#StandBySmith

[Richard Pryor]

There could indeed be truth in such an allegation, but talk of 'highly-placed sources' always makes me suspicious.

There was, for example, 'a source close to team' that contended that there was a rift between Steve Waugh and Shane Warne during the 1999 World Cup.

Who was the source? Why, the opposition NZ coach Steve Rixon!

According to Steve Waugh, such highly-placed sources might be disgruntled administrators or members/supporters of the opposition (playing or otherwise) looking to unsettle the side, or even a rival cricketer looking to unsettle a cricketer that he doesn't like.

EDIT: Not just rift, an outright feud. Just double-checked Steve's autobiography.

Warne going out of his way to have a whinge about Waugh on "I'm a Celebrity" decades after the fact lends credibility to Rixon though.

 

[DaRick]

Warne going out of his way to have a whinge about Waugh on "I'm a Celebrity" decades after the fact lends credibility to Rixon though.

Oh, there's no doubt that things between them have gone seriously downhill since.

At the time though, talk of a feud was overblown and the two were still on speaking terms. Warne apparently even confided to Waugh his insecurities during that tournament, which would tell against a real feud between them existing at that time.

 

[MinerBoy]

Suspend him, and let him come back as a player, not captain. I don't think he has enough credits in the trust bank for that.

Kudos for coming out and admitting it.

Deserves the opportunity to earn a second chance, if that makes sense.

Yep, this. Certainly isn't the worst thing ever and deserving of life bans.

Suspension, stripped of captaincy, do some time, earn back your place and trust and perhaps in time some respect.

 

[MinerBoy]

Well we have no grey area on this in terms of was it wasn't it ball tampering, its obvious and they did it. If it was an isolated thing without priors, I may agree with more leniency.

While I don't like other nations throwing stones when they aren't exactly on the high ground here (in particular England, India, Pakistan and SA), I would like us to cut the cancers which have run rampant in the team for a long time now.

My suspensions are based on the following assumptions (and I could be wrong):

- That Warner and Boof were the 'brains' behind the plan
- Smith was dumb enough to go along with it
- Bancroft was just asked to do it because Warner knew he was being focused on (in his mind persecuted)

Makes no difference to me if the idea was Warners. He didn't enact it or rubber stamp it. No way Warner gets held more accountable than Smith. Smith was the captain and should have said NO. I've been President of my club as well as captain/coach for many years and the buck stops there.

- To me Boof simply loses his job. What he can or can't do beyond that I'm not sure.
- Bancroft gets some form of suspension.....next series maybe. Maybe more.
- Smith and Warner as leaders and co-conspirators get 12 month ban, loss of leadership roles for any Aus/State team ever and must come back through the Shield with performances when their time is served.

 

[mcgarnacle]

thinking the whole team didn't know is naive in the extreme. every bowler would definitely know just by receiving the ball.

when you look at the image of Bancroft spooning sugar into his pocket in sydney, khawaja is in the background looking in his direction.

that's not to say all members of this squad should be sacked. the coach, captain, and vice-captain have to go for a period of time. these guys set the course for the rest of the team to follow. Smith and Warner will return if their form warrants it, although, Davey;s behaviour has certainly worn thin with the Aussie public.

bancroft is gone for the fact that he was the one caught doing it, and he already has 'ban' in his name.

 

[90N90S]

Cricket has never been a "gentleman's" game it's a lot of crap.

If it was a gentleman's game they would all be sitting on the pitch having a BBQ.

No sport can be called a gentleman's/gentlewoman's game as long as you are competing on the world stage it is not gentle.

Sorry but most of you are delusional if you think that.

 

[Richard Pryor]

Thinking on the report of Warner allegedly being busted stuff sandpaper into his hand strap thing at Port Elizabeth, would explain the ineptitude at hiding the tampering. Having to give a new guy the responsibility on short notice, can't give him the handstrap to hide it because it'd be too obvious...

 

[90N90S]

Makes no difference to me if the idea was Warners. He didn't enact it or rubber stamp it. No way Warner gets held more accountable than Smith. Smith was the captain and should have said NO. I've been President of my club as well as captain/coach for many years and the buck stops there.

- To me Boof simply loses his job. What he can or can't do beyond that I'm not sure.
- Bancroft gets some form of suspension.....next series maybe. Maybe more.
- Smith and Warner as leaders and co-conspirators get 12 month ban, loss of leadership roles for any Aus/State team ever and must come back through the Shield with performances when their time is served.

Think of poor old CH9 what are they going to do if Smith and Warner and some of their favorites in the Aussie team are banned?

We can't have that now can we maybe we will get lucky and the whole CH9 team will protest and quit or is that asking too much.?

 

[Blue1980]

There could indeed be truth in such an allegation, but talk of 'highly-placed sources' always makes me suspicious.

There was, for example, 'a source close to team' that contended that there was a rift between Steve Waugh and Shane Warne during the 1999 World Cup.

Who was the source? Why, the opposition NZ coach Steve Rixon!

According to Steve Waugh, such highly-placed sources might be disgruntled administrators or members/supporters of the opposition (playing or otherwise) looking to unsettle the side, or even a rival cricketer looking to unsettle a cricketer that he doesn't like.

EDIT: Not just rift, an outright feud. Just double-checked Steve's autobiography.

Inside source Graham Smith?

 

[Blue1980]

Makes no difference to me if the idea was Warners. He didn't enact it or rubber stamp it. No way Warner gets held more accountable than Smith. Smith was the captain and should have said NO. I've been President of my club as well as captain/coach for many years and the buck stops there.

- To me Boof simply loses his job. What he can or can't do beyond that I'm not sure.
- Bancroft gets some form of suspension.....next series maybe. Maybe more.
- Smith and Warner as leaders and co-conspirators get 12 month ban, loss of leadership roles for any Aus/State team ever and must come back through the Shield with performances when their time is served.

If I was going to predict I think these bans will be closer to the mark. I have gone the higher end with what I would do.

 

[Blue1980]

Faf is a repeat offender RE ball tampering though, so I find this argument problematic. Plus it is harder to give a repeat offender the benefit of the doubt.

On your broader post, Warner's a twat with a lousy prior record, but so was Shane Warne and we didn't ban him for more than 12 months for a more serious offence (drug use has always been punished far more harshly than ball-tampering). Not sure why Warner warrants even that.

He definitely deserves to be stripped of anything resembling a leadership role and harshly treated financially (may happen already RE sponsorships and the IPL), but not banned for more time than Smith (the captain who admitted to conspiracy) and Bancroft (the actual perpetrator). I'm in favour of short bans for all three given that nobody has ever been banned for ball-tampering (not even Faf). A ban in itself would be a radical punishment.

You bring up some valid points, ball tampering has never been taken seriously really but this is the first time anyone has been caught as blatantly. It's like Carlton with the salary cap and Essendon with the drug saga, of course others had done things before them but there is always someone who goes that step further and cops it (probably add Melbourne with tanking as well)

 

[Blue1980]

If I was going to predict I think these bans will be closer to the mark. I have gone the higher end with what I would do.

May also depend on if there is still any bad blood from the whole pay dispute last year. If they copped 2 years and went bleating how unfair it is I think its safe to say that the public would be siding with CA and not the players.

 

[CakeEater]

I was reading one of those compilation books of anecdotes from famous cricketers.

In there was a story about Arthur Mailey (Australian legspinner) and the English captain both catching each other using resin to lift the seam.

If they were doing that back in the 1920's and 30's and the fact that the ICC only views this as a minor transgression, its bemusing that theres such a pitchfork attitude towards this issue.

 

[Mateyman]

Thinking on the report of Warner allegedly being busted stuff sandpaper into his hand strap thing at Port Elizabeth, would explain the ineptitude at hiding the tampering. Having to give a new guy the responsibility on short notice, can't give him the handstrap to hide it because it'd be too obvious...

I don't really buy the whole - a dressing room attendant saw him putting sandpaper into his tape, because if that's the case why wouldn't you alert onfield umpires and ask for his tape to be checked?

 

[Richard Pryor]

I was reading one of those compilation books of anecdotes from famous cricketers.

In there was a story about Arthur Malley (Australian legspinner) and the English captain both catching each other using resin to lift the seam.

If they were doing that back in the 1920's and 30's and the fact that the ICC only views this as a minor transgression, its bemusing that theres such a pitchfork attitude towards this issue.

Unrelated, but reminds me of a story about W.G. Grace demanding an Australians bat be measured as he thought it violated the regulations, the Australians hit back by demanding Grace's bat also be measured, and Grace's was the one found to be too large.

 

[Blue1980]

I was reading one of those compilation books of anecdotes from famous cricketers.

In there was a story about Arthur Malley (Australian legspinner) and the English captain both catching each other using resin to lift the seam.

If they were doing that back in the 1920's and 30's and the fact that the ICC only views this as a minor transgression, its bemusing that theres such a pitchfork attitude towards this issue.

No one has been caught in the act on camera so blatantly, add social media to the mix and here we are.

 

[Richard Pryor]

I don't really buy the whole - a dressing room attendant saw him putting sandpaper into his tape, because if that's the case why wouldn't you alert onfield umpires and ask for his tape to be checked?

Presumably if he got caught he wouldn't have actually taken the tape onto the field afterwards, making it a he-said/she-said situation for the umpires and match referee.

That said, if the Daily Mail reports something it's good to take it with a liberal grain of salt.

 

[CakeEater]

No one has been caught in the act on camera so blatantly, add social media to the mix and here we are.

I'd disagree with you Afridi's actions were pretty blatant as well.

I guess that Smith and Bancroft were unlucky that the cameramen took time out of their day job (filming the SA female spectators ) to catch them in the act .

 

[Richard Pryor]

I'd disagree with you Afridi's actions were pretty blatant as well.

I guess that Smith and Bancroft were unlucky that the cameramen took time out of their day job (filming the SA female spectators ) to catch them in the act .

Difference is that with Aus the dishonesty was blatant as well, which I'd hazard a guess put more peoples noses out of joint than the tampering did. The whole sandpaper in the undies, sunglasses cloth out for the umpires routine is something that looks extremely dishonest and unfair to anyone even if they know nothing about cricket, whereas Afridi just looked hilarious.

 

[CakeEater]

Difference is that with Aus the dishonesty was blatant as well, which I'd hazard a guess put more peoples noses out of joint than the tampering did. The whole sandpaper in the undies, sunglasses cloth out for the umpires routine is something that looks extremely dishonest and unfair to anyone even if they know nothing about cricket, whereas Afridi just looked hilarious.

Thats true.

Just as an aside, in case anyone wants to read it- here is the book I was talking about

https://books.google.com.au/books?i...AJ#v=onepage&q=resin to lift the seam&f=false

 

[DaRick]

Inside source Graham Smith?

Actually plausible. He has spoken to the likes of Jack Egan (RE Steve Waugh) and Daniel Brettig before. He definitely likes being heard.

You bring up some valid points, ball tampering has never been taken seriously really but this is the first time anyone has been caught as blatantly. It's like Carlton with the salary cap and Essendon with the drug saga, of course others had done things before them but there is always someone who goes that step further and cops it (probably add Melbourne with tanking as well)

Not so much caught blatantly IMO (you don't get much more blatant than Afridi) but certainly the first time anyone has actually admitted to premeditated tampering. We're definitely heading into new territory there, agreed.

You raise an interesting point RE the pay dispute BTW. CA would certainly be more inclined to throw the book at Smith/Warner after they dragged CA into such acrimony.

CA in reality will have to balance the actual offence (relatively minor but more serious than other similar incidents), their past conduct and the greater needs of the side when taking action against Warner/Smith. Crippling your side's competitiveness in clutch series/tournaments will do nothing to win over fans, either.

 

[DrEvil_]

I love the people who are coming out and saying " he owned up to it so that's a positive "
They only owned up coz the got ******* caught
And to think they haven't been doing this before now is pretty naive

At least that's better than Essendon

 

[Truckosaurus]

'The bowlers knew about it. The whole team did'

The Australian cricket team is in danger of imploding over the cheating scandal that has rocked the sport following claims that the bowlers were ‘in’ on the plan to tamper with the ball in the third Test against South Africa at Cape Town.

A highly-placed source has told Wide World of Sports the bowlers were aware of the plan to use sticky tape on the ball to gain an edge over the Proteas, despite reports that spearheads Mitchell Starc and Josh Hazlewood knew nothing about it and are fuming over being linked to the scandal.

“They knew about it - don’t worry about that,” the source says.

Australian captain Steve Smith has said the leadership group was aware of plans to tamper with the ball in the third Test.

“You don’t have something like this happen and the whole team not know.

“Of course they are playing dumb about it - you can’t blame them.”

Smith has already admitted to hatching a plan with the leadership group for Cameron Bancroft to use sticky tape on the ball as they looked for an advantage with the series locked at 1-all.

Bancroft has also confessed to his role in the plot after he was busted by television cameras using sticky tape on the ball before shoving it down his pants during play on day three.

Smith’s decision to name the ‘leadership group’ – which reportedly includes Smith, vice-captain David Warner, Nathan Lyon, Mitchell Starc and Josh Hazlewood – has already caused a split among the players.

Hazlewood and Starc are furious at being drawn into it and there are reports that at least one of the bowlers has contacted the Australian Cricketers’ Association to demand that Cricket Australia clarifies their lack of involvement.

Smith was stood down as skipper for the remainder of the third Test, while Warner also gave up his position as vice-captain, but it is almost certain that there will be more punishments to come when Cricket Australia concludes its investigation.

Both Smith and Warner are facing year-long bans, while Bancroft could also be suspended. There are reports that coach Darren Lehmann will resign over the scandal.

The scandal has already seen skipper Steve Smith banned for the fourth and final Test against South Africa at The Wanderers on Friday.

Cricket Australia chief executive James Sutherland is expected to address the media after flying to South Africa.

The other concern is the impact it could have on the team in the long run, particularly if the senior players are already divided over the blame game which has erupted following the scandal.

There are a number of players already in the mix to fill spots in the team including Glenn Maxwell, Matt Renshaw, Joe Burns, Travis Head and Hilton Cartwright.

Cricket Australia hopes to provide more information on Wednesday morning (AEDT) after it has been investigated by Cricket Australia's Head of Integrity Iain Roy and executive general manager of team performance Pat Howard.

https://www.msn.com/en-au/sport/cri...the-whole-team-did/ar-BBKK06i?ocid=spartandhp

Who let Warner have post-game drinks with a journo?

 

[90N90S]

Who let Warner have post-game drinks with a journo?

Don't trust "highly placed sources."

 

[SherbertLemon]

At least that's better than Essendon

Yeah, there was a video of Stephen dank injecting banned peptides into the playing group. It also continues to show James Hird admiring his naked body in a full length mirror amirite