List Mgmt. Should I stay or should I go now? End of 2019 list management discussion

Wandering Hawk

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May 19, 2014
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out:
Miles, Mohr, Mirra, Mitchington
Langford, Roughead, Schoenmakers, Puopolo
(respect, and thanks for the service).

Smith and Ceglar if they prefer new homes.

That's a big cull of 8-10 players. Can't imagine much more in terms of numbers. 1-2 might be saved by this and given one more year reprieve if Ceglar and/or Smith go.

Would hope to pick up 4 players in the trade period or post delistings, and then draft/rookie 4-6.

The following year we then have plenty of room to scrutinise any of our marginal players - add say 2-3 retirements from our older cohort of Burgoyne/Stratton/Birchall/Frawley/Henderson and delist/trade the worst 2-4 of Glass/Brand/Morrison/Greaves/Golds/Nash/Hanrahan/Pittonet/Reeves/Moore.
 

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Nick the Pig

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Apr 3, 2019
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out:
Miles, Mohr, Mirra, Mitchington
Langford, Roughead, Schoenmakers, Puopolo
(respect, and thanks for the service).

Smith and Ceglar if they prefer new homes.

That's a big cull of 8-10 players. Can't imagine much more in terms of numbers. 1-2 might be saved by this and given one more year reprieve if Ceglar and/or Smith go.

Would hope to pick up 4 players in the trade period or post delistings, and then draft/rookie 4-6.

The following year we then have plenty of room to scrutinise any of our marginal players - add say 2-3 retirements from our older cohort of Burgoyne/Stratton/Birchall/Frawley/Henderson and delist/trade the worst 2-4 of Glass/Brand/Morrison/Greaves/Golds/Nash/Hanrahan/Pittonet/Reeves/Moore.
This is pretty much spot on with the only exception I see Poppy kept due to a lack of an ideal replacement. The intention hopefully that someone develops next year or a newbie comes in to force him out mid season the same as Lewis did to Roughie this year.
 

Wandering Hawk

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May 19, 2014
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This is pretty much spot on with the only exception I see Poppy kept due to a lack of an ideal replacement. The intention hopefully that someone develops next year or a newbie comes in to force him out mid season the same as Lewis did to Roughie this year.
Seems quite reasonable. We also are hardly hurt by keeping Puopolo at the cost of having one less place holder/depth on the list, we'd be digging quite deep into the rookie draft anyway. If we delist 8+ others I could easily see us keeping Puopolo, assuming that he feels good to go round again.

I'd be kind of pleased because I enjoy watching Poppy. My only fear is that if they stay on the list the old guard just keep getting picked due to loyalty/obstinacy by Clarkson and it keeps us from blooding youth or stifles our forward line development. But if we're already running Nash + Hanrahan regularly atm then we definitely have the flex spots to easily debut kids, and we probably can't afford too many kids all together at once in the forward line. Puopolo thus seems a very reasonable keep unless we land another mature small forward from trade period.

Thinking in terms of list age, I feel that we should only keep Puopolo if one of Smith or Ceglar goes, barring a surprise retirement from Birchall or Burgoyne. I'd rather not be facing getting stuck retiring six veterans next year and then barely having the capacity to delist kids that don't make it. It seems Birchall should stay, and it's not good enough imho to only lose Roughead and Mohr from our over thirty bracket.

Birchall, Stratton, Ceglar, Smith, Henderson, Puopolo, Burgoyne - mostly to go over the next 2-3years. Best staggered.
 
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burner1

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The obvious outs:
-langers
-rough (retire)
-miles (delist)
-shoey (body cooked)
-mohr (rookie - as above)

May leave:
-smith (money / term)
-ceglar (opportunities)

Not clear:
-birch (impey injury helps his case for 1 more year)
-silk (will he go round again?)
-Puopolo (retire? Looks cooked)
-Minch (can’t get on park, but may depend get a reprieve if Puopolo goes)
-brand (should leave for more opportunities but may be wanted to be kept for kpp depth)
-mirra (May be saved due to lack of kpp depth)

We can do a pretty big clean out without really having to make many tough calls. With a stronger list players such as glass would be under pressure but can’t see it happening this year. The over 30 group is interesting as if don’t move a few on the potential mass exit in a few years become more an issue.
 

Brant

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Sep 6, 2009
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Guys just remember when doing this exercise:

1. The most important indicator of a footballer's worth is his age.

2. Your expectations matter - not Clarko's or the Match Commitee.

3. Don't worry about who will replace a player when they retire - if you're frustrated because of Points 1 & 2 then just retire them anyway, so you'll have something to whinge about next year...


I see this advice has already been taken into account by most of you...

Carry on...
 

user33

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Sep 24, 2011
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I'd be shocked if Poppy leaves.

Poppy has played all year, I don't think Clarko keeps him in if they know he's gone (see Roughy). Through different rotations Clarkson would've got more games into Moore, Hanrahan, Cousins, Ross and Walker throughout the year instead of persisting with Poppy if it was his last season.

I think Birchall stays too... If we are competing next year and Birch is healthy, he's a huge asset, especially with Impey out.
 

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Flamin Joe

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After last night who still thinks Poppy is cooked and gone at the end of the year ?
I think with a better functioning forward line (which is slowly coming) the pressure acts he's so lauded for will start resulting in more goals. I think it's no coincidence that his lack of scoring is partly due to the lack of scoring across the entire team. Before anyone jumps on me, notice I said partly due, I'm happy to admit that age is catching up to him.

Personally I'd give him another year considering we have no other option banging down the door.
 

Blackhawk42

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Neither Moore or Hanrahan have or will have the pace either.
Oli has the pace but lacks the killer defensive instinct.
Moore looks classier but certainly isn't quick.

I'd like to see them both in the same side eventually. Hopefully another year with Poppy doesn't result in one of these boys playing VFL for the majority of the season. Moore was just starting to really get going before his latest little injury. Would love to see what he could achieve with 15+ games in the same season.
 

Hawk_francais

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Sep 20, 2015
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I would sugges that Minchington is the Puopolo understudy. I doubt we retire Pop and then also delist Minch.
I would do neither, though I have a suspicion that Impey could play forward eventually. He's fantastic in the backline but he's also had some outstanding flashes as a small forward, and is a great set-shot. The best replacement for Poppy on the list currently, fingers crossed for Minchington.
 

Davo-27

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Highlighted players under scrutiny as to whether they go on in 2020

Rucks
McEvoy - 30 - premium ruck
Ceglar - 28 - secondary ruck
Pittonet - 23 - back up ruck (possibly delisted and replaced?)
Reeves - 20 - developing ruck

KPP
Roughead - 32 - out of form champ (retired)
Frawley - 30 - premium defender
Schoenmakers - 28 - out of form forw (likely delisted?)
Mohr - 30 - back up defender - inj knee (likely retired?)
O'Brien - 25 - secondary defender/forw
Brand - 25 - back up defender (could be kept or delisted?)
Lewis - 20 - premium forward
Koschitzke - 18 - developing defender

Forws
Breust - 28 - premium forw
Gunston - 27 - premium forw
Puopolo - 31 - secondary forw (he still has the ability to affect the ball coming forw, but lacks the pressure he once had, retire or stay for 1 more?)
Wingard - 26 - premium mid/forw
Minchington - 25 - back up forw - poor form (i think he has 1 more yr, but could be delisted?)
Nash -21 - secondary forw
Moore - 20 - developing forw
Walker - 19 - developing forw/mid
Ross - 20 - developing forw
Hanrahan - 21 - developing forw

Defenders
Burgoyne - 36 - secondary def
Birchall - 31 - injured def (depends on medical, retired or another year?)
Stratton - 30 - premium def
Impey - 24 - secondary def/becoming premium def
Sicily - 24 - premium def
Hardwick - 22 - premium def
Miles - 22 - back up def (delisted?)
Mirra - 28 - back up def (delisted?)
Scrimshaw - 21 - secondary def
Jiath - 20 - back up def
Greaves - 19 - developing def

Mids
Shiels - 28 - secondary def mid
Smith - 30 - premium wing
Scully - 28 - secondary wing
Henderson - 31 - premium wing
Mitchell - 26 - premium inside mid
O'Meara - 25 - premium mid
Howe - 23 - secondary def mid
Morrison - 20 - secondary wing
Worpel - 20 - premium mid
Glass - 22 - back up mid (delist?)
Cousins - 21 - back up mid
Jones - 20 - developing mid
Golds - 19 - developing wing
 

Walshawk

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Lewis and Morrison drafting shows you can get good, perhaps great players with late draft picks, so I would be ruthless this year.
Off
Langford
Rough
Shoe
Brand - not up to it (if we get Patton (not a fan), then TOB becomes back up KPD
Mirra - not up to it
Pitto (unless we trade Cegs) simply not going to make it
Miles - Clarko will never play him
Minchinton
Mohr
Puopolo - only if Burgoyne plays on. Would play SB forward as we have plenty of HBFs. Clarkson is going to continue with Nash and you can’t have two non goal kicking forwards

I don’t think Glass will make it but nine delistings is enough. Bring on the draft picks.
 

butlers hawks

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I note that it is the Herald Sun but did anyone notice they have linked more Hawks to GCS? Isaac Smith, Grant Birchall and Paul Puopolo now added to the Jarryd Roughead and Shaun Burgoyne articles. Hawks have said they are going to be working with Burgoyne on a new deal if he wants to play on and despite this being said publicly Herald Sun has continually written articles on him being chased. The Smith part is interesting as it would need to be a trade, the other two are free agents though so would need to be compensation coming back.
 

Ned Ryerson

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Sep 23, 2012
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I note that it is the Herald Sun but did anyone notice they have linked more Hawks to GCS? Isaac Smith, Grant Birchall and Paul Puopolo now added to the Jarryd Roughead and Shaun Burgoyne articles. Hawks have said they are going to be working with Burgoyne on a new deal if he wants to play on and despite this being said publicly Herald Sun has continually written articles on him being chased. The Smith part is interesting as it would need to be a trade, the other two are free agents though so would need to be compensation coming back.
No way known the AFL give us compensation picks for Birchall and Poppy. They would likely not get big dollar contracts elsewhere due to their respective ages and therefore compersation will likely be a very late round pick at the very best.
 

cb16

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Sep 23, 2008
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No way known the AFL give us compensation picks for Birchall and Poppy. They would likely not get big dollar contracts elsewhere due to their respective ages and therefore compersation will likely be a very late round pick at the very best.
No compensation picks at all if we pick up a free agent ourselves....
 

Carl Spackler

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Jul 29, 2018
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I note that it is the Herald Sun but did anyone notice they have linked more Hawks to GCS? Isaac Smith, Grant Birchall and Paul Puopolo now added to the Jarryd Roughead and Shaun Burgoyne articles. Hawks have said they are going to be working with Burgoyne on a new deal if he wants to play on and despite this being said publicly Herald Sun has continually written articles on him being chased. The Smith part is interesting as it would need to be a trade, the other two are free agents though so would need to be compensation coming back.
“There could be a strong Hawthorn flavour at Gold Coast next season.

We know the Suns are chasing Jarryd Roughead for an off-field position and Shaun Burgoyne as a general in the back line for 2020.

But what about star wingman Isaac Smith, Paul Puopolo or even Grant Birchall?

The Suns are looking to inject some premiership experience and respected mentors into the club for next season, and the Hawks could be on the verge of a clean-out.

Smith is arguably the most interesting case as he has another year on his contract at Hawthorn but could find more security in the form of a longer-term deal elsewhere.

Birchall had a one-year deal in the works until his latest soft-tissue injury put that offer in danger.”
 
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