The Law Should we be punished for evil desires?

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Seeds

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Yeah I realise that now.
I just for some reason thought it would be a less literal definition of 'evil'.

Whats really to blame is the 'Morally corrupt things you do' thread which instead of being a cornucopia of salacious confessions is a snorefest of "I reach down into the middle of the bread packet and leave the stale slices on top" or "I put red grapes through as green at the supermarket and steal 24c".
lol that thread sounds like classic GD board. Take an interesting topic and make it boring.
 

William Wonka

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lol that thread sounds like classic GD board. Take an interesting topic and make it boring.
Boring sums it up perfectly.
I wasn't expecting "I rob Armourguard trucks for a living and my hobby is collecting Rhino horn" but its literally "Sometimes instead of giving all the money in my wallet to the homeless I hang on to a $50 for myself "
 

Chief

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Um weren’t you?
No i said you could argue that just downloading an image from Usenet - where there is no payment or anything - couldn’t be said to add to the demand for the images. So it’s a victimless crime. If you didn’t even look at them, again no victim.

But possession is of course illegal. Whether or not you paid for them. Whether or not you actually looked at them.

Whether that is analogous to a doll is your opinion. I reckon it is. If you want to say it has to be more like a photo of a child, well they are cast from a mold of a child. Mould?
 

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owen87

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He is right though. It’s not victimless. Weird that people are trying to say having sex with plastic is equivalent to sharing photos of actual child abuse. very weird.
That’s not what I took Chief as saying, thus my comment.

There’s also a difference between possessing and sharing - or, worse again, creating - child pornography.

They all exist on a spectrum of not ok though.

A desire, if not acted upon, shouldn’t be punished, no, in response to the OP.

But child sex dolls are pretty close to the line of acting upon or validating those desires.
 

Leeda

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That’s not what I took Chief as saying, thus my comment.

There’s also a difference between possessing and sharing - or, worse again, creating - child pornography.

They all exist on a spectrum of not ok though.

A desire, if not acted upon, shouldn’t be punished, no, in response to the OP.

But child sex dolls are pretty close to the line of acting upon or validating those desires.
salacious doll representation is deploraoble...
 

sorted

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No i said you could argue that just downloading an image from Usenet - where there is no payment or anything - couldn’t be said to add to the demand for the images. So it’s a victimless crime. If you didn’t even look at them, again no victim.
Even if there is no payment or anything for downloading it could still add to the demand for images, and more abuse. You show me yours and I'll show you mine etc.

But possession is of course illegal. Whether or not you paid for them. Whether or not you actually looked at them.
This discussion is a bit of a sidetrack. I don't think anyone has argued that such images should be legal to possess. Whereas there's different opinions on the dolls.
 

Chief

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Even if there is no payment or anything for downloading it could still add to the demand for images, and more abuse. You show me yours and I'll show you mine etc.



This discussion is a bit of a sidetrack. I don't think anyone has argued that such images should be legal to possess. Whereas there's different opinions on the dolls.
Goes to the point that has been raised - it being wrong to convict someone for ownership of a paedo doll because you haven’t actually harmed anyone.

Therefore, just downloading a zip file of images from a free source shouldn’t be illegal either. You haven’t added to demand, you haven’t looked at the images.

So, there’s an argument that if you hold one opinion, you’re being inconsistent if you don’t hold the other.

I hold that both are wrong and should be subject to legal consequences.

So - photos vs a doll.

What about the child they created the cast from that they used to make the dolls? It seems that’s just as bad as a photo.
 

Power Raid

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Goes to the point that has been raised - it being wrong to convict someone for ownership of a paedo doll because you haven’t actually harmed anyone.

Therefore, just downloading a zip file of images from a free source shouldn’t be illegal either. You haven’t added to demand, you haven’t looked at the images.

So, there’s an argument that if you hold one opinion, you’re being inconsistent if you don’t hold the other.

I hold that both are wrong and should be subject to legal consequences.

So - photos vs a doll.

What about the child they created the cast from that they used to make the dolls? It seems that’s just as bad as a photo.
one relates to latex

the other relates to the exploitation of a child

there is a major difference here
 

sorted

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Goes to the point that has been raised - it being wrong to convict someone for ownership of a paedo doll because you haven’t actually harmed anyone.

Therefore, just downloading a zip file of images from a free source shouldn’t be illegal either. You haven’t added to demand, you haven’t looked at the images.
But you didn't address my point that one person sharing these images might encourage others to do the same and create more. They are images of serious crimes against real children, possibly encouraging others to commit similar crimes.

The dolls are very probably not be based on real children who have suffered abuse, so there's no victims.
 

Chief

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But you didn't address my point that one person sharing these images might encourage others to do the same and create more. They are images of serious crimes against real children, possibly encouraging others to commit similar crimes.

The dolls are very probably not be based on real children who have suffered abuse, so there's no victims.
You don’t think a child having a cast made of their naked body so paedos can have sex with a rubber facsimile of them is abuse?
 

sorted

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You don’t think a child having a cast made of their naked body so paedos can have sex with a rubber facsimile of them is abuse?
Ignoring my point again.

You think shop mannequins are made from casts of real people?
 

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Chief

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Ignoring my point again.

You think shop mannequins are made from casts of real people?
No but I know how casts are made. “Realistic details” are difficult to sculpt and often made from casts of real people.

And to my mind we return to the idea of licensing for people under treatment. Like we do with methadone and the like.
 

owen87

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ITT:

Chief makes statement about two things being wrong.

People attack Chief for supporting those things.

Classic BigFooty.
 

Geelong_Sicko

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You don’t think a child having a cast made of their naked body so paedos can have sex with a rubber facsimile of them is abuse?
Damnit, if I google how these things are made I'm gonna go on a list aren't I? I'll happily go on a list for researching defence tech relating to war crimes or various conservative political f*ckeries but this? I guess my quest for knowledge ends here.
 

Power Raid

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No but I know how casts are made. “Realistic details” are difficult to sculpt and often made from casts of real people.

And to my mind we return to the idea of licensing for people under treatment. Like we do with methadone and the like.
if that is the case, then this is crossing the line and forms a basis of exploitation of a child

do you have a link to support evidence of this? I can only see "they could be" modeled off an image
 

Evolved1

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Can we not call it child 'porn'?

Its properly called child abuse material.

Calling it porn normalizes it to those twisted pricks.
I wouldn't know what to make of it if someone was charged with being in possession of child abuse material because the label is so broad, whereas we all know what child porn is.

Do you have reason to think relabeling the offense would have any practical benefit?
 

owen87

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I wouldn't know what to make of it if someone was charged with being in possession of child abuse material because the label is so broad, whereas we all know what child porn is.

Do you have reason to think relabeling the offense would have any practical benefit?
Wasn't he saying that's the official term - 'child abuse material'

For example;

 
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