Autopsy Swans defeat Hawks

[Mercy Seat]

People like to make excuses for our ineptness... Clarko hasn’t got tank in him, the only time he’ll genuinely play the kids and look to change things is if there is no mathematical way we can play finals.

Because we were trying win and Sicily is an AA rebounding defender and was having no impact forward. He gave away 4 FA playing forward.

Staggering people think we have tanked at any point so far.

Trust me - the club knows exactly where we are at with the list, where we are expected to be this year. No one knows this more than Clarko. What I'm hearing and all the stuff coming from the ITKs are saying the same thing. We want high draft picks this year more than anything

This idea that Clarko is "inept" and is the drunk captain deliriously hanging onto the sinking ship that some of you guys allude to is nuts. Of course Clarko is putting on a brave "we need to win this one" face on game day, but there's a reason he mostly gave up coaching from the bench a few weeks back.

There's no cleverly planned out tanking conspiracy, but there's experimentation going on in games, with players and the game style, and team selection, and just because Mitch Lewis is in the 2s doesn't mean that we're throwing hail mary's at the year with Rough.

 

[Spursfan]

well there is that but if it helps land someone who will help in the midfield etc why not

We'd have to pick a few forwards capable of kicking 50 goals each as well as mids if we're trading Gunston/Bruest

 

[Hawks851]

We'd have to pick a few forwards capable of kicking 50 goals each as well as mids if we're trading Gunston/Bruest

true i cant see either going anywhere unless a very very good offer comes up

 

[tige19]

Trust me - the club knows exactly where we are at with the list, where we are expected to be this year. No one knows this more than Clarko. What I'm hearing and all the stuff coming from the ITKs are saying the same thing. We want high draft picks this year more than anything

This idea that Clarko is "inept" and is the drunk captain deliriously hanging onto the sinking ship that some of you guys allude to is nuts. Of course Clarko is putting on a brave "we need to win this one" face on game day, but there's a reason he mostly gave up coaching from the bench a few weeks back.

There's no cleverly planned out tanking conspiracy, but there's experimentation going on in games, with players and the game style, and team selection, and just because Mitch Lewis is in the 2s doesn't mean that we're throwing hail mary's at the year with Rough.

Well only Clarko and the Davinci code decoders can understand what’s going on, hard to get a handle on things with selection.

 

[OnceKicked50]

Trust me - the club knows exactly where we are at with the list, where we are expected to be this year. No one knows this more than Clarko. What I'm hearing and all the stuff coming from the ITKs are saying the same thing. We want high draft picks this year more than anything

This idea that Clarko is "inept" and is the drunk captain deliriously hanging onto the sinking ship that some of you guys allude to is nuts. Of course Clarko is putting on a brave "we need to win this one" face on game day, but there's a reason he mostly gave up coaching from the bench a few weeks back.

There's no cleverly planned out tanking conspiracy, but there's experimentation going on in games, with players and the game style, and team selection, and just because Mitch Lewis is in the 2s doesn't mean that we're throwing hail mary's at the year with Rough.

You still haven't answered my previous questions. Instead, you are suggesting not coaching from the boundary means something.

Also, tige19 never referred to Clarko as 'inept'. You are just making random statements, playing the man, because, seemingly, you are unable to have a reasonable debate.

Again, if we have been 'tanking' like you said for the past month, can you explain:

1. Why Clarko made such a big deal about the Bombers game leading into it?

2. Why Big Boy was rushed back for this? Clearly underdone.

3. Why Roughead was brought in and Lewis doesn't play.

4. Why Ross hasn't debuted.

5. Why countless posters claim we are playing a number of players injured.

Also, can you explain this experimentation rather than make a general claim to it. Sicily move aside, what are you referring to? The same structure seems in place to me is why I ask.

We all seem to be frustrated with the same game style, slow ball movement, bomb it long. I honestly have no idea what changes you think are happening?

 

[smeltitdeltit]

His old man was a Kangaroo yes? Now a Swan coach?

Yep
The Kangas had father/son rights. Sydney has academy.
I wonder if there’s a hierarchy to it or he gets to chose.
The latter would be heading towards draft tampering IMHO

 

[Bumps"N"Grins]

I see the usual from Hawthorn supporters who cannot understand what is actually happening. But we are the worst set of football fans that kick our own team.
Lots of our people do, but here's my take and an excuse.

The boys were pathetic last night, can't hold tackles can't kick to team mates , can't score , can't mark over head much, we have top players down on form, we lost our captain to a stupid mistake, Buddy got going early , when he does, you get ruined.
Then we had the embarrasing number 37 debacle which may have put the nasty out of our team, what rot that was!

All I can remember when I saw that was Gibbo getting smashed !

Getting back to footy, I am sure we are in a "try out things" year.
On top of that you have to put up with some senior players out of form , they've been at the coalface of success for years and years.

Younger newer players getting blooded, this guarding space instead of cutting off space and tackling , playing the boundary when the ball keeps coming back.
Can't really blame the umps or the frees but as per usual the grey rules ruled the day, but everyone has to put up with that. Sydney too.

So understand that we can't win flags every year for 50 years, we have to re grow and develop and Clarko would be in the middle of a work in progress because Hawthorns precision which took the AFL clubs by the throat , has been found out.

You don't work out a new plan and a way to bamboozle other teams in five minutes!!!!

I'd like to see some real innovation some different game plans, some up the middle attacks, RISK RISK RISK RISK !!!! Yeah take risks.

If you get mangled who cares this year is a, "see how this goes" year, super attacking football, CUT THE RING, ATTACK AND HOLD TACKLES SOME UNSOCIABLE FOOTY, DO NOT GUARD SPACES, DON'T STAND THERE WITH YOUR BLEEDING ARMS IN THE AIR LIKE A DAMNED BASKETBALLER.

Poppy is the only Hawk that tries to run opponents down ! How often have we seen that. He put off Swan players a couple of times last night!!!!
But he's a hard stopper! Where are the others!

All we did is sit back and wait to be beaten to the ball. Too many loose Swans all night

Where has close checking gone ? Where has footy gone?

But remember, we have to get all the newbies into the plan perfectly, we will never have the draft of 14 or 15 years ago.

I mean, Joe Louis if he was still alive wouldn't be heavy weight champion still.

We can't act like spoilt kids because the situation changes. WAIT!

The only person you missed was Hitler.

 

[Mercy Seat]

You still haven't answered my previous questions. Instead, you are suggesting not coaching from the boundary means something.

Also, tige19 never referred to Clarko as 'inept'. You are just making random statements, playing the man, because, seemingly, you are unable to have a reasonable debate.

Again, if we have been 'tanking' like you said for the past month, can you explain:

1. Why Clarko made such a big deal about the Bombers game leading into it?

2. Why Big Boy was rushed back for this? Clearly underdone.

3. Why Roughead was brought in and Lewis doesn't play.

4. Why Ross hasn't debuted.

5. Why countless posters claim we are playing a number of players injured.

Also, can you explain this experimentation rather than make a general claim to it. Sicily move aside, what are you referring to? The same structure seems in place to me is why I ask.

We all seem to be frustrated with the same game style, slow ball movement, bomb it long. I honestly have no idea what changes you think are happening?

Read tige's post earlier - he said "we are inept". Considering most of the angst is headed towards the coaching, it seems pretty clear that's what was being inferred. I may be wrong.

Again, as I said earlier, we're not blatantly tanking - we've just put the cue in the rack and are testing things. We are running through the motions. You think Clarko's going to go all Dean Bailey and play just kids out of position? That s**t just doesn't happen these days, and it won't because that'll be the end of his career.

Respectable losses until the end of the year is the clear outcome. That answers every one of your questions. Respectable losses, no smashings, keep the club happy, keep the sponsors ok, and have a case to plead to recruits at the end of the year.

I may be wrong, but that's my interpretation from the very limited intel I have and what clearly seems to be happening with team selection and game day.

 

[OnceKicked50]

Read tige's post earlier - he said "we are inept". Considering most of the angst is headed towards the coaching, it seems pretty clear that's what was being inferred. I may be wrong.

Again, as I said earlier, we're not blatantly tanking - we've just put the cue in the rack and are testing things. We are running through the motions. You think Clarko's going to go all Dean Bailey and play just kids out of position? That **** just doesn't happen these days, and it won't because that'll be the end of his career.

Respectable losses until the end of the year is the clear outcome. That answers every one of your questions. Respectable losses, no smashings, keep the club happy, keep the sponsors ok, and have a case to plead to recruits at the end of the year.

I may be wrong, but that's my interpretation from the very limited intel I have and what clearly seems to be happening with team selection and game day.

It actually answers none mate. You are just talking in general terms, saying actually nothing other than 'Clako knows what he is doing'. You can't even explain it man.

I will just assume you can't sorry mate and let it be.

 

[Mercy Seat]

It actually answers none mate. You are just talking in general terms, saying actually nothing other than 'Clako knows what he is doing'. You can't even explain it man.

I will just assume you can't sorry dude.

Plenty of others understand it mate, I'm sorry if you don't get it.

 

[Davo23]

Just got back from Sydney.
Its always a good weekend there anyway, despite the result.

1. Saw my first security intervention: a couple of thuggish looking security people put 4 spectators out at half time: they were a bit noisy but harmless really. I guess the precious Chardonnay-drinking Sydney supporters were easily offended.

2. The 3rd quarter was great, then we seemed to run out of energy in the last. From my vantage point, we just couldn't get a pass to stick, or a move to continue in the last quarter, it was tight and just one bit of luck may have turned the game our way.

3. Can't really comment much on the game - the footy was pretty poor on both sides. Sydney are just average, they got a fast start, a couple of lucky goals, and we just never could catch them.

4. And it was extremely cold: the icy wind at the SCG was as cold as I've ever experienced at the footy.


Great choice of Cognacs at the Star Casino - damn expensive but they went down well - had proper brandy balloons, too!


Go Hawks.

 

[Mercy Seat]

Well try me out. What is the examples of 'testing' things you are referring to?

To make a few. Sicily, our all Australian performing intercept marker playing forward, Gunston back, playing way taller than we need to, how we set up in defence, way less kicking and marking than usual, team selection, and heap of other things. O’Brien swinging forward when the game was there to be won at 3/4 time.

 

[OnceKicked50]

To make a few. Sicily, our all Australian performing intercept marker playing forward, Gunston back, playing way taller than we need to, how we set up in defence, way less kicking and marking than usual, team selection, and heap of other things. O’Brien swinging forward when the game was there to be won at 3/4 time.

Sicily forward would have been to win. When it hasn't worked, each time, he is moved back. The opposite of tanking. He has been really poor forward.

O'Brien has been moved forward because someone has to for Sicily to go back. Not tanking.

Team selection is baffling. But if we were tanking, we don'r rush Big Boy back, we play Lewis over Rough, Ross over Poppy. Not tanking.

Kicking and marking is a result of not getting our hands on the ball as often. Not being as skilled to make kicks we used to. It's not tanking.

Gunston has barely played back this year.

Clarko is the best coach in the game, arguably the greatest of all time. But, he has not been bloody tanking for a month mate. He has been playing each and every game to win. To suggest otherwise is just really biased imo.

It suggests that we couldn't possibly be in this predicament because of our list, of the talent on our list, and that there is something greater at play here. There isn't dude. We have a really average list and we will work our way through this. But, hopefully after Friday night, Clarko will start to emphasise playing the youth over winning.

 

[Spursfan]

If they keep the same selection policy for the last 9 games then I think it's worthy of ranting about. But I am sure they will give some of these younger Box Hill boys a run (or Lewis's case more of a go) as we get closer to the end of the year.

 

[MinerBoy]

Not disagreeing with you but people have been moaning about our inability to hit the scoreboard .

It was well worth a try , hasn’t worked for a few reasons but damned if you do damned if you don’t .

The personnel up forward hasn't been the issue though, as Sicily soon found out. It's the opportunities we give our forwards that are the issue.

Sicily up forward is same result with a different player. While losing a key strength in the process.

 

[becalm]

Here's my thoughts on Lewis. After the Brisbane game Clarko said he is a keeper, he needs another preseason to build his strength and tank, so we will keep him in cotton wool. Then I want to have a good look at Brand to see if he will make the grade, therefore give him a good block of games.
Now I don't think it is a good idea to mention that word here in case the AFL hierarchy may be watching.

 

[becalm]

The player that worries me the most is Morrison. He is only a shadow of his former self. Lets hope he can turn it around next year. I don't think there is any chance of him being delisted this year though.

 

[Leather Poisoning]

Interesting game to reflect on.

I think Clarko always has his eye on the bigger prize - but things change so much week to week with other teams winning/losing, game plans, recruitment/list plans etc.

The Sicily switch to the backline was a very weird move.
He wasn't dominating by any stretch - but he had three shots on goal, was marking fairly well when he got a good look at it and Buddy had just been ruled out of the game.

Poor old Timbo - put together a really good defensive marking game. Possibly his best ever. But he got yanked out and all of a sudden we got exposed in that part of the ground by Blakey - who'd hardly seen the footy up to that point.

Everyone looks really flat.
Smith, Breust, Hardwick, Scully, McEvoy, O'Brien, Shiels - I can think of clear examples where each of these guys second guessed themselves resulting in a big stuff up. Breust looking to give it off in his primo snap range; McEvoy watched Sinclair in marking contests 2 or 3 times instead of just launching at the footy, Hardwick going for a big fly and crashing a team mate/dropping the mark. These are form/confidence issues. The team is ******* flat.

Impey, Glass, Hendo, Worpel - I think these were the only guys to really take the game on. These guys didn't doubt themselves. Sure, they made mistakes, but they did it when charging flat out, or kicking right through the footy, or breaking through a pack. They were looking for more dangerous/creative options with disposal. Really enjoyed the games of all these guys for that reason.

I think we're entitled to a blow out year. West Coast normally have one a year or two before winning a flag. Sydney are having one. Bulldogs and Adelaide both finished 13th the year before making a grand final from memory.

 

[becalm]

Glass is coming along nicely in his new role.

 

[becalm]

Did anyone watch the presser with Clarko?

He referenced that we have been in games, and that our percentage is good for a team 5-8. That we aren't getting blown away and we are close but lacking consistency.

I feel this is part of our issue. We are so defensive and have little to no run and carry, play on, take the game on. We had a great win against the Giants playing this way, but ultimately, whilst not being blown out, so many losses this year I've not really felt we were ever in it.

The players don't really look like they are having much fun and we are pretty horrific to watch.

Personally, I'd prefer Clarko was bold, didn't play to not be blown out, and try and change things up. Don't be afraid to lose by 10 goals, play the kids, encourage quicker ball movement, more risks. We are just going nowhere at the moment. Our ball movement is painful.

Clarko just says enough to keep the reporters happy. You can see from his demeanour that he is not upset in any way. Probably has a little chuckle afterwards.

 

[becalm]

One thing Clarko often says is AFL is a brutal game. For those who want Ross to have a game this year with his body should have regard for his safety.

 

[becalm]

Interesting what Ian Dicker said about Clarkson at his induction into the Hall of Fame.

 

[Gaston]

Clarko just says enough to keep the reporters happy. You can see from his demeanour that he is not upset in any way. Probably has a little chuckle afterwards.

Clarko is the modern day Kevin Sheedy. Could say anything at a presser and the mob will follow.
For instance, not much talk of where we were at until Clarko said we were a middle of the road side. Then the media all got on board.

 

[Franko Armani]

What did Ian Dicker say?

 

[Judd2Sewell]

To make a few. Sicily, our all Australian performing intercept marker playing forward, Gunston back, playing way taller than we need to, how we set up in defence, way less kicking and marking than usual, team selection, and heap of other things. O’Brien swinging forward when the game was there to be won at 3/4 time.

We've seen O'Brien forward (not good enough there), we've seen Sicily forward (doesn't get involved enough) and we've seen Gunston back (quality wherever he's played - though he's down on form obviously).

None of this is new to any of us and it's hardly experimenting with an eye on the future.