Opinion Stephen Silvagni

DangerousD

Norm Smith Medallist
Aug 16, 2015
5,949
7,515
AFL Club
Carlton
Other Teams
Arsenal
Onfield has been driven by SOS' list build. So if it's going well, how do they explain knifing a Club Legend?
You have written this a few times, how do you know its a knifing? Why constitutes a knifing in your book? I asked JAB a similar question and im not sure he answered it, how does one guy, sack an employee like SOS, if he doesn't have the support of the other staff or board?

If he does have the support of other staff and the board, which i think is evident as, they have obviously approved it, then is it still a knifing and if the board has approved it, then how is the debate still so one sided?
 

Ockhams razor

Rookie
Oct 5, 2004
38
1,618
AFL Club
Carlton
Other Teams
Carlton
There’s 2 sides to every story.

SOS is clearly unhappy with how he has been treated, nonetheless, those who he is upset with quite likely view their own behaviour as being in the best interests of the Blues, albeit with a touch of self interest.

My understanding is that SOS has chosen to depart, his position isn’t untenable, he is however, clearly unhappy with some senior people at the club and feels that it’s time.

This is different to him being pushed or exited. Like in any role, if you have more unhappy moments than rewarding ones you assess your options and make a decision accordingly, as he has done.

His role was almost complete, we are in great shape and success is likely to follow. With his boys at the club, his own playing legacy and that of his father, SOS will celebrate the club’s success and will always be a blues champion no matter where he goes next...
 

(Log in to remove this ad.)

Stamos

Brownlow Medallist
Mar 30, 2010
11,391
14,633
AFL Club
Carlton
You have written this a few times, how do you know its a knifing? Why constitutes a knifing in your book? I asked JAB a similar question and im not sure he answered it, how does one guy, sack an employee like SOS, if he doesn't have the support of the other staff or board?

If he does have the support of other staff and the board, which i think is evident as, they have obviously approved it, then is it still a knifing and if the board has approved it, then how is the debate still so one sided?
All sources, in the media and on here, have described it as a power struggle between the two. Liddle has won, and SOS is going, for no apparent reason. I call that a knifing.

The debate seems one sided, because there is no apparent reason for SOS to be going, and he seems to be unhappy about it. The reasons, whether leaked, or stated publicly, need to be explained, or it will always seem very one sided.
 

DangerousD

Norm Smith Medallist
Aug 16, 2015
5,949
7,515
AFL Club
Carlton
Other Teams
Arsenal
Which side of this drawn out saga benefits most from leaking tidbits to the media? Go back the 6 odd weeks on this board and have a read of the ITKs commentary, the articles from the media, the leaking of details of SOS at the board meeting. ALL of it, makes the CEO look like a tit.

Who would leak that?

The CEO to sabotage his position
or
A disgruntled employee about to leave?

Yet, we complain that there is leaks, ask yourself, which side of this gains the most from the leaks? Its not the club and its not the CEO
 

Dravid's in

All Australian
May 10, 2001
868
4,186
Adelaide
AFL Club
Carlton
Russell and Power have been two marquee appointments to the football department under Lloyd, plus Diesel back at the club. Someone more in the know can say whether it's Lloyd's doing, but it looks good on face value.

Lloyd responsible for Russell according to EP.
 

RoyalParade

Club Legend
Feb 19, 2012
1,509
2,564
AFL Club
Carlton
There’s 2 sides to every story.

SOS is clearly unhappy with how he has been treated, nonetheless, those who he is upset with quite likely view their own behaviour as being in the best interests of the Blues, albeit with a touch of self interest.

My understanding is that SOS has chosen to depart, his position isn’t untenable, he is however, clearly unhappy with some senior people at the club and feels that it’s time.

This is different to him being pushed or exited. Like in any role, if you have more unhappy moments than rewarding ones you assess your options and make a decision accordingly, as he has done.

His role was almost complete, we are in great shape and success is likely to follow. With his boys at the club, his own playing legacy and that of his father, SOS will celebrate the club’s success and will always be a blues champion no matter where he goes next...
Ok now this makes sense.
 

Stamos

Brownlow Medallist
Mar 30, 2010
11,391
14,633
AFL Club
Carlton
Now that’s a balanced post, appreciated OR




On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app
And this is a big part of why this is a fu** up, because we have not controlled the narrative, it looks worse publicly than what it probably is.
But it’s also bad that somebody like SOS is feeling that they’ve been treated badly.
 

Stamos

Brownlow Medallist
Mar 30, 2010
11,391
14,633
AFL Club
Carlton
Which side of this drawn out saga benefits most from leaking tidbits to the media? Go back the 6 odd weeks on this board and have a read of the ITKs commentary, the articles from the media, the leaking of details of SOS at the board meeting. ALL of it, makes the CEO look like a tit.

Who would leak that?

The CEO to sabotage his position
or
A disgruntled employee about to leave?

Yet, we complain that there is leaks, ask yourself, which side of this gains the most from the leaks? Its not the club and its not the CEO
You think SOS is leaking to Caro?
 

DangerousD

Norm Smith Medallist
Aug 16, 2015
5,949
7,515
AFL Club
Carlton
Other Teams
Arsenal
All sources, in the media and on here, have described it as a power struggle between the two. Liddle has won, and SOS is going, for no apparent reason. I call that a knifing.

The debate seems one sided, because there is no apparent reason for SOS to be going, and he seems to be unhappy about it. The reasons, whether leaked, or stated publicly, need to be explained, or it will always seem very one sided.
Im about to go to bed, but thanks for the back and forth. It seems there has been a power struggle or something of some sort and it appears Liddle has won, but seriously, it can't be for no reason, this is what i was asking you before, why would the board endorse the move if they didn't support it? One man, wouldn't have the purity to do this, unless they had a lot of support.

If they have a lot of support, does it not make it obvious there are reasons?

What does the CEO or the board have to gain, by coming out and saying why they have moved on SOS?
 

(Log in to remove this ad.)

smashbox gill

Premiership Player
Jun 25, 2008
3,167
7,286
Donnie
AFL Club
Carlton
There’s 2 sides to every story.

SOS is clearly unhappy with how he has been treated, nonetheless, those who he is upset with quite likely view their own behaviour as being in the best interests of the Blues, albeit with a touch of self interest.

My understanding is that SOS has chosen to depart, his position isn’t untenable, he is however, clearly unhappy with some senior people at the club and feels that it’s time.

This is different to him being pushed or exited. Like in any role, if you have more unhappy moments than rewarding ones you assess your options and make a decision accordingly, as he has done.

His role was almost complete, we are in great shape and success is likely to follow. With his boys at the club, his own playing legacy and that of his father, SOS will celebrate the club’s success and will always be a blues champion no matter where he goes next...
I just don’t want to see him build up another list when he could be building ours. I would be okay if he stepped away from football but if he stays I want him to be home at Carlton list manager position or another
 

DangerousD

Norm Smith Medallist
Aug 16, 2015
5,949
7,515
AFL Club
Carlton
Other Teams
Arsenal
There’s 2 sides to every story.

SOS is clearly unhappy with how he has been treated, nonetheless, those who he is upset with quite likely view their own behaviour as being in the best interests of the Blues, albeit with a touch of self interest.

My understanding is that SOS has chosen to depart, his position isn’t untenable, he is however, clearly unhappy with some senior people at the club and feels that it’s time.

This is different to him being pushed or exited. Like in any role, if you have more unhappy moments than rewarding ones you assess your options and make a decision accordingly, as he has done.

His role was almost complete, we are in great shape and success is likely to follow. With his boys at the club, his own playing legacy and that of his father, SOS will celebrate the club’s success and will always be a blues champion no matter where he goes next...
Now this is a post to like, detailed, thoughtful and adds heaps to the conversation.

Thanks for sharing.
 

teagueyubeauty

Premiership Player
Oct 5, 2004
3,898
8,130
Somewhere there
AFL Club
Carlton
Other Teams
Liverpool, Yankees
And this is a big part of why this is a fu** up, because we have not controlled the narrative, it looks worse publicly than what it probably is.
But it’s also bad that somebody like SOS is feeling that they’ve been treated badly.
I think it’s even worse that one side is airing it in the public domain, maybe the club have got it right.

The club has been incredibly tight through some pretty ordinary times, except now. I don’t think SOS is winning many friends at the moment, the leaks are clearly coming from those around him or even worse himself.

His position wasn’t untenable, he’s decided to go...what more do you want the club to say to rewrite the one sided narrative that won’t inflame the situation and put a champion of the club in a bad light. It’s a no win situation.


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app
 

DangerousD

Norm Smith Medallist
Aug 16, 2015
5,949
7,515
AFL Club
Carlton
Other Teams
Arsenal
Lastly before bed, if SOS was indeed leaving at the end of next year and it had anything to do with possible conflicts of interest. I really doubt that he would go work for another club. His job would directly affect the possible success of his kids, i just don't see it.
 

Percy2257

Give Me Back My Skateboard 🤕
May 11, 2019
411
664
AFL Club
Carlton
Its his dad at the end of the day, you know his first hero in life, happens to be a legend of the club he loves to boot..... and therein lies the problem I think!

He has two boys on the list and this situation was always going to end up like this. Jack backs his dad and I would say that Steve would back his sons to the hilt also...that's family! When it's all said and done can he really remove himself from delisting his boys when it comes time for that? remove himself from their contract negotiations which will affect their lives and also the lives of the other players who operate under the same salary cap? I think we all know the answer to this deep down. It's unavoidable and if the name wasn't Silvagni it would be agreed by all supporters it's not the best situation.

From what we hear he was always planning to vacate the role at the end of next season anyway. He has done a fantastic job but in reality the heavy lifting is done. It's up to the coaches of the club now to take the list forward.
This situation brings it about one year earlier. Not a great look for the CEO that's for sure, seems to be a bit too eager. But in saying that and knowing the ego of SOS as well it's two alpha males that can't get along here, it happens in business and most of the times it is untenable particularly between managers.

The person to go is usually the one lower on the food chain, particularly if the higher up manager is doing a good job, which we can all agree apart from this clash of personalities Liddle seems to be doing. A few months ago we were all singing his praises.

The club is bigger than the individual and everyone needs to take a chill pill here, the list is in fantastic shape thanks to SOS and we the members and supporters will never forget that (we are the club at the end of the day!). Off field we are in the best shape we have been for 25 years and the membership and revenues of the club are forecast to continue improving. Good players want to come to Carlton again and this will only continue in the next 5 years. Things are good and we should not lose sight of that because SOS has decided to retire a year early.

Everyone relax!
I agree. Relax. Btw at Carlton we love our Eetalyarns, it’s just that they get a bit carried away sometimes. And it’s amazing the number of Skips who barrack for Carlton who think like Eetalyarns. 😳😳😳
So keepa your dirty hands offa my list!
 

Percy2257

Give Me Back My Skateboard 🤕
May 11, 2019
411
664
AFL Club
Carlton
I don’t remember Jezza getting shafted.

He tied his allegiances to the President George Harris, and when Harris was voted out, Jezza decided to resign. I was pissed off with Jezza for leaving at the end of 1979, because of his loyalty to the ex-president and not the club.
Correct. Jezza sided with George Harris. A silly decision by him. And he has been back to the Club many times since. I recall being at PP in the late 90’s and he was driven round the oval.
 

KohPhi

Brownlow Medallist
Jul 24, 2015
17,758
56,446
AFL Club
Carlton
Not a particular popular view im about to share, but a former Blue who I know is pretty adamant that the club believes SOS may not have the same 'work ethic' of previous years and that Agresta is doing most of the hard yards.
This is just one of a number of reasons the relationship between Liddle and Silvagni has soured.
 

Percy2257

Give Me Back My Skateboard 🤕
May 11, 2019
411
664
AFL Club
Carlton
I don’t remember Jezza getting shafted.

He tied his allegiances to the President George Harris, and when Harris was voted out, Jezza decided to resign. I was pissed off with Jezza for leaving at the end of 1979, because of his loyalty to the ex-president and not the club.
Correct weight. Jezza got it wrong at the end of 1979. Partly that was because he wanted to be paid $75,000 as the playing coach and Harris supported him.
The reason for the internal board split at the end of 1979 is that Harris wanted to reduce the honorary 15 member board to 6 paid board members.
At least when it came to board numbers, Harris was years ahead of his time. It took the AFL many years to get Carlton to reduce the unwieldy size of its board.
 

mg25

Rookie
Dec 30, 2003
38
95
AFL Club
Carlton
Other Teams
carlton
Correct. Jezza sided with George Harris. A silly decision by him. And he has been back to the Club many times since. I recall being at PP in the late 90’s and he was driven round the oval.
In fact, he came back to coach the club 10 years later.

Sent from my SM-G973F using Tapatalk
 

Percy2257

Give Me Back My Skateboard 🤕
May 11, 2019
411
664
AFL Club
Carlton
I’ve got no doubt a lot of this has been probably blown out but the facts are:
*There is clearly disharmony and mistrust between Silvagni & Liddle. Not good.
*Board don’t appear unanimous. Not good.
*Jack is effectively criticising the CEO on twitter... Not good.
*angry supporter base. Not good.
*in SOS, We’ve lost a very effective List Manager, recruiter and talented negotiator. Not good.
*The CEO & President are nowhere to be heard from. Not good.

In an off season where this should be overwhelming positivity (particularly after draft week) there is the opposite. Not good.
With great love and respect, as is proven by the number of likes your post has received, that post is a triumph of easy superficial judgment over an understanding of the facts of an obvious complex situation.
Why should we supporters jump to emotively driven conclusions when we clearly don’t know most of the facts?
Just chill.
It seems that there are genuine philosophical differences within the management of the club about list formation.
Name one other club where such differences don’t exist!
 

ChrisKaias

Team Captain
Aug 11, 2014
331
1,745
AFL Club
Carlton
People are calling for the sacking of Lloyd, Liddle, everyone - and this is exactly the danger of having someone like SOS in the role he's in at the club. If everyone else is the problem, maybe actually SOS is the problem. But because he's a favourite son people completely lose objectivity.

He's done a brilliant job. But because of who he was as a player and his relationships with the powerbrokers, his influence seemingly went way beyond his stated role. That was fine for a few years but it's the way 'Old Carlton' would operate. Now that his rebuild is nearly done we need to move beyond that kind of attitude, and need to have everyone on the same page. Sacking everyone and keeping SOS isn't going to help - he was leaving anyway in a year.

His legacy is the amazing list he's built. I am really disappointed though that these leaks have come from him and his camp, it's at least one or the other if not both. I don't think that reflects well on him and I would have liked him to go with the decorum Bolton had, even though Bolton no doubt felt pretty hard done by too. There's no need to damage the club on your way out in a pique of fury.

Last thing I'll say - jury is out on Liddle. But what he's shown me is what an enormous backbone he has to take on SOS at Carlton where he felt that SOS was overstepping. Might bode very well for us. He has guts. If not, then he moves on and Prendergast steps in. But I'm going to give him that chance now he'll have the clear air he wants and the list manager he appoints.
 

Top Bottom