Opinion Stephen Silvagni

[dlb99]

I am less concerned about the Adelaide pick swap, Stocker looks a best 22 200 game midfielder.

I am more concerned that the team overall is being stunted.

This can turn around, and quickly.

 

[btdg]

I’ve said it before: 24 mature aged players brought in, 5 are current best 22. 19 late and rookie picks used, 1 is best 22.

Early picks also uninspiring. Dow can’t kick. Apparently Worpel slid past our second and third picks that year because of kicking, but seriously... Dow can’t kick. O’brien Is miles off, SPS not showing much, the GWS guys that have come in look ordinary.

First year was great. All 5 draftees solid and a good return for the players that left. Since then has been very poor, culminating in the panicked decision to trade pick 1 this year.

I think it’s difficult to judge some of the mature players because they simply haven’t been given a fair run by the coach. Gibbons gets to play forward pocket, for example, while Dow gets unlimited chances in the midfield.

But yeah, it’s been pretty bad for 3 straight summers

 

[Pafloyul]

SOS' main problem, for mine, is trying to work through a framework of a three year rebuild. That was never going to be enough time and I think that's caused a bit of confusion and some questionable decisions. For one thing, SOS and the club only had the one (the first) season in which to trade upwards, using the points system to trade multiple low draft picks for a few higher ones. The output since then has seen successively less impressive results despite our mostly lowly ladder positions.

 

[HavUEvaSeenTheRain]

Willing to pay Shiel overs gives me confidence in SOS. No doubt we will try again this offseason on another target.
Probably made more good calls than poor ones and that’s the most important thing. He’s obviously no genius or anything as there’s absolutely zero that is remarkable about this rebuild. It’s a simple bottom out and bring in top end talent. No great bargains or diamonds in the rough type of thing. Just a very solid, basic type of rebuild.
I still think he has done a good job but this is his biggest offseason.

 

[BrisbaneCFC]

SOS has done good IMO. He had traded well and brought talent to the club. You can see the talent there!

But they are not developing, this is due to coaching. Not just Bolton but all the coaches, where are our development and line coaches. There impact is non existent

Or they are simply at their top level already. SOS has done an ok job, question marks over draftees and trades brought in.

 

[BrisbaneCFC]

SOS got a first rounder for chris yarran. nuff said.

seriously though the list is fine. raw and unexpienced but talented. they've shown on many occasions they can compete with AFL players no problem. there aren't many better midfields around the bulldogs and collingwood and we went toe to toe with them just fine.

but particularly lately it seems very clear this isn't a team, it's just 22 players running around playing football like the auskick kids. no structure, positioning totally lost at sea and no discernible method of moving the ball other than 'kick on head of big guy'.

SOS hasn't been perfect but it's pretty clear that bolton just doesn't know what he's doing.

No, its not.

 

[Blue1980]

Liam Sumner
Rhys Palmer
Sam Kerridge
Billie Smedts
Matt Shaw
Aaron Mullet
Cam O'Shea
Daniel Gorringe
Matthew Lobbe
Andrew Phillips
Cam Polson
Darcy Lang
Jed Lamb
Jarrod Garlett
Jarrod Pickett

That is 15, mostly recycled players in 3 years that he has bombed on. I don't care about the hows or whys SOS and his team have stuffed way to many choices up for the precarious situations we started in.


That list could grow by another 5 by years end.

Out of the above, Phillips has been a handy backup ruck.

Kerridge and Lamb serviceable.

The rest utterly pointless to terrible.

 

[BrisbaneCFC]

Liam Sumner
Rhys Palmer
Sam Kerridge
Billie Smedts
Matt Shaw
Aaron Mullet
Cam O'Shea
Daniel Gorringe
Matthew Lobbe
Andrew Phillips
Cam Polson
Darcy Lang
Jed Lamb
Jarrod Garlett
Jarrod Pickett

That is 15, mostly recycled players in 3 years that he has bombed on. I don't care about the hows or whys SOS and his team have stuffed way to many choices up for the precarious situations we started in.


That list could grow by another 5 by years end.

Yep, and that's before you even look at the draft picks.

 

[Blue1980]

Just heard the Bolton press conference. Does anyone else feel he had an indirect crack at SOS and CO at the end? Basically said the age profile of the team is supposed to get older year-on-year but that hasn't happened at Carlton. Sounds like he's frustrated with the lack of mature players he's had available to him.

Probably knows he’s gone and believed he’s been setup to fail to some degree.

I agree to a point, both SOS and Bolts should be gone IMO

 

[BrisbaneCFC]

Newman should be, yes.

Kennedy, if physically rebuilt by Russell, and developed properly is a midfield bull that we desperately need.

Physically rebuilt or not, Kennedy is not a full time midfielder. He's a half forward who can play midfield for periods throughout the game.

 

[Blue1980]

Physically rebuilt or not, Kennedy is not a full time midfielder. He's a half forward who can play midfield for periods throughout the game.

Kennedy will be fortunate to be on our list in 2020, let alone be rebuilt.

He probably will be, but I don’t have high hopes.

Newman is okay, much better than most of our mature recruits we have got, though that is damning with faint praise

 

[bigm386]

I think SOS has been very good with his first and second round picks and trading assets for high value. Can't argue that.

My issue with SOS is he seems to have the attitude of best talent available meaning we have used late picks on young project players. With such a young list and holes in specific areas these picks to me should have been used on mature bodies say 23-28 yo players. We have serious issues with Ruckman, small forwards and mids

 

[FitzroyBlueBagger]

He's national drafting has been nearly bang on few players Cuningham McKay Macreadie Williamson have missed large chunks of games through injuries missing valuable development.
Probably Polson is the only cross ATM from all of national draft selections and he was a pick 59 few others probably need another season or two at least for a better guide.
His Rookie drafting and delisted players along with a few trades have been pretty ordinary at best
Shaw, O'Shea, Palmer, Mullet, Gorringe, Lobbe, Smedts were horrible additions big busts
Understand the needing roll players to support the drafted kids but this is where it was poorly executed particularly the way we neglected particular positional players we obviously needed and still do.
SOS has done a great job but can get better...

 

[BluesRule]

I think SOS has been very good with his first and second round picks and trading assets for high value. Can't argue that.

My issue with SOS is he seems to have the attitude of best talent available meaning we have used late picks on young project players. With such a young list and holes in specific areas these picks to me should have been used on mature bodies say 23-28 yo players. We have serious issues with Ruckman, small forwards and mids

Well balanced response.
Agree and think SOS is a substantial improvement over our previous recuiters.
What makes everybody think there is a better list manager out there who is available to us?

 

[jpfalvo]

Player development is a black hole at Carlton and has been for 20 yrs.

SOS trading of players isn't great though. Kennedy, Lang, Newman just from today's games aren't going to be their in 2 or 3 years time.

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What about 2 seconds and mcadam for McGovern. A known injury prone 10 game a year 10 possessions a game third tall fwd.

Should they not have been used in seasoned mid 20s mids. Cream not the cake, we need the cake right now.

The b.s. we have been sold about players not wanting to come, is more to do with what we are willing to pay in contract terms and cash. Maybe we need to get what we need to fill needs.

Maybe he should be casting the trade net wider than GWS and ex first rounders. Maybe we should be going for b grade talent from excellent successful systems.

Kennedy looks a bust for what we paid, setterfield another high potential high risk, marchbank the same. Very poor and should be highlighted

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[Pafloyul]

SOS has picked for need; Dow, O'Brien and Stocker were all needs based selections. More than needs based, needs assessed.

 

[Pafloyul]

What about 2 seconds and mcadam for McGovern. A known injury prone 10 game a year 10 possessions a game third tall fwd.

Should they not have been used in seasoned mid 20s mids. Cream not the cake, we need the cake right now.

The b.s. we have been sold about players not wanting to come, is more to do with what we are willing to pay in contract terms and cash. Maybe we need to get what we need to fill needs.

Maybe he should be casting the trade net wider than GWS and ex first rounders. Maybe we should be going for b grade talent from excellent successful systems.

Kennedy looks a bust for what we paid, setterfield another high potential high risk, marchbank the same. Very poor and should be highlighted

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Agree on McGovern, and some of those GWS trades were slightly overs under the circumstances. Wouldn't turn back the Marchbank trade, though, just wouldn't have gone after Pickett as well.

 

[Michael Jezz]

T

I’ve said it before: 24 mature aged players brought in, 5 are current best 22. 19 late and rookie picks used, 1 is best 22.

Early picks also uninspiring. Dow can’t kick. Apparently Worpel slid past our second and third picks that year because of kicking, but seriously... Dow can’t kick. O’brien Is miles off, SPS not showing much, the GWS guys that have come in look ordinary.

First year was great. All 5 draftees solid and a good return for the players that left. Since then has been very poor, culminating in the panicked decision to trade pick 1 this year.

I think it’s difficult to judge some of the mature players because they simply haven’t been given a fair run by the coach. Gibbons gets to play forward pocket, for example, while Dow gets unlimited chances in the midfield.

But yeah, it’s been pretty bad for 3 straight summers

This is very slanted.
Year 1 is a tick
Year 2 is a tick Don't agree- SPS is a tick Fisher at pick 25 is a tick. Both are forced to play inside when they are outside. Williamson and kerr were inspired late picks
Year 3. Dow and Obrien don't look good. De Konig looks inspired pick
Year 4. Walsh and Stocker look great

 

[jpfalvo]

SOS has picked for need; Dow, O'Brien and Stocker were all needs based selections. More than needs based, needs assessed.

All kids, I'm talking trades to fill the 23 - 27 age gap.

I'm talking miles, Lloyd, preuss, tyson, hall, even polec & pittard, kolodjashnij. Low cost to fill the list hole (with exception of polec)

J Lyon or R Conca would have been nice but both would have been difficult given one wanted to go home the other stay in QLD.

Brandon Ellis this year would be an example of good fit

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[Pafloyul]

All kids, I'm talking trades to fill the 23 - 27 age gap.

I'm talking miles, Lloyd, preuss, tyson, hall, even polec & pittard, kolodjashnij. Low cost to fill the list hole (with exception of polec)

J Lyon or R Conca would have been nice but both would have been difficult given one wanted to go home the other stay in QLD.

Brandon Ellis this year would be an example of good fit

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I agree there, rather two or three of them than one McGovern. I have a feeling that the MM trade was kind of forced from 'on high' so to speak, just don't know from whom.

 

[dlb99]

T
This is very slanted.
Year 1 is a tick
Year 2 is a tick Don't agree- SPS is a tick Fisher at pick 25 is a tick. Both are forced to play inside when they are outside. Williamson and kerr were inspired late picks
Year 3. Dow and Obrien don't look good. De Konig looks inspired pick
Year 4. Walsh and Stocker look great

Dow can come good if someone would actually dedicate time to smooth the disposal flaws.

This is the best list assembled at the Blues for 2 decades.

It can turn quickly.

However replaces the current will inherit something good.

 

[btdg]

T
This is very slanted.
Year 1 is a tick
Year 2 is a tick Don't agree- SPS is a tick Fisher at pick 25 is a tick. Both are forced to play inside when they are outside. Williamson and kerr were inspired late picks
Year 3. Dow and Obrien don't look good. De Konig looks inspired pick
Year 4. Walsh and Stocker look great

Thanks SOS!

Year 2: SPS and Fisher ok. All 4 rookies - delisted. All 4 late picks are outside our best 22. Brought in 2 veterans - both delisted. Paid a first round pick for Marchbank and Pickett - both injury prone and underwhelming. All up - 14 players recruited. 6 already delisted. Only 3 best 22 players from 14 selected. That’s appalling

Year 3: Dow - kicking so bad he is a potential bust. O’Brien - potential bust. Neither is best 22 on merit. Brought in 6 veterans. 2 are delisted, none of the other 4 are best 22 players. Brought in 2 late rookies. 1 already delisted, the other hasn’t played a senior game. De Koning - awful pick. Could have been available at 70. Taken ahead of midfielders we desperately needed like Worpel and Constable. Duplicates our best young players - at best he is trade bait. All up, 11 players recruited. The only player with any business being on the park right now is Dow in a development charity role

Year 4: Walsh - free hit at pick 1. Gifted priority access to state league players, didn’t use it. Gave up 3 assets for McPuddin - barely contributes and makes us too top heavy. Traded a future top 20 pick for Setterfield who is borderline best 22. Traded future pick 1 for Stocker who looks a solid back pocket prospect. Brought in 6 other mature players. Only 2 are best 22. 3 other late picks - none look remotely like contributing. 13 players added, 5 best 22.

The best that can be said is that our top 25 picks the last 3 years have been ok. Everything else is a complete shambles. It’s almost surprising when someone a mature age pickup actually does well at this point - and even then, Newman’s 10 Clanger effort today makes me wonder...

 

[Michael Jezz]

Thanks SOS!

Year 2: SPS and Fisher ok. All 4 rookies - delisted. All 4 late picks are outside our best 22. Brought in 2 veterans - both delisted. Paid a first round pick for Marchbank and Pickett - both injury prone and underwhelming. All up - 14 players recruited. 6 already delisted. Only 3 best 22 players from 14 selected. That’s appalling

Year 3: Dow - kicking so bad he is a potential bust. O’Brien - potential bust. Neither is best 22 on merit. Brought in 6 veterans. 2 are delisted, none of the other 4 are best 22 players. Brought in 2 late rookies. 1 already delisted, the other hasn’t played a senior game. De Koning - awful pick. Could have been available at 70. Taken ahead of midfielders we desperately needed like Worpel and Constable. Duplicates our best young players - at best he is trade bait. All up, 11 players recruited. The only player with any business being on the park right now is Dow in a development charity role

Year 4: Walsh - free hit at pick 1. Gifted priority access to state league players, didn’t use it. Gave up 3 assets for McPuddin - barely contributes and makes us too top heavy. Traded a future top 20 pick for Setterfield who is borderline best 22. Traded future pick 1 for Stocker who looks a solid back pocket prospect. Brought in 6 other mature players. Only 2 are best 22. 3 other late picks - none look remotely like contributing. 13 players added, 5 best 22.

The best that can be said is that our top 25 picks the last 3 years have been ok. Everything else is a complete shambles. It’s almost surprising when someone a mature age pickup actually does well at this point - and even then, Newman’s 10 Clanger effort today makes me wonder...

The problem with late picks is a function of walking into a recruitment department with poor personnel and no analytics

 

[btdg]

The problem with late picks is a function of walking into a recruitment department with poor personnel and no analytics

Surely the head of recruiting is responsible for, I dunno, the personnel and analytics in the recruiting department?

And so the alternative is going ‘well, I liked that guy 3 years ago when he was in high school and I drafted him to my previous club, so why not?’

Even the trades we have made look dumb. Hawthorn gave up pick 44 for Jack Scrimshaw and got back pick 54 as well. We gave up pick 20 and 42 for Will Setterfield who was taken two picks earlier in the same draft and was coming off a knee reconstruction.

 

[I bleed Blue]

Sacking SOS basically says to our playing group "You are SOS's mistakes"

We have to stick with SOS. If we think that coaching is the problem then we need to let the new coach work with this group to know how SOS has really done.

Sack SOS and we need to rebuild/reshape the list.