Special assistance for Saints

[Demonic Ascent]

What would help bottom clubs is something closer to true free agency. This is why NRL clubs are up and down every year and the top 8 is tight. An extra draft pick, aside from hurting other clubs, probably isn't going to do much as so many draftees end up not doing much.

Increase rookie contracts to 2+1+1
Reduce the qualifying period for FA to 4 years
Lower the salary cap floor

 

[Demonic Ascent]

Make excuses for your club all you like, facts are:

1) They paid at least $2m for you coach, a luxury which a club like the Saints dont have which is preventing from Alan Richardson at the Saints from moving on and something similar.

2) You couldnt be trusted to run an administration properly so the AFL stepped in. The AFL made decisions on how to run your club. To deny that is a stupid assertion.

3) Pick 3 for Frawley is widely known to be a backdoor way to grant further concessions. You also received a PP a few yeara before the Frawley pick.

You need to stop being so defensive and sensitive.

Your club is in a great place now and thats something to celebrate.

Just don't get on your high horse about other clubs gettiing help when Melbourne have received just as many handouts as anyone.

With regards to your opinions about Melbourne, they're all incorrect.

As far as Carlton goes I don't mind them receiving assistance - just not a PP. They already have plenty of young talent on the list an extra pick won't do anything for them.

 

[bergholt]

And Saints paid pick 5 for Carlisle so pick 3 for Frawley isn't exorbitant.

Not quite!

 

[Juddernaut08]

With regards to your opinions about Melbourne, they're all incorrect.

As far as Carlton goes I don't mind them receiving assistance - just not a PP. They already have plenty of young talent on the list an extra pick won't do anything for them.

Time to read a newspaper (or even a simple google). Your ignorance doesn't mean it didn't happen.

 

[Demonic Ascent]

Time to read a newspaper (or even a simple google). Your ignorance doesn't mean it didn't happen.

You continue to assert subjective opinion as fact without offering any evidence in support. If you're not willing to provide something tangible to back up your wilfully ignorant assertions you may as well stop posting on the subject as you're making yourself look a fool.

 

[Juddernaut08]

You continue to assert subjective opinion as fact without offering any evidence in support. If you're not willing to provide something tangible to back up your wilfully ignorant assertions you may as well stop posting on the subject as you're making yourself look a fool.

LOL you gave a blanket statement "all those things are wrong". You are the one who looks like an ignorant fool.

Even your fellow Demons supporters admit you received assistance in money, picks and management appointments. Perhaps try reading back before spouting off. You'll never improve or learn that way.

Try listening when people teach you things.

 

[Demonic Ascent]

LOL you gave a blanket statement "all those things are wrong". You are the one who looks like an ignorant fool.

Even your fellow Demons supporters admit you received assistance in money, picks and management appointments. Perhaps try reading back before spouting off. You'll never improve or learn that way.

Try listening when people teach you things.

We didn't receive any assistance in picks.
We received some additional financial assistance to restructure our FD - which is comparable to what some clubs get in additional assistance year on year. We also get screwed with fixtures year on year while some other underperforming clubs get gifted prime time games even though they've been irrelevant for 20 years. This impacts finances so while we got a one off special assistance grant clubs like Carlton get assistance year on year through financially beneficial fixtures.

 

[Juddernaut08]

We didn't receive any assistance in picks.
We received some additional financial assistance to restructure our FD - which is comparable to what some clubs get in additional assistance year on year. We also get screwed with fixtures year on year while some other underperforming clubs get gifted prime time games even though they've been irrelevant for 20 years. This impacts finances so while we got a one off special assistance grant clubs like Carlton get assistance year on year through financially beneficial fixtures.

Let's agree to disagree on Frawley - many believe the pick 3 was a backdoor way of giving you guys assistance, but if you want to disagree there's no way of proving either view for certain.

However, let's not forget Tom Scully was a PP you received, which still has massive benefits for your club today.

In: 2011-12: Melbourne loses Tom Scully to GWS under expansion poaching. Melbourne receives a future first round pick after your own pick (2012 pick 3) and a future mid-first round pick (2012 pick 14). In 2012, Melbourne traded both these picks to GWS for Mini-draft pick 2 (Jesse Hogan), Dom Barry and pick 20. Melbourne then traded picks 20 and 47 for Chris Dawes and pick 61. Essentially, Melbourne traded Tom Scully for Jesse Hogan and Chris Dawes.

http://demonland.com/forums/topic/38320-melbournes-compensation-picks/

The one-off assistance of $2M+ is assistance. Make all the excuses and conspiracy theorists about fixturing all you want, this is assistance, clear as day. You denying it is just desperate.

The money was likely tied to "getting your house in order" which is why the AFL stepped in to oversee your club appointments.

 

[Demonic Ascent]

Let's agree to disagree on Frawley - many believe the pick 3 was a backdoor way of giving you guys assistance, but if you want to disagree there's no way of proving either view for certain.

However, let's not forget Tom Scully was a PP you received, which still has massive benefits for your club today.

In: 2011-12: Melbourne loses Tom Scully to GWS under expansion poaching. Melbourne receives a future first round pick after your own pick (2012 pick 3) and a future mid-first round pick (2012 pick 14). In 2012, Melbourne traded both these picks to GWS for Mini-draft pick 2 (Jesse Hogan), Dom Barry and pick 20. Melbourne then traded picks 20 and 47 for Chris Dawes and pick 61. Essentially, Melbourne traded Tom Scully for Jesse Hogan and Chris Dawes.

http://demonland.com/forums/topic/38320-melbournes-compensation-picks/

The one-off assistance of $2M+ is assistance. Make all the excuses and conspiracy theorists about fixturing all you want, this is assistance, clear as day. You denying it is just desperate.

The money was likely tied to "getting your house in order" which is why the AFL stepped in to oversee your club appointments.

Lol Carlton getting gifted financially beneficial fixturing is not a "conspiracy" it's fact. How many prime time games this year? How many times over the last decade have they had home games against Essendon, Collingwood and Richmond?

Priority picks - yeah we got one in 2009 how many gave Carlton had?

AFL also refuse to investigate Carlton over tanking despite on of their coaches at the time admitting they were doing so. Having a former Carlton captain as head of the Commission had nothing to do with it though

Keep posting, your making yourself look extremely ignorant.

 

[Marc_Remillard]

Let's agree to disagree on Frawley - many believe the pick 3 was a backdoor way of giving you guys assistance, but if you want to disagree there's no way of proving either view for certain.

However, let's not forget Tom Scully was a PP you received, which still has massive benefits for your club today.

In: 2011-12: Melbourne loses Tom Scully to GWS under expansion poaching. Melbourne receives a future first round pick after your own pick (2012 pick 3) and a future mid-first round pick (2012 pick 14). In 2012, Melbourne traded both these picks to GWS for Mini-draft pick 2 (Jesse Hogan), Dom Barry and pick 20. Melbourne then traded picks 20 and 47 for Chris Dawes and pick 61. Essentially, Melbourne traded Tom Scully for Jesse Hogan and Chris Dawes.

http://demonland.com/forums/topic/38320-melbournes-compensation-picks/

The one-off assistance of $2M+ is assistance. Make all the excuses and conspiracy theorists about fixturing all you want, this is assistance, clear as day. You denying it is just desperate.

The money was likely tied to "getting your house in order" which is why the AFL stepped in to oversee your club appointments.

Actually Trengove would have been the extra pick. Scully was always going to go first, Trengove was the bonus.

I know you'll do anything to not accept this because it won't suit your argument

 

[Juddernaut08]

Actually Trengove would have been the extra pick. Scully was always going to go first, Trengove was the bonus.

I know you'll do anything to not accept this because it won't suit your argument

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tom_Scully

Throughout 2009, Scully was touted as a potential and likely number one draft pick for the AFL Draft.[3] In the draft, the Melbourne Football Club had both the No. 1 and 2 picks available to it, and used the No. 1 pick (a priority draft pick) to recruit Scully. Scully was presented with the number 31 jersey made famous by club and league legend Ron Barassi.[6]

 

[Juddernaut08]

Lol Carlton getting gifted financially beneficial fixturing is not a "conspiracy" it's fact. How many prime time games this year? How many times over the last decade have they had home games against Essendon, Collingwood and Richmond?

Priority picks - yeah we got one in 2009 how many gave Carlton had?

AFL also refuse to investigate Carlton over tanking despite on of their coaches at the time admitting they were doing so. Having a former Carlton captain as head of the Commission had nothing to do with it though

Keep posting, your making yourself look extremely ignorant.

I'm not denying Carlton has received assistance - I freely admit we have.

I actually have no problem with Melbourne receiving the assistance they received.

I'm calling out the hypocrites (not necessarily you, but your Demonic brethren) who now, after receiving assistance, are screaming blue murder at the Saints, Gold Coast and Blues receiving (proposed) assistance this year.

Same goes with the Hawks and Bris fans who have been doing the same, but just in much less number (that I've seen anyway).

 

[ShriekingShack]

Socialism manifesting itself in the AFL

 

[Juddernaut08]

Socialism manifesting itself in the AFL

Why don't you turn down your Gaff compensation then?

 

[Marc_Remillard]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tom_Scully

Throughout 2009, Scully was touted as a potential and likely number one draft pick for the AFL Draft.[3] In the draft, the Melbourne Football Club had both the No. 1 and 2 picks available to it, and used the No. 1 pick (a priority draft pick) to recruit Scully. Scully was presented with the number 31 jersey made famous by club and league legend Ron Barassi.[6]

Is it really that hard for you to understand? Seriously?

Let me put it another way, if Melbourne didn't get a PP and only had the chance to get one of Scully or Trengove which one would they have picked back then?

I'll give you a couple of minutes to work it out

 

[ShriekingShack]

Why don't you turn down your Gaff compensation then?

Of course a Carlton fan will defend it. I've lost count of how often you've been propped up by others who have made smart business decisions.

 

[Juddernaut08]

Is it really that hard for you to understand? Seriously?

Let me put it another way, if Melbourne didn't get a PP and only had the chance to get one of Scully or Trengove which one would they have picked back then?

I'll give you a couple of minutes to work it out

Facts are facts: Tom Scully was chosen using a priority pick. The conjecture that you would have likely picked him if you hadn't received a pick doesn't change this fact.

Even in denial when the facts are presented to you.

oh my!

 

[Juddernaut08]

Of course a Carlton fan will defend it. I've lost count of how often you've been propped up by others who have made smart business decisions.

Don't blame us for your basic math ability. Seek help...I won't call you a socialist.

 

[Demonic Ascent]

I'm not denying Carlton has received assistance - I freely admit we have.

I actually have no problem with Melbourne receiving the assistance they received.

I'm calling out the hypocrites (not necessarily you, but your Demonic brethren) who now, after receiving assistance, are screaming blue murder at the Saints, Gold Coast and Blues receiving (proposed) assistance this year.

Same goes with the Hawks and Bris fans who have been doing the same, but just in much less number (that I've seen anyway).

I just don't see how an extra pick will help fix the Blues in the short term and I don't think the Saints need it. If Carlton got an end of round 1 PP I wouldn't care but an extra top 5 pick is too much. Saints need help off field which the AFL gas given them with the move back to Moorabbin.

Gold coast need extra picks, they've been bleeding players - however this is dependent on the academy players coming through. What they need more than anything else is to invest in their academies and FD.

 

[Juddernaut08]

I just don't see how an extra pick will help fix the Blues in the short term and I don't think the Saints need it. If Carlton got an end of round 1 PP I wouldn't care but an extra top 5 pick is too much. Saints need help off field which the AFL gas given them with the move back to Moorabbin.

Gold coast need extra picks, they've been bleeding players - however this is dependent on the academy players coming through. What they need more than anything else is to invest in their academies and FD.

Fair enough if you can't see how it changes things in the short term - I don't think it does that much either by itself.

It does give flexibility though.

E.g:

We could trade it.
We could use picks 1 and 3 on Lukousius and Walsh and then have freedom to use our other picks to acquire quality talent like Setterfield.

Just gives flexibility.

 

[Don Won]

In the interest of equity, every team should get an additional priority pick in the order they finish the 2018 season. This priority pick should take place immediately after the first round. To remove any stigma of ‘priority pick’ let’s name this set of picks ‘the second round’

 

[Juddernaut08]

In the interest of equity, every team should get an additional priority pick in the order they finish the 2018 season. This priority pick should take place immediately after the first round. To remove any stigma of ‘priority pick’ let’s name this set of picks ‘the second round’

That's a good attempt at humour from you.

 

[bergholt]

Of course a Carlton fan will defend it. I've lost count of how often you've been propped up by others who have made smart business decisions.

AFL clubs aren't businesses. They're arms of the AFL. None of them could stand on their own two feet because who would they play against? How would they sell their TV rights individually? They all get "propped up" varying amounts by rights money etc.

 

[Darksidepoints]

While the Saints had a dog of a year, they have been more than competitive in the years prior.

It would be completely dependent on what 'assistance' they got.

One bad year shouldn't amount to a massive amount of support.

 

[Don Won]

That's a good attempt at humour from you.

Yeah, satire is my thing.