Opinion Something else happened.

[raffrox]

Oh look, an I was right, you were wrong post, just one game later.

My OP is about the clear evidence that our game plan is changing/has changed, and that being the major criticism of the coach, one game or more is not overly relevant. Even the GCSs game reveals a different game plan from what we have used in the past under Lyon.

I'd take from your OP that the club like it's supporters settle for mediocrity too often. If we think we achieved anything of great note last week then we're in trouble. Gold Coast will be the worst team by a fair margin this year and if they had kicked straight then they would have embarrassed us. They had 21 more inside 50's and 8 more scoring shots.

I'd want to see a 8 to 10 game streak where we don't necessarily win every game but where we don't fall back to old behaviours.

After today, that streak is back to zero.

 

[derPy]

Gold coast won the game at the ground level and one of the factors was that we were too tall. I was shut down by many posters here when i said we were too tall, and qld is slippery. The amt of dropped marks was a clear indication of the slipperiness they swarmed us with their ground level work. Poor team selection and obviously very poor effort from all players and coaches.
Team essentially the same as last year, with hogan and lobb in and no lachie neale - no1 else to get the hard ball

 

[theGav56]

I'd take from your OP that the club like it's supporters settle for mediocrity too often.

This is one of the odd attitudes that recurs on this board. At the very least our club has undergone massive changes over the last few years, and you don't do that in pursuit of mediocrity. Indeed it is an indicator of the opposite.

 

[raffrox]

This is one of the odd attitudes that recurs on this board. At the very least our club has undergone massive changes over the last few years, and you don't do that in pursuit of mediocrity. Indeed it is an indicator of the opposite.

So just changing stuff is a sign of not accepting mediocrity?

Gees your standards are low.

It's the outcome from those changes where the rubber meets the road and results have been mediocre at best.

I'm still not convinced that we're not just spinning our tires.

 

[trentjac]

I'd take from your OP that the club like it's supporters settle for mediocrity too often. If we think we achieved anything of great note last week then we're in trouble. Gold Coast will be the worst team by a fair margin this year and if they had kicked straight then they would have embarrassed us. They had 21 more inside 50's and 8 more scoring shots.

I'd want to see a 8 to 10 game streak where we don't necessarily win every game but where we don't fall back to old behaviours.

After today, that streak is back to zero.

I agree Raffox.....
I want to see a streak of games where we take the game on (attacking) win or lose. This defensive game plan sucks a fat one. We are identical to Sydney when we play defensive. Mark the ball, wait for forwards to stream forward whilst faster team defenses run back and out position us. When we play full out attacking, we are so enjoyable to watch. I would prefer to kick 100 and lose by 20, than kick 60 and lose by 3

 

[theGav56]

So just changing stuff is a sign of not accepting mediocrity?

Gees your standards are low.

It's the outcome from those changes where the rubber meets the road and results have been mediocre at best.

I'm still not convinced that we're not just spinning our tires.

Quite happy for you outline how to not accept mediocrity without changing things. Innovative concept.

 

[beetz]

This is almost rock bottom. Lucky to have only gotten away with a 3 point loss. GC are a terrible team and we just got rolled by them. I don’t know where the problem is exactly because I rate our list. Some good players there. Coaching, admin, culture?!

 

[raffrox]

Quite happy for you outline how to not accept mediocrity without changing things. Innovative concept.

Innovative? So you always believe something changing equals something good is happening?

Good grief.

I already stated my opinion. It's the outcome of any change that determines what matters. What does truly matter to this club? To me just being ok and not the worst has been important for too long.

 

[Midnite65]

This is almost rock bottom. Lucky to have only gotten away with a 3 point loss. GC are a terrible team and we just got rolled by them. I don’t know where the problem is exactly because I rate our list. Some good players there. Coaching, admin, culture?!

Compared to the days of Damien Drum and 2 win seasons? We have had 1 win and 1 loss, it is the end of Round 2 and it is almost rock bottom??????? Lets at least see our record at the half way mark.

 

[Cesoir]

Compared to the days of Damien Drum and 2 win seasons? We have had 1 win and 1 loss, it is the end of Round 2 and it is almost rock bottom??????? Lets at least see our record at the half way mark.

Agree with this, we are sitting in 6th position and the sky is not falling. Yet...

We really need to turn this around quickly for the Saints game and making wholesale changes is not the answer. Just need to review, learn from this and smash next week.

 

[Purple Jesus]

Innovative? So you always believe something changing equals something good is happening?

Good grief.

I already stated my opinion. It's the outcome of any change that determines what matters. What does truly matter to this club? To me just being ok and not the worst has been important for too long.

You can’t expect things to be different if you change nothing, is his point. Seems to have gone over your head in pursuit of that agenda.

 

[FreoRicci]

Compared to the days of Damien Drum and 2 win seasons? We have had 1 win and 1 loss, it is the end of Round 2 and it is almost rock bottom??????? Lets at least see our record at the half way mark.

Holy god. Those days..
Ross is smart, but this change to defensive mindset. No, this squad, team ain’t built for that. Not at all. Give them the attacking plan, make sure the defence is locked and away we go.
St Kilda won’t be easy beats. They have fast runners and actually will damage us if we go defensive.

 

[Snuffaluphagus]

Agree with this, we are sitting in 6th position and the sky is not falling. Yet...

We really need to turn this around quickly for the Saints game and making wholesale changes is not the answer. Just need to review, learn from this and smash next week.

Nup, I want Ross gone this week and we need to drop Cerra, Brayshaw, Darcy, Schultz, Banfield, Wilson, Lobb and Hughes. Who for you ask, I dont care as long as I feel better about myself and we play someone new like North so I can watch him for 15 games before deciding he's a spud and needs to go back to Peel

 

[raffrox]

You can’t expect things to be different if you change nothing, is his point. Seems to have gone over your head in pursuit of that agenda.

But changing something can still mean you've done nothing.

You've clearly not been around many different companies or organisations implementing change or ever voted in a state or federal election if you can't understand that concept.

You don't get a gold star for just doing new stuff. You are judged on the outcome of the change. Why is that hard to understand? I'm judging Ross on this and he hasn't convinced me.

 

[Freo88]

Oh boy. This thread hasn't aged well.

 

[Taylor]

Losing to gold coast took a lot of the shine off the big win first round.

Looks as though we have great games when our stars play well and poor games when our guns don't fire. Go figure huh.

 

[Alfonz]

This is one of the odd attitudes that recurs on this board. At the very least our club has undergone massive changes over the last few years, and you don't do that in pursuit of mediocrity. Indeed it is an indicator of the opposite.

Not really. The route the club has gone down the last few years is the definition of accepting mediocrity. Peddling a line to supporters at all opportunities that we are rebuilding and losing is OK. It is a pathetic attitude. What the club has done over the last few years has set us on a path to be the next Carlton/Melbourne/Saints.

 

[theGav56]

Not really. The route the club has gone down the last few years is the definition of accepting mediocrity. Peddling a line to supporters at all opportunities that we are rebuilding and losing is OK. It is a pathetic attitude. What the club has done over the last few years has set us on a path to be the next Carlton/Melbourne/Saints.

That is a danger with rebuilding. They don't always work in one direction. A key player can leave and provide a setback, and hopefully an opportunity. They can fail completely. I think the rebuild is the right direction, and I think it is on track for the 2020 deadline the club/coach nominated. If not, they get held to account, but seems a reasonable time-frame.

There are significant differences between how we have gone about it and how those clubs have which give me some optimism. Of particular relevance to this thread is that all of those clubs butchered and bungled their way through the coaching leadership situation. Pretty happy to have an established coach in place for our rebuild, with his time-frame perfect for transition to a new coach if things are not progressing.

Over on the autopsy thread posters are busy having a crack at Darcy, Cerra and Brayshaw. Really disgraceful, uninformed posting. In reality it is amusing having warriors coming on here all hairy chested talking about not accepting mediocrity and the lack of change at the club, while simultaneously taking the cane to the emerging players. Many double up with castigating the older players who have been retained to help them transition. I know for fans sport can be a release for the frustrations of daily life, but there is a real inability to see things in any longer term context.

 

[raffrox]

I can't say we agree on a whole heap theGav56 but I completely agree about not hammering developing players for not having the goods yet.

 

[salim malik]

Every losing team supporter that tries to put the loss into context and find some positive from the loss is hit with the accepting mediocrity insult or drinking cool aid which by the way is a reference to a cyanide laden mixture that killed 900 odd people including children.
There is a not all good and not all bad philosophy that I like and to keep me enjoying my days following my team I will stick with that and forget my mediocrity and drinking my beer instead of the cool aid.

 

[wayToGo_]

Every losing team supporter that tries to put the loss into context and find some positive from the loss is hit with the accepting mediocrity insult or drinking cool aid which by the way is a reference to a cyanide laden mixture that killed 900 odd people including children.
There is a not all good and not all bad philosophy that I like and to keep me enjoying my days following my team I will stick with that and forget my mediocrity and drinking my beer instead of the cool aid.

Such a kool beer drinker The last thing you should being doing after a loss as a supporter is supporting

 

[Kenyan]

Losing to gold coast took a lot of the shine off the big win first round.

Looks as though we have great games when our stars play well and poor games when our guns don't fire. Go figure huh.

You better get used to it. The sh## will hit the fan if Fyfe gets injured. Midfield depth is the big issue particularly after losing Lachie Neale. Cerra, Brayshaw 2 or 3 years away from being genuine midfielders. Lots of other small young midfielders but the jury is out on them. Blakey will have impact when he returns - Mundy been great player but not a genuine A grade mid these days. Conca not a midfielder, Sunny gun but better up forward.

 

[Joao]

Gold coast won the game at the ground level and one of the factors was that we were too tall. I was shut down by many posters here when i said we were too tall, and qld is slippery. The amt of dropped marks was a clear indication of the slipperiness they swarmed us with their ground level work. Poor team selection and obviously very poor effort from all players and coaches.
Team essentially the same as last year, with hogan and lobb in and no lachie neale - no1 else to get the hard ball

Was at the ground and can confirm that conditions were perfect (well maybe it was a little warm). It definitely wasn't slippery. No wind either.

You'll have to look elsewhere for reasons why we dropped marks.

 

[tonygeeks]

That is a danger with rebuilding. They don't always work in one direction. A key player can leave and provide a setback, and hopefully an opportunity. They can fail completely. I think the rebuild is the right direction, and I think it is on track for the 2020 deadline the club/coach nominated. If not, they get held to account, but seems a reasonable time-frame.

There are significant differences between how we have gone about it and how those clubs have which give me some optimism. Of particular relevance to this thread is that all of those clubs butchered and bungled their way through the coaching leadership situation. Pretty happy to have an established coach in place for our rebuild, with his time-frame perfect for transition to a new coach if things are not progressing.

Over on the autopsy thread posters are busy having a crack at Darcy, Cerra and Brayshaw. Really disgraceful, uninformed posting. In reality it is amusing having warriors coming on here all hairy chested talking about not accepting mediocrity and the lack of change at the club, while simultaneously taking the cane to the emerging players. Many double up with castigating the older players who have been retained to help them transition. I know for fans sport can be a release for the frustrations of daily life, but there is a real inability to see things in any longer term context.

Err .... weren't you trying to organise a street parade down the cappuccino strip for Rosco after he CLEARLY demonstrated his new attacking game plan last week in this very thread ?

Tad hypocritical there I think

The accepting mediocrity bit is mostly 25 of seeing the same old excuses I would have thought , it was funny last week when the ball cupper's were gleefully pointing out the Sydney board pulling out the same attacks on Longmire as the brick throwers were using on Lyon as some sort of vindication of how stupid we all are

Longmire who has made the finals every year he's been in charge and was pretty stiff to get rolled in a granny 3 yrs ago is every chance to get necked before Lyon

Let that roll around in your head for a minute


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[Dirty_banchez]

I can't say we agree on a whole heap theGav56 but I completely agree about not hammering developing players for not having the goods yet.

The loss against GC should be laid at the feet of the leadership group and Ross but more so the leadership group. Players didn't step up, got complacent and didn't show leadership in the moments that mattered.

You better get used to it. The sh## will hit the fan if Fyfe gets injured. Midfield depth is the big issue particularly after losing Lachie Neale. Cerra, Brayshaw 2 or 3 years away from being genuine midfielders. Lots of other small young midfielders but the jury is out on them. Blakey will have impact when he returns - Mundy been great player but not a genuine A grade mid these days. Conca not a midfielder, Sunny gun but better up forward.

Coaches need to find a solution - easier said than done but that is what their jobs entail.