List Mgmt. Talk about the makeup of our list (and overall list management)

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yaco55

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Have posted for the last two years that skill is the biggest issue which needs to be addressed - Forget about effort,structure etc,etc,etc - As it stands now the game plan is solid, structures around the ground are solid and the effort is usually OK - Do we realise that in four of losses the winning team has kicked 86,77,75 and 73 points - The actual game style has strikingly improved since round 8 in 2018 - But any effective game plan must have a minimum skill level by hand and foot - And skill can be improved.
 
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1. Andy McGrath. Has been fluctuation from very good to average at times. Has been used in the midfield at times but I think he is more suited to wing or half back. Nothing wrong with having a super star winger who can kick a goal and defend. He is doing well but has had some issues with picking up midfield craft in a midfield that is short of A grade midfielders.
2. Tom Bellchambers. Mid to lower range ruck. Is up and down as far as having an impact around the ground and for a big bloke has limited physical presence. Tap work is good but struggles against the rucks who jump. Simply needs to be taking 7 or 8 marks every week like he has shown he can at his best and FFS take some angry pills or viagra or anything. Get mad son.
3.Darcy Parish. The lack of inside midfielders has forced him to play outside his hitting zone a lot. He is a run and link midfielder who can win some inside footy but not back up continually smashing into the contest. In some ways Shiel is having an effect as he plays the same role as Parish liked to when he was AA twice as an under 18. He needs to find the next step as he has had three years of just above average but he also needs us to develop a better midfield so he can play his best role. Has been an offender as far as being a bit loose in the midfield defence.
4. Kyle Langford. The talent wasted player although not through his own fault. Here is a guy who should be playing half forward / half back and maybe some wing but our lack of big bodies and his willingness to take it on has seen him taking on inside midfielder. Now he does have some skill in this department but he is just not a physical smash in all the time guy and his decision making is not the quickest. Good on him for putting his hand up and continually saying I will do it but it is just not there. He is in no mans land right now.
5. Devon Smith. Looks like a player who has had pre season issues right now. Is about 70% of what he was last season. One of the reason why I liked picking him up is he is an angry man. Yes he can give away some free kicks but he is in the face of the opposition and likes to tackle blokes to the ground. We are really missing his best right now.
6.Joe Daniher. 2017. 60 goals. Upward and onward . Then the injury stick smacks him big time. He is a massive loss as even at an unimproved 2017 level he was a serious player for us. Right now we are just waiting and hoping. Needs to really lift in the defence department. The biggest offender as far as switching off and letting an opponent run off him. Needs to tighten his defensive position so he is not 20 meters away thinking he has players covered.
7. Zack Merrit . A grade. The only thing he needs to do is improve his zone defence. Has to work on being a bit closer to someone when the ball goes out of his area. Not talking about hard body on body but just a few meters closer so he can cover better. Like the way he enjoys smashing people in tackles. It is too bad we do not protect him better so he doesn't get as smashed up as I would like to see him being more physical off the ball and putting pressure on
8. Marty Gleeson. We miss him. Strong marking defenders who can run off are always good value.
9. Dylan Shiel. Has been what I hoped for other than his kicking going south for whatever reason. Has to find a way to lift it or we do not get full value from his ability to break the lines from a contest.
10. Aaaron Francis. The big hope. I still say on ability he was the best in that draft but Housten we have a problem. His assets are his marking, good skills and decision making and being able to kick the ball where many can not. Also he is very clean at ground level. Now his down side is endurance and second efforts and not being overly athletic. Through no real fault of his own he has not really been able to work on this until pre season this year. This year he got a bit of work in but he has not hit the seniors with the confidence he had last year when he dominated the VFL for 6 weeks. Right now he is a bit of a one trick pony. If his biggest trick , his marking , is taken away or he is not clunking them like he can then he becomes an issue. He is a young man that needs the confidence but has also struggled with the step up in training needed to go to the next level. Right now he looks like he needs a bit of VFL time in the back half to build that confidence in his marking and general play. He has some incredible talent but there is also a very big risk he may not be able to find the endurance to be able to be who we want him to be.
11. David Zaharakis. Has been playing more of a half back defending role recently but in all Honesty I want Andy Mcgrath playing his role in the side. IMO he needs to go but I doubt they would as the coach loves him.
12. Mark Bagualey. Has done super well coming from Frankston as a rookie but his time has come.
13. Orazio Fantasia . Star qualities. Too many injuries.
14. Jordan Ridley. One of our good hopes for the future.
15. Jayden Laverde . All you can really say is ****. ****. Double ****.
16. Josh Begley. Was looking good until he blew up his knee.
17. James Stewart. Lost his way a bit last year and now dogged with injury. Now we are waiting to see if he can get back to 2017 form.
18. Micheal Hurley. A grader who is no longer as good as he was but still very good.
19. Kobe Much. Promising but injuries have hurt.
20. Zak Clarke. Has struggled to get back onto the pace of AFL footy.
21. Dyson Heppell. Would be regarded as a super star if only he was even a fraction quicker. The skipper will run through a wall if needed. The only concern I have is he is just too nice. Would like to see him hand out a bit of the punishment the oppossition give him all the time.
22. Irving Mosquito . Very early but he has some tricks. Needs time to develop a consistent game.
23. David Myers. What could have been. Doubt he was ever going to be a star but he may well have been a very consistent player. We will never know. Is struggling to string together anything really good week in and week out.
24. Jordan Houlahan. Has been better this year but that would not be hard. I am still not sold. Needs more work rate and his set shot kicking has not been flash this year.
25. Jake Stringer. You have to say he struggles to live up to his early form and hype but is a very good player and has been prepared to play out of his comfort zone and help in the middle where he does block well. Two down sides. Is not the best chaser out of defence and he needs to kick a lot more of his easy set shots.
26. Cale Hooker. A grade. If he could kick straight he would be hailed as one of the best swingmen of his time.
27. Mason Redman. Starting to show how good he is.
28. Mitch Brown. Good B grade player. Nice tank and work rate. Contested marking is his poor point for a bloke his size. I think he is a better defender than a forward. Good depth player to have around.
29. Patrick Ambrose. The team man. Good endurance. Always goes hard. Limited ability with ball in hand. Handy mark. Does a job but is not flashy.
30. Brendan Zerk Thatcher . Good strong mark and has done some good stuff but since injuring his ankle he has struggled for form and he needs to learn to puch. Tries to mark everything.
32. Noah Gown. Very raw right now.
33. Brayden Ham. Good endurance runner who can play a bit. Just a bit too thin at the moment.
34. Jake Long. I just do not think he back himself enough. Has the ability to take the game on but often doesn’t.
35. Matt Guelfi . Has done well enough. Like the way he will block and help his team mates. Not a star but tries to play his role.
36. Micheal Hartley. Seems to have lost the confidence to back himself to intercept the ball like he use to. Gets in trouble looking at his opponent a lot but in saying that his VFL form is generally solid and he probably should have had more opportunity.
37. Dyalan Clarke. If his kicking was better he would be playing now.
38. Sam Draper. Bugger.
39. Trent Mynott. Had his battles last year but has been very good this year. Not far of getting a game IMO.
41. Ben McNiece . handy player but IMO is just short of AFL level.
42. Adam Saad. Great player. His defending is under rated.
43. Anthony McDonald – Tipungwuti – super star ability but struggling to find a consistent form line this year.
44. Shaun McKernan . B grade player but an important cog that keeps getting injured.
45. Connor McKenna . Not going as well this year and has not lowered the back half turnovers in his game. Good player but has to stop turning it over as much.
46. Tom Jok. Has potential as a defender but currently injured.
49. Matt Dea . Reliable B grade player. Has his detractors but he can come in and play his role if needed. The type of back up most clubs like.
 
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So the gaps are.
Better ruck.
A grade inside midfielder.
Some more hard edge in your face players.
The list is strong but it is strong as far as flankers go but week in genuine midfield while being well off for KP defenders and a bit light on KP forwards.
Injury has been an issue as well as it has tested the depth of our week areas.
 

Duckworth

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So the gaps are.
Better ruck.
A grade inside midfielder.
Some more hard edge in your face players.
The list is strong but it is strong as far as flankers go but week in genuine midfield while being well off for KP defenders and a bit light on KP forwards.
Injury has been an issue as well as it has tested the depth of our week areas.
So, you are the 'expendable' flankers that can get us the inside midfielder we need? Would you consider the Collingwood guy currently in the VFL? (forget his name).
 
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So, you are the 'expendable' flankers that can get us the inside midfielder we need? Would you consider the Collingwood guy currently in the VFL? (forget his name).
I presume you are talking about Brayden Sier. Currently injured and has not played much footy this year. I think the Pies would consider one of the second round picks but that is only my opinion. Right now I have not seen enough under 18 footy this year to have an informed opinion on inside midfielders who would be around that mark.

Tough choice coming up in the mid season draft. Find a ruck of the future or a midfielder for the future who fit the age bracket of under 23.
 

eth-dog

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I presume you are talking about Brayden Sier. Currently injured and has not played much footy this year. I think the Pies would consider one of the second round picks but that is only my opinion. Right now I have not seen enough under 18 footy this year to have an informed opinion on inside midfielders who would be around that mark.

Tough choice coming up in the mid season draft. Find a ruck of the future or a midfielder for the future who fit the age bracket of under 23.
The inside mid options (if they're still there, one of which I doubt) are Mitch Riordan and Mitchell Hibberd.

Oliver Eastland, Ajang Ajang and Michael Knoll seem to be the front runners for a ruck spot
 
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The inside mid options (if they're still there, one of which I doubt) are Mitch Riordan and Mitchell Hibberd.

Oliver Eastland, Ajang Ajang and Michael Knoll seem to be the front runners for a ruck spot
I got hold of the WAs v SA state game to have a look at. Josh Deluca was impressive. I know he did not do much when he was at Freo but he is flying at the moment and has put on a bit of size.
 

eth-dog

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I got hold of the WAs v SA state game to have a look at. Josh Deluca was impressive. I know he did not do much when he was at Freo but he is flying at the moment and has put on a bit of size.
Problem with Deluca is that he's 179/80, to go with Smith (176/77) McGrath (178/80), Merrett (180/80), Parish (180/80), Shiel (182/82) and Guelfi (183/79) as very short inside mids. Hibberd at 191/90 provides a POD, Riordan at 187/83 the same.
 

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Problem with Deluca is that he's 179/80, to go with Smith (176/77) McGrath (178/80), Merrett (180/80), Parish (180/80), Shiel (182/82) and Guelfi (183/79) as very short inside mids. Hibberd at 191/90 provides a POD, Riordan at 187/83 the same.
He is short but the recent screening stats I have seen have him at 85kg and is very very good at winning inside footy and has decent pace on the spread.
Personally I do not care about being over 185cm. All I care about is being able to win inside footy on a regular basis and not being slower than a sloth. From what I see this bloke is ready to go. Looks like a faster better midfield version of Geulfi.
 

Bunk Moreland

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Parish - midfield
Redman - back / midfield
Ridley - back
Francis - back
Langford - forward
Laverde (when fit) - forward / midfield

Just play them. In the seniors. We literally have nothing to lose. We’re not going to win a flag or compete for Top 4.

If we play all these guys, uninterrupted, in their preferred positions... as if it was 2016... I’d guarantee we find at least one genuine 200 game player, and probably more.
 

_Swoon

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Parish - midfield
Redman - back / midfield
Ridley - back
Francis - back
Langford - forward
Laverde (when fit) - forward / midfield

Just play them. In the seniors. We literally have nothing to lose. We’re not going to win a flag or compete for Top 4.

If we play all these guys, uninterrupted, in their preferred positions... as if it was 2016... I’d guarantee we find at least one genuine 200 game player, and probably more.
They can press their way into the team no different to any other club in the league. A winning culture is just as important, not to mention it sends a very weird message to the playing group if we decide to bench players and tank because we've written off the season at 3-5.

IMO shuffling the list around isn't the answer to our problems, it's fixing our gameplan and learning to take the individualism out of our play. Pumping the list full of youth for the sake of it will only confuse the matter further.
 
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Parish - midfield
Redman - back / midfield
Ridley - back
Francis - back
Langford - forward
Laverde (when fit) - forward / midfield

Just play them. In the seniors. We literally have nothing to lose. We’re not going to win a flag or compete for Top 4.

If we play all these guys, uninterrupted, in their preferred positions... as if it was 2016... I’d guarantee we find at least one genuine 200 game player, and probably more.
The coach has plenty to lose :p
I know what you are saying but the coach has to go down fighting. The pressure right now is to turn the form and make finals. He is not in a position to do a Clarkson at the moment rightly or wrongly.
 

BrunoV

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Parish - midfield
Redman - back / midfield
Ridley - back
Francis - back
Langford - forward
Laverde (when fit) - forward / midfield

Just play them. In the seniors. We literally have nothing to lose. We’re not going to win a flag or compete for Top 4.

If we play all these guys, uninterrupted, in their preferred positions... as if it was 2016... I’d guarantee we find at least one genuine 200 game player, and probably more.

Not liking this Bunk, for one reason. It seems to me to be implicit that there would be a negative impact on the team's performance if these players were to be selected.

The only thing we have done by refusing to select these players is limit ourselves.

We're committing this self harm because we have coach who at best can't see the forest from the trees.

It's the ultimate irony that Worsfold seems incapable of doing the one thing that will save his job.


Edit: was just making a point.
 
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Duckworth

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I presume you are talking about Brayden Sier. Currently injured and has not played much footy this year. I think the Pies would consider one of the second round picks but that is only my opinion. Right now I have not seen enough under 18 footy this year to have an informed opinion on inside midfielders who would be around that mark.

Tough choice coming up in the mid season draft. Find a ruck of the future or a midfielder for the future who fit the age bracket of under 23.
Sier was the one! I would be going for the best inside mid. We will have enough ruck cover by mid-season draft time (barring further injuries). Getting a half season into someone who can take on the Myers role is the bigger hole, just my 2c.

As a ruck I think so, but not as a forward. I'm on the fence whether we should go a ruck or if we should go a mid, but I think we will go a ruck.
See above. Think it will depend on how the ruck injuries go in the next few weeks.
 
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fishardansin

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So the gaps are.
Better ruck.
A grade inside midfielder.
Some more hard edge in your face players.
The list is strong but it is strong as far as flankers go but week in genuine midfield while being well off for KP defenders and a bit light on KP forwards.
Injury has been an issue as well as it has tested the depth of our week areas.
What you've basically said is we have heaps of icing without much cake. Those teams never play in the GF. You need quality grunt winning the ball and holding the spine together. It is why prior to the SAGA I thought our build was better than Carlton's.

Smith Saad and Stringer are all great pickups, immediate best 22 players. However, none addressed the biggest issue we had. Smith did tackle around the ball a lot, and Saad meant McGrath added to our midfield. I suppose, if Myers and Langford had have come on and played well in the midfield plus a dream injury run with Hurley, Ambrose, Hooker, McKernan, Stewart and Daniher we could be different. However, teams rarely get the dream runs and hoping those two mids would fill the big-bodied mid role was clutching at straws a bit.

I reckon we have two more good years of Hooker and Hurley. Less of Bellchambers. Can we get this list up to top two standard in that time or do we do a mini-rebuild to take advantage of the class that is 5 years younger?
 

Andronicus

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Have posted for the last two years that skill is the biggest issue which needs to be addressed - Forget about effort,structure etc,etc,etc - As it stands now the game plan is solid, structures around the ground are solid and the effort is usually OK - Do we realise that in four of losses the winning team has kicked 86,77,75 and 73 points - The actual game style has strikingly improved since round 8 in 2018 - But any effective game plan must have a minimum skill level by hand and foot - And skill can be improved.
In regards to the first bolded point........they always do.

The second bolded point is just puzzling.
 
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