Autopsy St Kilda v Sydney Rd 18 2017

[Monika72]

A ruck / forward is one position we need to fill, so agree 100%.

So we keep Marshall, then who of the other 3 ruckmen we let go?

 

[Kilroy]

We simply dont have the cattle.

 

[#gosaintas]

So we keep Marshall, then who of the other 3 ruckmen we let go?

He's a fwd/ruck. The only one on our list.

 

[Monika72]

I agree we keep him but we can't keep 4 ruckmen on our list

 

[AFLOnline]

Billings and Gresh need to learn to get dangerous verse strong opposition. They are our barometers and when they aren't influential it's hard to win games. I'd love to have the ball is Jill's hands more often too.

Dunstan had a really good game.

Only highlight of the game was Jake dropping Buddy like a sack of s**t.

 

[Jade Buddha]

Yes Marshall is definately a fwd/ruck so who is in our best tall forward set up?

Bruce, Members, Marshall would be mine right now and on current form.

Give Paddy time to build in the vfl.

 

[saintbill]

Sydney push teams out wide then set up zones. You can know what to do but it's like corralling cattle, get the dogs to bark at them and they go where you want them too. The only way to play the corridor is to have exceptional skills, when we did use it last night it destroyed us and caused them to score back the other way because we couldn't get it to a player on their own. Sydney don't allow you to get any space t work in and if you run a lead someone pushes back across in your space.

I agree it is not easy to pull the trigger through the middle, particularly when you don't have the skills to necessarily pull it off. However, what is the alternative? Do exactly what Sydney want and go wide and down the line where they have numbers? That effectively guarantees a loss. I would rather lose by 100 trying to pull the trigger, then lose by 40-60 the exact same way we lose to them every time. Just before 3 quarter time we had 22 inside 50's. Wow.....

There were multiple occasions there was space in the middle, the issue is we don't even work to provide an option. We don't have the cattle, but we are poorly coached.

 

[Jade Buddha]

Jimmy looked a little off speed last night, his decision making was a bit off speed as well. I do like the look of him, Sav and Robbo delivering off the half back line though.

Lones had a crack but wasn't really in the game last night, his forward entry straight to a sydney player in the first quarter really set the tone for the night. You just cannot make those kind of mistakes.

Thought our guys really dropped their heads last night. Sydney have picked up the bully team mantra to get themselves out of the whole this year and it's working well - particularly noticable on our younger players that didn't get involved.

 

[nitewalker13]

Just saw this picture on Saints page.

 

[JG22]

As expected really, as is a loss for next week.

Saw these games coming, which will see us well behind the eight ball.

Going to be chasing tail for the rest of the season, will need to win at least 3 of last 4.

 

[StCicatriz]

Seems to be a issue with a lot of our players no confidence Coaching staff need to fix it

There's footage out there of a respected senior player looking at roo and rolling his eyes when Richo was talking to i think the forwards in the rooms at half time in a game earlier this year

 

[StCicatriz]

Based on our current structures, gameplan & list we look like a team that will never reach great heights & be a middle of the road team like lolnorf. Yuck.

Lolnorf still over achieved and made two prelims

I'd say they were pretty well coached for what they had

 

[Yabadoo22]

What stood out the most for me last night was our lacking of forward pressure once the ball hit the deck. Billings plays the role
Of a small forward but he is virtually just as useless as a ruckman when the ball hits the ground, he looks slow, hardly chases and puts on no pressure. Gresh for a quick small man is much the same. Lonie looks like he tries the hardest of the 3 but can never get close to tackling a bloke and when he does he just gets pushed off by the ball carier anyway. I'm happy for dunstan, looked like he really gave his all last night and worked his ass off. Our midfield is to slow with dunstan, Steele, ross and Stevens, I don't Think we can play all 4.

 

[Mikka84]

View attachment 395225

#diversity

 

[Jade Buddha]

For mine Steele was the biggest disappointment in the midfield. Can tackle but isn't a good user of the ball in fact looks fumbly and doesn't hit team mates. Just seems to pass or knock it out in a very rushed haphazard way.

 

[mr bagcroft]

No culture. No idea. Amateur admin.
Same old story. Par for the course. On we sail.

 

[VDS66]

So we keep Marshall, then who of the other 3 ruckmen we let go?

Good question. Hickey will want opportunity so may move on. Also if we don't think he is up to it, he will be moved on.

You can look at Holmes as a pure emergency back up.

Ideally you keep Billy and Tom. Let Tom work as a ruck forward at Sandy and see how he goes?

 

[Diehard Saint]

For mine Steele was the biggest disappointment in the midfield. Can tackle but isn't a good user of the ball in fact looks fumbly and doesn't hit team mates. Just seems to pass or knock it out in a very rushed haphazard way.

Give him a rest for a couple of weeks. Didn't have a full pre season and is maybe feeling it. As it is I don't think we should be playing Dunstan, Steele, Stevens and Ross together and Dunstan took another step forward last night I thought.

 

[druzyp]

Think one of the problems is that the boys arent reading the opposition handballs properly (during their slingshots)... especially from their backline. Had the same problem against the bombers last week. They get cooked applying constant pressure in the wrong places.

But the main reason we're losing is because we're not scoring. Its just too easy for opposition to read our ball movement because we're doing cookie cutter predictable passes/kicks down the boundary. That goes for our predictable handballing aswell...

 

[The_Steadier]

And what about against the average teams like Essendon

Average teams can play like top teams occasionally.

Like us against tigers or gws for instance.

The bombers played like a top team against us.

 

[FlyingSledghamer]

Don't forget we started during the compromised drafts.. 2013 (billings) was our first top 10 pick since Armo?

Weve traded out/downgraded multiple first round picks in the last 5 years. Some were good but some were bad. And i cant help but think maybe if we just had of gone full rebuild and tryed improving our draft position over the years, yes maybe we would have been worse off in the short term. But better off in the long term.

 

[bennymc7]

For mine Steele was the biggest disappointment in the midfield. Can tackle but isn't a good user of the ball in fact looks fumbly and doesn't hit team mates. Just seems to pass or knock it out in a very rushed haphazard way.

I actually thought he was one of the few who tried to slow it down a little and find the best option..

Koby on the other hand reminds me of mav in the midfield, shocking disposal, hard as nails but just not good enough.. give me dunstan any day

 

[bennymc7]

Blokes we think will be good who are yet to play 50 games...

Acres, Sincs, Gresh, Membrey, Steele, Paddy, DMac (backing him in)

We see what JB has done this year when he's passed that mark.

Im hanging in there with our kids

 

[stfan]

Blokes we think will be good who are yet to play 50 games...

Acres, Sincs, Gresh, Membrey, Steele, Paddy, DMac (backing him in)

We see what JB has done this year when he's passed that mark.

Im hanging in there with our kids

Players who played last night who have played less than 50 games:
- Sydney = 9
- St Kilda = 6

 

[FlyingSledghamer]

Here's how I see it right now...

When we play our brand at our best we are brilliant. We've seen that a few times this year and it's irresistible.

But we have a tendency to go into our shell and play dull bruise free football and tonight was an example. We were just pathetic tonight and I still look at that game and think we should have won. We kept Buddy quiet but let Sinclair have a night out?! Our midfield in the stoppages was non-existent! I'm actually despairing at that performance. If we'd brought anywhere near our best we'd have won.

I thought Billings was just downright awful in the first half. I love Jack but he seems to have gone back into his shell and he's not backing himself. Constantly looking to handball to players in a worse position. Not that he's alone there, we were always looking for nothing handpasses when the Swans would just kick it forward from a stoppage backing their teammate to win the next contest.

There was so much wrong with tonight so I don't see the point in going into it too deeply but the bottom line is our pressure and ability to compete was PATHETIC! Our midfield was embarrassed tonight. Our forward pressure was disgraceful. Our work around stoppages was awful, especially considering Longer actually appeared to get the better of the ruck (take note those blaming Hickey for last week, midfield just as bad tonight).

Here are some names I would throw into the getting dropped pile:
Gresham
Steven (love him but downright useless tonight)
Acres
Lonie
Billings

That's 5 guys off the top of my head that played bruise free gutless football tonight. And how we were so unprepared to win contested football, especially in the first quarter, is frankly beyond me. This was the most important game of the year and we served up crap.

We need to wake up now because we are going down a bloody bad path. I don't for a second think our rebuild is in tatters - but we need to take stock and think about how we play our football because it is all over the shop right now. Two weeks ago we were amazing but the most important thing in footy today is constistency.

So on that note - this should be Roo's last year. If you can not compete to the level every week then you can't play this game at AFL level. I have loved that man and everything he's done and I wanted the fairytale flag as much as anyone, but it's time.

POSITIVES: Dunstan was fantastic, I thought Bruce was great, Membrey back next week. There were others but in the end...... just disappointing.

I think we played 3 good games this year.
West Coast in Perth we played strong footy and almost won. Umpires crucified us.
GWS win was strong footy.
Richmond was very strong footy.
Freo win over there was good but. Their form has been questionable.
The rest were pretty much 'meh' wins and horrible losses.
3 good games out of 18 Rounds.

Dunstan was very good last night. But I cant help but think it took him to get demoted 3 times to sandy to get him in the right frame of mind. Coaches just cant get them to play consistant serious footy. And it wouldnt surprise me if in a couple weeks hes demoted again. Gotta back it up week in week out.

Savage was really good too. Looks like it may have clicked but just like Dunstan. IMO this is just a good example of how the players can show what level they can play at but they dont consistantly. Again. Why is that? To me its just another poor reflection on the leadership and coaching. Preperation.

Billings. Absolute plodder. Plays a couple good games, and then just goes through the motion.
Hardly ever see him bust his guts to get to a contest. Put on some pressure. Never gets out of a canter.. Again, as above. Doesnt look motivated. Poor reflection of the leadership and coaching.