Movie Star Wars - Episode IX - The Rise of Skywalker - Spoilers and Rumors

[Exe Gesis]

edgie roxking with the sporting analogies today

 

[JackOutback]

I remember sitting in the cinema for the Phantom Menave and thinking it felt more like Star Trek than Star Wars after the first five mins. It eventually worked its way to a Star Wars vibe but I thought TFA felt more like a Star Wars film than any of the PT films. I mean partly because it was a facsimile. But still. TLJ deliberately blazed it’s own trail but it still felt like Star Wars to me. Scenes like Snoke’s throne room and Crait were designed to evoke an OT vibe even as it went in different directions.

 

[edgie]

What different directions?

Sent from mTalk

 

[JackOutback]

What different directions?

Sent from mTalk

Let’s not have this argument again where it’s ‘a betrayal if Star Wars lore’ but also ‘a rip off of Star Wars’. If you think it subverts Star Wars, then it’s clearly not some shameless rip off.

 

[edgie]

Let’s not have this argument again where it’s ‘a betrayal if Star Wars lore’ but also ‘a rip off of Star Wars’. If you think it subverts Star Wars, then it’s clearly not some shameless rip off.

I never said it subverts being serious. I only used that in mockery of the subversion point of view.

There's no argument, there's just a failure to address key beats of this movie that do things new and different when I question those who think it does.

 

[Exe Gesis]

Rj was clearly just trolling SW fans thruout TLJ .... "i have a bad feeling about this" being spoken by BB8....no actual lightsaber duels....and so on.

 

[edgie]

Rj was clearly just trolling SW fans thruout TLJ .... "i have a bad feeling about this" being spoken by BB8....no actual lightsaber duels....and so on.

He was brave enough to let go of some superficial things that reoccur in the series like one liners and the like, but when it came crunch time, he reverted to Empire vs Rebels, Red lightsabre vs Blue, Millennium Falcon, old Jedi Master becoming one with the force, Imperial Walkers, and this.



Way to shake things up soldier.

 

[Exe Gesis]

Way to shake things up soldier.

Yeah, he was dick-teasing. He basically thought everyone would worship his intellect....how he subverted everything, then promising something all new, only to revert back to the same safe things as well. Thought everyone would praise and laud him, that faux humble smirk he does while waving at the audience -- before everyone saw the movie.

 

[mike123]

Let’s not have this argument again where it’s ‘a betrayal if Star Wars lore’ but also ‘a rip off of Star Wars’. If you think it subverts Star Wars, then it’s clearly not some shameless rip off.

It is those, it’s a classic case of having your cake and eating it.

 

[HahnPremium]

Yeah, he was dick-teasing. He basically thought everyone would worship his intellect....how he subverted everything, then promising something all new, only to revert back to the same safe things as well. Thought everyone would praise and laud him, that faux humble smirk he does while waving at the audience -- before everyone saw the movie.

Agree.
"Im gonna shake the whole star wars universe. " Then proceeds to lean heavily on trusted tropes and anything "new" that was attempted felt out of place and nonsensical. Worst of both worlds approach.

 

[mike123]

The funny thing is most Rey and Snoke backstory theorists actually went in different directions the series haven’t taken before.

 

[JackOutback]

So people have spent 12 months complaining about how RJ ‘betrayed’ Star Wars and now the argument is he didn’t go far enough

He was still making a Star Wars movie, he was hardly going to make a Shakespearean period drama. He introduced enough new ideas to open the door for more interesting movies in the future, for moving past Jedi/Sith and the Skywalkers, while staying true to a series about good and evil and space wizards. My concern is JJ will now squib the opportunity because of a noisy minority. He had to play it safe in TFA, people wanted OT nostalgia after the PT backlash. But let’s hope he actually sees this through.

 

[edgie]

> complains about noisy minority ruining next film
> admits that previous movie had to be a certain way because the previous trilogy was poorly received and he was on board with that
> movie from said trilogy better received by fans than The Last Jedi

?????????????

Sent from mTalk

 

[edgie]

He betrayed Star Wars with certain things and yeah, what he done with Luke.

What he done with Luke though was not original in itself. It is something already seen, but poorly applied to this character because of this faux fresh and original story.

It's not original though. We've seen it all before.

Like... It's just not good. That's the problem here.

Sent from mTalk

 

[edgie]

TFA got the he introduced things defence. TLJ is getting the he introduced things defence. When are they just gonna stop worrying about introducing things and just make a damn good movie with what they've already got?

Sent from mTalk

 

[Matera92]

TFA got the he introduced things defence. TLJ is getting the he introduced things defence. When are they just gonna stop worrying about introducing things and just make a damn good movie with what they've already got?

Sent from mTalk

It's too late now.

 

[Ice-Wolf]

As I've said before with a little more polish on the script TLJ could have worked, it's not that some of the overall ideas were bad they were just poorly executed. I still reckon even with out working on the script it could have been saved in the editing room with some minor reshoots.

1. Leia rams the SSD instead of Admiral Gender Studies D) (ties up the Carrie Fisher loose end and Leia goes out a boss)
2. Admiral Gender Studies/Poe story actually make sense i.e. Holdo is worried that there may be a spy on board feeding the first order info and the side mission being authorised (the extra tension just wasn't needed and everyone on the Resitance ship just looked stupid)
3. Luke doesn't die at the end and the Ben/Luke fallout better explained.

The Rey is noone thing can just be sold as a lie in the next one after all the darksiders lying/misleading in order to manipulate wouldn't be out of character nor is is out of character for the lightsiders (Kenobi's point of view bullshit).

For the record the Kenobi Theory was just ******* stupid anyway and it would have made more sense for her to be Luke's daughter also makes for a reason why Luke was so broken he believed that he lost his family as well as his students it would also add to his motivation not to train her, initially he doesn't want to fail his daughter like he failed his nephew. Also thematically it keeps the saga story focused on the Skywalker family.

 

[JackOutback]

> complains about noisy minority ruining next film
> admits that previous movie had to be a certain way because the previous trilogy was poorly received and he was on board with that
> movie from said trilogy better received by fans than The Last Jedi

?????????????

Sent from mTalk

The overall backlash for the PT trilogy was greater than TLJ. Adjusted for inflation, TLJ is the 43rd highest ranking movie of all time, ROTS is 68th; it has significantly outperformed it. My personal opinion is that much of the goodwill for ROTS is that TPM and AOTC were so poor, it looks better by comparison, but that’s not a measurable thing; I know I came out of the cinema thinking it had somewhat redeemed the trilogy but it didn’t hold up to a rewatch. But either way, the backlash was a cumulative thing, hence TFA looking to revive the OT vibe.

 

[Exe Gesis]

Ticket Sales =/= a measure of a film's worth necessarily.
TLJ was a hugely anticipated sequel, hence the big numbers up there with TFA...which was as hugely anticipated after decades of no SW.
Often with SW, people go back and watch multiple times.
TLJ's catch-cry was "you have to see this movie multiple times to get it" further inflating the ticket sales.

 

[edgie]

We are in a golden era of box office returns where comic book characters and car movies can even crack a billion. Avatar cracked two billion and who is gonna remember it as anything more than that 3D movie in a couple more years. It is literally the highest return and its an after thought.

Box office means next to nothing now unless in extreme examples.

Sent from mTalk

 

[edgie]

If it was so important to revive to OT vibe, why so quick to s**t on it and replace the stalwarts of it?

It's so incredibly conflicted its infuriating.

Sent from mTalk

 

[JackOutback]

Ticket Sales =/= a measure of a film's worth necessarily.
TLJ was a hugely anticipated sequel, hence the big numbers up there with TFA...which was as hugely anticipated after decades of no SW.
Often with SW, people go back and watch multiple times.
TLJ's catch-cry was "you have to see this movie multiple times to get it" further inflating the ticket sales.

Box office is but one measure, of course, but you can’t say TLJ was an ‘anticipated sequel’ when ROTS was the conclusion of a high profile sequel and possibly the last Star Wars movie that would ever be made.

We are in a golden era of box office returns where comic book characters and car movies can even crack a billion. Avatar cracked two billion and who is gonna remember it as anything more than that 3D movie in a couple more years. It is literally the highest return and its an after thought.

Box office means next to nothing now unless in extreme examples.

Sent from mTalk

The movie industry has been hit by streaming and downloading, its hardly a golden era. It is perhaps shrinking down to event movies somewhat but box office will never be irrelevant.

 

[edgie]

Box office is but one measure, of course, but you can’t say TLJ was an ‘anticipated sequel’ when ROTS was the conclusion of a high profile sequel and possibly the last Star Wars movie that would ever be made.


The movie industry has been hit by streaming and downloading, its hardly a golden era. It is perhaps shrinking down to event movies somewhat but box office will never be irrelevant.

Big movies are as big as ever.

Sent from mTalk

 

[JackOutback]

Big movies are as big as ever.

Sent from mTalk

Sure, but as dismissive of Avatar as you were, it’s been 10 years and hasn’t been topped. That includes two of the biggest event movies you’ll ever see: a Star Wars sequel and the conclusion to a decade long Marvel journey. Box office still counts, TLJ didn’t make $1.3b with nobody liking it.

 

[Ice-Wolf]

Sure, but as dismissive of Avatar as you were, it’s been 10 years and hasn’t been topped. That includes two of the biggest event movies you’ll ever see: a Star Wars sequel and the conclusion to a decade long Marvel journey. Box office still counts, TLJ didn’t make $1.3b with nobody liking it.

Too be fair it was "IN 3D!"

Avatar was also very much an event, it also didn't hurt to be attached to James Cameron and also be his long-awaited follow up to Titanic.