Politics Should Australia go nuclear?

[JoondalupJ]

sorry for the cut and paste but absolutely yes.

personally I do not advocate the construction of a gen 3.5+ reactor in Oz (with a qualification) but certainly do for a gen 4. We absolutely should not build plutonium generators (ie Chernobyl was a plutonium weapons plant that produced power as a by-product rather than a power station per se) and we shouldn't build gen 2 or gen 3 reactors like the 1960s possibly 1950s design of Fukushima.

Gen 4 is of particular interest as it........hold on, just some background on uranium. 99.7% of uranium is the crap stuff (u-238) and 0.3% is the good stuff (u-235 - can produce power from). in the enrichment process you turn the uranium into a gas, wizz in around in circles and try to separate isolate "more" of the lighter gas. This increases the 0.3% to around 4% for a nuclear fuel rod, 20% for a submarine fuel rod and 99.9% for a bomb. It is exponentially harder to increase the % meaning running a weapons program is almost impossible to hide from inspectors.

So in a gen 3.5+ you burn at most 0.3% of the uranium and you get the extra "kick" from U-238 which when hit by a neutron and turns into Plutonium before like the U-235 becomes additional fuel. This u-238 to plutonium bit is the same concept of a thorium to U-233 rector which are both "fertile" material.


Gen 4 reactors are far more efficient as they not only burn the U-235 but most of the U-238 as well. These not only burn new feed more efficiently but they can also burn the spent fuel rods from early generation reactors.

Thanks for that. I believe that the public are not informed or if they are , don't listen.
As is a trait of we Aussies sometimes, in that we say she'll be right or leave it as it is.

Leaving it as it is seems to be a more dangerous idea.

The Gen 4 you speak of sounds like a good idea , I think I had always thought that nuclear being so clean was a good idea if the problems around it like waste was solved.
Those problems I did not understand and and won't pretend to now. But there are a few people with scientific mathematical backgrounds that understand the pros and cons of nuclear , and imagine if we can remove the coal industry , with a clean nuclear energy, then create jobs by going renewable mad as well in research, its all win win.

Again seriously, thanks for the info, keep it simple for poor old me .. ha ha ha .

 

[JoondalupJ]

There's underground fresh water reservoirs that outback communities rely on.
That's why there's opposition to certain mining projects.

Stable? Maybe take a look at how many earthquakes and tremors occur.

View attachment 196496

Seems heaps stable.


Having said that though I'm of the opinion that we should have gone nuclear, the full shebang nuclear power and weapons, when the British were out here at Maralinga conducting tests.

Undeclared secret program like Israel.
Who would do anything about it? Our allies the UK who'd have helped? Or our other allies who supplied Israel and Saddam with similar and worse tech?

Who'd complain Indonesia? Just turn another blind eye to their human rights abuses and they'll get over it.

Israel???? perhaps we have?

 

[Power Raid]

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-india-nuclear-idUSKBN0U619N20151224

India wants to dramatically increase its nuclear capacity to 63,000 megawatts (MW) by 2032, from 5,780 MW, as part of a broader push to move away from fossil fuels, cut greenhouse gas emissions and avoid the dangerous effects of climate change.

 

[little graham]

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-india-nuclear-idUSKBN0U619N20151224

India wants to dramatically increase its nuclear capacity to 63,000 megawatts (MW) by 2032, from 5,780 MW, as part of a broader push to move away from fossil fuels, cut greenhouse gas emissions and avoid the dangerous effects of climate change.

India have a space program. Not investing in nuclear when you have a space program is like investing in a navy when all you have is desert.

 

[Power Raid]

India have a space program. Not investing in nuclear when you have a space program is like investing in a navy when all you have is desert.

what is the link?

 

[Kwality]

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-india-nuclear-idUSKBN0U619N20151224

India wants to dramatically increase its nuclear capacity to 63,000 megawatts (MW) by 2032, from 5,780 MW, as part of a broader push to move away from fossil fuels, cut greenhouse gas emissions and avoid the dangerous effects of climate change.

Its either coal or nuclear at this point, renewables aren't up to the job of powering India going forward.
http://www.newindianexpress.com/nat...pur-by-2016-End/2016/01/25/article3244477.ece

The relevance of the space program went thru to the keeper for me, but here is a link:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indian_Space_Research_Organisation

 

[Power Raid]

Its either coal or nuclear at this point, renewables aren't up to the job of powering India going forward.
http://www.newindianexpress.com/nat...pur-by-2016-End/2016/01/25/article3244477.ece

The relevance of the space program went thru to the keeper for me, but here is a link:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indian_Space_Research_Organisation

I'll be interesting for India as they have strong states and a weaker commonwealth. I think that will deliver a variety of solutions.

Hopefully they get more right than wrong

 

[little graham]

The clowns in this thread are a laugh. You heard right, CLOWNS.

As part of broad strategy to reduce greenhouse gases massively in the next 30 years, France has introduced policy to cut nuclear power by a third to reduce greenhouse gas emissions

France is one of the major players in the nuclear power club. This devastates the industry and makes a mockery of the claims of various clowns here.

 

[Power Raid]

The clowns in this thread are a laugh. You heard right, CLOWNS.

As part of broad strategy to reduce greenhouse gases massively in the next 30 years, France has introduced policy to cut nuclear power by a third to reduce greenhouse gas emissions

France is one of the major players in the nuclear power club. This devastates the industry and makes a mockery of the claims of various clowns here.

how old are the reactors they are shutting down?

 

[little graham]

how old are the reactors they are shutting down?

Currently France source seventy five percent of their power from nuclear. They are scaling that back to fifty percent and increasing renewables to 40 percent, in the hope of reducing emissions by 30 percent. They believe they can reduce even more by changing lifestyle and designing more efficient products/machinery.

When they reach their target, they will shut down more nukes and introduce more renawables.

Only a clown would advocate for nuclear power, are you a clown?

 

[FPPF]

Currently France source seventy five percent of their power from nuclear. They are scaling that back to fifty percent and increasing renewables to 40 percent, in the hope of reducing emissions by 30 percent. They believe they can reduce even more by changing lifestyle and designing more efficient products/machinery.

When they reach their target, they will shut down more nukes and introduce more renawables.

Only a clown would advocate for nuclear power, are you a clown?

Oh sit down you silly greeny.

 

[Power Raid]

Currently France source seventy five percent of their power from nuclear. They are scaling that back to fifty percent and increasing renewables to 40 percent, in the hope of reducing emissions by 30 percent. They believe they can reduce even more by changing lifestyle and designing more efficient products/machinery.

When they reach their target, they will shut down more nukes and introduce more renawables.

Only a clown would advocate for nuclear power, are you a clown?

lol

have you considered what % nuclear power is considered optimal? the CO2 debate is a very interesting one. Love to hear more about nuclear power and CO2

 

[Papa G]

 

[Power Raid]

Looks like cameco's uranium investment at Yeelirrie has gone up in smoke.

 

[Power Raid]

The royal commission here is about alot of things. One of them is trying to inflate the price of uranium. Our economy is stuffed, alot of our iron ore is only able to be mined because uranium that comes with it pays for it.

I destroyed the validity of that royal commission in four questions to it.

France and Germany are both getting out of nuclear power. It's a pity you post on such ideological
grounds, we have alot in common.

I guarantee Germany will reverse its decision and no France is not getting out of nuclear.

Oh and Olympic Dam is not an iron ore mine. Iron is a credit.

 

[Bollox]

The royal commission here is about alot of things. One of them is trying to inflate the price of uranium. Our economy is stuffed, alot of our iron ore is only able to be mined because uranium that comes with it pays for it.

I destroyed the validity of that royal commission in four questions to it.

France and Germany are both getting out of nuclear power. It's a pity you post on such ideological
grounds, we have alot in common.

Where do some of you get this utter crap ?
You just sit there and make it up ?

 

[JoseMourinho]

Olympic Dam is a uranium mine Lol.

Australia won't move to nuclear since they have so much domestic coal which is miles cheaper than Nuclear atm.

 

[Power Raid]

Olympic Dam is a uranium mine Lol.

Australia won't move to nuclear since they have so much domestic coal which is miles cheaper than Nuclear atm.

The uranium grade is super low and a lot is refractory (can't be extracted).

The asset is managed from Sth America in their copper division.

And yes coal is abundant on the east coast, so any move for nuclear will be from areas like SA, Pilbara or Geraldton

 

[Hawk Dork]

Nuclear cant compete then add the clean up costs.
The graph doesnt show solar thermal but
Solar thermal can be tacked onto existing coal powered turbines.
So can geo-thermal if the conditions are right.
This massively reduces the upfront costs and re purposes or supplements existing old tech

 

[Power Raid]

Nuclear cant compete then add the clean up costs.
The graph doesnt show solar thermal but
Solar thermal can be tacked onto existing coal powered turbines.
So can geo-thermal if the conditions are right.
This massively reduces the upfront costs and re purposes or supplements existing old tech

Can't compete with what? compare apples with apples

 

[Hawk Dork]

Energy supply has more than one source.
So the comparison is between apples and oranges

 

[Papa G]

http://www.smh.com.au/business/ener...-boost-over-its-lifetime-20160211-gmrcgx.html

 

[bomberclifford]

Agree Papa G but I don't hold out much hope. Unfortunately, 'just doing it' is just not the SA way.

 

[Papa G]

Agree Papa G but I don't hold out much hope. Unfortunately, 'just doing it' is just not the SA way.

Yes the SA do nothing attitude is still a massive issue, but I actually think the bigger problem will be getting the Feds to agree. The Federal Labor party are still massively Anti, the Greens are well the Greens, and I think "inner city latte sipping left wing media" for want of a better phrase will also mount a massive scare campaign against.
But let's face it, for somewhere like Port Augusta, it could be a massive opportunity and if the worst was to happen and there was a Nuclear accident, it may even improve the joint.

 

[Pie eyed]

I destroyed the validity of that royal commission in four questions to it.

Truly peed my pants....
You're not a little shorter than average are you?
Wear a sort of pointy tri-cornered hatty thing and whack your hand inside your vest a bit too often?