News Suns to ask for Pick 1 as a priority pick

[Johnny Bananas]

Carrara oval had Rugby played on it before the VFL played its first game there in 1986. Where else should of built the stadium?

I can think of at least three better locations for accessibility.

The AFL doesn’t build train lines to MCG, Adelaide oval, Perth Stadium, the SCG. The state governments do that.

Any more brilliant insights, Sherlock?

The AFL are masters of lobbying. They've successfully lobbied for pretty much every club to get a new training facility built with government funding. They had the ability to lobby for a new stadium to be built in a more accessible location, instead they lobbied for the rebuilding of Carrara which is in a truly awful location for building a consistent and regular fanbase.

You think the AFL is neglecting them? They pump $25 million into the club every year. They didn’t spend a fortune to just neglect them.

No, I said Gold Coast were neglected at startup. Not as badly the Bears or Freo were, and not simply taken advantage of like the Eagles or Crows, but still not good enough.

 

[Blackas87]

I can think of at least three better locations for accessibility.


Any more brilliant insights, Sherlock?

The AFL are masters of lobbying. They've successfully lobbied for pretty much every club to get a new training facility built with government funding. They had the ability to lobby for a new stadium to be built in a more accessible location, instead they lobbied for the rebuilding of Carrara which is in a truly awful location for building a consistent and regular fanbase.


No, I said Gold Coast were neglected at startup. Not as badly the Bears or Freo were, and not simply taken advantage of like the Eagles or Crows, but still not good enough.

What are the locations?

The Gold Coast isn’t that big. Carrara is 15 mins from Surfers Paradise and 5 minutes of off the Pacific Motorway. I lived 2017 near Coolangatta, strait up the motorway and turn off, was easy to get to. Yes parking a pain in the ass and having to get shuttle bus in.

I’d love to know (because I’m thinking of moving permanently to the Coolangatta area because it’s awesome down there) a better location for where the Suns should play that would be easier to get to.

I disagree they were neglected, apart from training facilities which still helped them improve over the first 4 years.

 

[kreglze]

What are the locations?

The Gold Coast isn’t that big. Carrara is 15 mins from Surfers Paradise and 5 minutes of off the Pacific Motorway. I lived 2017 near Coolangatta, strait up the motorway and turn off, was easy to get to. Yes parking a pain in the ass and having to get shuttle bus in.

I’d love to know (because I’m thinking of moving permanently to the Coolangatta area because it’s awesome down there) a better location for where the Suns should play that would be easier to get to.

I disagree they were neglected, apart from training facilities which still helped them improve over the first 4 years.

This is my opinion, but being in absolutely woeful training facilities since day 1 has really contributed to the awful injury lists and general conditioning of the players early on. Not being in elite surroundings means not having elite output. Yeah we had a 10 win season off pure talent and Gary Ablett being in the best form of his career. But as soon as injuries came about, we absolutely crumbled. Winning 2 of our last 8.

 

[Procrastinator35]

Did you hold the same belief when Hawthorn got their three priority picks? Hawthorn, Carlton and Melbourne have all had three picks at the start of the 1st round. The GCS are a basket case, much worse than what those teams ever were. Now those teams and Collingwood are allowed to use the northern clubs as their recruitment grounds.

3 eh?....Perhaps you should do some thorough research before putting your foot in it.

Melbourne has received twice as many priority picks in the first round; 4 to our 2.....And A fat lot of good it's done em.

So much for that argument then.

 

[Lore]

What has GWS getting have to go with the GC not being set up properly? GWS got way over the top imo.

Fact is Gold Coast had 10 win, 12 losses, 93.7% after 4 season, and the club was running in the right direction. They were basically a middle club, missed the finals by 2 games and % and everyone was expecting them to make the leap to finals the following year.

They made decisions that turned them backwards.

I’ll give you the tin shed facilities even though they were improving in those years, it didn’t seem to matter back then.

The transport to the stadium should have nothing to do how the team performs.

While that may be the case, the people that were there making decisions a decade ago have largely been replaced, most especially in the last 18 months. Why penalise the people who wear that jumper now on the basis of what the people wearing that jumper a decade ago chose to do with it?

To quote a fox footy article from earlier this year:
"The Suns appointed Mark Evans as CEO, Jon Haines as head of football, Stuart Dew as senior coach and Craig Cameron as list manager at different stages of 2017. They knew as soon as they got there that changes needed to be made, but halfway through last year they realised they needed to make an aggressive reset.

The key four pillars oversaw 27 different changes across the football and high performance department, including five new coaches and an influx of mature-age recruits from rival clubs or out of the state leagues who were all highly regarded for their character, as well as the introduction of a player excellence program that has the potential to be the benchmark of the competition."

Inside the ‘major reset’ that has changed the culture of the Gold Coast Suns

How 27 changes rescued Suns from doomsday scenario

www.foxsports.com.au

Any PP decisions need to be made based on what these people are doing now, and will be able to do into the future. Not what was done by other people in the past ten years.

I dare say Mark Evans would still have some pull at AFL House as well, if ever they needed to convince the league to help them.

 

[Blackas87]

3 eh?....Perhaps you should do some thorough research before putting your foot in it.

Melbourne has received twice as many priority picks in the first round; 4 to our 2.....And A fat lot of good it's done em.

So much for that argument then.

Melbourne have only taken Sylvia and Scully as priority picks at the start of the first round

 

[Blackas87]

While that may be the case, the people that were there making decisions a decade ago have largely been replaced, most especially in the last 18 months. Why penalise the people who wear that jumper now on the basis of what the people wearing that jumper a decade ago chose to do with it?

To quote a fox footy article from earlier this year:
"The Suns appointed Mark Evans as CEO, Jon Haines as head of football, Stuart Dew as senior coach and Craig Cameron as list manager at different stages of 2017. They knew as soon as they got there that changes needed to be made, but halfway through last year they realised they needed to make an aggressive reset.

The key four pillars oversaw 27 different changes across the football and high performance department, including five new coaches and an influx of mature-age recruits from rival clubs or out of the state leagues who were all highly regarded for their character, as well as the introduction of a player excellence program that has the potential to be the benchmark of the competition."

Inside the ‘major reset’ that has changed the culture of the Gold Coast Suns

How 27 changes rescued Suns from doomsday scenario

www.foxsports.com.au

Any PP decisions need to be made based on what these people are doing now, and will be able to do into the future. Not what was done by other people in the past ten years.

I dare say Mark Evans would still have some pull at AFL House as well, if ever they needed to convince the league to help them.

GC have had 7 top 10 picks the last 3 drafts, along with pick 1 coming this year. They have plenty of young talent within the club already. Should we see if they can develop what they already have before giving them more?

 

[Opts]

What? How were the Suns not set up properly?

First 4 years
2011: 3 wins 56.3%
2012: 3 wins 60.8%
2013: 8 wins 91.7%
2014: 10 wins 93.7%

Suns were improving every year. What do the Suns do? Sack Guy McKenna and appoint Rocket Eade

2015: 4 wins 72.9%

But hey let’s blame the AFL for giving the Suns 9 of the first 15 picks in the 2010 draft, and a larger salary cap by $1million to poach the best player in the Comp (Gary Ablett) among others before free agency came in.

They did the Suns wrong, give the the Suns a priority pick.

Had the GCS been in a football state then it would be fair to say that the AFL did set them up correctly. However, they are in a non-football state and very few of their recruits want to stay there. Young players, especially those with an ego want to play in a football state and in particular for a club that plays on the MCG. What they really need is a higher salary cap to allow them to give a financial incentive to players for retention (ie COLA) and a higher soft cap to enable them to get superior management to the club and to compensate for the financial disadvantages of being in a non-football state.

To make things worse they are in the particularly difficult market of the Gold Coast where even the NRL struggles. How are GCS and GWS ever going to get enough supporters to be able to survive on their own? Putting new clubs in those markets was a big mistake but I suppose that's a topic for another thread/day.

 

[Opts]

Melbourne have only taken Sylvia and Scully as priority picks at the start of the first round

You're forgetting Travis Johnstone.

 

[Blackas87]

Had the GCS been in a football state then it would be fair to say that the AFL did set them up correctly. However, they are in a non-football state and very few of their recruits want to stay there. Young players, especially those with an ego want to play in a football state and in particular for a club that plays on the MCG. What they really need is a higher salary cap to allow them to give a financial incentive to players for retention (ie COLA) and a higher soft cap to enable them to get superior management to the club and to compensate for the financial disadvantages of being in a non-football state.

To make things worse they are in the particularly difficult market of the Gold Coast where even the NRL struggles. How are GCS and GWS ever going to get enough supporters to be able to survive on their own? Putting new clubs in those markets was a big mistake but I suppose that's a topic for another thread/day.

On your last point, I’m not sure any other sport in the world puts a professional team in the highest level competition at a location to grow the sport.

Agree on the Gold Coast location, I lived there during 2017 and people are more interested in there own outdoor activities (fishing, surfing ect) than watching sport, a lot of people aren’t even interested in NRL and if they are they support the Broncos but they’ll all love the state of origin.

Even while i was there I was less interested in footy than what I normally am back in Melbourne. Just a different life style.

But I also lived in Parramatta 2014 and Aussie Rules is more popular on the Gold Coast than western Sydney. NRL and Soccer dominates that area a lot more than it does in qld.

 

[Opts]

3 eh?....Perhaps you should do some thorough research before putting your foot in it.

Melbourne has received twice as many priority picks in the first round; 4 to our 2.....And A fat lot of good it's done em.

So much for that argument then.

Sorry to make you look stupid but;

Priority draft pick - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

 

[Blackas87]

You're forgetting Travis Johnstone.

Was pick one, wasn’t a priority pick

 

[Blackas87]

Sorry to make you look stupid but;

Priority draft pick - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

Oh he was lol, we had pick 2 as well but traded they pick for Jeff white. You learn something everyday hey

 

[Johnny Bananas]

What are the locations?

Ideally near the coast, in the central stretch from Southport down to Burleigh. They could have bought out the home grounds of either Southport or Broadbeach and built them into a boutique stadium. Or at Pizzey Park in Burleigh. Or looking outside that area, Helensvale is well connected with ample room for parking.

As you've said, Carrara's one advantage is being near the M1, unfortunately it's difficult to park nearby and you have to rely on shuttle buses. They've made noises for years about putting a ferry terminal nearby but I don't think anything has actually been done about it.

The ideal location in my mind, just from looking at the map but not having done any in-depth analysis, is where Broadbeach Library and community centre now stands. I seem to remember reading they were only built in 2008, maybe the AFL could have got the site if they'd been planning a team a little earlier. Who knows. Mint location though, right next to Pacific Fair and the main light rail stop.

On your last point, I’m not sure any other sport in the world puts a professional team in the highest level competition at a location to grow the sport.

Several of them do. The issue is that soccer is the most popular sport in practically every country, and it's the only game in town in most of them. Rugby league and ice hockey have created teams outside their heartland, so too soccer in countries like the US and India where they're a minor sport.

Anyway, these are both side topics from the point of the thread.

 

[Blackas87]

Ideally near the coast, in the central stretch from Southport down to Burleigh. They could have bought out the home grounds of either Southport or Broadbeach and built them into a boutique stadium. Or at Pizzey Park in Burleigh. Or looking outside that area, Helensvale is well connected with ample room for parking.

As you've said, Carrara's one advantage is being near the M1, unfortunately it's difficult to park nearby and you have to rely on shuttle buses. They've made noises for years about putting a ferry terminal nearby but I don't think anything has actually been done about it.

The ideal location in my mind, just from looking at the map but not having done any in-depth analysis, is where Broadbeach Library and community centre now stands. I seem to remember reading they were only built in 2008, maybe the AFL could have got the site if they'd been planning a team a little earlier. Who knows. Mint location though, right next to Pacific Fair and the main light rail stop.


Several of them do. The issue is that soccer is the most popular sport in practically every country, and it's the only game in town in most of them. Rugby league and ice hockey have created teams outside their heartland, so too soccer in countries like the US and India where they're a minor sport.

Anyway, these are both side topics from the point of the thread.

They are side points from issue agree.

Burleigh would be too far South for people in the North. Traffic would be a nightmare anywhere close to Surfers, never been to Southport so can’t have an opinion on that but yeah the Sharks would be an option.

I really don’t think Carrara is in a bad location, central along the M1, just needs transport and proper parking.


Do the leagues create teams? I don’t know in India but in the U.S the teams have owners and are business, they are put in a location to make a profit not grow the sport. The last team to enter the MLS is FC Cincinnati, Owned by Carl Lindner. He’s there to make a profit.

 

[Johnny Bananas]

Do the leagues create teams? I don’t know in India but in the U.S the teams have owners and are business, they are put in a location to make a profit not grow the sport. The last team to enter the MLS is FC Cincinnati, Owned by Carl Lindner. He’s there to make a profit.

America is a very profit driven country. The MLS at the moment has cities queueing up for expansion so they can pick the most profitable markets. 15 years ago, that wasn't the case, they were still trying to hit the mainstream. A better example is the NHL expanding into the desert and Florida, or rugby league into London.

 

[majortinkle]

Gold Coast should get the pp. afl have to make sure teams don’t profit from tanking. They’ll know the importance Melbourne have put on coming 17th over the second half of the season. They’ll make sure gc get the 2 standouts in the draft

 

[OB11]

Correct me if I'm wrong but it is pretty much mathematically impossible for the Crows to get pick 2 now after tonight?

With Anderson no chance to go to the Crows will their posters clear off from this forum and be replaced by Demons posters?

 

[Crow till I die]

Correct me if I'm wrong but it is pretty much mathematically impossible for the Crows to get pick 2 now after tonight?

With Anderson no chance to go to the Crows will their posters clear off from this forum and be replaced by Demons posters?

Take a hike. You got no idea you really don't. You don't understand a thing about live pick trading and the damage PP' s will do to it. With an attitude like yours i'd rather see melbourne get one of anderson or rowell than GC

 

[OB11]

Take a hike. You got no idea you really don't. You don't understand a thing about live pick trading and the damage PP' s will do to it. With an attitude like yours i'd rather see melbourne get one of anderson or rowell than GC

Thank you - I needed a laugh

 

[Blackas87]

America is a very profit driven country. The MLS at the moment has cities queueing up for expansion so they can pick the most profitable markets. 15 years ago, that wasn't the case, they were still trying to hit the mainstream. A better example is the NHL expanding into the desert and Florida, or rugby league into London.

We are getting way off topic but the London Broncos Rugby league club, originally Fulham RLFC were created by the chairman of Fulham FC Ernie Clay with the purpose of creating an income for the football club. They weren’t created by the league for expansion purposes. Rugby league in England has promotion/relegation, the only way to the top league is by earning your spot their. They weren’t given a spot in the top flight.

All NHL teams are franchises with owners. The league might have an intension of expanding to new areas but the owners of the new franchises are their to make a profit.

1993 Wayne Huizenga was given the licence for a team in Miami. Wayne wasn’t pouring in $millions for 30 years to grow the sport in Miami and then hope to turn a profit. Miami was a viable option from day one like all expansion teams are in all U.S sports.

 

[Johnny Bananas]

We are getting way off topic but the London Broncos Rugby league club, originally Fulham RLFC were created by the chairman of Fulham FC Ernie Clay with the purpose of creating an income for the football club. They weren’t created by the league for expansion purposes.

I doubt they've had many years of profit, and have probably been kept alive through league funding. I doubt Toronto makes a profit either.

1993 Wayne Huizenga was given the licence for a team in Miami. Wayne wasn’t pouring in $millions for 30 years to grow the sport in Miami and then hope to turn a profit. Miami was a viable option from day one like all expansion teams are in all U.S sports.

And the Phoenix Coyotes? Atlanta Thrashers?

 

[Elmer_Judd]

Take a hike. You got no idea you really don't. You don't understand a thing about live pick trading and the damage PP' s will do to it. With an attitude like yours i'd rather see melbourne get one of anderson or rowell than GC

Don't think Adelaide getting pick 4 instead of pick 3 due to the GC PP is going to be the end of the world for The Crows.

 

[Crow till I die]

Don't think Adelaide getting pick 4 instead of pick 3 due to the GC PP is going to be the end of the world for The Crows.

Don't think GC not getting a PP is the end of the world

 

[OB11]

Don't think Adelaide getting pick 4 instead of pick 3 due to the GC PP is going to be the end of the world for The Crows.

If it moved the crows pick from 55 to 56 they'd launch a mass hunger strike. These are people motivated by the integrity of the sport, not self interest.

FYI my interest in getting a GC PP is purely out of self interest.