Certified Legendary Thread Sympathy for *essendon II - over 6500 days since EFC won a final / AC signs w NM, EFC implode / RIP D2D and T_S

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You remind me of my ex wife - no matter how f***ing wrong you are and how stupid you look, you just have to have the last word.

Oh right
 

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Craig Sholl was better than Dean Wallis.

I've said this already.

Sheedy routinely picked Wallis over far better players. So what? It's irrelevant to my point.

Even tho this is a week old I have to agree with you.

Sheedy was a poor coach at your club.

Obviously your judgement of players is better than his and that gives me faith in your ability to determine whether or not the Doc would have made the cut at your club in 1987.
 
The Doc was brilliant and no doubt, if he was playing at * and had the same form as he did at North then they probably could have won the flag. Like Mark Roberts, The Doc was more than a role player, even if outsiders saw these blokes in that way. They were creators, genuine forward targets and enablers who (under the coaching of Pagan) made North a genuinely multi-dimensional team. I get it though, that Sheedy was a different kind of coach who used players in specific roles such as the infamous era of the hitman.

I dunno if I'd have had him in my favourite players at the time but he was one of my most appreciated if that makes sense. There was a point, maybe early in '96 where I remember just thinking "Geeze he is bloody good" and elevating him into my top North players. Up there with likes of Arch, Stevo, Duck, Mighty Mick, Corz and Schwatta.

Thanks for the opportunity to reminisce Bonce. You must have good heart. Even when you're trying to troll you actually make life better.:thumbsu:

Craig "The Difference" Scholl.

Here's to ya.

:beercheers:
 
Trade Secrets series: How Essendon saved their 2013 draft in the wake of supplement penalties

Before Essendon was stripped of early draft picks in 2013 it was hatching a plan to secure Marcus Bontempelli and Ben Brown. Suddenly, the Bombers held the weakest hand in a very strong draft. Sam Landsberger explores how they salvaged their situation in our new Trade Secrets series.

Sam Landsberger, Herald Sun
Subscriber only
|
June 12, 2020 12:48pm


Essendon had to get creative.

The Bombers’ research of the 2013 draft was almost complete when they lost their first two selections in late August.

Suddenly, they held the weakest hand in what they rated as a very strong draft.

“We were under siege,” list boss Adrian Dodoro recalled.

“Here we were – a stable, strong football club – and all of a sudden we’ve got sanctions, we’ve got boys doubting their careers, we’ve got suspensions looming.

“That (draft) was critically vital to our footy club because of what was pending, in terms of the ASADA stuff.”

Dodoro ranked full-forward Ben Brown in the top 25 and it is believed Essendon was the only club that had Marcus Bontempelli, and not Tom Boyd or Josh Kelly, at No.1.

The Bombers wanted to use their first selection to trade up the order for Bontempelli, and almost certainly would’ve secured Brown before North Melbourne did at pick 47.

But Carlton replaced Essendon in both the finals and the draft order, using pick 13 on Patrick Cripps, as the Bombers watched their wish list disappear.


PICK 26: ZACH MERRETT

Shortly before the draft, Dodoro called Rory Lobb to tell the West Australian he was most likely heading to Essendon.

The Bombers’ list strategy had prioritised taking a ruckman and, armed with No.26 after trading Stewart Crameri, Lobb was their man.

“Then, I remember speaking to Bomber (caretaker coach Mark Thompson) on the Gold Coast an hour before the draft and Bomber said to me, ‘What’s your gut feel?’” Dodoro said.

“I said, ‘My gut feel is this kid Zach Merrett’s going to be a star’.

He said, ‘Always go with your gut instinct, don’t worry about what strategy says’.”

When Essendon interviewed Merrett that year the left-footed stoppage star knew the names of every board member and sponsor.

That impressed Dodoro, who ranked Merrett at around 15.

It was only when Essendon’s pick rolled around that Dodoro changed his mind.

Words to the effect of, ‘F--- it, I’m taking Zach’ were audible to fellow recruiters as Merrett – and not Lobb – became a Bomber.

PICK 55: ORAZIO FANTASIA

With the cream gone by their next pick, Essendon wanted to find a high-potential player who other clubs would doubt.

The Bombers always liked a skinny kid from South Australia called Orazio Fantasia, who weighed just 65kg and wasn’t invited to the draft combine.

Fantasia showed a mix of speed, endurance and balance while playing seniors at Norwood.

“A lot of people just felt he was never going to get the body to play league footy. He could’ve ridden light weight in the Melbourne Cup,” Dodoro said.

“I’ve got no doubt Orazio could actually play up on a wing and go through the midfield a lot more than what he does and be a very, very damaging player.

“A bit like Peter Matera was for West Coast. I know Woosha’s (coach John Worsfold) had that same view as well.”

Administrator Matt O’Hanlon first put VFL prospect Patrick Ambrose on Essendon’s radar.

Ambrose was courageous, but his kicking was wayward and he was far from a standout.

Still, he got his chance as a rookie and has re-signed swiftly and with minimal fuss ever since.

But it wasn’t “pens down” after the rookie draft. The Bombers had one more ace up their sleeve.

When the AFL imposed the draft sanctions, Dodoro hired Vic Metro coach Marty Allison to scour the globe.

He wanted to find a Category B rookie of first-round potential to dilute the penalty.

In December, Allison attended the AFL Europe combine – Port Adelaide was the only other club to travel overseas for it – where Irish 17-year-old Conor McKenna was a clear standout.

“If I was able to put a contract underneath him in December 2013, I would’ve signed him there and then,” Allison said.

“Beep test, agility test, standing vertical jump … Conor was elite in all things.”

It was the first time McKenna had picked up a Sherrin.

After the combine Allison spent 10 minutes introducing himself to Conor’s parents, Pat and Sheila McKenna, who were across the drugs scandal because it was world news.

Allison’s advice was simple – read as much as you can, and ask as many questions as you want.

In April, McKenna kicked 4.3 in an exhibition involving AFL Academy teenagers Christian Petracca, Isaac Heeney and Touk Miller.

The Bombers were able to convince Conor McKenna to join them instead of Collingwood. Picture: Michael Klein

“That was the worst thing that could happen to the Bombers, because we went from the only club interested to having 17 companions,” Allison said.

The AFL invited McKenna to the October draft combine at Marvel Stadium, where he was a man in demand.

“The poor kid is 18 and his head is spinning,” Allison said.

“All the other clubs were saying, ‘What do you want to go to the Bombers for? They’re drug cheats and they inject players’ and all this sort of stuff.”

Then, Essendon’s two-year offer at a standard rookie wage (around $75,000) was blown away by Collingwood’s three years at about $150,000.

With McKenna slipping, Allison approached Dyson Heppell at Crichton Medal night.

“I said to Heppell – who was on leave – that if Conor grew up in Melbourne he’d be a top-10 draft pick, he’s that good” Allison said.

“What’s missing is I’d love him to hear from a player’s perspective what it’s like at the footy club in this environment.”

Heppell met McKenna at Marvel Stadium the next day, and 45 minutes later McKenna turned down the Magpies to sign with Essendon.

Allison also helped straighten Ambrose’s kicking, using video analysis to teach the defender not to move the ball outside his body width while running.

Suddenly, the Bombers had three players of first-round quality – Merrett, Fantasia and McKenna – despite holding just one top-50 draft pick.

“We salvaged the situation,” Dodoro said on the Dodcast podcast.

“But I always look back and think of the opportunity lost, because that was a bumper draft.

“The way we ranked our draft that year, had we of kept our selections we probably would’ve been set up today.”



THE ASADA TAX

It was known internally as the “ASADA Tax”. From 2013-2016 the Bombers had to overpay their players in order to keep them.

“Player managers were circling, because all of a sudden if you wanted to retain a player then you had to pay a little bit more,” Dodoro said.

“Who wanted to come to Essendon during those days? Nobody wanted to come to our football club.”

The media was also circling. Talk of an exodus wouldn’t go away, and when players were banned for the entire 2016 season those fears became real inside Tullamarine.

Players needed to be convinced that, with a fifth-straight season impacted by the saga, the club was on the right track.

Enter Heath Hocking. The lifelong Bombers supporter signed up quickly, and set the ball rolling.

Hocking’s three-year recommitment was the first sign of forgiveness.

Slowly, the banned Bombers followed suit … right up until captain Jobe Watson, who was making coffees in New York.

Only Michael Hibberd wanted out in 2016.

“What Adrian did at that time was incredible, absolutely incredible,” former coach James Hird said.

“To walk out with the list they had in 2017 after everything happened was a remarkable result, and it’s all credit to the club, and particularly to Adrian.”
Brendon Goddard joined the Bombers as a free agent.
Brendon Goddard joined the Bombers as a free agent.

BJ FORESIGHT

When Hird was appointed coach in 2010 the Bombers started building a team that would challenge for a premiership in 2014-16.

Early in Hird’s tenure, Brendon Goddard was identified as gettable under the incoming free agency rules.

“A year or two out Adrian said, ‘OK, this is what the landscape looks like, let’s look at what we need,” Hird said.

“(He said) we need experience, good leadership, a player who’s played in finals and someone who’s really going to drive our list hard.

“As the coach I said, ‘OK, we’ve got a younger list that potentially needs some professionalism around it and some help for Jobe and these other guys’.

“We went through a list of 15 players, and Brendon was at the top of that list.”

Goddard headlined the inaugural batch of free agents as he crossed on a four-year contract.

Suddenly, Hird had the best two players from the 2002 draft in Goddard and Watson to lead his team.

THE ‘S’ QUARTET

Devon Smith had his heart set on a trade to Essendon when he found himself in the Collingwood carpark.

It was then and there that Smith’s manager, Ned Guy, came clean.

Guy told Smith that he had accepted the job as Collingwood’s list boss, and had set up the meeting to woo him to the Magpies.

The day after Smith committed to Essendon he received an email from former St Kilda coach Alan Richardson with a very generous offer. Once again, he couldn’t be swayed.

That was in 2017, when Dodoro had three big trades to strike as Adam Saad and Jake Stringer also chose Essendon.

Dodoro offered Western Bulldogs pick 11 in a deal for Stringer, but when they played hardball the Bombers swiftly handed that selection to GWS to ensure they didn’t miss out on Smith.

Saad and Stringer then arrived for nothing more than three second-round picks, and Dylan Shiel rounded out the haul 12 months later.

While the Bombers gave up plenty for Shiel, they had secured a package of four quality players for effectively three first-round picks and change.
Devon Smith wouldn’t be swayed from joining the Bombers. Picture: Michael Klein
Devon Smith wouldn’t be swayed from joining the Bombers. Picture: Michael Klein

Carlton courted Shiel by flying him to Noosa on a private jet with its heavy hitters, but Shiel did his own analysis and sacrificed about $3 million to join Essendon.

The Bombers believe their authentic approach trumped the Blues’ salesmanship, holding meetings inside club headquarters and with on-field (instead of off-field) figures.

The Stringer research was exhaustive.

“We met with him a number of times – his mum, his dad, his partner – as there was a lot of work getting to the bottom of a lot of rumours,” Dodoro said.

“And thankfully they were all rumours. We couldn’t find anything that would change our mind or sway us into not taking Jake.”

MORE DIAMONDS IN THE ROUGH

Essendon delisted defender Michael Hartley last year partly because it was time to let Brandon Zerk-Thatcher blossom.

The Bombers identified that the 2017 draft was paper-thin after pick 40, and so they completed two sets of rankings – 18-year-olds and mature players.

At pick 66 they took 19-year-old Zerk-Thatcher and at pick 78 they took 20-year-old Matt Guelfi.

Both look like clever choices.

Dodoro's analysis showed that desperate defender Zerk-Thatcher was a competitive beast and the versatile Guelfi was underdeveloped, having broken his leg at 17.

“Geez (Zerk-Thatcher) moves a lot like SOS (Stephen Silvagni),” Dodoro said.

“His mannerisms with the reach, the spoil, the body shape – long torso – and the courage.”

JAMES HIRD ON POST-DRUGS NUCLEUS

“The Essendon midfield with those two (Smith and Shiel) and Zach and Heppell, it’s going to be a pretty good midfield. Then the forward line; hopefully they can keep Joey, but Joey, Fantasia, and (Anthony McDonald)-Tipungwuti is a very versatile forward line. Then you go to the backline with McKenna, Saad, (Michael) Hurley, (Cale) Hooker and (Andy) McGrath. There’s quality players on each line.”
 
I seriously don't think, in my time watching North, 40+ years, I have seen a better mark, for North, when running full tilt at the ball than the Doc.
"Role Player" .....yeah righto * clowns

Exactly. When he marked his grip was so solid it as the entire universe revolved around it. Sometimes Tarryn Thomas take marks that remind me of him actually.
 
Last edited:
Trade Secrets series: How Essendon saved their 2013 draft in the wake of supplement penalties

Before Essendon was stripped of early draft picks in 2013 it was hatching a plan to secure Marcus Bontempelli and Ben Brown. Suddenly, the Bombers held the weakest hand in a very strong draft. Sam Landsberger explores how they salvaged their situation in our new Trade Secrets series.

Sam Landsberger, Herald Sun
Subscriber only
|
June 12, 2020 12:48pm


Essendon had to get creative.

The Bombers’ research of the 2013 draft was almost complete when they lost their first two selections in late August.

Suddenly, they held the weakest hand in what they rated as a very strong draft.

“We were under siege,” list boss Adrian Dodoro recalled.

“Here we were – a stable, strong football club – and all of a sudden we’ve got sanctions, we’ve got boys doubting their careers, we’ve got suspensions looming.

“That (draft) was critically vital to our footy club because of what was pending, in terms of the ASADA stuff.”

Dodoro ranked full-forward Ben Brown in the top 25 and it is believed Essendon was the only club that had Marcus Bontempelli, and not Tom Boyd or Josh Kelly, at No.1.

The Bombers wanted to use their first selection to trade up the order for Bontempelli, and almost certainly would’ve secured Brown before North Melbourne did at pick 47.

But Carlton replaced Essendon in both the finals and the draft order, using pick 13 on Patrick Cripps, as the Bombers watched their wish list disappear.


PICK 26: ZACH MERRETT

Shortly before the draft, Dodoro called Rory Lobb to tell the West Australian he was most likely heading to Essendon.

The Bombers’ list strategy had prioritised taking a ruckman and, armed with No.26 after trading Stewart Crameri, Lobb was their man.

“Then, I remember speaking to Bomber (caretaker coach Mark Thompson) on the Gold Coast an hour before the draft and Bomber said to me, ‘What’s your gut feel?’” Dodoro said.

“I said, ‘My gut feel is this kid Zach Merrett’s going to be a star’.

He said, ‘Always go with your gut instinct, don’t worry about what strategy says’.”

When Essendon interviewed Merrett that year the left-footed stoppage star knew the names of every board member and sponsor.

That impressed Dodoro, who ranked Merrett at around 15.

It was only when Essendon’s pick rolled around that Dodoro changed his mind.

Words to the effect of, ‘F--- it, I’m taking Zach’ were audible to fellow recruiters as Merrett – and not Lobb – became a Bomber.

PICK 55: ORAZIO FANTASIA

With the cream gone by their next pick, Essendon wanted to find a high-potential player who other clubs would doubt.

The Bombers always liked a skinny kid from South Australia called Orazio Fantasia, who weighed just 65kg and wasn’t invited to the draft combine.

Fantasia showed a mix of speed, endurance and balance while playing seniors at Norwood.

“A lot of people just felt he was never going to get the body to play league footy. He could’ve ridden light weight in the Melbourne Cup,” Dodoro said.

“I’ve got no doubt Orazio could actually play up on a wing and go through the midfield a lot more than what he does and be a very, very damaging player.

“A bit like Peter Matera was for West Coast. I know Woosha’s (coach John Worsfold) had that same view as well.”

Administrator Matt O’Hanlon first put VFL prospect Patrick Ambrose on Essendon’s radar.

Ambrose was courageous, but his kicking was wayward and he was far from a standout.

Still, he got his chance as a rookie and has re-signed swiftly and with minimal fuss ever since.

But it wasn’t “pens down” after the rookie draft. The Bombers had one more ace up their sleeve.

When the AFL imposed the draft sanctions, Dodoro hired Vic Metro coach Marty Allison to scour the globe.

He wanted to find a Category B rookie of first-round potential to dilute the penalty.

In December, Allison attended the AFL Europe combine – Port Adelaide was the only other club to travel overseas for it – where Irish 17-year-old Conor McKenna was a clear standout.

“If I was able to put a contract underneath him in December 2013, I would’ve signed him there and then,” Allison said.

“Beep test, agility test, standing vertical jump … Conor was elite in all things.”

It was the first time McKenna had picked up a Sherrin.

After the combine Allison spent 10 minutes introducing himself to Conor’s parents, Pat and Sheila McKenna, who were across the drugs scandal because it was world news.

Allison’s advice was simple – read as much as you can, and ask as many questions as you want.

In April, McKenna kicked 4.3 in an exhibition involving AFL Academy teenagers Christian Petracca, Isaac Heeney and Touk Miller.

The Bombers were able to convince Conor McKenna to join them instead of Collingwood. Picture: Michael Klein

“That was the worst thing that could happen to the Bombers, because we went from the only club interested to having 17 companions,” Allison said.

The AFL invited McKenna to the October draft combine at Marvel Stadium, where he was a man in demand.

“The poor kid is 18 and his head is spinning,” Allison said.

“All the other clubs were saying, ‘What do you want to go to the Bombers for? They’re drug cheats and they inject players’ and all this sort of stuff.”

Then, Essendon’s two-year offer at a standard rookie wage (around $75,000) was blown away by Collingwood’s three years at about $150,000.

With McKenna slipping, Allison approached Dyson Heppell at Crichton Medal night.

“I said to Heppell – who was on leave – that if Conor grew up in Melbourne he’d be a top-10 draft pick, he’s that good” Allison said.

“What’s missing is I’d love him to hear from a player’s perspective what it’s like at the footy club in this environment.”

Heppell met McKenna at Marvel Stadium the next day, and 45 minutes later McKenna turned down the Magpies to sign with Essendon.

Allison also helped straighten Ambrose’s kicking, using video analysis to teach the defender not to move the ball outside his body width while running.

Suddenly, the Bombers had three players of first-round quality – Merrett, Fantasia and McKenna – despite holding just one top-50 draft pick.

“We salvaged the situation,” Dodoro said on the Dodcast podcast.

“But I always look back and think of the opportunity lost, because that was a bumper draft.

“The way we ranked our draft that year, had we of kept our selections we probably would’ve been set up today.”



THE ASADA TAX

It was known internally as the “ASADA Tax”. From 2013-2016 the Bombers had to overpay their players in order to keep them.

“Player managers were circling, because all of a sudden if you wanted to retain a player then you had to pay a little bit more,” Dodoro said.

“Who wanted to come to Essendon during those days? Nobody wanted to come to our football club.”

The media was also circling. Talk of an exodus wouldn’t go away, and when players were banned for the entire 2016 season those fears became real inside Tullamarine.

Players needed to be convinced that, with a fifth-straight season impacted by the saga, the club was on the right track.

Enter Heath Hocking. The lifelong Bombers supporter signed up quickly, and set the ball rolling.

Hocking’s three-year recommitment was the first sign of forgiveness.

Slowly, the banned Bombers followed suit … right up until captain Jobe Watson, who was making coffees in New York.

Only Michael Hibberd wanted out in 2016.

“What Adrian did at that time was incredible, absolutely incredible,” former coach James Hird said.

“To walk out with the list they had in 2017 after everything happened was a remarkable result, and it’s all credit to the club, and particularly to Adrian.”
Brendon Goddard joined the Bombers as a free agent.
Brendon Goddard joined the Bombers as a free agent.

BJ FORESIGHT

When Hird was appointed coach in 2010 the Bombers started building a team that would challenge for a premiership in 2014-16.

Early in Hird’s tenure, Brendon Goddard was identified as gettable under the incoming free agency rules.

“A year or two out Adrian said, ‘OK, this is what the landscape looks like, let’s look at what we need,” Hird said.

“(He said) we need experience, good leadership, a player who’s played in finals and someone who’s really going to drive our list hard.

“As the coach I said, ‘OK, we’ve got a younger list that potentially needs some professionalism around it and some help for Jobe and these other guys’.

“We went through a list of 15 players, and Brendon was at the top of that list.”

Goddard headlined the inaugural batch of free agents as he crossed on a four-year contract.

Suddenly, Hird had the best two players from the 2002 draft in Goddard and Watson to lead his team.

THE ‘S’ QUARTET

Devon Smith had his heart set on a trade to Essendon when he found himself in the Collingwood carpark.

It was then and there that Smith’s manager, Ned Guy, came clean.

Guy told Smith that he had accepted the job as Collingwood’s list boss, and had set up the meeting to woo him to the Magpies.

The day after Smith committed to Essendon he received an email from former St Kilda coach Alan Richardson with a very generous offer. Once again, he couldn’t be swayed.

That was in 2017, when Dodoro had three big trades to strike as Adam Saad and Jake Stringer also chose Essendon.

Dodoro offered Western Bulldogs pick 11 in a deal for Stringer, but when they played hardball the Bombers swiftly handed that selection to GWS to ensure they didn’t miss out on Smith.

Saad and Stringer then arrived for nothing more than three second-round picks, and Dylan Shiel rounded out the haul 12 months later.

While the Bombers gave up plenty for Shiel, they had secured a package of four quality players for effectively three first-round picks and change.
Devon Smith wouldn’t be swayed from joining the Bombers. Picture: Michael Klein
Devon Smith wouldn’t be swayed from joining the Bombers. Picture: Michael Klein

Carlton courted Shiel by flying him to Noosa on a private jet with its heavy hitters, but Shiel did his own analysis and sacrificed about $3 million to join Essendon.

The Bombers believe their authentic approach trumped the Blues’ salesmanship, holding meetings inside club headquarters and with on-field (instead of off-field) figures.

The Stringer research was exhaustive.

“We met with him a number of times – his mum, his dad, his partner – as there was a lot of work getting to the bottom of a lot of rumours,” Dodoro said.

“And thankfully they were all rumours. We couldn’t find anything that would change our mind or sway us into not taking Jake.”

MORE DIAMONDS IN THE ROUGH

Essendon delisted defender Michael Hartley last year partly because it was time to let Brandon Zerk-Thatcher blossom.

The Bombers identified that the 2017 draft was paper-thin after pick 40, and so they completed two sets of rankings – 18-year-olds and mature players.

At pick 66 they took 19-year-old Zerk-Thatcher and at pick 78 they took 20-year-old Matt Guelfi.

Both look like clever choices.

Dodoro's analysis showed that desperate defender Zerk-Thatcher was a competitive beast and the versatile Guelfi was underdeveloped, having broken his leg at 17.

“Geez (Zerk-Thatcher) moves a lot like SOS (Stephen Silvagni),” Dodoro said.

“His mannerisms with the reach, the spoil, the body shape – long torso – and the courage.”

JAMES HIRD ON POST-DRUGS NUCLEUS

“The Essendon midfield with those two (Smith and Shiel) and Zach and Heppell, it’s going to be a pretty good midfield. Then the forward line; hopefully they can keep Joey, but Joey, Fantasia, and (Anthony McDonald)-Tipungwuti is a very versatile forward line. Then you go to the backline with McKenna, Saad, (Michael) Hurley, (Cale) Hooker and (Andy) McGrath. There’s quality players on each line.”

So * missed Brown because they drug cheated? (And that well know star the Zerkster went seven picks ahead of Nick Larkey.)

Good thing they sorted their KPF issues with Joe Danniher.

Phew.
 

The only logical explanation for Dodoro's ongoing tenure at * is that there must actually be records of the PEDs that they administered to the players and the Dodo is in possession of the only copy.

On a positive note, the longer he stays there, the less likely it is that they'll have any success. Happy days.
 
The only logical explanation for Dodoro's ongoing tenure at * is that there must actually be records of the PEDs that they administered to the players and the Dodo is in possession of the only copy.

On a positive note, the longer he stays there, the less likely it is that they'll have any success. Happy days.


Yep.

He's got a dirt file.
 
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