St Kilda - time to get your house in order

[tigerwill]

Interesting comparing some of the money the afl gives to respective clubs.
Some could also possibly be money for club/ training facility upgrades. That can skew the totals given.

I find it ironic that Gill can single out the saints when there's a few clubs in a similar position financially, or clubs that have been and got out of it with afl assistance.

 

[tigerwill]

Thanks for the previous replies.

 

[Kwality]

Richmond are living proof you can turn a serial basket case around.
There's still hope for us.

Optimistic to believe you have a management that approaches the Tiges, e.g the caravan is still on the move racking up the $costs, expecting/selling the new venue is the game changer (reusing the Seaford propaganda).

 

[Kwality]

http://s.afl.com.au/staticfile/AFL Tenant/AFL/Files/Images/compressed_2016-AFL-Annual-Report (1).pdf

Page 73 breaks it down similarly for all clubs.

Plus, we do know why they give out higher amounts to certain clubs, it’s to prop them up, plain and simple.

There is a desire to keep clubs
In the black.

 

[Damon_3388]

Need to get their Linen House in order, amirite?

Seriously though, I always thought the move to Seaford was kind of bizarre in a practical sense. I don't imagine too many of the players and coaches live near there, so making 80-100km round trips for training and meetings every day is a pretty big a mental and physical drain. Sitting in a car for a couple of hours every day can't be good for an athlete's recovery either.

Paying Scott Watters half a mil to go away can't have helped the financial situation either.

 

[Falchoon]

Need to get their Linen House in order, amirite?

Seriously though, I always thought the move to Seaford was kind of bizarre in a practical sense. I don't imagine too many of the players and coaches live near there, so making 80-100km round trips for training and meetings every day is a pretty big a mental and physical drain. Sitting in a car for a couple of hours every day can't be good for an athlete's recovery either.

Paying Scott Watters half a mil to go away can't have helped the financial situation either.

Not that big of a deal

I'd rather drive from Moorabbin to Seaford daily at 8am than Moorabbin to Punt Rd/Swan St

 

[telsor]

Need to get their Linen House in order, amirite?

Seriously though, I always thought the move to Seaford was kind of bizarre in a practical sense. I don't imagine too many of the players and coaches live near there, so making 80-100km round trips for training and meetings every day is a pretty big a mental and physical drain. Sitting in a car for a couple of hours every day can't be good for an athlete's recovery either.

Paying Scott Watters half a mil to go away can't have helped the financial situation either.

Hawthorn is at Waverley, and soon to be in Dingely...

 

[Ice-Wolf]

Need to get their Linen House in order, amirite?

Seriously though, I always thought the move to Seaford was kind of bizarre in a practical sense. I don't imagine too many of the players and coaches live near there, so making 80-100km round trips for training and meetings every day is a pretty big a mental and physical drain. Sitting in a car for a couple of hours every day can't be good for an athlete's recovery either.

Paying Scott Watters half a mil to go away can't have helped the financial situation either.

It was meant to be at Frankston Oval and then when we couldn't come up with the cash to make that work after it was projected to blow out by about 3 million over original estimates they had to search for another location in Frankston Council. So again it's never having enough cash on hand that has really crippled these initiatives. And we only moved from Moorabbin because we couldn't make the original redevelopment work financially without moving our pokies and the council wanted us to lessen the number of machines (NOTE: we weren't adding any more machines just moving them about 200m)

Funny thing was if we'd waited a few months the Frankston Grand Stand burnt down and we likely would have been able to work something out at Frankston Oval anyway. Really we only needed the playing facilities there as it would have been easy to find office space ect in the Frankston CBD anyway.

 

[Noidenous]

Effectively bankrupt.

You made a 'profit' and have positive assets due to one off items...the government grants for Moorabbin and major AFL backing.

Even with that though, your couldn't pay your debts without the AFL underwriting you....check section 1b of the financial report 'going concern'.
There is also the small matter of the almost $4M you owe to the AFL that they're just not getting around to asking for (trade payables).


Memberships and sponsorships being 'up' and at record levels is part of the problem...even with this, your club is pretty much at the bottom when it comes to revenue (you would be at the bottom if it wasn't for almost $9M in government grants). To get on a similar level to all other clubs, you need to take those record levels and double them! That's how far off the pace you are.

This is exactly what our 'diehard' contingent on the Saints board don't understand.

Can talk about membership all you want, but when you're spending $4m to make $4m and that's supposedly underpinning your ability to improve on field... it's just delusional.

Only way to make a considerable amount of money as an AFL club these days is to a) own your own stadium, or b) bring in so many fans it completely blows out any expenditure/handicap you have to cover as part of your contract/rent.

In a year we could've easily made finals, we had the 5th lowest home attendance average across the league last year, with GWS and the two QLD sides below us. From VIC, only North were lower. We, as a club, have far too many 'superfans' who dribble on and on about whether you're a member or not, then spend every weekend asking for streams to home games and wondering why only 14,000 people have turned up on a Saturday arvo. It's pathetic.

The AFL doesn't give a s**t how many memberships you have, it cares how many arses on seats and rancid pies they sold.

 

[edgie]

Easily made finals? Apart from one game against GWS it was an underachieving year.

 

[Noidenous]

Easily made finals? Apart from one game against GWS it was an underachieving year.

Imagine 5% of those set shot behinds actually being goals.

 

[docko911]

I’ll start believing this BS when St Kilda get a crowd of 14,865 to a home preliminary final.

I’ll also start believing it when clubs from state competitions aren’t getting $100k+ yearly donations from the AFL and the fees involved in AFL resemble those of soccer for junior/youth players.

The list goes on with reasons why club debt is nothing more than a facade by the AFL. How could the AFL abandon any club with over 30,000 members?

 

[StCicatriz]

That's only part of the equation though.

The real question with debts is an organisation's ability to cover it....What is their revenue?, What assets do they have that they could sell if required? etc. (and for an AFL club, how far would the league go to keep you there? Applicable for NSW & QLD clubs)

On these measures, St Kilda really doesn't look good.


There was a thread a few months back about how important this year was for various clubs, which mainly covered flag windows ... I mentioned that St Kilda needed to fire with it's current rebuild because its very existence was on the line...People gave me s**t for it, but it's still true.

i agree with this.

 

[StCicatriz]

i look forward to the day when myself and other saints fans dont have to keep making excuses for our football club

the problem we have had is that every administration for as long as i can remember have made a decent mistake or more that we then have to live with for years, often making it harder for the next administration. we can find excuses and blame someone else but at the end of the day its our own doing.

etihad deal sucked: well we signed it
we lost the money and major presence in tassie: well we turned out back on it
over committed spending post thomas as part of the focus on football direction: well we turfed the administration that was focused on making money
started to draft and trade poorly resulting in the cliff: well we did that, we were more focussed on winning a grand final with the list we had
seaford debacle/move away from moorabbin: yeah nice work archie. again our own doing
lost the next wave of sponsors in the pipeline from the finals years: again we did that, due to off-field behaviour and our inability to not let the media frame a false and defamatory narrative
watters/pelchen debacle: well yeah thats what happens when the CEO and President walk out of the club and quit with no hand over plan. employees still getting paid but no one knows where they are. summers has to come in and effectively rebuild the entire football club from the ground up. dont get me started on the infamous turn dustin martin away story

my fear now is this admin might be complacent. finnis might be too self interested in his own career progression over club interest. my other fear is we may be letting the past dictate the future, for example the need to show coaching stability due to not having a stable history there. which means we sign richo to 2020 without him making finals. all flag winning sides play finals by this point in their rebuild.

 

[StCicatriz]

Pissing contest aside. Imagine being a saints fan. Competitive in 3 grand finals. Should have won a minimum of 2 of the 3.

I get why opposition supporters snipe us. We are an easy target and at the end of the day. Nothing better than empowering your belief in your club by belittling the club you perceive to be weaker.

We need to get to a point where we are no longer the easy target.

 

[BulldogJake]

St Kilda should move their house to New Zealand

 

[Our Game]

Yes it dosent look like St Kilda is going to improve any time soon Then again thats their history over 140 years They seem to be cursed with making the same mistakes over and over.
They only have one flag to their name for a reason but could easily have had 5 or 6 given some of the great teams and champion players they have had over the past 60 years.

 

[edgie]

If only the AFL could gift them a flag or a trade or a coach or a free kick advantage from time to time

Sent from mTalk

 

[mr bagcroft]

Yeah we should fold and distribute members equally to all other Melbourne clubs.
Then erase the clubs 140 year history...
Then rename the suburb.

 

[DERIBERATE]

When there was an even fixture Rich went broke and had to be bailed out.
Like Collingwood.
Hawks had a coupla bad years and nearly merged with Melb.

Many clubs get an AFL lift. Scheduling, double ups, interstates, stadia returns, blockbusters and fixtures.
Some don't. This season should be a good one for us financially as we can finally compete. Same goes for WB and Nth. No excuses for us now.

Cherrypicked. All the VFL clubs were under. Forgetting SOS? Save Our Saints.

 

[tomjoad]

We manage just fine.

Who's your dealer??

 

[Johnny Bananas]

I'm actually amazed that the Saints still exist and never came close to merging, given the long history of futility on-field and incompetent management off-field. It's a real tribute to their long-suffering fans who have stuck by them.

 

[Tasmanian saint]

I'm actually amazed that the Saints still exist and never came close to merging, given the long history of futility on-field and incompetent management off-field. It's a real tribute to their long-suffering fans who have stuck by them.

Ignore this guy people complete troll