “I think this person is a killer”, in foresight.

I recall one of the things she said in her interview - that in the few days before the murders he stopped using gift cards and started paying for things on his credit card. It’s all very well to say in hindsight that there were behavioural changes, but I struggle to believe that anyone at the time would have thought, “Hmmm, I think this guy is planning a murder of his wife and kids.” I mean, if you went to the police with what she had beforehand, they would have laughed her out of the station.

Finding out that he was still with Shanann and that it was an affair doesn’t equate to the fact that she knew what was going on, even in terms of their relationship. He was always lying to her; that much was obvious, in the same way as he persisted in lying to the police. The story was changing, and she was getting more truth, but she was still being led to believe that he and Shanann no longer had a full relationship.

You also did say she was a cold-hearted b****. I don’t understand how someone can be labelled that when they put their own humiliation aside out of concern for the welfare of others. That’s what she did. She had no obligation to come forward, because an affair is not a crime or even necessarily relevant to a murder. She has set herself up to be judged and maligned and criticised. There is no self serving motive there. She sacrificed her reputation in the hope or saving their lives, if they were still alive, or getting them justice. Doing that, in my book, whatever your personality otherwise, is the sign of a decent human being.
Sorry, there was a self serving motive. Once she realized the disappearance of Shanann was getting world wide coverage she new she was going to be found out as the mistress and it was better for her to go to Police rather than they come to her.
I'm not in any way saying she was involved, but, I'm looking at the situation from many angles and any possibilities, it would be remiss not. there is a lot of talk and I'm not sure if its true of her not being completely truthful, her phone pinging in the wrong area on that morning as to where she said she was and of Googling Shanann's Facebook, prior to her murder. Why did she delete everything off her phone and his? Watt's also insisted she was not involved and did not want her questioned. Why?
I watched her Police interview again, and still feel she was very cold hearted in regard to what had happened, her empathy did not seem real.
 

ms finch

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Did you watch the video?

She basically got caught telling a web of lies to police when she came forward.

And also did research on goggle on how to make money from the situation.
Sorry, there was a self serving motive. Once she realized the disappearance of Shanann was getting world wide coverage she new she was going to be found out as the mistress and it was better for her to go to Police rather than they come to her.
I'm not in any way saying she was involved, but, I'm looking at the situation from many angles and any possibilities, it would be remiss not. there is a lot of talk and I'm not sure if its true of her not being completely truthful, her phone pinging in the wrong area on that morning as to where she said she was and of Googling Shanann's Facebook, prior to her murder. Why did she delete everything off her phone and his? Watt's also insisted she was not involved and did not want her questioned. Why?
I watched her Police interview again, and still feel she was very cold hearted in regard to what had happened, her empathy did not seem real.
Yes, I have watched the video.

I am not saying she is perfect or even likeable, but I think there is a far cry between someone having an affair and not behaving well, and someone having a role in a triple murder (including of two little kids) and being called a cold hearted b****.

Plenty of other people, with much more information than her, believed Chris in the aftermath. She turned on him as quickly as any of them.

We are seeing a snapshot of a person in a difficult situation under an enormous amount of pressure. At points police are asking questions to establish whether she was an accessory to the murders. She was coming to terms with the situation, caught up in the murder of children and being questioned about potential involvement. She is agitated and stressed and defensive, which is not a true representation of a person. I would be defensive too, if I was innocent of something and feeling accused of it, especially when it’s a murder.

Given the line of questioning, police would almost certainly have checked her out as an accessory. They did not even attempt a charge of that so I think it’s a fair conclusion there was no substantive evidence of it.

Unless she actually lied to the police or kept something substantive from them, it doesn’t really matter to me how she came across. She was doing her part to help, which is what matters, and she did this voluntarily. She was within her rights to not go to them, to retain a lawyer from the outset, and to not participate in it at all. This is a totally legitimate course of action, and would have saved her judgement, of which she has been subjected to plenty. I really don’t see why anyone would put themselves through what she did if they weren’t genuinely concerned about the situation. Any notoriety or financial gain that she was interested in, could have been better achieved by NOT speaking to the police. She may have explored other options, which is why I said she isn’t perfect, but ultimately she did the right thing, and she did it fairly quickly. That to me is someone with a conscience, however messed up they are otherwise.

Everything that appears odd and the questions that have been raised can, in my view, be explained by someone who was starting to believe that Chris was not telling her the full story about the affair in the period beforehand. Other elements can also be explained by someone wanting to cover up the affair initially in the aftermath when thinking that Shanann and the kids were simply missing.

I’ll add something else here. What if he had been completely innocent? She didn’t know that he wasn’t at the time she came forward. So she knew she was sacrificing her relationship, whatever the outcome. What if Chris had been a good guy who had an affair, Shanann had run off with the kids, and he was the love of her life? She was prepared to throw that away because she cared more about his wife and kids.

But anyway, it was the role and the “cold hearted b****” comment that I was really debating. I don’t think she had anything to do with what he did, or that she knew in any way that he was even contemplating murdering his family for her. She was an unwitting patsy in whatever scheme of self-gratification he had going on. And I am certainly not going to claim that I like her or that she came across well, but I don’t think she’s an awful human being.

I also do believe that people who come forward in situations like this deserve support, however unlikeable they are, if they have done nothing wrong. People who DON’T come forward I have a massive problem with because they are often enabling the individual. Coming forward is hard, and I think it’s made more difficult if people think they will be judged.
 
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owen87

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This is the police cam footage the day she was reported missing

The neighbour is showing the cop and police cctv video footage of Chris's front yard showing how Shannon never left the house etc.. Chris ute backs up.

Chris has his hands on his head like he's stressed about his wife and kids bt he's shitting himself about the camera footage. He can't wait to get out of there.

The neighbour is looking at Chris watching his reaction.

When Chris leaves the house the neighbour basically says to the cop he's acting all suss. This neighbour solved in straight away.

It's funny when you re-watch that before and after the show, going from not knowing whether he was involved, to knowing he's guilty.

Instead of a guy who's stressed and worried about his family, you see one who's just been caught in the act trying to explain himself. The neighbour played it well, went along with Watts and then the moment they got privacy, told the cop that nothing was right.
 

Angus Young

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It's funny when you re-watch that before and after the show, going from not knowing whether he was involved, to knowing he's guilty.

Instead of a guy who's stressed and worried about his family, you see one who's just been caught in the act trying to explain himself. The neighbour played it well, went along with Watts and then the moment they got privacy, told the cop that nothing was right.
Exactly. And the whole time he's checking his phone...anyone innocent that has no idea what happened to them would be glued to that cctv footage looking to see if there is something.
 

johnymac1

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It's funny when you re-watch that before and after the show, going from not knowing whether he was involved, to knowing he's guilty.

Instead of a guy who's stressed and worried about his family, you see one who's just been caught in the act trying to explain himself. The neighbour played it well, went along with Watts and then the moment they got privacy, told the cop that nothing was right.
first sign for me, was he rushed up to shake the police officers hand
 

owen87

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first sign for me, was he rushed up to shake the police officers hand
Not sure I'd read a lot in to that, it's not one single instance of bizarre behaviour that makes someone guilty. He just had a whole collection of things mounting on top of one another.

I can't even begin to imagine how I'd react if I'd had a wife and two children go missing as an innocent person, I might shake the cops hand just for being there to help.
 

2006_Eagles

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Not sure I'd read a lot in to that, it's not one single instance of bizarre behaviour that makes someone guilty. He just had a whole collection of things mounting on top of one another.

I can't even begin to imagine how I'd react if I'd had a wife and two children go missing as an innocent person, I might shake the cops hand just for being there to help.
It's funny becuase he rushes to shake the cops hand and doesn't even acknowledge the two friends/neighbours on his drive. Well trained cops would be watching his every move

Can someone suddenly just snap in adulthood and become a psychopath having never shown any signs beforehand?
 

afl genius

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The wife recording everything about her life was somewhat unsettling, it was as of she knew something was going to happen. Must admit he seems like a normal guy but you can tell its him once they establish that all her belongings are still at the house and no sign of force entry/struggle

There's a similar doco on Netflix called the staircase (mind you im only 2 eps in) for anyone who interested.
 

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