MMA-UFC So what do you want sport or entertainment.

[MMAPride Scott]

this is going to be a long post be warned, watching this board esp during the time of the Melbourne card its been interesting to see how people see MMA there is the old age question what is it a sport or Entertainment.

Watching wrestelmania at Dallas 100k + in attendance Danas dream he has always talked about doing a show there. WWE puts on a great show but it is exactly that a show all stars can perform and they can put them on a plane and have them ready to go the very next week if they like.

now back to the UFC and MMA there is an old age problem over do you want it to be a sport rules ect or do you need to be be entertained. this is where the MMA audience is torn by rights it shouldnt matter how a fighter wins a fight, whether it be a decsion , ko or a sub. But how many times does someone get leapfrogged because they fight exciting, or they sell more PPV's. dont even get started on intrim titles, divisions being held ransom over egos and $$$$$$$. thats the entertainment side of things.

I guess the other prob you have is UFC wanting it to be a sport but when it suits them want it to be full on entertainment .

me I would love for it to be a simple sport where someone like Magny that has a streak going would get preference over someone with a loss. I have no problems seeing the flyweights being the only title fight on a PPV. and dont give a monkeys what Connor thinks he is, pick a divsion and stick to it. in the sport world Connor may only be getting a title shot at 145 right now because he would of been behind a list of about 5 fighters after his siver fight.

 

[Ry009]

I don't think the argument is sports vs entertainment because the sport itself has become more refined over time, and the pre match trash talking is and will always be a staple of selling combat sport PPVs.

I think what you're trying to say is that should $ be the driving factor for the promotion at the risk of integrity to the sport.

I'm a Conor and Ronda fan, but they are obviously the golden kids of UFC and have been promoted to the moon and back at the expense of a lot of good talent they still have on the roster.

If you only decide to promote a select few then you go back to the problem with boxing. I probably wouldn't be able to rate who is decent or not if I never visited this board to begin with. All of you are a very knowledgable bunch of lads

Diaz vs McGregor was fine as a one off due to the circumstances, but I think everyone is in agreement that a rematch for no belt on the exact same card makes a mockery of the sport they've done well to this point refine and legitimise.

If they just promote the entire roster when they deserve it, they wouldn't have as hard a time promoting cards. They only have eyes for 200 and then the first NY card later this year. I think a lot of decision now are being made to bank some big matches for that card too which is a joke.

It's a bit like the AFL sadly where $$$ at the top end is more important than building a more robust all round competition.

Oh and WWE did not put a good show on in Dallas by the way

 

[phantom13]

I have no issue with it being entertainment but not at the expense of the legitimacy of aspects of the sport.

I discussed this elsewhere but the titles have to be the pinnacle and this should be done by title fights being the prize money fights. Diaz v McGregor headlining cards over title fights is wrong, cop it for 196 because of the circumstances but doing it again for 200 is unforgiveable to me.

Also think PvZ doing Dancing With The Stars is not on, wouldnt see an up and coming footballer or basketballer doing it, but i know im on my own here.

UFC will always have to blend the sport/entertainment lines but just recently i feel like they have jumped the shark and its grating on me.

 

[Gigantic]

In a perfect world for me, we would have an actual ranking system that would be able to determine your place in the division. I recall Demian Maia saying something very similar in his last post-fight interview. However we don't live in that perfect world and the nature of MMA simply doesn't allow for a way to actually determine that, but I wish it did. I've always preferred relevant fights over money fights.

 

[MMAPride Scott]

I have no issue with it being entertainment but not at the expense of the legitimacy of aspects of the sport.

I discussed this elsewhere but the titles have to be the pinnacle and this should be done by title fights being the prize money fights. Diaz v McGregor headlining cards over title fights is wrong, cop it for 196 because of the circumstances but doing it again for 200 is unforgiveable to me.

Also think PvZ doing Dancing With The Stars is not on, wouldnt see an up and coming footballer or basketballer doing it, but i know im on my own here.

UFC will always have to blend the sport/entertainment lines but just recently i feel like they have jumped the shark and its grating on me.

its when you see things like this fighter get a shot at a title because he is more exciting, IMO dec, ko or sub no should be no differance a win is a win. but its the UFC and dana that want to push the sport when it suits them then offers a TUF series with a title shot thats f**ked man. i wouldnt be so against it if was like a comeback with seasoned vets but just tuf contestants dam.

I undertand they need to make money and I understand the crowds mind look at our board and the lead up to the melbourne Card

 

[Ry009]

its when you see things like this fighter get a shot at a title because he is more exciting, IMO dec, ko or sub no should be no differance a win is a win. but its the UFC and dana that want to push the sport when it suits them then offers a TUF series with a title shot thats f**ked man. i wouldnt be so against it if was like a comeback with seasoned vets but just tuf contestants dam.

I undertand they need to make money and I understand the crowds mind look at our board and the lead up to the melbourne Card

I'm a "ooooh shiny" type a guy, but I find the proper in clinch fights just as entertaining and probably more absorbing than the open striking type fights, that's what makes MMA good now is the variety that you'll never get in boxing.

The biggest name in boxing in the last 10 years is a guy who beat his opponents by running circles in the ring 90% of the fight, but he's made the most money out of it.

Problem is, the Banana Fritter Bros and Dana just see the $ and I don't think it's going to change soon.

Hopefully Bellator refocus soon and build a more legitimate brand than they have in recent years.

 

[Ry009]

Also think PvZ doing Dancing With The Stars is not on, wouldnt see an up and coming footballer or basketballer doing it, but i know im on my own here.

I don't think fighters should be restricted from doing stuff but I can see where you're coming from and agree with you in that the notoriety from DWTS will probably factor in her next fight which will be a joke.

She made a good showing in her last match, but I would have thought it was a wake up call as she was still a fair way off as 9 times out of 10, Namajunas would beat her IMO.

Should be training 24/7 instead of doing that garbage.

 

[Oaktree]

The UFC have done a decent job in producing a high volume of shows with their PPV / Fight Night split which in turn allows the capability to produce more big names in their organisation.

The problem in managing the top end I guess is the balance of focusing on a select few 'star' fighters along with balancing the contenders and giving title shots.

The problem with the UFC is that they sell the concept of entertainment over the fighting which is where guys like Conor can exploit the system to his advantage.

Guys who are quieter and prefer to do the talking in the cage therefore have less marketability unless they do highlight reel stoppages.

The whole bonus incentive scheme (KO of the night, etc) could be scrapped where the funds are distributed to fighters across the whole fight card.

I always think it is BS when someone who is headlining a card and winning hundreds of thousands already gets an extra 50 or 100k for their knockout or win.

Plus the ranking system needs to be treated more seriously for the sport to be taken more as a sport than entertainment.

 

[Guy Threepwood]

She made a good showing in her last match, but I would have thought it was a wake up call as she was still a fair way off as 9 times out of 10, Namajunas would beat her IMO.

Only 9? I think closer to 11 times out of 10 personally. Rose was a different class.

 

[Magnum]

A bit of both, but like Phantom, not at the expense of the sport.

The fact is the UFC's model (which has been great for MMA to get to this point), is now putting severe limitations on its growth as an "actual sport" - as I predicted a long time ago.

Truthfully, an independent association for pro fighters should be established that ALL pro orgs must work through - like the ATP is for tennis - if MMA is to ever properly become a worldwide sport. The UFC can't horde all the fighters and use them as their play things for the sole purpose of making money (which is basically what they do). They give the UFC a facade of legitimacy, but in the end, the long term strategy is, and always has been to make money. Entertainment and any benefits of MMA are more or less byproducts of the main goal.

In any case, an independent pro-fighters association, worldwide alignment to minimum conditions set up by the association, as well as INDEPENDENT tracking and setting of rankings is essential.

On top of this, fighters must be free agents, like tennis players are, to work through the association. The only stipulation I would have is that champions must defend or forfeit their belt so are immediately 'on the hook' top defend it. If MMA globally is to be a true sport, there should be no reason a fighter cannot fight any other fighter (of similar rank, but not necessarily) in an effort to improve their rank (or make money). Just as tennis players are not prohibited from entering any tournament to keep up their rankings, so should fighters. As fighters move up the rankings, individual orgs would grant title shots to fighters who have earned it - either inside or outside the org, and through the association.

Then orgs would have to put the money up, attract the big names and ranks and a more competitive and 'worldwide' framework would materialise. It keeps everyone honest - fighters and orgs. And give huge freedom and flexibility to fighters in pursuing their careers. Orgs could take a cut from sponsorship, as it was

The UFC would still be the big dog, and attract the biggest names as it can offer the biggest purses. Higher points would be allocated for those fights, and they would need to keep 'lifting their game' to remain on top, attract the best fighters such that they can sell PPV. But smaller players could also enter the market if fighters aren't locked behind their contracts - which is a good thing.

This would be my ideal scenario - obviously MMA couldn't do this maybe even 5 years ago, but I think now the global scene is mature enough for this to happen.

If the UFC is indeed up for sale and is bought by another company, then perhaps it will provide a big enough shake up to see this kind of shift, who knows.

Sorry for the long post, in the end, entertainment and variety are the main things I like about MMA. I'd like to see lots of top orgs put on great shows, attract top fighters and have fighters be able to fight anywhere they please (different rulesets and so on being possible - like grass court, clay court, etc), but have a worldwide governing body ensure everything is legit

 

[Ry009]

Yeah bang on.

Funny that Dana doesn't rule out or put down the idea of MMA in the Olympics, but by the same token refers to the UFC as a business.

The Banana Fritters Bros and Dana have done a tremendous job to make UFC a commercial success, but MMA has gotten to the stage where it needs to take the next step and evolve.

It's been refined from its early beginnings but it definitely needs to be regulated a bit more with rankings/qualifications/title shots so there's a lot less amaguity.

It's a shame that a rematch that should have been left as a 'fun fight' has taken the gloss off a lot of great cards that's have occurred in this part of the year and into 200.