Review Strategy changes to turn this thing around

[GoEaglesGoSGIO]

I tend to find these discussions bounced around many many different threads so its probably worth localising it to one. If their is one thing to understand or look at over these last 5 years is not much has changed in the last 5 years... Sure we moved Kelly to the WAFL for a few weeks and Mini came in to do press conferences instead of Adam Simpson. We have also moved alot of the faceless people on with fitness and medical staff for sure but when it comes to the 120 minutes per week of football, not a hell of alot has changed. We still play with 4 tall forwards, we still have no tagger, we still have no defensive pressure up forward, we still have no lead up CHF. It just goes on and on.

Perhaps if we put some ideas in here the muppets can read them and look at them . I dunno, im bored. These are the changes im wanting to see from now til the end of the season

- Hough into the middle as a tagger - He went in the midfield with limited success, went back down back and is failing hard. Why not just go back to the limited success aspect. I dunno about you but im sick of knowing the oppositions best player will towel us up week in week out with absolutely nothing done to prevent it
- McCarthy as full time midfielder - Well he trained in that spot. We lack pace in around the stoppages too. He has shown defensive intent as well when in the middle. Just ****ing do it already
- Resting midfielder up forward - Are we the only team in the AFL to not do this besides North? When you lack defensive pressure in the midfielder it means you need a extra midfielder in your team at the sacrifice of something. Hewett, Reid and Kelly all need HF time
- No more 4 tall forwards, even if MRP lights on fire- Enough. It hasnt worked for 5 ****ing years. Its not going to work. GIVE.UP
- Yeo down back - A big part of Norths resurgence is the use of Luke Parker

26

Luke Parker

Age

33

Ht

183cm

Wt

88kg

Pos.

M/F

Career

Season

Last 5

D

24.2

5star

K

12.6

5star

HB

11.6

5star

M

3.8

4star

T

5.6

5star

CL

5.8

5star

D

22.1

5star

K

12.3

5star

HB

9.9

5star

M

3.9

4star

T

5.0

5star

CL

5.5

5star

D

21.2

5star

K

11.4

4star

HB

9.8

5star

M

2.0

3star

T

8.0

5star

CL

5.2

5star

down back. A veteran head and steady influence. Now we know Duggan cannot do that, we know Baker cannot do that so get someone else to do that ffs
- Baker in the midfield mix - Game has gone past him as a flanker but we know he can still win a hard ball so perhaps just play him in that role.
- Tag someone from the forward line - With Hutchinson back the role id like to see him in is simply nullifying the oppositions best intercepter. Somewhat of a tag but knowing also Huthincson can tackle and help keep the ball in
- Blood players in defense - We really struggle with pace and agility down back so lets put the guys with some down there. Time for Grego to get a full time gig and Allan to have a year in defense to
- Waterman as lead up CHF - Best way to stop the yips is to bring him up the ground. Even Dean Cox

Dean Cox

Age

44

Ht

203cm

Wt

107kg

Pos.

F/R

Career

Season

Last 5

D

15.9

4star

K

8.9

3star

HB

6.9

4star

M

5.3

5star

T

1.5

3star

G

0.6

4star

No current season stats available

D

13.0

4star

K

5.8

3star

HB

7.2

5star

M

4.8

5star

T

1.4

4star

G

0.0

1star

figured this out during the SOO as his best role. Have him lead up and then run back with his man.

This would leave us with the following over the next coming weeks

HB: Ginbey, H.Edwards, Grego
FB: Lindsay, Young, Yeo
C: Davis, Reid, Duursma
HF: Murdock, Waterman, Hewett
FF: Owies, Shanahan, Hutchinson
R: Williams, McCarthy, Hough
I/C: Baker, Gross, Kelly, Allan, CDT

A more rounded team which matches more what the oppositon are doing with a defensive structure and some actual tactical changes. I thank you for listening to this Ted Talk

 

[Doashuey]

Some good ideas. Worth trying a few of them at this stage I think. Dont have much to lose.
Yeo to defence instead of Duggan would really make us a better team I think if we can cover his midfield output.
Im assuming Allan out of your named team is an oversight given you want him to do a stint in defence?

 

[Quinz]

The thing is Yeo was our second highest clearance winner yesterday, and drifted forward to have 4 shots at goal (the less said about them the better).

I fear that we need his grunt in the middle still.

 

[GoEaglesGoSGIO]

The thing is Yeo was our second highest clearance winner yesterday, and drifted forward to have 4 shots at goal (the less said about them the better).

I fear that we need his grunt in the middle still.

I think we need some more pace in the middle though and more leadership in defense so the swap of McCarthy and Yeo can achieve that. The pressure would be on McCarthy to use his pace to provide some extra defensive pressure which I feel he can do.

 

[No Hassle Hough]

I thought Mini played the tall forward line to get games into Archer, CDT and Shanahan.

However, when Archer went out he brought in JW to replace him.

Maybe he just doesn’t rate the smaller options? Doesn’t make a lot of sense to me.

 

[HellsBells88]

Yeo to half back is a great call. Definitely would miss him in the middle but we need some physicality and organisation back there pretty quickly.
I have a feeling we will see Harry Edwards and Shanahands as our key backs before the season is finished. It feels like our second key forward needs to be able to chop out the ruck and we can’t keep fronting up with all of them so we can only really have one of CDT, archer when he’s back, or JW.
I thought Duggan as the tagging forward would be an option, he’s not getting dropped and a dump kick into the forward line isn’t ideal but a hell of a lot better than coming out of the backline.
Baker should really be in the middle, he can fill a lot of spots but I think the forward line is the last place I’d have him.
I’m not feeling this game plan. We should have gone a bit more basic and balanced then started adding to it with what we have and as they all developed. We’ve gone all in on attack straight off the bat which just seems so backwards. If we can’t defend the ground and let teams score from nearly every entry we have no chance to be competitive

 

[Smotie2]

I tend to find these discussions bounced around many many different threads so its probably worth localising it to one. If their is one thing to understand or look at over these last 5 years is not much has changed in the last 5 years... Sure we moved Kelly to the WAFL for a few weeks and Mini came in to do press conferences instead of Adam Simpson. We have also moved alot of the faceless people on with fitness and medical staff for sure but when it comes to the 120 minutes per week of football, not a hell of alot has changed. We still play with 4 tall forwards, we still have no tagger, we still have no defensive pressure up forward, we still have no lead up CHF. It just goes on and on.

Perhaps if we put some ideas in here the muppets can read them and look at them . I dunno, im bored. These are the changes im wanting to see from now til the end of the season

- Hough into the middle as a tagger - He went in the midfield with limited success, went back down back and is failing hard. Why not just go back to the limited success aspect. I dunno about you but im sick of knowing the oppositions best player will towel us up week in week out with absolutely nothing done to prevent it
- McCarthy as full time midfielder - Well he trained in that spot. We lack pace in around the stoppages too. He has shown defensive intent as well when in the middle. Just ****ing do it already
- Resting midfielder up forward - Are we the only team in the AFL to not do this besides North? When you lack defensive pressure in the midfielder it means you need a extra midfielder in your team at the sacrifice of something. Hewett, Reid and Kelly all need HF time
- No more 4 tall forwards, even if MRP lights on fire- Enough. It hasnt worked for 5 ****ing years. Its not going to work. GIVE.UP
- Yeo down back - A big part of Norths resurgence is the use of Luke Parker down back. A veteran head and steady influence. Now we know Duggan cannot do that, we know Baker cannot do that so get someone else to do that ffs
- Baker in the midfield mix - Game has gone past him as a flanker but we know he can still win a hard ball so perhaps just play him in that role.
- Tag someone from the forward line - With Hutchinson back the role id like to see him in is simply nullifying the oppositions best intercepter. Somewhat of a tag but knowing also Huthincson can tackle and help keep the ball in
- Blood players in defense - We really struggle with pace and agility down back so lets put the guys with some down there. Time for Grego to get a full time gig and Allan to have a year in defense to
- Waterman as lead up CHF - Best way to stop the yips is to bring him up the ground. Even Dean Cox figured this out during the SOO as his best role. Have him lead up and then run back with his man.

This would leave us with the following over the next coming weeks

HB: Ginbey, H.Edwards, Grego
FB: Lindsay, Young, Yeo
C: Davis, Reid, Duursma
HF: Murdock, Waterman, Hewett
FF: Owies, Shanahan, Hutchinson
R: Williams, McCarthy, Hough
I/C: Baker, Gross, Kelly, Allan, CDT

A more rounded team which matches more what the oppositon are doing with a defensive structure and some actual tactical changes. I thank you for listening to this Ted Talk

I agree with your ideas and strategies but this won't happen because mini won't ever drop Duggan.
Everything revolves around this one decision and u til it happens nothing will change.

A major part of our issues has been leadership, intent and pressure and until Duggan is gone this won't be addressed

 

[ghostbat12]

positional changes isnt going to make this better. train team defense, following opposition players and for love of god, practise when to leave your man to impact contest and when not to.

too many are getting sucked in and not holding their position/covering their man. tell them unless you impact the contest, hold your position.

 

[Reminiscence]

Send Bo into the middle.
Explosive two way runner who takes the game on and is defensively sound as well.
Send in McCarthy for more midfield rotations, shift TK to wing & HF more

Shift Duggan to HF, Baker to HB

 

[ghostbat12]

Send Bo into the middle.
Explosive two way runner who takes the game on and is defensively sound as well.
Send in McCarthy for more midfield rotations, shift TK to wing & HF more

Shift Duggan to HF, Baker to HB

none of that stops end to end goal scoring that opposition do. even from kick ins.

this week, improve pressure pressure pressure and run run run run with your opponent. don't get sucked in and stand aside.

sick of seeing 3-4 eagles players hanging around next to each other. they are all playing their own individual pressure game.

 

[Mighty Eagles]

I would like to see our leadership group take more accountability for the past month.

We’ve been incredibly generous with some players, in terms of their contract & selection. Time for them to put their hand up when the tide is against us.

 

[DorothyG]

We need forward half pressure.

When the ball hits the deck after the inevitable long bomb, we need to win it back our self or force the stoppage.

That allows time those up the ground to set up defensively or create the wall for repeat entry.

That isn't happening ATM, the ball hits the deck, rebounds out of the 50 due to lack of pressure and our mids/backs are in attack mode and out of position defensive wise. The then don't know or are unable to transition to a shut down mode quick enough.

We've show moments in games when we get the time we can lock the ball in our forward half and stop the easy transition, we just need that time which we aren't getting.

I think playing JWilliams was an error and can see him being replaced by an Owies. We've been too forward tall this year and need to change that up

 

[Truckosaurus]

Lead for the ball. Even if the opposition has their defensive zone set up, lead for the ball. Either:

• you draw a defender off their mark and create space for someone else or
• you create a two on one that you're hitting with momentum

Long down the line to the pack is the safest option but also the one with the least likelihood of leading to a score. It's 90% of how we move the ball out of the backline. Every second week I sit in my seat and wait 30 seconds for a player at half back to make that same decision over and over again. And they make it because no one is moving for them (sometimes someone will move and they're too slow to take it, but no one puts in a second lead).

See also: bombing long to the hot spot.

Movement makes things happen. Just run for the ball, please. And honour the lead.

 

[Knifey Spoony]

I would like to see Baker go in the middle as a tagger. He is our captain, put him on the oppositions best player and have him show the way by beating his opponent.

 

[Wellillbe]

Some great ideas and strategies. But i think our most important issue that needs addressing is getting our best player, playing good footy, we can not have Harley just been the handball over the head guy out of a pack whilst he gets mauled by 3 tacklers. On the weekend he had 27 touches 19 of them were handballs and i reckon 15 of them were over his head look aways. I will die on this hill, Harley isnt a midfielder. Wasted there doesnt have pace to burn and his second, third efforts arent there cause he spends half his time recovering from wrestling and been hammered by opposition players. I reckon his spot is high half forward rolling up to contest, bursting through, not standing at rucks feet wrestling.

HF: Reid Waterman Hewett
F: Murdoch Shanahan Champion

 

[PremiershipNo4]

Some desperation to win the ball, win the contest would be a start point.
It’s pathetic, just no fight.
I’m so sick of people defending our team on this forum, sink the boots in they deserve it.
We are the softest team in the AFL, we just roll over.
You don’t consistently get beltings unless you roll over, have a ****ing go!

 

[Balls In]

Some great ideas and strategies. But i think our most important issue that needs addressing is getting our best player, playing good footy, we can not have Harley just been the handball over the head guy out of a pack whilst he gets mauled by 3 tacklers. On the weekend he had 27 touches 19 of them were handballs and i reckon 15 of them were over his head look aways. I will die on this hill, Harley isnt a midfielder. Wasted there doesnt have pace to burn and his second, third efforts arent there cause he spends half his time recovering from wrestling and been hammered by opposition players. I reckon his spot is high half forward rolling up to contest, bursting through, not standing at rucks feet wrestling.

HF: Reid Waterman Hewett
F: Murdoch Shanahan Champion

Losing two big bodied tackling machines from around the contests has coincided this drastic decline in our performances. Aside from many easy breakaway clearances and a mountain of uncontested possession we are now gifting the opposition, the lack of defence mids also means players we prefer to play more outside like Harley are having to be more inside. It's a massive lose lose.

 

[GoEaglesGoSGIO]

Losing two big bodied tackling machines from around the contests has coincided this drastic decline in our performances. Aside from many easy breakaway clearances and a mountain of uncontested possession we are now gifting the opposition, the lack of defence mids also means players we prefer to play more outside like Harley are having to be more inside. It's a massive lose lose.

People blocking for him as opposed to the tackling aspect

One issue I have with Harley is his 1 on 1 contest work around moving his man and marking is his strength and we have never and i mean ever tried to use it. We are so obsessed with trying to make him work as a midfielder we havnt bothered working on his versatility.

Its poor coaching that comes from a obsession with 4 talls, small midfield rotations and a inability to change tactics from when we are winning possession to vs when we are not . A reason the teams run away with big leads is because we do nothing different to stop it

 

[Ambrose Burnside]

Lead for the ball. Even if the opposition has their defensive zone set up, lead for the ball. Either:

• you draw a defender off their mark and create space for someone else or
• you create a two on one that you're hitting with momentum

Long down the line to the pack is the safest option but also the one with the least likelihood of leading to a score. It's 90% of how we move the ball out of the backline. Every second week I sit in my seat and wait 30 seconds for a player at half back to make that same decision over and over again. And they make it because no one is moving for them (sometimes someone will move and they're too slow to take it, but no one puts in a second lead).

See also: bombing long to the hot spot.

Movement makes things happen. Just run for the ball, please. And honour the lead.

I go hoarse yelling "give him something to kick to you lazy (insert multiple expletives of increasing inventiveness here" all game long

 

[GoEaglesGoSGIO]

I go hoarse yelling "give him something to kick to you lazy (insert multiple expletives of increasing inventiveness here" all game long

I think its because people dont block for each other so players dont really have a way to lead up to the ball. None of our forwards are going to turn their opponent on the lead except maybe Waterman so we need blocking which is fairly easy with the big bodies we have but then we simply never do it or try to do it. All 4 of our forwards like to sit slightlly seperated so our dumb bailout kicks have a contest of some sort to hit, ignoring the fact the contest isnt helpful since we dont really win them at all. We need Shanahan and CDT next to each other trying to provide a block for whoever is moving.

The player we should be trying to hit on the lead is CDT. You are absolutely zero chance of spoiling it once he gets his hands out. He is too long . He either marks it or you chop his arms and he gets a free

 

[ziad]

I think its because people dont block for each other so players dont really have a way to lead up to the ball. None of our forwards are going to turn their opponent on the lead except maybe Waterman so we need blocking which is fairly easy with the big bodies we have but then we simply never do it or try to do it. All 4 of our forwards like to sit slightlly seperated so our dumb bailout kicks have a contest of some sort to hit, ignoring the fact the contest isnt helpful since we dont really win them at all. We need Shanahan and CDT next to each other trying to provide a block for whoever is moving.

The player we should be trying to hit on the lead is CDT. You are absolutely zero chance of spoiling it once he gets his hands out. He is too long . He either marks it or you chop his arms and he gets a free

our key forwards are 18-19 years old - give them a few years. Waterman is a third tall and well short of being a key power target.

 

[GoEaglesGoSGIO]

our key forwards are 18-19 years old - give them a few years. Waterman is a third tall and well short of being a key power target.

The issue isnt the success or failure of something. They dont even try to do it. Its not a 18 years old thing, its a coaching thing. Bello should be long gone. The guy is as inept as can be.

I dont see the point of replacing Simmo yet keeping the treasure chest of failure he had in the backroom. It needed to be a full cleanout from top to bottom.

 

[Balls In]

I honestly don't think our current situation has anything really to do with onfield. Our future relies 100% on retaining our key young talent, getting as many games into them as possible, and upgrading many Simpson era seniors as we can.

 

[Jumpoff Joey]

I tend to find these discussions bounced around many many different threads so its probably worth localising it to one. If their is one thing to understand or look at over these last 5 years is not much has changed in the last 5 years... Sure we moved Kelly to the WAFL for a few weeks and Mini came in to do press conferences instead of Adam Simpson. We have also moved alot of the faceless people on with fitness and medical staff for sure but when it comes to the 120 minutes per week of football, not a hell of alot has changed. We still play with 4 tall forwards, we still have no tagger, we still have no defensive pressure up forward, we still have no lead up CHF. It just goes on and on.

Perhaps if we put some ideas in here the muppets can read them and look at them . I dunno, im bored. These are the changes im wanting to see from now til the end of the season

- Hough into the middle as a tagger - He went in the midfield with limited success, went back down back and is failing hard. Why not just go back to the limited success aspect. I dunno about you but im sick of knowing the oppositions best player will towel us up week in week out with absolutely nothing done to prevent it
- McCarthy as full time midfielder - Well he trained in that spot. We lack pace in around the stoppages too. He has shown defensive intent as well when in the middle. Just ****ing do it already
- Resting midfielder up forward - Are we the only team in the AFL to not do this besides North? When you lack defensive pressure in the midfielder it means you need a extra midfielder in your team at the sacrifice of something. Hewett, Reid and Kelly all need HF time
- No more 4 tall forwards, even if MRP lights on fire- Enough. It hasnt worked for 5 ****ing years. Its not going to work. GIVE.UP
- Yeo down back - A big part of Norths resurgence is the use of Luke Parker down back. A veteran head and steady influence. Now we know Duggan cannot do that, we know Baker cannot do that so get someone else to do that ffs
- Baker in the midfield mix - Game has gone past him as a flanker but we know he can still win a hard ball so perhaps just play him in that role.
- Tag someone from the forward line - With Hutchinson back the role id like to see him in is simply nullifying the oppositions best intercepter. Somewhat of a tag but knowing also Huthincson can tackle and help keep the ball in
- Blood players in defense - We really struggle with pace and agility down back so lets put the guys with some down there. Time for Grego to get a full time gig and Allan to have a year in defense to
- Waterman as lead up CHF - Best way to stop the yips is to bring him up the ground. Even Dean Cox figured this out during the SOO as his best role. Have him lead up and then run back with his man.

This would leave us with the following over the next coming weeks

HB: Ginbey, H.Edwards, Grego
FB: Lindsay, Young, Yeo
C: Davis, Reid, Duursma
HF: Murdock, Waterman, Hewett
FF: Owies, Shanahan, Hutchinson
R: Williams, McCarthy, Hough
I/C: Baker, Gross, Kelly, Allan, CDT

A more rounded team which matches more what the oppositon are doing with a defensive structure and some actual tactical changes. I thank you for listening to this Ted Talk

Hough, as a tagger, creates a defensive vacuum. Hough is our best one-on-one defender against small-to-medium forwards. Moving him to the middle exposes the backline to small forwards. I prefer losing midfield (35 disposals) to risking/leaking 5 goals to a small forward.

Maybe it's worth having Ginbey as the tagger?

I do think McCarthy should play D50 primarily. IMO, McCarthy and Lindsay have found their position as Half-Back Flankers, providing speed and distribution. I would want to keep them in the back half to turn defence into offence.

I don't believe we have anyone else who is more suited to these roles. Their distribution by foot will be important for modern-day footy.

Between Baker/Yeo, they should be the general, organising the kids and providing stability. I don't see Duggan lasting, to be honest. Both of them can rotate into midfield only for clearances or over the quarter, then return to defence.

The four-tall argument is getting lost; we need to turn one into a ruck or KPD. For me, it's Archer Reid. It frees up Ginbey and provides more speed, transition and mobility around the ground. I think we are shooting ourselves in the foot here because he is too good and being lost to play on the best key forward.

The spine should be AReid/Young/BBW/Shanahan and Waterman and coming from the interchange is CDT chopping out BBW 40/60 split% tog.

It will take about six to twelve months to figure this out. We still need to find a balance in the midfield and its connection to the F50. I'm having trouble seeing how Bo Allan, Hamish Davis, Hutchinson, Graham, Greggo, Gross, Kelly, and Hewett all fit.

Duursma and Reid are the only guaranteed spots.

I am leaning towards Hewett, Hutchinson and probably Champion to play F50, with Harley rotating through.

Nevertheless, I would not be chucking the baby out with the bath water. It's just going to take time to figure out where they settle. For me, it's not black or white yet...

 

[GoEaglesGoSGIO]

Hough, as a tagger, creates a defensive vacuum. Hough is our best one-on-one defender against small-to-medium forwards. Moving him to the middle exposes the backline to small forwards. I prefer losing midfield (35 disposals) to risking/leaking 5 goals to a small forward.

Maybe it's worth having Ginbey as the tagger?

I do think McCarthy should play D50 primarily. IMO, McCarthy and Lindsay have found their position as Half-Back Flankers, providing speed and distribution. I would want to keep them in the back half to turn defence into offence.

I don't believe we have anyone else who is more suited to these roles. Their distribution by foot will be important for modern-day footy.

Between Baker/Yeo, they should be the general, organising the kids and providing stability. I don't see Duggan lasting, to be honest. Both of them can rotate into midfield only for clearances or over the quarter, then return to defence.

The four-tall argument is getting lost; we need to turn one into a ruck or KPD. For me, it's Archer Reid. It frees up Ginbey and provides more speed, transition and mobility around the ground. I think we are shooting ourselves in the foot here because he is too good and being lost to play on the best key forward.

The spine should be AReid/Young/BBW/Shanahan and Waterman and coming from the interchange is CDT chopping out BBW 40/60 split% tog.

It will take about six to twelve months to figure this out. We still need to find a balance in the midfield and its connection to the F50. I'm having trouble seeing how Bo Allan, Hamish Davis, Hutchinson, Graham, Greggo, Gross, Kelly, and Hewett all fit.

Duursma and Reid are the only guaranteed spots.

I am leaning towards Hewett, Hutchinson and probably Champion to play F50, with Harley rotating through.

Nevertheless, I would not be chucking the baby out with the bath water. It's just going to take time to figure out where they settle. For me, it's not black or white yet...

• Im ok with a small forward kicking 5 instead of 2 if it means stopping the teams best midfielder from smashing us to pieces. I kind of trust Grego/Allan to be able to stop a man also moreso, especially Allan. Guys got some mongrel
• I think Yeos decision making and ball use is as good as McCarthys. Its a like for like
• I think Archer Reid needs to be a KPD but wont happen overnight and is probably next years conversation unfortunately