Shattered

[WaynesWorld19]

Somewhat puzzled ....just got back from the game .....we only lost by two points but I left feeling we had been thumped after half time.

There's no doubt that Craig went in a tall light believing the extra run of Douglas to be important ....however losing Rutten left us effectively two talls down and it was a very critical contributing factor to the loss tonight.

The significant stat tonight ....and it has been a barometer of our performances was the tackle count ...... we were embarassed in this dept.
Two things happened after Qtr Time:

1. Our intensity dropped and the hunger for the contest was not there .....you could feel that "some" players felt we were going to win easiliy.

2. St Kilda really lifted their intensity around the ball ......they got hands in to deflect our handballs and where we were able to cleanly get handballs off in the first qtr ....we were given no time to dispose and when we did they managed to get deflections on our handballs.

You could see the momentum shift .....our cleanness in disposals within the space of 15 minutes turned to hesitancy and slopiness.

We were forced wide after qtr time with hardly any passages down the centre corridor .....played right into St Kildas hands as we ultimately kicked long to a crowded forward line.

Johncock a good player in the first qtr was taken by Milne to the goal line for the last 3 qtrs where two things happened:

1. Firstly he was effectively taken out of the play .....Craig why did you allow that????..... well IMO Massie would have been the man to release Stiffy up the ground BUT we needed him to cover the extra tall that we were short of because of Rutten.

2. Secondly ....Joghncock was showed up for body strength by Milne ....so a win on all counts to Lyon.

Thompson: Chocolates to boiled lollies in one week ......really labored of the ground tonight and his disposals ....ouch

Douglas: Not up to it YET ....looked slow but is this a by product of putting weight on .....he definately slower than last season .....so there must be reasons and I'm sure he can get the yard of pace back.

Also he does put his team-mates under pressure with his disposals.

Maric: Thought a good game .....he was holding his marks but there were instances where he was a logical go to player and the ball carrier opted to go wide to a less favoured option.

If you present you should receive!

Doughty: Iam quickly falling off the Doughty wagon ....as a backboner he has to be playing at 80-100% of his capabilities ....AP he's almost a liability but there isn't any players putting pressure on his position.

McGregor: Slow bigmen are quickly becoming a liability in todays game

Bock: looked very dangerous early .....disappeared after half time ....is he injured? OR not working hard enough.

If he wasn't injured then why wasn't he put on Reiwoldt? ....I suspect because of the large time slots on the bench he WAS carrying something that is affecting his mobility.

Macleod: Looked to running at a different speed to other Crows players ....it showed tonight AGAIN our need for some speed in the midfield.

IMO clearly our best player and arguably BOG.

Edwards: effectively tagged out of the game after Baker was switched onto him after qtr time ....are we strating to see some inconsistency of performance now from Edwards as he apparoaches his career twilight?

Burton: Ran in straight lines OK ......but the lad just couldn't turn on that knee ...affected his performance terribly

Knights: yep ....his star is rising

Reilly: when on the ground he made smart decisions ....tried to come inboard most times ....and his disposal was IMO good.
But he was off the ground alot ....is he still having problems with that ankle??

Interesting ....last 5 minutes ....game on the line ....and who are the players sitting on the bench ....Van Berlo, Reilly, and Douglas

Am I wrong to think that we needed our serious runners on the ground in that last 5 minutes????

 

[Drummond]

Interesting ....last 5 minutes ....game on the line ....and who are the players sitting on the bench ....Van Berlo, Reilly, and Douglas

Am I wrong to think that we needed our serious runners on the ground in that last 5 minutes????

Glad you brought this up.

VB had 4 possessions in the first half of the last quarter, and then went off. Being one of our best runners I thought he would come on with about 5 minutes left to see if he could give us a lift though the midfield. I waited, and waited, and waited and yet no change was made. Our players looked dead our there in the last 5-10 minutes, and we had 3 midfielders resting on the bench. Thompson especially looked exhausted.

 

[Markthirtytwo]

Didn't see the game only heard it on the radio at times.

But going by most of you sounded like we got flogged.

Only two points in it at the end, surely there must have been some good points about some of the players.

If we go pantsed by all and sundry why wasn't the difference larger?

 

[smoovy]

I don't blame Craigy as much as some for tonight. I know the match up on Riewoldt was not the best with Massie, but quite frankly I don't think it would have mattered who was on him tonight.

This match was completed decided in the midfield, we were absolutely cut up tonight. Forget looking at any stats, it was St Kildas ability to run the ball through the centre square and have good clean ball to deliver to their forwards. Ater quarter time we never looked like having any run and at the same time were losing a lot of contested ball.

That said somehow we only lost by 2 points. But the reality is the saints had 8 more scoring shots. I think missing Bass is really going to hurt us over the coming weeks. I have no doubt if he was in the side tonight we would have got across the line. His ability to play that loose man role was really missed and is courage to get in the way of the leading forwards.

 

[smoovy]

Didn't see the game only heard it on the radio at times.

But going by most of you sounded like we got flogged.

Only two points in it at the end, surely there must have been some good points about some of the players.

If we go pantsed by all and sundry why wasn't the difference larger?

Out competiveness and spirit kept us in the game. Everything else ranged from mediocre to basically shizenhousen.

 

[birdmanptr]

Surely now Griffen comes back in so we do actually have a tall that can move

Full forward for mine

 

[exit]

Again Adelaide's decision making fell apart when the pressure was on. I tipped Saints because more often than not Adelaide lose when they are expected to win. And they don't win close games, full stop.
Thompson gets plenty of the ball but burns it so often it's not funny.
No point blaming the umps. Adelaide always have to win despite the umpiring. Always have, always will.
So many close losses, more injuries, you just get the feeling it's not meant to be this year.

 

[birdmanptr]

Negatives from tonight:

Rutten's injury

Further realisation that Roo may need to give it away at the end of this season.

Further exposure of our midfield as front running receivers once they get 4 goals up.

The end of our Top 4 claims

Losing games we should win

 

[tcsoul]

We got killed. St Kilda kicked badly, hence 2 points not 5+ goals.

St Kilda played us the way the good teams should, cover our half forward line and half back line, our run starts at the half back line, pressure there leads to a blind kick to a covered half forward line. How many times did we get to centre wing and just kick to 3 on 1's etc, or switch play allowing more numbers back for St Kilda, we either need to get a decent CHF, PAV if you will though I dont think he's worth the cost unless it's a multi way trade, or somehow the crows go back to how they played the first full year of Craig's coaching and realise what they are doing differently now.

I'm all for flexible structure, but how about admitting some players shouldn't be playing and bringing in the younger ones, make some players earn the spot they think is there's. Injuries or not, there are other options, try them and find out, no worse then what we are doing now.

 

[Glenno23]

Ah, close games, so much luck in em

We hit the post once, if that had gone through we MIGHT have won

If the Saints posters had gone though, they might have won by more

I felt the umpires were very good tonight, they let the game go with the flow and didnt get involved unless they had too. A few bad decisions, but they are human.

also, of our 7 goals in the 1st half, 4 were from free kicks. We got smashed in the marks inside 50 category. We need a big strong forward (Read: Pav) to take some big grabs. Welsh was good tonight, but dropped a pretty easy mark at CHF, in which they rebounded straight for a goal, when we should have been kicking to the top of our goal square for a mark or crumb

St Nick, Harvey, Fisher and Hayes ran amok. Gehrig was good. Rutten is a great player until he comes up against a leading forward and doesn't have his partner in crime (Bassett) to help protect the space

So many times the saints runners on the rebound were far too good, or had it far too easy after we kicked it straight to a saints player on our HF line and just watched them ease it into their forward 50

Questions need to be asked of our structure at the dome, its not like they were not sure what the weather is going to be like. I know we lost some talls in the game, but against St Nick, Gehrig, Kosi and co, they were always going to be that little bit too tall for us.

Very dissapointing, as it was a golden opportunity to cement a top 8 spot and challenge for the top 4

 

[bigman]

Somewhat puzzled ....just got back from the game .....we only lost by two points but I left feeling we had been thumped after half time.

There's no doubt that Craig went in a tall light believing the extra run of Douglas to be important ....however losing Rutten left us effectively two talls down and it was a very critical contributing factor to the loss tonight.

The significant stat tonight ....and it has been a barometer of our performances was the tackle count ...... we were embarassed in this dept.
Two things happened after Qtr Time:

1. Our intensity dropped and the hunger for the contest was not there .....you could feel that "some" players felt we were going to win easiliy.

2. St Kilda really lifted their intensity around the ball ......they got hands in to deflect our handballs and where we were able to cleanly get handballs off in the first qtr ....we were given no time to dispose and when we did they managed to get deflections on our handballs.

You could see the momentum shift .....our cleanness in disposals within the space of 15 minutes turned to hesitancy and slopiness.

We were forced wide after qtr time with hardly any passages down the centre corridor .....played right into St Kildas hands as we ultimately kicked long to a crowded forward line.

Johncock a good player in the first qtr was taken by Milne to the goal line for the last 3 qtrs where two things happened:

1. Firstly he was effectively taken out of the play .....Craig why did you allow that????..... well IMO Massie would have been the man to release Stiffy up the ground BUT we needed him to cover the extra tall that we were short of because of Rutten.

2. Secondly ....Joghncock was showed up for body strength by Milne ....so a win on all counts to Lyon.

Thompson: Chocolates to boiled lollies in one week ......really labored of the ground tonight and his disposals ....ouch

Douglas: Not up to it YET ....looked slow but is this a by product of putting weight on .....he definately slower than last season .....so there must be reasons and I'm sure he can get the yard of pace back.

Also he does put his team-mates under pressure with his disposals.

Maric: Thought a good game .....he was holding his marks but there were instances where he was a logical go to player and the ball carrier opted to go wide to a less favoured option.

If you present you should receive!

Doughty: Iam quickly falling off the Doughty wagon ....as a backboner he has to be playing at 80-100% of his capabilities ....AP he's almost a liability but there isn't any players putting pressure on his position.

McGregor: Slow bigmen are quickly becoming a liability in todays game

Bock: looked very dangerous early .....disappeared after half time ....is he injured? OR not working hard enough.

If he wasn't injured then why wasn't he put on Reiwoldt? ....I suspect because of the large time slots on the bench he WAS carrying something that is affecting his mobility.

Macleod: Looked to running at a different speed to other Crows players ....it showed tonight AGAIN our need for some speed in the midfield.

IMO clearly our best player and arguably BOG.

Edwards: effectively tagged out of the game after Baker was switched onto him after qtr time ....are we strating to see some inconsistency of performance now from Edwards as he apparoaches his career twilight?

Burton: Ran in straight lines OK ......but the lad just couldn't turn on that knee ...affected his performance terribly

Knights: yep ....his star is rising

Reilly: when on the ground he made smart decisions ....tried to come inboard most times ....and his disposal was IMO good.
But he was off the ground alot ....is he still having problems with that ankle??

Interesting ....last 5 minutes ....game on the line ....and who are the players sitting on the bench ....Van Berlo, Reilly, and Douglas

Am I wrong to think that we needed our serious runners on the ground in that last 5 minutes????

Agree with most of your comments WW. A contributing factor to our loss was the non selection of another tall - Perrie (a real risk anyway or Gill) or even Marty against a forward line that is tall and mobile. I am sure this will not happen again as Craigy basically siad it was a tough decision ot leave out another tall.)

Anothe factor was losing Rutten. Although he was getting towelled up it meant our flexibility was lost. It meant putting Massie back on to a tall.

Anothe factor was our midfield being stiched up after quarter time. We were put under enormous pressure as you said and we gave them too much time and space. We seem to pay little respect to Harvey and he has now panttsed us on two occasions (remmeber the final two years ago).

Another factor was our poor kicking and decision making. When we are put under some pressure we seem to go to water.

The removal of Kenny to the back line also meant that we tended to play wider and wider and not down the corridor.

We seem ot be playing unfit players or at least players who are veyr sore - Thommo looked to be lame all night. Roo injured his ankle in a pack mark and also was struggling.

Get over the umps. They may ahve been a small influence but a number of things combined to produce t his most disappointing result.

Our inability to win close contests is becoming a real issue.

 

[sainters]

Well, that wasnt good. I dont know which I am more annoyed at, our burning of the ball, or the armchair ride the Saints got after 1/2 time... umpire 25 a saints member?

Umpires? Crows were out played after quater time, umpires had no effect on the result.

Great game by both teams, but at the end of the day there will be a loser (99% of the time anyway), could have quite easily gone either way.

 

[Fred]

And the Umpires were shithouse, I'd love to see the inside 50 free kick count.

And our forwards, as much as I bag them a lot of the time, **** me, they get nothing from the umpires, meanwhile every time it went inside the Saints 50, they got a free.

Adelaide got 3 goals from frees while the saints got 2.

Source: The Age stats.

 

[Total Crows]

Jen, Ill wait for WWs Good Bad or Ugly but I feel you have missed the mark ona few here

Yes you are right Douglas wasnt spectacular...but what impressed me was his poise and how purposeful he was in his disposals and attack on the ball.

Welsh was lively but maybe my definition of awesome is different to yours. Was good not awesome

Huddo struggled??? I had him as BOG in the 1st half. And VB was strong in the 1st half

Maric is still learning the game and will only get better.

I agree with you Welsh was okay, but dropped an absolute sitter in the last quarter which the Saints pounced on and turned into a goa. Was far from awesome IMO.l

 

[WaynesWorld19]

Glad you brought this up.

VB had 4 possessions in the first half of the last quarter, and then went off. Being one of our best runners I thought he would come on with about 5 minutes left to see if he could give us a lift though the midfield. I waited, and waited, and waited and yet no change was made. Our players looked dead our there in the last 5-10 minutes, and we had 3 midfielders resting on the bench. Thompson especially looked exhausted.

Drummond he looked tired in the third qtr?? ....as I said he really labored across the ground last night ....in fact several players looked tired in the legs ....Shirley really struggled to keep up with del Santo .....it's not good when one player is moving apparantly freely and his tagger looks like he has run a marathon and is running on the spot

 

[Il Naso De Gastev]

Umpires tend to reward the players that are first in for the ball, which last night was the Saints. Umps had no bearing on the outcome.... and anyone who blames them as contributing to the result is kidding themselves.

Was it just me or was Johncock horribly out of sorts?? Thought Milne took the points there... which is unbelievable given that Milne is nothing more than a VFL footballer.

 

[Crow Envy]

Agree with most of your comments WW. A contributing factor to our loss was the non selection of another tall - Perrie (a real risk anyway or Gill) or even Marty against a forward line that is tall and mobile. I am sure this will not happen again as Craigy basically siad it was a tough decision ot leave out another tall.)

Anothe factor was losing Rutten. Although he was getting towelled up it meant our flexibility was lost. It meant putting Massie back on to a tall.

Anothe factor was our midfield being stiched up after quarter time. We were put under enormous pressure as you said and we gave them too much time and space. We seem to pay little respect to Harvey and he has now panttsed us on two occasions (remmeber the final two years ago).

Another factor was our poor kicking and decision making. When we are put under some pressure we seem to go to water.

The removal of Kenny to the back line also meant that we tended to play wider and wider and not down the corridor.

We seem ot be playing unfit players or at least players who are veyr sore - Thommo looked to be lame all night. Roo injured his ankle in a pack mark and also was struggling.

Get over the umps. They may ahve been a small influence but a number of things combined to produce t his most disappointing result.

Our inability to win close contests is becoming a real issue.

Most of what you wrote was spot on but Massie was playing on a tall from the start of the game, Riewoldt. This was because we were a tall short and not because Rutten got injured. Craig and the selection team stuffed up tonight, and it sounds like they are not even admitting it rather saying the loss of Rutten made us become a tall short, well Craigy thats CRAP, we were caught short before that injury. Blind Freddy could see we needed another tall going into the game, why couldnt our COACHES!

 

[oporto]

Teams can't win games when the free kick count is that out of proportion. Crows really need to work on the frees. Maybe get the umpires to come and explain their rules to us...and while their there slip them some lunch money

I've heard this before....just cant remeber where

 

[Redlegs14]

I am getting seriously fed up with the umpires copping the blame from some supporters after every loss.

Our performance last night , apart from the first quarter, simply wasn't good enough for a team who are supposedly gunning for a top 4 berth.

Blaming the umpires only serves to give opposition supporters the ammunition they need to label us as ****ing whingers, and to be honest, they are right on the money.

Umpires make mistakes, as they did last night, just as many of our players made horrendous mistakes, but on the whole I thought the umps did a pretty decent job last night, so get over yourselves, and lay the blame where it should be laid- at the feet of the players.

 

[21knights]

As a lot of other people have said. Selection was a huge screw up this week. What were they thinking putting Massie on Riewoldt? I just don't see how that was ever going to work at the Telstra Dome. I felt sorry for Massie. I was also very surprised that we got that close, we were doomed before the first bounce.

 

[Mad Dog]

{snipped excellent summary}

1. Our intensity dropped and the hunger for the contest was not there .....you could feel that "some" players felt we were going to win easiliy.

{snipped excellent summary}

Macleod: Looked to running at a different speed to other Crows players ....it showed tonight AGAIN our need for some speed in the midfield.

{snipped excellent summary}

fantastic appraisal WW.....nailed it completely but particularly these points.

I'm convinced our midfielders thought they had it won at qtr time and started to loaf as they did against West Coast.

This is why injuries while important in the second half do not excuse a 4 scoring shots to 9 second qtr

 

[Damp Squarie]

Shattered as well... and angry.

Why was McGregor left down back and kept there for so long? I thought NC would change him with Bock in the last quarter but it just didnt happen. I kept waiting...and Kenny kept on getting smashed!

We missed Bassett badly. With Rutten gone mid game it was always going to go down to the wire. The Saints shouldve won by a shitload more except for inaccuracy...well done to them.

 

[CaptainDangerfield]

Negatives from tonight:


Further realisation that Roo may need to give it away at the end of this season.


Positives from tonight:


Another step towards structural change for our list.

Another step towards strategic change amoungst those who are directing our on field performance.

Another stella performance from Knights.

A further reality check

What do you mean by this MD - "Another step towards strategic change amoungst those who are directing our on field performance."??

As for your other comment, "strutural change". I wonder for the rest of the season if Craigy ( in his conservative nature )will just continue to shuffle the deck chairs - various combinations of Welsh, Bock, Kenny, Stevens. Or will he show some daring ( and an eye to the future )and try Griffen as a premanent forward or why not bring in Sellar for a game ot two. Why the hell did we recruit Gill. Wasn't he supposed to be insurance in the event we lost talls. How many talls do we have to loose before het gets a game?

 

[Duck Farmer]

I sympathise with you guys over the umpiring. It's been shocking for us over the last two weeks and seems to now be carrying over to the Crows.

On the bright side, you've got a potential gun in Chris Knights. Had a few poor disposals but otherwise looked the goods.

On the down side, Riewoldt killed you and Craig's match ups seemed strange. I guess losing Rutten restricted his options.

 

[CaptainDangerfield]

We have had some shocking umpriring decisions go against us this year, which could have cost games. However, last night the umpriring wasn't the difference between winning and losing. Too be honest, I thought we were lucky wo get within 6 goals of them. We were shocking after quarter time, off and on the ground.