Analysis Small Forward

[Turbocat]

Although an issue , I think being able to get games into mids in FP and others area should help get our new mids tally up quicker. But is it that hard to recruit a kid who has mid potential but is a real goal sneak?

 

[Cyclone Larry]

McCarthy was looking promising but his foot issues don't look promising enough to continue viewing him as a reliable future option. Safe to say Menzel is a long shot to come back and play at the level we were expecting before his first knee.
It's frustrating seeing guys like Lang playing in the forward pocket and struggling to find their place in the game. He needs to play higher up the ground and find more of the ball.
Resting some of the mids as small forwards would be the option I'd go.
Motlop, Caddyl, Stokes and Selwood do well when having cameos down forward.
I'd love to see our CHF taking a mark 50-60m out dead in front for a change. Its flanks or deep to the square these days.

 

[Partridge]

Seems pretty clear McCarthy was earmarked for the role this season. There were a lot of positive noises from the club when he made it on the field last season and he was rated highly enough to get a gig in a final. I reckon he would have played 15+ games this season if fit and his injury threw a spanner in the works.

He might have. The problem is though he's another totally unproven player. His best credential is 'being rated'. He has kicked 0 goals at senior level. And of course, he's yet another player who so far has been crippled by long term injuries.

 

[Art Vandelay_]

we won plenty of the ball against Fremantle when the game was there in the balance and every time we pumped it inside fifty, Hawkins and Clark gave us literally nothing. I know some will whinge about that but it's a fact. Watch the replay in the second and third quarter. Caddy, Selwood, Guthrie were winning the ball so it's not solely a midfield issue. Our forward line setup is bloody shizenhousen!
It's been that way for years.
You think back when Hawkins had a back back and he was left there to try and be the single key forward target when there were clearly options available so something is breaking down between the coach and the forwards coach, or whoever sets up that half of the field.

Also, Bartel has never, not once shown he is capable of becoming a goal kicking forward so who orchestrated that one?
Why not try someone who is very agile and quick off a standing start a go?

The only area we broke even with them per say in the midfield was centre clearances which was -1. Smacked in stoppage clearances. smacked in hitouts, con poss, Ucon poss. Face it we were beaten everywhere in the middle. They had first use of the ball all afternoon.

You say 'we won plenty of the ball', well Selwood 7 clearances then Stokes, Guthrie and Caddy 4. In contrast Neale 9, Mundy 8, Fyfe 6, Hill 5, Suban 5. So 5 blokes with more clearances than our 2nd most productive players. Smacked!

You say the forward set up is rubbish and it probably is but fixing our midfield is EASILY more important than the forward line. No use having the best crumbers and KPF if you don't first have a competent ruckman and midfielders around him to get them the ball. This is the biggest area to address, this is where our problems yesterday originated.

It's also not giving enough credit to Fremantle their structures make it quite difficult to get effective I50's. Port have a better forward set up than we do, a better ruckman and midfield and they were kept to 68 points by this fremantle team still missing Dawson and/or Silvagni.

 

[Partridge]

McCarthy was looking promising but his foot issues don't look promising enough to continue viewing him as a reliable future option. Safe to say Menzel is a long shot to come back and play at the level we were expecting before his first knee.
It's frustrating seeing guys like Lang playing in the forward pocket and struggling to find their place in the game. He needs to play higher up the ground and find more of the ball.

If anyone involved at list management at Geelong considers Menzel, Cowan, McCarthy or Vardy as part of their long term plans, they need their heads examined. The only viable and sane option right now is assume they're all finished, and start planning for replacements damn quick.

 

[fpm84]

He might have. The problem is though he's another totally unproven player. His best credential is 'being rated'. He has kicked 0 goals at senior level. And of course, he's yet another player who so far has been crippled by long term injuries.

Agree we can't put our eggs in the one basket. At the same time Scott and the coaches find themselves in a catch 22 situation - people say 'play the kids' and they're prepared to do that. McCarthy, Thurlow and Walker played finals last season. Cockatoo, Lang and Gregson seem like they'll get a run of games this season. Likewise Bews. Kersten got games last season even when his form didn't warrant it. I can also see Thurlow, Gore and maybe Jansen playing a handful of senior games this season. And as I said, it's likely McCarthy would have been in that pack of players too. It's tough when supporters want us to 'play the kids' and when we do, complain that we're not playing well or that we lose comfortably to very good sides.

 

[Partridge]

He's got the speed, seems to have the like for a contest and ability to finish. less pressure than dropping him into the middle as well

No offence Willo, but we're talking about a guy who has played 2 senior games and so far has looked as far off the pace and utterly uncompetitive as any debutant I can remember. It's not that he's not doing much; he's not doing anything. At least the other inexperienced guys in Lang and Gregson have shown something at times. He shouldn't even be considered for the seniors again until he can demonstrate a semblance of form in the VFL.

 

[geelong_boy]

I know it's been said before, but Chapman could have easily played this role for us in 2014-2015.

He could have, but he decided to leave.

 

[Willo_]

No offence Willo, but we're talking about a guy who has played 2 senior games and so far has looked as far off the pace and utterly uncompetitive as any debutant I can remember. It's not that he's not doing much; he's not doing anything. At least the other inexperienced guys in Lang and Gregson have shown something at times. He shouldn't even be considered for the seniors again until he can demonstrate a semblance of form in the VFL.

No offence taken, I'm only basing that off his willingness to tackle and throw himself into the contest, I think he should go back to the VFL and find some footy at open age level.

But if they do insist on picking him then at least put him in the forward pocket not up on the ball

 

[BlightysCats]

Someone like Walters would be ideal. None of our forward pockets since Chapman and Johnson (when they played there) have carried a goal threat.

It has been missing.

However, I don' think that is the real problem, our forward 50 entries are so low, we could have the best small forward in the game it would not make a blind bit of difference.

We have arguably the best key forwards in the league and they are not even getting into the game so I think a small forward would suffer the same problem as well.

Main priority is fixing the midfield woes as our forwards are starving and our backs are over worked.

I agree, I don't understand why we don't just play a completely flooded defence with only Clark, Hawkins, and a quick like Cocky etc ahead of the ball and when we win the ball just kick the bloody thing use it minimally and get it forward as quick as possible to the two big guys and get the mids to sprint forward to feed off any scraps. Give Clark and Hawk a go at it, if it comes to ground Cocky and maybe Murdoch could provide pressure/small forward goal kicking options. We need to move it so that our forward line is open, too often this season by the time we get it down there it's crowded.

 

[geelong_boy]

That's the frustrating thing, SJ. He could've made the spot his own by kicking goals and making himself indispensable. Surely the club would've given him more games or another year if he had a good one. You can understand the club's POV of not offering him two years given his injury history balanced versus giving others game time.

 

[Willo_]

Also to add I would like to see Mr Smedts start down under the feet of the big blokes against Norf (he has copped a week for whacking the Freo bloke)
He has the speed, agility and nose for a goal to play well there..added in with him looking much better and more comfortable at the level this year

 

[cynical]

Taylor Hunt...

If Cowan's body holds up for more than 5min.

Smedts would make a good small forward but then where are we going to park all the apprentice mids and too old for full time mids like Bartel Stokes and SJ.

 

[bulletproof]

No offence Willo, but we're talking about a guy who has played 2 senior games and so far has looked as far off the pace and utterly uncompetitive as any debutant I can remember. It's not that he's not doing much; he's not doing anything. At least the other inexperienced guys in Lang and Gregson have shown something at times. He shouldn't even be considered for the seniors again until he can demonstrate a semblance of form in the VFL.

I am as excited about Cockatoo as anyone, but we pay the senior coach to be a little bit more level headed. If Murdoch had of started the season like Cockatoo, there would be major outrage.

It is time for Cockatoo to show what he can do at the lower level now. He will be back soon enough.

 

[Partridge]

Taylor Hunt...

If Cowan's body holds up for more than 5min.

Smedts would make a good small forward but then where are we going to park all the apprentice mids and too old for full time mids like Bartel Stokes and SJ.

Well, you could play the older ones in the VFL from time to time.....

Nah, just kidding.

 

[SJ]

That's the frustrating thing, SJ. He could've made the spot his own by kicking goals and making himself indispensable. Surely the club would've given him more games or another year if he had a good one. You can understand the club's POV of not offering him two years given his injury history balanced versus giving others game time.

Sure I can. I get it.

But at the same time we promoted Burbury to the senior list and cut him just as promptly. What a waste of time that was.

 

[BlightysCats]

I am as excited about Cockatoo as anyone, but we pay the senior coach to be a little bit more level headed. If Murdoch had of started the season like Cockatoo, there would be major outrage.

It is time for Cockatoo to show what he can do at the lower level now. He will be back soon enough.

Disagree, we've played him for a game and a half, the first game was a baptism of fire if I've ever seen one and the next one he came on after it was over. We may as well play him against the Coasters to give him a game where he might at least have some chance of showing us his wares and getting some confidence in himself. I think Murdoch or Gore should come in too.

 

[BlightysCats]

How embarrassing that the match review panel has done for us what the MC should've done two weeks ago and force us to drop Smedts.

 

[STP18]

Maybe we can throw Blicavs up there.

 

[STP18]

How embarrassing that the match review panel has done for us what the MC should've done two weeks ago and force us to drop Smedts.

Funny, I wouldn't mind them giving him a crack at that small/medium forward position. When you look at 2015 form and that alone, there have been many worse performers than a kid playing in a foreign position.

 

[BIGANT]

It sounds like kersten has redefined that small fwd role, the last few games in the vfl.

 

[Willo_]

How embarrassing that the match review panel has done for us what the MC should've done two weeks ago and force us to drop Smedts.

Completely disagree, given he has been thrown into the backline when he seems a natural forward I think he's been fine. Better than some of our much more experienced players

 

[catempire]

We need to do what Bomber did and start the midfielders in the forward pocket play them there and give them spells in the middle. When they've earned it or want it bad enough then they can "graduate". IMO this is the reason why a lot of our midfielders, past and present, were decent at sniffing out a goal.

I reckon he is doing this now. We are seeing Selwood, Caddy and GHS there now. It's just that they don't have the goal sense that Chappy, Gaz and SJ had.

I was worried pre-season when they said they were going to play Bartel in the mids more this year. There's 25 odd goals from last year gone straight away. Jimmy knows where the goals are.

 

[catempire]

Not all his fault though.
I think our recruiters like Stephen Wells need to stop drafting in the best available talent and start drafting in the best talent needed for the team's structures.

We have needed key position defenders for a while now but we continue to skip that one. We have needed a ruckman for a long time but prefer to skip that one too.

I'm not going to complain though as Cockatoo is going to be future champion but at the same time, I certainly wouldn't have had any issues if we targeted a ruck last year.

Bobby, although he is only a rookie and I have only seen a half of a VFL practice match of him, Read is your man.

 

[Willo_]

Bobby, although he is only a rookie and I have only seen a half of a VFL practice match of him, Read is your man.

Yep... there is just something about him isn't there