Coach Support a Carlton coach for once?

Remove this Banner Ad

J-dog

All Australian
Jun 18, 2014
722
1,451
Melbourne
AFL Club
Carlton
Other Teams
Minnesota Vikings
Seems people are losing their minds again after losing to a premiership contender and going 2Ws and 3Ls. Looks eerily similar to when we sacked a club great who won more games as coach than he lost.
Will we ever learn?

There's nothing to gain by sacking a coach now and everything to gain by showing support.
Maybe instead of crying about a loss to a premiership contender we should be trying to show a bit of tolerance, support and solidarity?

Or is that something that only the good club's and their supporters do?
 

SkyhorseTamer

Norm Smith Medallist
Jun 4, 2016
7,875
19,584
AFL Club
Carlton
Seems people are losing their minds again after losing to a premiership contender and going 2Ws and 3Ls. Looks eerily similar to when we sacked a club great who won more games as coach than he lost.
Will we ever learn?

There's nothing to gain by sacking a coach now and everything to gain by showing support.
Maybe instead of crying about a loss to a premiership contender we should be trying to show a bit of tolerance, support and solidarity?

Or is that something that only the good club's and their supporters do?
Has to be a joke right?

There's obviously issues with structure gameplan and playing players out of position.

We have players looking like they're playing with no confidence as well. This is all on coaching. It's only reasonable to question the coaches. The kind of everything is fine supporter you want don't support top clubs they support St Kilda and sit on their ******* hands for 50 years and are happy with productions like 'the streak'. Sacking Teague may be premature or wrong but putting pressure on the club for selling hope and looking like a system less outfit is one hundred percent what we should be doing as supporters. The good clubs respond by fixing what's wrong. That's pretty clearly development and structure. Let's see if we start getting better at that over this season, structure and gameplan especially. I feel that will decide Teagues future more than ladder position, if that makes sense. The current game plan worked for a half vs freo and thats it. Richmond had almost 80 inside 50s against us, a bad Collingwood team smashed us, gold Coast was a system less scrap heap of a game and then this. Where we had just severe issues with players playing out of position expected to do things they cannot (Kennedy at Hf expected to be a pressure providing cog to lock it in ports f50, just isn't gonna happen).
 

Log in to remove this ad.

GenYBlue

Seeking #17
May 31, 2010
175
521
Melbourne
AFL Club
Carlton
While I agree that talks of sacking Teague are premature, comparing his output and therefore job security to that of Ratts' is a bit unfair.

Ratts won three finals and apart from his injury cruelled final season in 2012, increased the teams output significantly each year.

Teague has won a handful of games, it's chalk and cheese at this point.
 

J-dog

All Australian
Jun 18, 2014
722
1,451
Melbourne
AFL Club
Carlton
Other Teams
Minnesota Vikings
I'm not saying we don't have problems- blind Freddy can see we do.

But I ask you, with players like Casboult and Ed and Williamson and their low footy IQ constantly giving the ball back to the opposition, how is the team ever going to achieve what people seem to demand? I love the players I mentioned as examples because they play for our club and I'm sure they are fantastic clubmen, but that is easily a player on each line who will constantly give the game away. Is that the coach? Maybe - I think it's the recruiters and development but I'd happily listen to your opinion.

Surely anyone can see the MC (which includes the coach) demanding that players put together a string of good games in the 2s before promoting them (e.g. Kennedy) at the expense of an underperforming player (e.g. Setterfield). Wouldn't you then question how the players I mentioned are playing every game and none of the high draft picks we brought in are taking these crucial games off them?

What I do see is a gameplan which can be very effective if we actually kick straight. It's a high pressure gameplan and I see players busting a gut but I don't see any scoreboard pressure. Does Teague have to kick the goals himself too? Why does Harry go to ground so often? Why is nearly every kick he takes a snap? Can't he play genuine FF and actually kick straight? And why do our better ball users so often sit the ball on his head? Can't they try and find a better option or get to a better position to pass (like in the corridor)?

But it doesn't stop there unfortunately. Why does Willo take 5min to find a bad option? Why does it look like he's getting kicking lessons from Levi? Maybe Teague should go and make the passes for him?
Why does Cas have Rocca give him kicking lessons for over 2 whole bloody years and still can't kick? Does he have amnesia every game day? Maybe Teague should take the set shots for him? Why is every kick SPS executes a floater/lollipop? Why do our players sit their passes on top of the heads of Betts, Gibbons and Murphy? Maybe Teague should be player coach and we can direct all our play through him? Thank God we brought in Fogarty.

My point is things are improving with this coach and are better than they were with the last 2 coaches. We defend better with this coach and we move the ball better from defence. We also manage to get lots more repeat F50 entries with this coach. Dunstal mentioned in the broadcast we were 50 x F50 entries to Port's 45 odd F50 entries yet we were down by about 8 goals. The coach needs to get these players playing to a structure which makes this happen. It's then up to the players to execute.

These problems are old ones and point more towards development of players rather than the coach's gameplan. I for one am absolutely sick of watching our players make stupid decisions and poor skills, I'm not sick of the coach effecting a strategy to give them these opportunities.
 
Last edited:

J-dog

All Australian
Jun 18, 2014
722
1,451
Melbourne
AFL Club
Carlton
Other Teams
Minnesota Vikings
While I agree that talks of sacking Teague are premature, comparing his output and therefore job security to that of Ratts' is a bit unfair.

Ratts won three finals and apart from his injury cruelled final season in 2012, increased the teams output significantly each year.

Teague has won a handful of games, it's chalk and cheese at this point.
That's my point!
So far Teague is improving the W column each year. Just a shame we are starting from such a low base!

I know we aren't killing it right now but we certainly had chances to win in each of our 3 losses so far. That's strategy. We didn't win them and I think that if we didn't make so many stupid decisions and actually had a high DE% and higher accuracy at goal we would probably have won them. That's player skill execution.
 

J-dog

All Australian
Jun 18, 2014
722
1,451
Melbourne
AFL Club
Carlton
Other Teams
Minnesota Vikings
A contender away from home, missing high quality players, had injuries during the game, played a gruelling round 4 game.
I can appreciate your opinion but I really disagree. Please see my follow up post above.
I genuinely would like a proper discussion on the topic. What are your thoughts?
 

FRUMPY

Brownlow Medallist
Aug 18, 2006
23,052
25,336
Melbourne
AFL Club
Carlton
Seems people are losing their minds again after losing to a premiership contender and going 2Ws and 3Ls. Looks eerily similar to when we sacked a club great who won more games as coach than he lost.
Will we ever learn?

There's nothing to gain by sacking a coach now and everything to gain by showing support.
Maybe instead of crying about a loss to a premiership contender we should be trying to show a bit of tolerance, support and solidarity?

Or is that something that only the good club's and their supporters do?
David, worry about coaching and not those on Big footy.

Sent from my CPH2005 using Tapatalk
 

J-dog

All Australian
Jun 18, 2014
722
1,451
Melbourne
AFL Club
Carlton
Other Teams
Minnesota Vikings
Teague needs to reassess his gameplan, tactics, structures and player positions, quickly

This 5th gear attacking mode looks great when everything goes right, but it's not sustainable
Sorry but I disagree.
I feel the strategy is fine but a few players cannot execute and will lose us matches regardless of the strategy.
 

jj1978

Norm Smith Medallist
May 11, 2006
7,297
8,099
Melbourne
AFL Club
Carlton
I can appreciate your opinion but I really disagree. Please see my follow up post above.
I genuinely would like a proper discussion on the topic. What are your thoughts?
My thoughts are that he did so well as a caretaker in 2019 on the back of not his coaching but emotion of the season. The sacking of Bolton opened the players eyes and lit something and Teague’s ability to be a friend and let them play worked. As a senior coach we’ve had continuos 5 goal run ons, strange selections, lack of continuity week to week. Fix an issue this week, but that means something we did successfully the week before slips in its stead. 30+ game sample size and we’re receding. He has till middle of the year, and if we’re not in finals contention we can’t blame the players.
 

(Log in to remove this ad.)

J-dog

All Australian
Jun 18, 2014
722
1,451
Melbourne
AFL Club
Carlton
Other Teams
Minnesota Vikings
Has to be a joke right?

There's obviously issues with structure gameplan and playing players out of position.

We have players looking like they're playing with no confidence as well. This is all on coaching. It's only reasonable to question the coaches. The kind of everything is fine supporter you want don't support top clubs they support St Kilda and sit on their ******* hands for 50 years and are happy with productions like 'the streak'. Sacking Teague may be premature or wrong but putting pressure on the club for selling hope and looking like a system less outfit is one hundred percent what we should be doing as supporters. The good clubs respond by fixing what's wrong. That's pretty clearly development and structure. Let's see if we start getting better at that over this season, structure and gameplan especially. I feel that will decide Teagues future more than ladder position, if that makes sense. The current game plan worked for a half vs freo and thats it. Richmond had almost 80 inside 50s against us, a bad Collingwood team smashed us, gold Coast was a system less scrap heap of a game and then this. Where we had just severe issues with players playing out of position expected to do things they cannot (Kennedy at Hf expected to be a pressure providing cog to lock it in ports f50, just isn't gonna happen).
Cause and effect.
I agree the effect/outcome is not desirable but I disagree that the strategy is the cause, and that the player mentality is the cause instead.

Tonight's game for example.
We looked good and like we were putting in when the score was close, but as Port kicked away further and further the playing group started to drop their heads and effort went down. Even the commentators mentioned it 10min into the 3rd Q!
That's a weak mentality and poor attitude.
When we challenged Port were too big, smart and strong. Our players still ran out the game but anyone could see even they felt they were beaten.

If we sacked a coach who is forcing players to work hard in the 2s before they get a game, how would this affect the team mentality in a positive way? Wouldn't you think it's Groundhog Day if you were a Carlton player right now and Teague got sacked mid season?
 

J-dog

All Australian
Jun 18, 2014
722
1,451
Melbourne
AFL Club
Carlton
Other Teams
Minnesota Vikings
My thoughts are that he did so well as a caretaker in 2019 on the back of not his coaching but emotion of the season. The sacking of Bolton opened the players eyes and lit something and Teague’s ability to be a friend and let them play worked. As a senior coach we’ve had continuos 5 goal run ons, strange selections, lack of continuity week to week. Fix an issue this week, but that means something we did successfully the week before slips in its stead. 30+ game sample size and we’re receding. He has till middle of the year, and if we’re not in finals contention we can’t blame the players.
Maybe you won't but I certainly will blame players that can't kick, make stupid decisions and won't 2 way run.
 

CarltonBlooz

Senior List
Mar 9, 2021
226
553
AFL Club
Carlton
Seems people are losing their minds again after losing to a premiership contender and going 2Ws and 3Ls. Looks eerily similar to when we sacked a club great who won more games as coach than he lost.
Will we ever learn?

There's nothing to gain by sacking a coach now and everything to gain by showing support.
Maybe instead of crying about a loss to a premiership contender we should be trying to show a bit of tolerance, support and solidarity?

Or is that something that only the good club's and their supporters do?
Club isn't going to sack Teague mid-season, would take a lot of 60+ point drudging's for that to even be considered.

Teague hasn't done anything to prove he is even remotely near the level that Ratten achieved before we got rid of him.

He'll 100% play out the season, but if this persists into next year with the same sub-standard he'll go.

0 chance of him playing out the 7-8 years examples others have said about Richmond, Geelong without significant improvement + deep finals runs over the next few years.

People have every right to be mad about where we are at the moment as its entirely the club's fault we're in this position in the first place.

Good clubs meaning who? Richmond, Geelong, Hawks?
 

J-dog

All Australian
Jun 18, 2014
722
1,451
Melbourne
AFL Club
Carlton
Other Teams
Minnesota Vikings
I don't want to watch that ******* game again but if anyone is interested in the torture, could they please count how many times we kicked to Murphy, Betts and Gibbons and sat the ball on their heads? And how many times Port broke/walked through our tackles? And how many times did we blindly hack a kick out of the middle without even looking? And how many missed targets from both D50 and going into F50?

We gotta stop doing dumb sh*t like this. It's ******* losing us games!
 
Last edited:

J-dog

All Australian
Jun 18, 2014
722
1,451
Melbourne
AFL Club
Carlton
Other Teams
Minnesota Vikings
Club isn't going to sack Teague mid-season, would take a lot of 60+ point drudging's for that to even be considered.

Teague hasn't done anything to prove he is even remotely near the level that Ratten achieved before we got rid of him.

He'll 100% play out the season, but if this persists into next year with the same sub-standard he'll go.

0 chance of him playing out the 7-8 years examples others have said about Richmond, Geelong without significant improvement + deep finals runs over the next few years.

People have every right to be mad about where we are at the moment as its entirely the club's fault we're in this position in the first place.

Good clubs meaning who? Richmond, Geelong, Hawks?
Funny you mention those clubs - 2 supported their coaches when the going got tough and they won multiple flags, the other supported their coach unconditionally and got reward very quickly.

Be mad at the club for bottoming out and not developing high draft picks well. No-one can argue that. But don't say the coach has a sh*t strategy when we have every chance to win each game we play.

9 goals 14 should have been 14 goals 9.
Aliir is good but he's not ******* superman and we made him look like it tonight.
 
Last edited:

Gethelred

Brownlow Medallist
May 1, 2016
16,345
31,974
AFL Club
Carlton
Club isn't going to sack Teague mid-season, would take a lot of 60+ point drudging's for that to even be considered.

Teague hasn't done anything to prove he is even remotely near the level that Ratten achieved before we got rid of him.

He'll 100% play out the season, but if this persists into next year with the same sub-standard he'll go.

0 chance of him playing out the 7-8 years examples others have said about Richmond, Geelong without significant improvement + deep finals runs over the next few years.

People have every right to be mad about where we are at the moment as its entirely the club's fault we're in this position in the first place.

Good clubs meaning who? Richmond, Geelong, Hawks?
I think it would take just 1 40+ point drubbing to get him fired.

We play Essendon in 2 weeks.
 

mario bortallotto

Team Captain
Mar 24, 2018
441
767
AFL Club
Carlton
I think it would take just 1 40+ point drubbing to get him fired.

We play Essendon in 2 weeks.
were possibly going to struggle until martin fisher ect get back tdk included hard to coach turnover after turnover and some really dum footy tonight . there was some kind of effort just got deluded with missed goals and ball being butchered all night largely player fault . but we were out coached tonight by hinkley and voss mk2 they done there homework on us for sure . they had a plan and it worked pushing us wide out of defence then ground was very open for there transitioning . port are very well drilled hard organized side . there right into the flag this year.
other teams at times are trying to open up the forward line and have mismatch going through plow direct opponent with some success.

im not dropping of teaghey at all yet.....but vossy mk2 excites me more than lyon if it ever goes that way
 
Last edited:

TENACIOUS

My Man Paddy Dow
Aug 16, 2008
819
2,680
AFL Club
Carlton
Sorry but I disagree.
I feel the strategy is fine but a few players cannot execute and will lose us matches regardless of the strategy.
Who blindly picks these players to play week in week out J-dog ?
Why have our players stagnated and not been developed under Teague's guidance/management?

Feel people are more so wanting assistant coaches gone
 

Blue1980

Brownlow Medallist
Jun 9, 2011
13,977
16,088
Melbourne
AFL Club
Carlton
Next step will be to bring in different and/or more experienced people alongside Teague, before getting rid of him.

He will at least get to next season, but if we have a middling year of 10 wins or less, then rejig things and don't have a good season next year, I think we will move on.

Still a long way to get to that point though, and he's not in any danger, yet. We have only had one really heavy defeat in his tenure (v Geelong in 2019) and tonight was one of the rare games since he's been in charge we were never really a chance to win, but we at least avoided a St Kildaesque destroying of our percentage.

The midfield mix still seems all wrong, like Walsh in the guts has made him into a superstar, but others seemingly lost and without a defined role.

Forward pressure tonight was non existent without JSOS. Eddie is cooked, but we don't have much else to bring in without Fisher and Martin available.

We are mid range, and needed all hands on deck and to play at our very best to have a chance tonight, and we were pretty average.
 

J-dog

All Australian
Jun 18, 2014
722
1,451
Melbourne
AFL Club
Carlton
Other Teams
Minnesota Vikings
Who blindly picks these players to play week in week out J-dog ?
Why have our players stagnated and not been developed under Teague's guidance/management?

Feel people are more so wanting assistant coaches gone
I don't think they are 'blindly' picking players, but who is pushing them out of the side?
******* no-one.
Don't hang it all on Teague.
We want to find the problem so we can fix it but the club will not come out and directly blame someone. It's hard to say exactly who is accountable except that everyone is partially responsible.

What we should remember though is that this year we finally have a stand alone VFL side and can train a gameplan and ethos from the reserves up. Let's see at the end of the year if this improves our player development before we start calling for anyone's head.
 

Remove this Banner Ad