Opinion Stephen Silvagni

DangerousD

Formerly 'dangerousdane'
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No

There is a massive difference between being ‘over ruled’ and ‘not being involved’. You just continue to not get it.
That’s if you believe everything written in a dodgy newspaper.
I don’t believe this stuff happens by accident and if SOS wasn’t involved, I still believe he knew, even though the HS said he didn’t.

SOS being overuled and not having the ultimate say on who comes in, which includes Betts, is the crux of the problem.

So maybe you don’t get it as much as you think.
 

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DangerousD

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I agree that many have gone too hard with some of the comments, so let's strip it back

If one had to go, who you prefer it to be and why?

If I was making the call it would be Liddle. Easier to find a decent CEO, rather than a decent recruiter
If one had to go, it’s easy, the one who is being unreasonable and not pulling in the same direction the club want to go.

Whoever that is, the club board will know and hopefully make the right call, I still hold hope for a resolution.
 

Nori

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SOS not done yet..
You just made my night!!! There is something terribly wrong about SOS having to fend off a CEO that appears to have been drinking his own bathwater. He's the only individual within the club that actually has the strength (character and reputation) to tell CEOs and board members to butt out of list management decisions. I hope for the sake of the club that SOS prevails.
 

DangerousD

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Yes you can. SOS should be overruled by probably Brodie and his team when he needs to be (at the draft) and the coach for recruits in instants where it’s not really going to have a majorly affect on the list. Liddle should have no say in this area.
As I agree with the call that was made I’m happy for a set up that works like that, but I’ve been told SOS isn’t too keen on that type of deal, I also have no issue with the CEO bringing potential recruits through the club as long as SOS and co actually decide to recruit them.
 

Nori

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Yes you can. SOS should be overruled by probably Brodie and his team when he needs to be (at the draft) and the coach for recruits in instants where it’s not really going to have a majorly affect on the list. Liddle should have no say in this area.
Absolutely. No problem with a healthy debate between people that have expert knowledge. What's not fine is someone who has no expertise (i.e Liddle) overruling the experts.
 

DangerousD

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The main bias I am seeing littered throughout the Carlton forum is your own.

It's tiresome, and a minority position to boot. Give it a rest.
That’s quite funny, I’m interested to hear what you think my bias is? I take it you know what bias is?

Minority position? You mean someone who refuses to believe articles in the HS and someone who doesn’t take ITK posters opinions as fact.
 

Elmer_Judd

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Absolutely. No problem with a healthy debate between people that have expert knowledge. What's not fine is someone who has no expertise (i.e Liddle) overruling the experts.
This is the thing though, no one knows for sure what has actually happened for this fall out to happen, I worshipped SOS as a whipper snapper Carlton fan (still do) but how do we know for sure that Liddle is the villain in this piece and SOS an scapegoat ?

It all boils down to FACTS, we need established FACTS to make an objective and balanced opinion as to the events that have taken place, otherwise its all speculation and conjecture at this point (and why I strongly feel that the club and associated person's involved have to make a concise and honest statement about what is happening, sooner rather than later)

Liddle for all we know, is the innocent party in this fiasco, lets see how this thing plays out.
 

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DangerousD

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This is the thing though, no one knows for sure what has actually happened for this fall out to happen, I worshipped SOS as a whipper snapper Carlton fan (still do) but how do we know for sure that Liddle is the villain in this piece and SOS an scapegoat ?

It all boils down to FACTS, we need established FACTS to make an objective and balanced opinion as to the events that have taken place, otherwise its all speculation and conjecture at this point (and why I strongly feel that the club and associated person's involved have to make a concise and honest statement about what is happening, sooner rather than later)

Liddle for all we know, is the innocent party in this fiasco, lets see how this thing plays out.
Actual common sense, he also might not, it’s also possible both parties are stubborn and are sticking to their guns on what’s best for the football club.

People should be smarter than to just blindly fall for media crap and rumours.
 

Arr0w

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If one had to go, it’s easy, the one who is being unreasonable and not pulling in the same direction the club want to go.

Whoever that is, the club board will know and hopefully make the right call, I still hold hope for a resolution.
Okay, will narrow the criteria

Let's say both are equally stubborn, which one goes, which stays

Shoot
 

SOS must stay

Draftee
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Okay, will narrow the criteria

Let's say both are equally stubborn, which one goes, which stays

Shoot
Is this even a question?

Brad Lloyd has come from a basket case in Freo, Liddle was the membership guy at Richmond, Silvagni is the architect of potentially the greatest ever overhaul in arguably the most important domain of an AFL club.

This nonsense about Liddle and Lloyd being 'system driven' which rubs Silvagni up the wrong way. Who cares what Liddle and Lloyd think about list management. It would be like Barker and Cripps clashing on midfield setups, is it even a question which one goes if it becomes untenable?
 

DangerousD

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Okay, will narrow the criteria

Let's say both are equally stubborn, which one goes, which stays

Shoot
Im not going to pick a name out of a hat and play favourites of some sort. Whats the point of choosing a name?
But
If they are both equally as stubborn and are equally to blame, the club would have to evaluate which role is easier replaced and also weight up, will whoever replaces either position, have the same issues as his predecessor and who is better at their job.

The club would also need to take in to consideration, potential conflict of interest concerns if another SOS is drafted.
 

Arr0w

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Im not going to pick a name out of a hat and play favourites of some sort. Whats the point of choosing a name?
But
If they are both equally as stubborn and are equally to blame, the club would have to evaluate which role is easier replaced and also weight up, will whoever replaces either position, have the same issues as his predecessor and who is better at their job.

The club would also need to take in to consideration, potential conflict of interest concerns if another SOS is drafted.
Careful of those splinters
 

DangerousD

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Careful of those splinters
Sitting on the fence in regards to a made up hypothetical yes, not in reality. I have tried to be clear in my posting the last few days where i stand. I want the Carlton football club to move forward and be successful, for this to happen we have to have everyone pulling in the same direction, if there are some that aren't and are not ready to back the direction of the club, then that's who i think should go.

The names are irrelevant, their history is irrelevant. I don't know the facts but people within the club do and they will make the call.
 

Macca43

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If one had to go, it’s easy, the one who is being unreasonable and not pulling in the same direction the club want to go.

Whoever that is, the club board will know and hopefully make the right call, I still hold hope for a resolution.
Why do we want everyone to agree? Differing points of view and debate are healthy to have.

SOS got his way on almost every recruitment, the one he was over ruled on he got for the price he was happy to accept. Seems like everything working well to me.
 

DangerousD

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Why do we want everyone to agree? Differing points of view and debate are healthy to have.

SOS got his way on almost every recruitment, the one he was over ruled on he got for the price he was happy to accept. Seems like everything working well to me.
If everyone agreed here it would be a pretty boring place, i hope whatever issues there are, they can be worked through.
 

Macca43

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If everyone agreed here it would be a pretty boring place, i hope whatever issues there are, they can be worked through.
I struggle to believe 2 people with the experience and reputation of Liddel and SOS would allow differences of opinion to derail them or the club or to be so petty and power hungry that they are the only allowed an idea.
 

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